153429 réponses à ce sujet

[Avejajed]

In case this is helpful, extracts from World of Thedas: 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And then in a seperate box: 

 

 

Okay okay this is helpful, yes.

 

So they saw the gods themselves as dragons- and that's why they think the archdemons were dragons. The old tevinter gods were not  given human form. Because the dreamers said as much?

 

Solas says he does not believe that the Tevinter gods were gods, but he believes they existed-  So maybe the archdemons are just regular corrupted (powerful, though) high dragons. The dragons were misinterpreted as the forms of the gods themselves, but maybe these old gods never...

 

Well okay. Let's think, there's a theory that says the old gods and the elven pantheon are connected, or may be the same set of entities given different names by differing cultures.

 

But they aren't like...pets.

 

Thinking...

[Vorathrad]

"The organized worship of the Old Gods was at its highest prior to the First Blight,[...]"

What an interesting coincidence.

Thank you for the extracts, I enjoyed reading them. Is "World of Thedas" worth buying? I read that there are quite a few mistakes.

[Colonelkillabee]

But that's the point, right?

 

All this time, we've (not all,but most) automatically assumed (because, reasons) that these archdemons are either directly connected to the Tevinter old  gods or are the Tevinter old gods, blighted.

 

But why?

 

Why do they have to be connected at all? There's not nearly enough proof that one has anything to do with the other.

 

So some guy is like, dude, that dragon looks A HELL OF A LOT like this statue I saw four years ago of Dumat. Must be him! And thats' what we base this off of?

 

That's not even going into how unlikely it is that anyone around had actually ever even "seen" Dumat, much less be able to carve a statue of him with any believable realistic features.

 

The calling, though. Hell, if I was an ancient old demony dragon thing I'd be blaming my **** on someone else too. ""OOOH I'm so evil and mean. My name is Dumat!" And then he's all like "Those idiots are so studid they think I'm Dumat hahahah."

 

Well, or something like that.

 

So you're asking how do we know these old gods were the ones that sent the dreams? And how do we know they're the tevinter old gods?

 

Well, we know they're the old gods because that's what the tevinter called those locked away godly beings. The only thing we don't truly know is that they indeed sent the dreams. I assume anyway, unless someone has some proof that the tevinter magisters were talking to the old gods and not something else.

[drake2511]

*sobs into the abyss*

Spoiler

And he looks so sad when he walks away

Spoiler

 

I am finally almost sort of done with this Dread Wolf drawing! 

 

[Somewhat NSFW]

 

Spoiler

 

Wow. I love it, wonderful job!

[Avejajed]

So you're asking how do we know these old gods were the ones that sent the dreams? And how do we know they're the tevinter old gods?

 

Well, we know they're the old gods because that's what the tevinter called those locked away godly beings. The only thing we don't truly know is that they indeed sent the dreams. I assume anyway, unless someone has some proof that the tevinter magisters were talking to the old gods and not something else.

 

How do we know that the archdemons are the same beings that Tevinter calls the old gods?

 

Maybe they were...I don't know..pretending to be the old gods, to cause their power and worship to dwindle, which it does. After the blight the worship of the old gods, for various reasons and also the blight, declines until it's all but gone.

 

What if that was the point. Maybe the archdemons (or whoever was controlling the archdemons) was manuvering it so that these people thought the gods they worshiped had betrayed them by bringing about a blight?

 

All the while maybe the actual old gods were locked away without any power to prevent the situation.

 

In this theory the vint old gods and the elven pantheon can still be either connected, or the same entity given different names by differing cultures.

[Mims]

You should make a tumblr so I can reblog them Or if you give me permission, I'll blog it with your name and website in the description of the pictures.

 

 

I'll definitely look into setting up a tumblr of some kind! I may make a few changes on that picture first.

 

But, thank you all! It is very much appreciated.  

[RebbyWriter]

So, I was cutting up some onions for dinner, right? My eyes were burning up, man! (btw, I tried the gum trick, it doesn't work)

 

Anyway, the fumes from these onions are so bad that tears are streaming down my face. As I wiped my face with a tissue I said aloud, "I haven't felt this teary eyed since Solas left me."

 

So then, it dawned upon me; Solas is not an egg. He is an onion. Think about it, onions are a staple. I know people who use onions in everything they make. People keep coming back to them and endure such pain and tears to have them. Onions have layers, like Shrek Solas. And...well..onions are round and shiny like his head.

 

*sniffles*

[TanisLave]

Really wanna play in Tevinter now. 

[Sable Rhapsody]

Yeah, I don't think Solas is like Sun Li. But I wish we had a Sun Li, or at least a villain that was evil without being crazy about it. Bioware seems to like their villains to be either:

 

- redeemable

- corrupted/crazy/full ham

 

There's rarely room for more subtle antagonistic forces. Part of the reason I really like the Architect. Although he sort of fits under the redeemable category, I think his lack of understanding human emotions will always be an issue even if he's on our side for the time being. 

 

I want to find whomever wrote Sun Li and shake their hand.  He does stand out pretty dramatically among BioWare's other villains.  Even Jon Irenicus, my second favorite, is pretty nuts.  Brilliant and terrifying, but nuts.

 

As for the Architect, I see him as a case of Blue and Orange Morality. Similar to the geth in ME2.  He's not a bad dude, and the things that he wants aren't bad.  He and normal people just have trouble communicating that to each other.  Sparing the Architect was the decision that made my Warden (and by extension me as a player) really sour on the Wardens as an organization.  DA:I just nailed it home.  They really have no idea what the f*** they're doing beyond "Warden stabs Archdemon."

[Sister Squish]

"The organized worship of the Old Gods was at its highest prior to the First Blight,[...]"

What an interesting coincidence.

Thank you for the extracts, I enjoyed reading them. Is "World of Thedas" worth buying? I read that there are quite a few mistakes.

 

It is useful as reference - as a map, and timeline. Also lots of artwork, if you like that sort of thing! 

  I cannot speak to it's accuracy, although I think it is interesting that there are very few things that are stated as fact, and much more that reads "it is said...", "this person claims...." "records say..." which means that we may question a lot. 

 

Like.... "the first Neromenian Dreamers claim to have had visions of a Realm of the Gods, and as proof of their visions, demonstrated miraculous powers". 

  So, they didn't prove their visions particularly, and this "Realm of Gods" was only later assumed to be the Fade. Does this mean there is a potential third realm of existence, where they learned blood magic? Could it be the Void, where the Forgotten Ones were said to have been imprisoned?

 

Edit: Top of page mims! 

[Avejajed]

So, I was cutting up some onions for dinner, right? My eyes were burning up, man! (btw, I tried the gum trick, it doesn't work)

 

Anyway, the fumes from these onions are so bad that tears are streaming down my face. As I wiped my face with a tissue I said aloud, "I haven't felt this teary eyed since Solas left me."

 

So then, it dawned upon me; Solas is not an egg. He is an onion. Think about it, onions are a staple. I know people who use onions in everything they make. People keep coming back to them and endure such pain and tears to have them. Onions have layers, like Shrek Solas. And...well..onions are round and shiny like his head.

 

*sniffles*

 

*sobs*

 

Let's talk about feels.

 

This song.

 

 

Lyrics

 

Giving this world everything I've got
Running through the woods, running through this shots
Tryna to survive a day!
All I want is that you extend your hand to me
Sitting outside waiting for the words to come
Living my life tryna do what's right,
In hope of a better day
You know those words you wrote me brought me to my knees
All I'm saying is that

You're home, you'll never be alone
You're home, you'll never be alone
You're home, to be alone
You're home, hope you find your way home

Singing outside waiting for the world to call
Living my life tryna do what's right
In the hope of a better day
And all I want is that you extend your hand to me
Oooh, I want show me where it hurts,
We'll make it OK
Tell me that you'll stay
Even when I'm far away
My voice will carry through
Until the end it's me & you
We can make it if we try
All that I'm saying is that

You're home, you'll never be alone
You're home, you'll never be alone
You're home, to be alone
You're home, hope you find your way home

You're never gonna be alone...

 

 

[Colonelkillabee]

How do we know that the archdemons are the same beings that Tevinter calls the old gods?

 

Maybe they were...I don't know..pretending to be the old gods, to cause their power and worship to dwindle, which it does. After the blight the worship of the old gods, for various reasons and also the blight, declines until it's all but gone.

 

What if that was the point. Maybe the archdemons (or whoever was controlling the archdemons) was manuvering it so that these people thought the gods they worshiped had betrayed them by bringing about a blight?

 

All the while maybe the actual old gods were locked away without any power to prevent the situation.

 

In this theory the vint old gods and the elven pantheon can still be either connected, or the same entity given different names by differing cultures.

I think it would be an easier theory to pass on if you focus on who actually sent the dreams rather than if the dragons are their old gods. They worship those dragons, and they gave them that name, so even if they were told by someone else that they were named Dumat, Urthemiel, etc when they weren't, it wouldn't matter unless the old god Dumat was a real thing, not some elven god with an adopted name. You get me?

[Leiou]

I just finished the destruction of Haven in my 2nd PT and you know the part where the inquisitor is walking through the blizzard? You can hear a wolf howling in the distance. I remember in my first pt I kept expecting to get jumped by wolves, which never happened. But now I was thinking, what if that was Fen'harel guiding the player to safety? The howling totally gets louder the closer the inquisitor gets to the camp.

[Adynata]

I just finished the destruction of Haven in my 2nd PT and you know the part where the inquisitor is walking through the blizzard? You can hear a wolf howling in the distance. I remember in my first pt I kept expecting to get jumped by wolves, which never happened. But now I was thinking, what if that was Fen'harel guiding the player to safety? The howling totally gets louder the closer the inquisitor gets to the camp.

 

This is interesting, because when Quizzy arrives, some people seem really relieved, like Cullen, as if they weren't expecting her but Solas doesn't seem even remotely surprised to see her.

[Caddius]

"The organized worship of the Old Gods was at its highest prior to the First Blight,[...]"

What an interesting coincidence.

Thank you for the extracts, I enjoyed reading them. Is "World of Thedas" worth buying? I read that there are quite a few mistakes.

Except we have very recent and explicit evidence that the opposite was true. I'm thinking this was either one of the mistakes or they just didn't get the memo.

Corypheus and the other Magisters reached out to the Golden City because the Old Gods stopped whispering to them, and worship of the Old Gods was in a sharp decline.

My guess is that as the Imperium expanded, the theocratic elements gave way to just pure power-based magocracy. More Magisters, more apprentices, a focus on etting ahead rather than 'Getting ahead for Papa Dumat'.

I don't have any saves at the start of Here Lies the Abyss. They're all mid-way through the Fade portion. I couldn't find the Codex entry about the dragon looking like Dumat. I did find the one about the Warden in Fears of the Dreamer interesting in that he seems to be beseeching someone to give him a way to destroy the Blight. Of course, Andrastianism wasn't really at thing at that point. The proto-Maker entity wasn't worshiped. And then you turn in a vial of darkspawn blood to his altar to answer his prayer.

I'm not willing to dismiss the idea that Theodosians correctly identified Dumat/the Dragon that is identified as Dumat. It sounds like the temples, much like the Creator temples, had certain ways of depicting various dragons. That scholars debate for a few years points to it being difficult or possibly just making it up, that scholars come to a grounded conclusion on which Archdemon was which points to there being enough similarities enough that we shouldn't sweep it under the rug.

I do like this notion that Dumat and the other Old Gods were Dreamers or demons, depicting themselves as dragons, eventually aiming the Magisters at the dragons. (Pillars of the Earth?)

Sister Squish's World of Thedas thing about how some people think that Dumat created the darkspawn and led them against Thedas on his own is quite interesting.

Who thinks that? Old God worshipers? It would be quite the contrast between Andrastianism and Old God worship. 

MAKER: The people have turned their back on me. So I'll return the favor and just ignore them. Screw this. I'm going to make cooler worlds. *floats off* *comes back when he's lonely and wants a girlfriend*

DUMAT: The people have turned their back on me. I'll just kill them off until I can fit the survivors into a temple, and I'll call it good.

[Sable Rhapsody]

I just finished the destruction of Haven in my 2nd PT and you know the part where the inquisitor is walking through the blizzard? You can hear a wolf howling in the distance. I remember in my first pt I kept expecting to get jumped by wolves, which never happened. But now I was thinking, what if that was Fen'harel guiding the player to safety? The howling totally gets louder the closer the inquisitor gets to the camp.

 

This is totally my headcanon.  I love the idea that there's an element of divine salvation in the Inquisitor surviving Haven.  Just not from the god that everyone would expect 

[Caddius]

This is totally my headcanon.  I love the idea that there's an element of divine salvation in the Inquisitor surviving Haven.  Just not from the god that everyone would expect 

You can even see wolves, but they politely back off if you walk towards them.

They like their future stepmom, I guess. 

[Armdin]

I just finished the destruction of Haven in my 2nd PT and you know the part where the inquisitor is walking through the blizzard? You can hear a wolf howling in the distance. I remember in my first pt I kept expecting to get jumped by wolves, which never happened. But now I was thinking, what if that was Fen'harel guiding the player to safety? The howling totally gets louder the closer the inquisitor gets to the camp.

 

I have to say I loved that segment of the game. I constantly thought I'd wander off into the wrong area every few paces, the poor Inquisitor shivering and cold. I was sat with my partner when he did it the first time and he was explaining to me who Corypheus was (I'd never played DA2), and when we got to that stage of him wandering in the blizzard we were both completely silent.

 

I love how the Inquisitor falls to their knees when they reach the camp, like a mixture of exhaustion but most of relief to have made it. ^^

 

In relation to what you said I honestly don't agree. The Frostbacks is full of wolves and I don't think Solas has any particular control over them (otherwise we'd never need to fight them), or is able to see through their eyes. I don't like the idea of linking everything to do with wolves to Solas just because he's Fen'Harel. ^^;

[Sable Rhapsody]

You can even see wolves, but they politely back off if you walk towards them.

They like their future stepmom, I guess. 

 

In the case of my Lavellan, future stepmom spoils any animal she gets her hands on, and will happily give all the ear scritches 

 

In relation to what you said I honestly don't agree. The Frostbacks is full of wolves and I don't think Solas has any particular control over them (otherwise we'd never need to fight them), or is able to see through their eyes. I don't like the idea of linking everything to do with wolves to Solas just because he's Fen'Harel. ^^;

 

I know it smacks of "OMG disgustingly cute" to have Solas guide Lavellan out of Haven, but I just can't help it.  There is a dearth of cute, fluffy stuff for Solas in-game, and even in fanart/fanfiction, so I wind up headcanoning as many as I can.  I totally don't have a problem 

[BoscoBread]

In the case of my Lavellan, future stepmom spoils any animal she gets her hands on, and will happily give all the ear scritches 
 

 
I know it smacks of "OMG disgustingly cute" to have Solas guide Lavellan out of Haven, but I just can't help it.  There is a dearth of cute, fluffy stuff for Solas in-game, and even in fanart/fanfiction, so I wind up headcanoning as many as I can.  I totally don't have a problem 

Yes. Massive lack of cute. Just breathless passion and heart shattering sadness. I want fluffy happy solas times.

[Mims]

You can even see wolves, but they politely back off if you walk towards them.

They like their future stepmom, I guess. 

 

I am going to have to search for them! 

 

I also love the headcanon that Solas might have had something to do with it. I suppose we won't ever know unless someone asks, but it I like it. Particularly if they aren't even attacking you. 

[Emperor Iaius I]

Okay okay this is helpful, yes.

 

So they saw the gods themselves as dragons- and that's why they think the archdemons were dragons. The old tevinter gods were not  given human form. Because the dreamers said as much?

 

Solas says he does not believe that the Tevinter gods were gods, but he believes they existed-  So maybe the archdemons are just regular corrupted (powerful, though) high dragons. The dragons were misinterpreted as the forms of the gods themselves, but maybe these old gods never...

 

Well okay. Let's think, there's a theory that says the old gods and the elven pantheon are connected, or may be the same set of entities given different names by differing cultures.

 

But they aren't like...pets.

 

Thinking...

 

Thing is, though, that we've seen blighted dragons before (not least in this game), and they aren't the same thing as archdemons. The red lyrium dragon didn't cause a Blight. There clearly is something special about them, even if it's unclear what they are. Solas doesn't think they're gods for whatever gods mean to someone like him, but they're something else -- some sort of strange ancient power for sure.

 

But what they are, what their connection to the Blight is, and how the Blight came about will continue to be a headscratcher.

[Armdin]

I know it smacks of "OMG disgustingly cute" to have Solas guide Lavellan out of Haven, but I just can't help it.  There is a dearth of cute, fluffy stuff for Solas in-game, and even in fanart/fanfiction, so I wind up headcanoning as many as I can.  I totally don't have a problem 

 

Oh, I can definitely relate. ^.^ It's fine for headcanon and fluff, I think.

[Leiou]

You can even see wolves, but they politely back off if you walk towards them.

They like their future stepmom, I guess. 

Oh really? I'll have to look around more next time.

 

I have to say I loved that segment of the game. I constantly thought I'd wander off into the wrong area every few paces, the poor Inquisitor shivering and cold. I was sat with my partner when he did it the first time and he was explaining to me who Corypheus was (I'd never played DA2), and when we got to that stage of him wandering in the blizzard we were both completely silent.

 

I love how the Inquisitor falls to their knees when they reach the camp, like a mixture of exhaustion but most of relief to have made it. ^^

 

In relation to what you said I honestly don't agree. The Frostbacks is full of wolves and I don't think Solas has any particular control over them (otherwise we'd never need to fight them), or is able to see through their eyes. I don't like the idea of linking everything to do with wolves to Solas just because he's Fen'Harel. ^^;

I really love this scene to. It's a nice contrast from the action-packed fire and destruction of Haven to a suddenly cold and quiet struggle for survival.

[tsunamitigerdragon]

In the case of my Lavellan, future stepmom spoils any animal she gets her hands on, and will happily give all the ear scritches 

 

 

I know it smacks of "OMG disgustingly cute" to have Solas guide Lavellan out of Haven, but I just can't help it.  There is a dearth of cute, fluffy stuff for Solas in-game, and even in fanart/fanfiction, so I wind up headcanoning as many as I can.  I totally don't have a problem 

Well, I think it's also very easy to read his guiding Lavellan or honestly ANY Inquisitor out of Haven as a very intelligent, tactical move on his part. It's clear he needs the inquisitor for his own ends. Not to mention the rifts still exist and need to be closed, they are the only one capable of doing so at present.