153431 réponses à ce sujet

[Maria13]

Thanks Maria

 

Hey, no probs... 

[Moirin]

But, this is basically the "playersexual" conception that the writers previously rejected, because it makes it seem that the NPCs aren't real people, they're romance bots.
 
Sex doesn't negate a spiritual/ intellectual connection. For some people, it's what deepens it.

I understand why they'd choose not to show a sex scene in DAI, because he's deceptive and then dumps her, so players could feel used. Maybe they'll continue to be agnostic about this question in future content. That's fine. To me the fact that you can roleplay Solas and Lavellan as being sexual, means- he's not asexual. Maybe they didn't do the deed for whatever reason, maybe they never would if Lavellan is asexual, but in his own character he sees sex as part of love. That's enough for me. I don't need a fade to black for any further clarity. Of course, I'd welcome a chance to develop the relationship more on screen, if that's what they decide to do in post-game content.

 

Agreed with this, all of this, very much. The fact that they left it up to headcanon on if Solas and Lavellan had sex or not says to me that Solas is definitely not asexual, he's just letting your Lavellan lead when it comes to their intimacy, of course that means if someone's Lavellan is asexual he respects that, which is great.

 

I think a strong case could be argued on Solas being Demi-Heterosexual though (if from what I read about it I'm understanding it correctly).

 

If people want to advocate a character in Inquisition for asexual representation then I think their better bet is Cole tbh.

 

I think Limpstella illustrated exactly what some of our frustrations are with regards to Solas and "our people". 

Spoiler

http://limpstella.tu...ho-can-never-be

 

This accurately sums up my frustration with Solas on this topic. Also when talking about the orb just after Haven is destroyed (before you reach Skyhold) then it's our people too. Solas is so frustrating about this.

 

[Colonelkillabee]

I really don't have to see a scene, and am okay that there isn't one.  However, I very much see Solas as a sexual character.  Even dialogue that is not romance related kind of suggests this, asking Cole if he has an interest in women, and what he says at the Winter Palace in particular.  My Lavellan's definitely did the deed with him (some more than others depending upon their background and personality).  

I am glad that asexual players can enjoy the romance and overlook these things and would not want them to be denied that by adding a scene now.  On the other hand, I'd be really irritated if the character of Solas was changed and made explicitly asexual in future content because he is popular with asexual players, although I don't see that happening either.

For me, it's about as annoying as people ignoring that Solas has a more aggressive side. His sexuality is a part of him, same as Cassandra's soft side, her romantic side is a part of her. Now, I don't care what anyone wants to headcanon for their own personal enjoyment, but why should I personally humor something that clearly goes against a character's personality when brought up in a discussion?

 

His having had sex with Lavellan is different. I mean, I think "side benefits" is rather clear cut no matter what the devs say... but that I can let slide because well, I don't really give two ****s what other people's characters according to them do. But I couldn't humor him supposedly being asexual anymore than I could humor someone saying Cass was a closet lesbian or something. Why bull**** it.

[Colonelkillabee]

I think a strong case could be argued on Solas being Demi-Heterosexual though (if from what I read about it I'm understanding it correctly).

This would be just heterosexual... Attraction for me is strongly tied to emotion, to the point that I'm not truly attracted, like seriously attracted to someone unless I get to know them and get close to them. That just makes me not a hoebag, lol. Not "demisexual".

[Siha]

Funny thing is, it should be so easy to have another checkbox in the settings:

 

[ ] helmets off

[ ] sex scenes off

 

And if checked then just end the scene a few seconds earlier. Stop the scene with Cullen after the kiss, before the Inquisitor knocks down the cup. Let the Solas scene go on after he leaves the balcony. Stop the Blackwall scene before the barn. Let Cass be dressed if the box is checked. And so on. Bull would be difficult to stop because the relationship with him basically evolves around sex. But that's fine, I think, players are warned before and can choose to just let him go. 

[Moirin]

This would be just heterosexual... Attraction for me is strongly tied to emotion, to the point that I'm not truly attracted, like seriously attracted to someone unless I get to know them and get close to them. That just makes me not a hoebag, lol. Not "demisexual".

 

According to that thing Delphine linked us to about Demisexuality there is a difference. Which is why I said "assuming what I read about it is accurate."

 

EDIT: Here it is, read the last sentence.

[Colonelkillabee]

According to that thing Delphine linked us to about Demisexuality there is a difference. Which is why I said "assuming what I read about it is accurate."

It's not, I'm just gonna say that. Not every sexual preference needs its own sexuality.

 

When "Asssexual" becomes a sexuality that's socially accepted by Tumblrinas, then I'll humor it. Till then, I classify it as bs and everyone wanting to be a special snowflake.

[Moirin]

It's not, I'm just gonna say that. Not every sexual preference needs its own sexuality.

 

When "Asssexual" becomes a sexuality that's socially accepted by Tumblrinas, then I'll humor it. Till then, I classify it as bs and everyone wanting to be a special snowflake.

 

I think if people want the label they can have the label, and if they don't and just wanna say they are heterosexual then that's fine too. Not my place to judge people on how they label their own sexuality.

[Catfishers]

I also don't need a sex scene to be shown in a romance for the romance to feel "complete" or to establish a level of intimacy. The Solavellan romance arc's story will feel complete not through the inclusion of a scene where they have sex but when the questions it raises are answered and Lavellan has some form of closure or resolution, whatever form that may take - getting back together, not getting back together, whatever. Furthermore the intimacy and closeness between the two is evident to me already from the way the romance was written, from the things he says to her, from the way it's choreographed - consider the way they walk together in the final scene.

 

I was somewhat surprised to find myself completely unbothered by the lack of sex scene. It seemed like I should have felt like we were 'missing out', but I really didn't miss it. Not only that, but I don't particularly feel the need for them to have any sort of sex scene in the future.

 

I certainly feel like he and my Lavellan had a sexual relationship. Or, at least, a relationship with sexual intent. But I've always read a certain degree of hesitance into Solas' interactions with Lavellan, as if the times they are truly intimate (or, I suppose, sexual) are very much lapses in his self-control. I almost think he'd try to avoid sex, not because he didn't want it, but perhaps out of fear that Lavellan might eventually feel used? Or to try and make their eventual parting easier? I don't know, he always seems so torn.

 

But maybe I'm in the minority with that reading?

[Addai]

According to that thing Delphine linked us to about Demisexuality there is a difference. Which is why I said "assuming what I read about it is accurate."
 
EDIT: Here it is, read the last sentence.

And I think it's kind of silly we have to make new -isms for things that are just the normal range of human sexuality. But hey, whatever you want to call it.

[Patchwork]

Funny thing is, it should be so easy to have another checkbox in the settings:

 

[ ] helmets off

[ ] sex scenes off

 

And if checked then just end the scene a few seconds earlier. Stop the scene with Cullen after the kiss, before the Inquisitor knocks down the cup. Let the Solas scene go on after he leaves the balcony. Stop the Blackwall scene before the barn. Let Cass be dressed if the box is checked. And so on. Bull would be difficult to stop because the relationship with him basically evolves around sex. But that's fine, I think, players are warned before and can choose to just let him go. 

 

My concern is that if such a setting exists then the demands for a No Homosexuality checkbox will gain traction. 

 

I think the way it's handled with Dorian and Blackwall is best, you can choose to have sex with them or not and the relationship carries on regardless. 

[Colonelkillabee]

I think if people want the label they can have the label, and if they don't and just wanna say they are heterosexual then that's fine too. Not my place to judge people on how they label their own sexuality.

Well from here on, I'm asssexual and I want to be represented in this discussion too since Solas is clearly an asssexual.

[Siha]

I tried to research this. There is no scientific notion of "demisexual" (yet). Research might be started in the future but so far there is no such thing, at least nothing published. That term is sort of a "self-description" by people who want to distinguish themselves from "normal hetero/homosexuals".
So I go by Wikipedia, which does not have an own article on "demisexuality" but is willing to mention it in the article on asexuality. It speaks of a sexual attraction being the result "once a reasonably stable or large emotional connection has been created". I personally think that falls into "normal" boundaries of hetero/homosexuality. But if people wish to have an own term for this trait of character, why not.

 

However, anybody who feels even any initial attraction to another person based on outer appearance or anything else is not demisexual. The basic assumption seems to be that you must know this person really well, at least as a longer term close friend, until you even start to acknowledge he's of any gender at all or might be a potential mate in the first place. I think this is true for very very few people only. But looking at somebody, thinking him attractive, and only not sleeping with him because of a desire to get to know him better first, that's just "normal". And it's nearly sad that our world suddenly needs an own term for this.

[Mims]

So far games have yet to create a sex scene that doesn't read to me like awkward puppets flopping around with each other. So I don't really mind if they never have a sex scene with Solas [or Josie]. I don't need to see something overtly to know that it happened with my particular Lavellan.

 

And ultimately I dislike this sort of tumblr mentality that one side needs to win above the other. 

[Moirin]

I tried to research this. There is no scientific notion of "demisexual" (yet). Research might be started in the future but so far there is no such thing, at least nothing published. That term is sort of a "self-description" by people who want to distinguish themselves from "normal hetero/homosexuals".
So I go by Wikipedia, which does not have an own article on "demisexuality" but is willing to mention it in the article on asexuality. It speaks of a sexual attraction being the result "once a reasonably stable or large emotional connection has been created". I personally think that falls into "normal" boundaries of hetero/homosexuality. But if people wish to have an own term for this trait of character, why not.

 

However, anybody who feels even any initial attraction to another person based on outer appearance or anything else is not demisexual. The basic assumption seems to be that you must know this person really well, at least as a longer term close friend, until you even start to acknowledge he's of any gender at all or might be a potential mate in the first place. I think this is true for very very few people only. But looking at somebody, thinking him attractive, and only not sleeping with him because of a desire to get to know him better first, that's just "normal". And it's nearly sad that our world suddenly needs an own term for this.

 

Like I said, I was referring to the information I was given (which I linked above, but here it is again, the last sentence is what I was referring to), as you are basing your information on what you read, I can't really claim to have all the knowledge on the topic. Labels are labels and people take the one they like in the end.

 

Anyway, I never claimed Solas was or wasn't, I simply said it could be argued. It's not as if I am stubbornly trying to defend that he is demisexual or demi-hetero, I wasn't advocating for either side here.

[Siha]

Like I said, I was referring to the information I was given (which I linked above, but here it is again, the last sentence is what I was referring to), as you are basing your information on what you read, I can't really claim to have all the knowledge on the topic. Labels are labels and people take the one they like in the end.

 

Anyway, I never claimed Solas was or wasn't, I simply said it could be argued. It's not as if I am stubbornly trying to defend that he is demisexual or demi-hetero, I wasn't advocating for either side here.

 

Neither was the point of my post, which is also why I did not quote you; I was not speaking to you. I don't care what or what not he is. I simply tried to find out a definition for the term, found there is no scientific one, and explained what I did find and where it leads to.

[Heidirs]

sex or no, I do wish we had one of two more scenes with Solas. The first time I played, I honestly felt the relationship to be a bit wishy washy. After the first scene, he says he needs time to consider. In the second, he nearly walks away, then kisses you, then walks out. In the third, he says he wants to show you what you mean to him, and if you pick the "i know" option, the dialogue is "You're my..."  and he says "That is the question, isn't it?"

 

of course, you can pick different dialogue options to different effects. But I still wonder how solidified of a relationship they had.

 

Maybe it is all up to interpretation?

[Solas]

So far games have yet to create a sex scene that doesn't read to me like awkward puppets flopping around with each other. So I don't really mind if they never have a sex scene with Solas [or Josie]. I don't need to see something overtly to know that it happened with my particular Lavellan.

 

And ultimately I dislike this sort of tumblr mentality that one side needs to win above the other. 

I see a subset of the sexual!Solas fandom and a subset of the asexual!Solas fandom arguing regularly on Tumblr, both sides can be aggressive and insistent and it's generally unpleasant. I never get involved, I feel kind of in-between or removed from the two communities anyway.

 

My preference is that it's kept open/not one way or the other because yeah it's not a contest or something. :S

[zambixi]

sex or no, I do wish we had one of two more scenes with Solas. The first time I played, I honestly felt the relationship to be a bit wishy washy. After the first scene, he says he needs time to consider. In the second, he nearly walks away, then kisses you, then walks out. In the third, he says he wants to show you what you mean to him, and if you pick the "i know" option, the dialogue is "You're my..."  and he says "That is the question, isn't it?"

 

of course, you can pick different dialogue options to different effects. But I still wonder how solidified of a relationship they had.

 

Maybe it is all up to interpretation?

 

Don't care about the sex scene - Bioware's sex scenes aren't particularly well animated anyway - but I 100% wish we had more scenes. We get three for the romance and two of those are "normal" scenes with the romance part added at the end. Even if you're friends with him, it seems he lacks content (though maybe not as much as Vivienne lacks content).

 

If Inquisition is supposed to be happening over a three year period, their relationship should have been more intimate regardless of whether that relationship is sexual, romantic, or platonic. The first playthrough didn't seem as sparse because I rushed through it (to get to all the romance content), but this time the romance (and a lot of the other companion relationships -- I finished Dorian's whole questline right after Haven) seems really empty.

[nikki-tikki]

Can we please not bring deep space tumblr stuff in here...

[Mims]

I'd have definitely enjoyed another scene or two. Unfortunately that was more of a budget casualty. 

 

Most of it is up to your assessment of when the romance started, and whether or not it got intimate. [Physically or otherwise.] There's certainly enough dialogue options and comments by other people to infer whatever you'd like. If you wanted them to only be flirting, then that's a valid read. But you could also consider them having a substantially more close relationship too.

 

One of the things angry Lavellan yells at him after the break up is to ask him to admit she was a 'casual' dalliance. Sex or not- that implies whatever it was they had was far from casual. Otherwise she wouldn't have been as angry as she was. There would have been no expectation of anything more. 

 

I see a subset of the sexual!Solas fandom and a subset of the asexual!Solas fandom arguing regularly on Tumblr, both sides can be aggressive and insistent and it's generally unpleasant. I never get involved, I feel kind of in-between or removed from the two communities anyway.

 

My preference is that it's kept open/not one way or the other because yeah it's not a contest or something. :S

 

Yeah, I feel similarly. Its great that both sides enjoy the romance. Why would you want to deprive either side of enjoying something? There's nothing to argue over.

 

Character canons are going to change from game to game. This always happens. Lavellan can be a wide range of people, and yet most of us tend to assume that their particular character feels the most 'right'. That's only natural. Its a game, so as long as you don't kill spirit friend or punch him in the face, Solas is going to 'approve' of your character. Even if in your particular game, you might think: "Well, I don't see Solas liking that sort of person." 

 

Its the same situation, just with sexuality. Different people filling in the blanks. 

[Addai]

So far games have yet to create a sex scene that doesn't read to me like awkward puppets flopping around with each other. So I don't really mind if they never have a sex scene with Solas [or Josie]. I don't need to see something overtly to know that it happened with my particular Lavellan.
 
And ultimately I dislike this sort of tumblr mentality that one side needs to win above the other.

One side is going to "win" in that, he either is or isn't. The devs have said they don't like the notion of playersexuality. Of course, an individual can have a range of sexual expression throughout their lifetime, too.

Anyway, I see Solas as sexual, but if PW says he's asexual, that will be that as far as I'm concerned. And it could affect how I view the character. I could no longer see Fenris x f!Hawke in the same light when I learned Gaider wrote the romance for male Hawke. It made more sense that way so Fenris x f!Hawke no longer seemed plausible. And I probably couldn't plausibly see Solavellan as asexual, either. But that's the breaks. Characters are what they are, and I prefer that they be fleshed out even if it means it affects my PC.

[yetanothername]

I think the question in this case is not about trying to win one way or the other, but finding it strange to divide the opinions into two and weigh them the same - much like if, to use another's example, a subset of people decided to interpret something Cassandra said as meaning she was secretly into women. Having someone suggest that they not be ruled out because they are equally likely just seems strange. Certainly they should not be maligned for their opinions or fantasies any more than anyone else, especially about fictional characters - but others do not feel compelled to weigh those interpretations equally against the representations in game and by devs, either.

 

No one wants to feel they are being made to look like they are intolerant because they think someone was portrayed well (or word-of-godded) as one thing while some are happy to imagine differently. *weighs hands* Some people like to imagine that Iron Bull is Elgar'nan - should it never be contradicted to allow those fantasies to live? It's a difficult thing to discuss because of the lack of representation different groups have, so it gets uglier faster.

 

In the case of Solas, many are fine with no specific scene - I certainly get the devs avoiding it with some already feeling personally used (not character story, personally abused) by events, but our arguments as ever revolve as much around why a course of action is taken as what that course is. This has been your random dose of Why Lurkers Lurk. Have a nice day.

[Mims]

One side is going to "win" in that, he either is or isn't. The devs have said they don't like the notion of playersexuality. Of course, an individual can have a range of sexual expression throughout their lifetime, too.

Anyway, I see Solas as sexual, but if PW says he's asexual, that will be that as far as I'm concerned. And it could affect how I view the character. I could no longer see Fenris x f!Hawke in the same light when I learned Gaider wrote the romance for male Hawke. It made more sense that way so Fenris x f!Hawke no longer seemed plausible. And I probably couldn't plausibly see Solavellan as asexual, either. But that's the breaks. Characters are what they are, and I prefer that they be fleshed out even if it means it affects my PC.

 

He's already said that he left it up to the player to decide. So unless he goes back on saying it- no side is going to win. There's no need to. It just isn't written as a romance that needs that sort of clearcut answer. 

 

As far as Fenris goes, sure. But he's still an option for female Hawke. On top of that, he has a relationship with Isabella. That's what made it into the game, so they didn't seem to think it broke canon. Saying that FHawkexFenris isn't plausible doesn't seem fair. I doubt very much Gaidar was implying that he felt that his hand had been forced when he chose to let Fenris be romanced by female players. 

 

[Saying this as someone who has little stake in Fenris romance, as it isn't my canon.] 

[Moirin]

If Inquisition is supposed to be happening over a three year period, their relationship should have been more intimate regardless of whether that relationship is sexual, romantic, or platonic. The first playthrough didn't seem as sparse because I rushed through it (to get to all the romance content), but this time the romance (and a lot of the other companion relationships -- I finished Dorian's whole questline right after Haven) seems really empty.

 

Did we have a timeline for how long Inquisition took?