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Solas Thread - NOW OFFICIALLY MOVED to Cyonan's BSN (link in OP)


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#78551
Colonelkillabee

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snip

 

Yep, like you said, we didn't autopsy the body and the recounting of his death isn't reliable due to his legend, so I don't put much stock in that. He could have easily died either way, so I go with the headcanon that the man who thought so highly of himself went out like a ******, because that is beautiful beautiful good ol' mundane irony that only real life would dare write.

 

And I agree about wanting the same from Tevinter... they have a lot of potential for some truly fantastical and crazy stories.



#78552
Caddius

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<snip>

What I've always found fascinating and horrifying about Justice possessing Anders is that, while he's still devoted to Justice, it's become focused only on Mage Rebellion. Everyone and everything that stands in its way is an opponent against Justice, and should be righteously terminated.

Anders is the only companion to approve of Fenris being sold back into slavery to Danarius, because Fenris opposes the cause. Justice creating a black-and-white dichotomy is the only way I can justify (hehe) that.

Likewise, Elthina and all of the people, whether it be priests or people there for help and sanctuary, are tools whose use for the cause is to burn.

I mean, I'm not fond of Elthina, personally. I can see why she would try to remain a neutral, stabilizing force, but it drives me nuts that the one force both Orsino and Meredith respected did not take a more proactive stance in shutting down the rampant blood mages and horrific abuses of power in the Circle.

I think having a sword and Tranquil brand above their heads legally, and rape and post-Harrowing Tranquil brand above them illegally, has some damaging effects on mage psyche. The constant abuses alluded to in DA2 make Greagoir's stern oversight in Origins seem fair, but even then, you've got Irving's determined politicking to strike a blow against the Chantry for every mage of his lost, to make sure they don't get too upity. 

I'd be an Aequitarian myself. The mages managed to get themselves out of candle-duty and into Circles back during the early days of the Chantry. They should be able to curtail the Templars' abuses without starting a world war. Then again, they proved themselves hopelessly incompetent in Inquisition, which is to be expected since they've never had to handle independence or political power like that before.

...Though you'd think they'd recognize Tevinter as a bad ally. <_<   

 

Rhoxi: Yeah, apostates don't really get to solve the Circle problem without violence. :(

It's why I suspect most of the Libertarians are really in the Aequitarian or even Loyalist factions. Only the really hardcore, passionate ones are silly enough to paint a target on their head for the Chantry and Templars, while the wily ones would quietly increase freedoms in one of the 'stable' groups, waiting for the opportunity for a big push. I haven't read Asunder yet, how do the Fraternities interact there? :)

I'd try to go for political reforms by using the political sway mages have. Mages are essential to any kingdom's army, the Grey Wardens, and serve in courts as arcane advisers. That's influence. While the Templars could annul them for trying to get more rights, the Chantry at large would take notice, as would the other Circles. That kind of attitude wouldn't work out. (As Meredith proved so well.)

I definitely understand why Anders would lash out, because you can only handle so much patience and careful maneuvering when the other side routinely rips away your friends' identity. Especially when they then proceed to use the punished Tranquil as one of their main sources of income, which is one of the shadiest things in all of Dragon Age.


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#78553
Cecilia

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Interesting viewpoint! Thanks for sharing it in such a descriptive manner. I personally feel that the world is much more grey rather than black/white. Let's say a poor individual in our world had a dying wife and could not afford to pay the outrageous prices a doctor was charging since he knew that the man really needed the medicine. Let's say that the man broke in and stole the medicine and gave it to his wife and she got better, but the doctor was stolen from; yet not hurt. Stealing is in indeed "wrong", but circumstances and situations push people to do "wrong" things.

 

I do believe the Templars overstepped the boundaries of "disciplining" mages whenever they have the right to basically commit genocide and abuse any mage at any time with little consequences. Both sides have faults and I certainly do not support terroisim, however, Anders is much more grey character and should never just be called a "terrorist" That is one thing that makes me rather annoyied, plus whenever people try to insult me and call me a "terrorist-lover". I went into the Anders thread and it is far too late to revive it, but the crap they had to put up with should had never have happened.

 

Indeed.

 

Yup.

 

Like I said before - I definitely love Anders and I do understand why he did what he did, but I don't think it's comparable to a man stealing medicine for his wife. In the case of theft, which is objectively still wrong (I'm a bit harsh I'll admit), it doesn't directly threaten the life/physical well being of the pharmacist and the pharmacist is, in fact, directly complicit in the conflict that motivates the criminal act (so I would view that as along the lines of Anders blowing up a garrison full of sleeping Templars - still questionable under a strict application of just war theory, but given the nature of the mage/templar conflict, passable). What Anders actually did is closer to a man with a sick wife who holds the pharmacist's daughter hostage until the pharmacist gives him the medicine - the victim of the action changes the heinousness of the crime dramatically even if the motivation remains the same. More meta-analytically, I think Anders actions are supposed to be considered heinous and indefensible (albeit sympathetic) because those actions were representative of how far Anders and Justice have come since Awakening as characters - Justice, at least, is no longer its original self, but rather Vengeance. I know a lot of players of Bioware games have vengeance-boners, but actions borne out of a wish for vengeance are fundamentally destructive rather than constructive and only serve to perpetuate and escalate conflict, to the detriment of all parties. 

 

Calling Anders an out and out terrorist, however, isn't really correct either. He commits an act of terror - I'm not budging on that point - but I don't think that equates him with people like Osama Bin Laden or Hitler (also someone who commits acts of terror under my definition). Terrorism isn't Anders' primary source of recourse and he is arguably driven to it by a combination of aggressive violations of just means by the opposing side as well as mental imbalance/possession (a spirit like Justice is much less likely to understand the nuances between right motivations and right means) - I generally belong to the camp that believes that Anders is no longer fully responsible for his actions by the time that he has blown up the Chantry.

 

Also, excellent points, Cecilia. I appreciate all of the well-reasoned discussion on this thread!

 

I guess, while I don't morally support Anders's actions, I find that I can't judge them. In the world of Thedas, there is no political or legal process he can turn to, and mages are denied basic liberties such as physical freedom, privacy, right to travel, marriage and paternity rights, and any kind of due process or right to trial. In such a situation, who wouldn't think of starting a revolution? You are right though, that there are better ways to go about it than destroying a building full of non-combatants, of course.

 

Also, erm . . . to keep this Solas-related! This line broke my heart the second play through, knowing who he is:

 

Spoiler

 

"You would think such understanding would stop me from making such terrible mistakes. You would be wrong."

 

Maybe I just enjoy tragic characters too much! :wub:

 

Thank you~ I just wanted to say Solas looks really pretty in that shot!


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#78554
Avejajed

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I dont have an opinion on Anders blowing up the chantry. My Hawke's do, depending on various personalities. (Ones like yay! Mage rights! The other uses murderknife.) I don't , because it's not a real event that happened.
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#78555
RogueBait

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*a wild Ary appears and throws art at the thread*

 

Spoiler

*poofs*  :ph34r:

 

 

Be friends with me on tumblr!

 

This is beautiful! What a dumb time to be out of likes. Stop posting great stuff, people.

 

 

I always viewed the Dalish as a mixture of Native American and the Pictish cultures.

 

That's kind of what I've been inclined to compare the Dalish culture to as well.

 


Solas. Mmmm dat voice. If Patrick Weekes ever decides to write another DA novel, Gareth needs to do the audiobook.

 

Hell, I want GDL to narrate my life.

 

JeSzFph.gif

 


As for the Dalish=Native Americans/Celts.

<very interesting historical observations>

 

I enjoyed reading that. Very interesting ideas and observations in that wall of history text right there. ;3


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#78556
Caddius

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This is beautiful! What a dumb time to be out of likes. Stop posting great stuff, people.

 

 

That's kind of what I've been inclined to compare the Dalish culture to as well.

 

 

 

 

 

I enjoyed reading that. Very interesting ideas and observations in that wall of history text right there. ;3

You could even say it was a Hadrian's Wall of history text.  B)

 

...Okay, okay, I submit myself for execution by the thread.  :lol:


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#78557
Vorathrad

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Do you.. do you like the bad kind?

Do you mean the man-eating ones or archdemons? If it's the first, yeah definitely :P If it's the latter, I pity them for being such majestic creatures twisted into pure destruction. It's like the old gods are forced to eat themselves in a killing spree.

Dragons are so beautiful in DAI that I couldn't bring myself to hunt them until my third pt. And I don't enjoy it and stopped playing days ago.
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#78558
almasy87

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I've gone and made a silly thing:

 

You might have to zoom to read it nicely.
I'm not going to colour it properly, but I had some fun making it xD 
 


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#78559
NightSymphony

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Do you mean the man-eating ones or archdemons? If it's the first, yeah definitely :P If it's the latter, I pity them for being such majestic creatures twisted into pure destruction. It's like the old gods are forced to eat themselves in a killing spree.

Dragons are so beautiful in DAI that I couldn't bring myself to hunt them until my third pt. And I don't enjoy it and stopped playing days ago.

I can't bring myself to hunt them either. They are beautiful.  I hate killing them in Skyrim too.


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#78560
Sable Rhapsody

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Dragons are so beautiful in DAI that I couldn't bring myself to hunt them until my third pt. And I don't enjoy it and stopped playing days ago.

 

I can't bring myself to hunt them either. They are beautiful.  I hate killing them in Skyrim too.

 

I downloaded a mod that dramatically reduces the number of random dragons (except the super-high level ones from DLC) after completion of the main quest.  I liked it a lot better that way, since I'd think the dragons would stop eating random people left and right once they had Paarthurnax as their leader rather than Alduin, and acknowledged the Dragonborn's superiority.

 

In DA:I, I only killed the Ferelden Frostback because I needed to get Iron Bull approval. I think I killed the Bone Pit dragon too back in DA2, but that was mostly because I wanted the shiny chestpiece.  The dragons are beautiful, but at a certain point my gamer greed does override that  :lol:


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#78561
Caddius

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Do you mean the man-eating ones or archdemons? If it's the first, yeah definitely :P If it's the latter, I pity them for being such majestic creatures twisted into pure destruction. It's like the old gods are forced to eat themselves in a killing spree.

Dragons are so beautiful in DAI that I couldn't bring myself to hunt them until my third pt. And I don't enjoy it and stopped playing days ago.

A while back, there was a conversation about a brand of faux-phalli (Which needs to be in the dictionary, dammit!) called Dragon.

I believe Rabbitonfire was one of the perpetrators.  :lol:

If that isn't what she was referring to, and I just made this conversation really weird, then I guess I'm just going to awkwardly stand in the corner over here.  :ph34r:


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#78562
CuriousArtemis

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HE CALLED ME GRACEFUL.

 

movies-harry-potter-faint-fainting.gif

 

And then he asked me a question and I flirted and he smiled and said that wasn't really an answer OHMYGOD!!!!!!!


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#78563
Vorathrad

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I can't bring myself to hunt them either. They are beautiful.  I hate killing them in Skyrim too.

Me too. Even if the dovahkiin theme is perfect for putting you in dragon-killing mood, I never liked it. And there is a point when so many of them are attacking you, that I felt really guilty with my pockets full of dragon bones and the strong belief that I was wiping them out.

Trying to stay on topic, I don't recall Solas saying anything about dragons. Does he make any interesting comments?

#78564
MaidenM

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A while back, there was a conversation about a brand of faux-phalli (Which needs to be in the dictionary, dammit!) called Dragon.

I believe Rabbitonfire was one of the perpetrators.  :lol:

If that isn't what she was referring to, and I just made this conversation really weird, then I guess I'm just going to awkwardly stand in the corner over here.  :ph34r:

 

If I know Rabbit, it totally was.

 

If I'm wrong, take comfort in that you where not the only one whose thoughts went there :P


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#78565
Elessara

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Me too. Even if the dovahkiin theme is perfect for putting you in dragon-killing mood, I never liked it. And there is a point when so many of them are attacking you, that I felt really guilty with my pockets full of dragon bones and the strong belief that I was wiping them out.

Trying to stay on topic, I don't recall Solas saying anything about dragons. Does he make any interesting comments?

 

Yes, he says something like ... there is beauty in such raw power.  Or something to that effect.


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#78566
Vorathrad

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A while back, there was a conversation about a brand of faux-phalli (Which needs to be in the dictionary, dammit!) called Dragon.


And here I am speaking of having my pockets full of dragon bones.
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#78567
Caddius

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And here I am speaking of having my pockets full of dragon bones.

 

And here I am speaking of having my pockets full of dragon bones.

That awkward moment when a dragon recognizes his old buddies Carl and Eustace as being your armor...:(


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#78568
MoonDrummer

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That awkward moment when a dragon recognizes his old buddies Carl and Eustace as being your armor...:(

Or that you're beating him to death with his mum's shinbone...
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#78569
NightSymphony

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cryingcartoondragon.gif


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#78570
Vorathrad

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That awkward moment when a dragon recognizes his old buddies Carl and Eustace as being your armor...:(

  

Or that you're beating him to death with his mum's shinbone...


What an awful moment to be out of likes xD

#78571
Giton

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On Alexander's death: here and here.

 

Alexander and the giants, for funsies.

 

On Topic: Theories on how Solas got his scar: 

 

Was thinking about the fade and ran into a door; freak ball accident; wolf vs dragon fight; the first time he took is paramour to a wyvern pit it also did not go well; after yelling "I am a golden God!" and jumping from a roof into a pool during one of Falon'Din's ragers.

 

Edited to add, this is the best book title ever: “Greek Fire, Poison Arrows, & Scorpion Bombs: Biological and Chemical Warfare in the Ancient World” (2009).

 

Bioware needs to add "scorpion bombs" to the next game.


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#78572
laurelinvanyar

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On Topic: Theories on how Solas got his scar: 

 

Was thinking about the fade and ran into a door; freak ball accident; wolf vs dragon fight; the first time he took is paramour to a wyvern pit it also did not go well; after yelling "I am a golden God!" and jumping from a roof into a pool during one of Falon'Din's ragers.

I thought maybe a mabari bit him there like in the stories. Poor guy probably has a dog phobia. 


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#78573
RogueBait

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You could even say it was a Hadrian's Wall of history text.  B)

 

...Okay, okay, I submit myself for execution by the thread.  :lol:

 

k5yKt6u.gif

 



I can't bring myself to hunt them either. They are beautiful.  I hate killing them in Skyrim too.

 

I feel sooo damn guilty every time I kill a dragon. They're all so beautiful and unique and lovely and. Ugh. I killed all ten of them in my current PT. ;___; I needed the trophyyyy.


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#78574
Vorathrad

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Yes, he says something like ... there is beauty in such raw power.  Or something to that effect.


Thanks!

#78575
Moondreamer01

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I thought maybe a mabari bit him there like in the stories. Poor guy probably has a dog phobia. 

 

That scar is pretty round... He just had a ton of acne as a teen and tended to scracth, so it scarred :P


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