153429 réponses à ce sujet

[Siha]

I don't mean to imply it's acceptable to others here in real life, I just don't find it attractive even in fiction. I don't know.

 

I admit I am not quite sure if I understand correctly. However, to the last bit at least: I am not so sure about the intention of the writers. I do not believe they try to wipe away negative traits of character, like close-mindedness and discrimination, or especially try to write a controversial character (at least not regarding Solas; concerning other characters I am not so sure). I think the issue here is rather that they try to build him up:

 

First we only see the fable of the dread wolf, no clear picture. Everything is negative and bad about him, he is evil incarnate. Now they want to show us a broken character who struggles with how he is perceived while at the same time his pride makes him disregard it (emotional dilemma). I am not sure where they will go, maybe this is a reverse approach and they will end up showing us what he used to be like, before something twisted how he is interpreted (as this "dreadful wolf"); i.e. maybe they started off by showing us a "bad" character and now try to explain, in small steps, how it came to be. Basically open our eyes to see how nothing is so simply good or bad. They do like this. Think of Saren in ME1, who we got to know as the big bad and in the end we had to understand that he was just so helpless. Similar approach with TIM in ME2/ME3.

 

I fear, and of course I might be wrong, that the issues that arise from this approach, are mostly due to two factors, which are budget and time between games. They scratch the surface with a few short cut scenes and additionally expect from the player to keep it all in mind and to keep an open mind until they reveal the next bit 5 years later. I felt this way about Flemythal, too. First she was a fable, the Witch from the Wilds, then she was a nice old lady, then she was a monstrous soul eater, then she was this monstrous soul eater in awesome clothing, then we didn't actually know what she was anymore. And in the end? In the end is she Mythal, a prototypical mother figure, a divine incarnation that represents (how close) love (is related to punishment).

 

Ok, I am beginning to lose the thread here. Sorry.

 

TLTR:

I think the intentions and what is transported probably diverge at this point. But I don't believe the authors try to excuse something. I don't even think they thought some people would interpret it as "racism". Maybe they thought everybody would just see this broken, lonely wolf that starts to snap at everyone around in the face of his own helplessness. I could be wrong, but I think the authors have to struggle with so much discrimination and bashing every day, I don't want to believe they would be so tactless.

 

This is, however, completely unrelated from people interpreting it all as racism and excusing it. Which I dislike, in fiction or reality.

[The Oracle]

I'm going to bed. This is all just too much adorable for my brain to handle. Night folks.

[Colonelkillabee]

All this talk of Solas' departure reminded me of a Metallica song (everything reminds me of Metallica, lol):

 

https://youtu.be/nYSDC3cHoZs

 

http://www.azlyrics....idisappear.html

[KarateKats]

Finally rolled out of bed... so many pages to read. I bet Rabbit lit someone on fire or something.

[Illyria]

This is good, because my Lavellan is going to own a million.

 

 

Could've fooled me.  Dude keeps accidentally killing them in my game.  Pull of the Abyss + Fire Mine is awesome but indiscriminate.

 

 

Every time chain lightning kills some random animal instead of the dudes standing right there I die a little inside.

 

No nug killing is allowed in-game. I'd like to think my characters have put an outright ban on it and informed all their companions. Cole totally agrees. The others just note it down as one of the Inquisitors more baffling eccentricities. Leliana, while never saying it out allowed, secretly greatly approves and it's one of the reasons she doesn't go craycray and stab the Inquisitor in the eyeball. 

 

Glad I'm not the only one who hates killing nugs.  I also hate killing snufflers because of their adorable nickname but they drop amazing leather.  And I can't buy it anywhere

 

Solas has a tendency to aggro peacful creatures.  He sometimes goes into combat in the Emerald Graves and starts killing nugs, and he once managed to aggro every bogfisher in the Fallow Mire.

[Colonelkillabee]

snip

Yes, I don't like it when people excuse the negative traits of anyone, same as I don't like people to blow it out of proportion either. It's a part of his character, that his arrogance and also his inexperience with these races makes him look down on them as a whole. Otherwise, he'd not act so surprised at inquisitor's so called "wisdom" (putting aside for a moment that this is the typical special snowflake mary sue acknowledgement). But while it should be acknowledged, it should also be taken into consideration that this was him in a moment of anger, and as pointed out, his comment was past tense.

 

It's still pretty shitty that he'd make a sweeping statement of an entire race based off of one man or woman, but hey. No one's perfect. Accept that this is a part of his character, appreciate the complexity. All of that, but excusing it would also be as much a disservice to him as getting hung up over it would.

[Taelaa]

His real hatred is reserved for the Qun not the Qunari themselves.

 

This is an important distinction, because, as IB pointed out Qunari isn't what they call the race, it's their belief system. It's impossible to be racist against a belief system all by itself and it is the belief system that Solas has a problem with.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Solas has a tendency to aggro peacful creatures.  He sometimes goes into combat in the Emerald Graves and starts killing nugs, and he once managed to aggro every bogfisher in the Fallow Mire.

 

Solas went on a bogfisher murder rampage in the DLC Frostback Basin.  Apparently the middle of a fight against angry Avvar is the perfect time to try and decimate the local population 

[Colonelkillabee]

Damn, the thread went dead for longer than I expected And after so much activity too. I think that Solas does indeed hate specifically the Qun, though if I told you that I hated Islam, I'm sure a lot of people would call me racist. And I indeed do have my issues with Islam. I don't hate Arabs and Muslims, however. I am sure it's the same here, remembering of course that this is not a perfect analogy.

[RogueBait]

And I'm out of likes. Unsurprising.

 

I don't think I was doing a good job of expressing my thoughts on what's going on with Solas (and the whole discrimination debate) in the first place, and stopped being able to form coherent thoughts entirely as soon as the cute little cat appeared.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ So I jumped onto the heartwarming animal stories train pretty hard. Still there, in fact. No regrets.

 

I'd much see him surrounded by bunnies though. But I'm sure he'd love cats as well. He's the type to love everything, and I can relate to that. (If I had the financial means, my home probably would be a gigantic shelter/field for all kinds of animals in need).

 

This has basically been my lifelong mantra, practically word for word. My husband worries one day it will be so.

 

I wonder if Cole can read animals the same way he can read people.  Maybe he's able to tell if they're cold or sick or hungry, and he gathers them up in his hat and takes them back to the tavern.

 

Stahp, this is too much heartwarming for me. _

 

Feeling the strong urge to sketch Solas cuddling a needy kitty to balance out these cute Cole+animal artworks.

[yetanothername]

This is an important distinction, because, as IB pointed out Qunari isn't what they call the race, it's their belief system. It's impossible to be racist against a belief system all by itself and it is the belief system that Solas has a problem with.

 

He certainly has 100%, unapologetic issues with the Qun, but I don't think this is what is anyone was referring to. Some comments were not about the belief system or its followers, but about the giant horned people themselves. I believe this is most prominent in Adaar's balcony scene. I think we were just discussing the intention behind the words or if it's reserved for specific sets of people or, etc. Some of us live in caves because we talk too much when we leave them, though. It's a little stereotypically hermit, I suppose.

[yetanothername]

<snip>

 

Thank you for clarifying, I'm with you on all of this.

[Addai]

Damn, the thread went dead for longer than I expected And after so much activity too. I think that Solas does indeed hate specifically the Qun, though if I told you that I hated Islam, I'm sure a lot of people would call me racist. And I indeed do have my issues with Islam. I don't hate Arabs and Muslims, however. I am sure it's the same here, remembering of course that this is not a perfect analogy.

It's hard to separate people who identify so closely with a philosophy that they subsume their entire will and personality to it. What is hating a philosophy anyway? If it's not held or practiced, ideology is just a dead thing. It's when people implement it that things happen.

[Meer]

Finally rolled out of bed... so many pages to read. I bet Rabbit lit someone on fire or something.

Spoiler

 

I missed you so much today Carrie. It was lonely going, but our bone-faced people were well represented.

[Colonelkillabee]

It's hard to separate people who identify so closely with a philosophy that they subsume their entire will and personality to it. What is hating a philosophy anyway? If it's not held or practiced, ideology is just a dead thing. It's when people implement it that things happen.

Indeed, though one still has to recognize the difference. I don't consider disliking things about someone the same as hating them personally. If I did, there'd be a lot of people I call friends now that wouldn't be with that train of thought. They don't become important unless someone gives me a reason to let it get in the way of how I feel about them.

 

The people themselves who dislike that might not see it that way, but that's not important. What the individual thinks is.

[KarateKats]

I missed you so much today Carrie. It was lonely going, but our bone-faced people were well represented.

Spoiler

Thank you for carrying on while I slept the sweet dreams of our skeleton-kind.

[BoscoBread]

http://kissiebear.tu...-tale-under-the

 

Hobo Solas Returns in an Exciting PART 3

[legbamel]

Life conspired today to bring me Parlez-Vous Français while liz's

Spoiler

Creeper Solas was lunging about my screen and now I imagine him dancing around the Emerald Graves singing this song but, y’know, with elvhen in place of French.  He only does this when Sara and Lavellan are in the party, naturally, to see if they have a sense of rhythm.  The rhythm of the language, of course.  Not some sort of naughty, heaving, other kind of rhythm.  Ahem.

 

I spoilered the creeper because it's huge.    I'm finally fewer than 200 pages behind so I may have something more...lore-appropriate and related to the conversation to contribute by the end of my life the weekend.

[Addai]

Indeed, though one still has to recognize the difference. I don't consider disliking things about someone the same as hating them personally. If I did, there'd be a lot of people I call friends now that wouldn't be with that train of thought. They don't become important unless someone gives me a reason to let it get in the way of how I feel about them.
 
The people themselves who dislike that might not see it that way, but that's not important. What the individual thinks is.

I agree, though it's definitely easier with people who hold their ideologies loosely. I'm sure what Solas dislikes in particular is that the Qunari intend to impose their ideology on everyone in Thedas. I don't think his outlook qualifies as racism, even though that word has been abused to meaninglessness so I'm sure a case could be made. He doesn't think Bull is incapable of rising above the Qun, he's just not surprised if he doesn't. His view is more cynicism than racism. Also he applies it pretty equally to elves.

[RogueBait]

Since the friendship chat contingent of this thread has fallen so hard for Affirmation Skeletor:

 

Spoiler

 

(It's Solas and Lavellan.)

[Rabbitonfire]

http://kissiebear.tu...-tale-under-the

 

Hobo Solas Returns in an Exciting PART 3

Just show it: 

 

(NSFW) Puppet/dog fur/kitchy furniture Trigger:

Spoiler

http://vhenantrash.t...ne-of-my-spirit

 

edit: whoever did the tags on vhenantrash made me laugh.

[RogueBait]

Just show it: 

 

(NSFW) Puppet/dog fur/kitchy furniture Trigger:

Spoiler

 

I think I want that furniture set. My home could rock the **** outta that.

[Colonelkillabee]

The things we do to the ones we love the most. lol

[Sable Rhapsody]

The things we do to the ones we love the most. lol

 

It's a complicated relationship on Facebook 

[Rabbitonfire]

The things we do to the ones we love the most. lol

Why haven't you made a Cassandra parady? I want to see an otaku.