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[BoscoBread]

I think if you're playing a Lav you owe it to yourself from the start to have a bit of an argy bargy with him...

 

After all you must have some sort of faith in your cultural background since you agreed to act as a spy for you clan at the conclave... I would head canon that Solas would have a little less respect for someone who immediately acquiesces to him slagging off their people anyway...

Ugh, this.  I get that if you're like "Lav: The Super Dalish" that you and Solas will NEVER get a long. But I think that can be said about ANYONE that is so intractable in their world views that they can't listen and acknowledge that there may be other points to consider. 

 

I didn't even headcanon as Mega-Dalish, but like... my Lavellan is still Dalish. She would still treasure that. Her up-bringing.  The vallaslin.  She knows Solas thinks he means well when he says certain things and as a player I know a lot of it his anger is borne out of desperation to make a connection with the elves of this time because he's so alone, but like...she's proud of who she is and where she came from.  She's willing to hear him out and acknowledge that some things about their history are wrong, but the Dalish aren't just "their history". They much more than that. They built their own traditions. Made their own stories.  So in short, I like to think that Solas would understand that pride too.  Or at least that confident sense of self. 

[Moirin]

Especially since Solas can actually be there when you meet her in some cases. Like...hey, here's your "oldest friend" and you're not even a little shocked that she's a shem now and also not gonna mention anything to your Dalish girlfriend who's confused as all get out right now? Oh, alright sure, tell me more about how I should harden my heart thanks.

 

^{_{I'm not bitter}}

 

To be fair Solas isn't actually there when you meet Mythal, even when you summon her. All the companions take a momentary hike so to speak. Tbh, I'm pretty sure Solas would have made himself scarce anyway with Mythal coming around. If he doesn't want you to know who he is yet I doubt he would risk it.

[Jaison1986]

*Looks at Sera thread* *Laughs*

 

I swear, every time someone dislikes a female character, it's not long before someone starts yapping about sexism. As if it's just dudes disliking characters like her and Bianca.

 

Tell me about it. Cassandra, Vivienne and Sera are the companions I like the least in Inquisition. And aparently, It's because they're woman. And the funny thing is that most of my favourite characters in the series are female. Bethany, Morrigan, Leliana, Aveline, Shale, Sigrun. And I would defend these girls to the end of the earth. People love using the sexism card to shut down the argument. I don't dislike someone for their gender, I dislike them for their character.

[Cee]

Precisely. I don't care how passive I am. When someone insults something important to me to my face, chances are I'm not going to respond warmly. He asked for that.

 

He may not necessarily approve of your disagreeing with him, but I don't think he disapproves, either. Take the balcony scene. Answering "Yes" to his querying you if he misjudged the Dalish, and you don't net disapproval. He doesn't approve, but looking from his perspective, he did just see one of his stubbornly held beliefs shot down. Honestly, I wouldn't be keen on approving of that, either, even if I did accept it. Which, I don't see him as accepting it exactly, so much as seeing it from your point of view. I think he still holds plenty of grievances concerning the Dalish, but I think that scene shows him softening toward them. That's just my take on it, anyway.

 

That's what I chose originally, and it was interesting later that I found out he approves if you take credit for yourself but then he also kind of relents and even mentions that you deserve that but the Dalish probably still influenced you.

 

It's like, you're sort of reinforcing his idea that you're some sort of anomaly with that and he approves, but then even sort of meets you half way.

 

Still, I thought on my first playthrough that taking full credit sounded out of character and...arrogant? Especially since I RPed it straight early about her customs and gods.
 

[ComedicSociopathy]

To be fair Solas isn't actually there when you meet Mythal, even when you summon her. All the companions take a momentary hike so to speak. Tbh, I'm pretty sure Solas would have made himself scarce anyway with Mythal coming around. If he doesn't want you to know who he is yet I doubt he would risk it.

 

Still doesn't explain why no one even seems to aware that you meeting her even happened. It's sort of big thing after all. 

[Addai]

*Looks at Sera thread* *Laughs*

 

I swear, every time someone dislikes a female character, it's not long before someone starts yapping about sexism. As if it's just dudes disliking characters like her and Bianca.

We're gender traitors. 

 

I'm not sure any DA minor character can rival Cammen for hate. But let us not speak of that abomination.

[ComedicSociopathy]

Tell me about. Cassandra, Vivienne and Sera are the companions I like the least in Inquisition. And aparently, It's because they're woman. And the funny thing is that most of my favourite characters in the series are female. Bethany, Morrigan, Leliana, Aveline, Shale, Sigrun. And I would defend these girls to the end of the earth. People love using the sexism card to shut down the argument. I don't dislike someone for their gender, I dislike them for their character.

 

Well, that's dumb. I mean unless your arguments against those three are that there unattractive or something else ridiculous like that then I really don't see why the sexism card is being used. 

[ComedicSociopathy]

We're gender traitors. 

 

I'm not sure any DA minor character can rival Cammen for hate. But let us not speak of that abomination.

 

What's wrong with Cammen? 

[Colonelkillabee]

Wait, what? Whose using the sexism defense for Sera? 

Just check the last two or three pages in their thread. Some funny ****. If anything they should take it as a compliment, the male characters in this game aren't interesting enough to the plot to grant the same level of discussion, even if it is negative.

 

You know, besides Loghain. And Anders. Two of the most hated characters in the series ever, and moreso than every hated female character combined.

 

But na, we just hate women. Brb, gonna go slap my mother who I hate so much for having a vagina.

[zambixi]

Still doesn't explain why no one even seems to aware that you meeting her even happened. It's sort of big thing after all. 

 

Combination of hand-waving in the writing and the fact that few would believe you even if you told them. I mean we're talking about the organization that asks you "are you sure you're not the Herald?" right up until the end of the game. Admitting you'd met Mythal to most of them would probably get a lot of side-eye and questions of your mental health. Omitting a reaction from Solas though? I think that's just 100% the writers not wanting to reveal more than they're ready for.

 

 

Well, that's dumb. I mean unless your arguments against those three are that there unattractive or something else ridiculous like that then I really don't see why the sexism card is being used. 

 

Sexism goes so far beyond whether or not someone is attractive, or even things obviously related to gender/sex that this isn't a catch-all defense against sexism. But I would really, really like to avoid this topic of conversation as it can get ugly very quickly.

[Addai]

What's wrong with Cammen? 

 

Where's Skadi from the old forum. I need her right now.

[ComedicSociopathy]

Just check the last two or three pages in their thread. Some funny ****. If anything they should take it as a compliment, the male characters in this game aren't interesting enough to the plot to grant the same level of discussion, even if it is negative.

 

You know, besides Loghain. And Anders. Two of the most hated characters in the series ever, and moreso than every hated female character combined.

 

But na, we just hate women. Brb, gonna go slap my mother who I hate so much for having a vagina.

 

Ignore them. They don't know you and they don't know your honest opinions about women. Their just being weird right now for... reasons. 

[nikki-tikki]

Out of curiosity, what other motives do you think the Nightmare had?

 

I had a theory that the nightmare may or may not have been the same Fear entity that Dirthamen had. Headcannon of course though. I just wanted to see if there were things I could tie them together with. 

[Moirin]

Still doesn't explain why no one even seems to aware that you meeting her even happened. It's sort of big thing after all. 

 

Leliana asks about it at the war table doesn't she? I don't remember.

 

But I wasn't saying it was an excuse for the companions to not ask about summoning Mythal, I was a bit confused by that as well. My guess is that they simply don't know about the eluvian/fade meeting and if you summon her they are more awe struck about the dragon summoning or something? Solas probably just avoids the subject on purpose however.

[ComedicSociopathy]

 

Where's Skadi from the old forum. I need her right now.

 

He's kind of pathetic I guess, but honestly he seems barely worthy of mention.  

[Maria13]

Ugh, this.  I get that if you're like "Lav: The Super Dalish" that you and Solas will NEVER get a long. But I think that can be said about ANYONE that is so intractable in their world views that they can't listen and acknowledge that there may be other points to consider. 

 

I didn't even headcanon as Mega-Dalish, but like... my Lavellan is still Dalish. She would still treasure that. Her up-bringing.  The vallaslin.  She knows Solas thinks he means well when he says certain things and as a player I know a lot of it his anger is borne out of desperation to make a connection with the elves of this time because he's so alone, but like...she's proud of who she is and where she came from.  She's willing to hear him out and acknowledge that some things about their history are wrong, but the Dalish aren't just "their history". They much more than that. They built their own traditions. Made their own stories.  So in short, I like to think that Solas would understand that pride too.  Or at least that confident sense of self. 

 

This: respect garners respect.

 

Sure, the Dalish are wrong on some things and so is the ancient elven god... Who was sleeping for all those centuries after the fall... I don't blame him for that, no, but if you're going to criticize me at least try my shoes for size first.

 

I think Solas really does mellow and moderates his ideas towards the end.

[Colonelkillabee]

Sexism goes so far beyond whether or not someone is attractive, or even things obviously related to gender/sex that this isn't a catch-all defense against sexism.

Like racism, sexism loses all meaning when people start claiming things not "obviously" related to the topic at hand are sexist and racist.

 

Because what is "obvious" is relative, and it's also speculative. The end result of this mentality is that everyone starts pointing fingers yelling sexism this, racism that. And we all leave the discussion dumber for it.

[Cee]

We're gender traitors. 

 

I'm not sure any DA minor character can rival Cammen for hate. But let us not speak of that abomination.

 

People dislike Cammen?

 

As for hate rival, Habren Bryland comes to mind.

[zambixi]

This: respect garners respect.

 

Sure, the Dalish are wrong on some things and so is the ancient elven god... Who was sleeping for all those centuries after the fall... I don't blame him for that, no, but if you're going to criticize me at least try my shoes for size first.

 

I think Solas really does mellow and moderates his ideas towards the end.

 

I hope that his views become more moderate; sometimes I worry that it's more just an extraordinary level of exceptionalism though. Or that his views are becoming more moderate against his better wishes (Cole's lines about "it means everyone could be real but it can't" come to mind). Like the worst possible thing in the world would be that he's wrong. Which makes sense, because the last few times he's been wrong have been borderline-catastrophic.

 

Not really sure what I'm saying here. I agree with you, but also wonder if he's doing his best to ignore that his views are becoming more moderate because that's a challenge to his reasoning regarding his future plans.

[Addai]

Like racism, sexism loses all meaning when people start claiming things not "obviously" related to the topic at hand are sexist and racist.

 

Because what is "obvious" is relative, and it's also speculative. The end result of this mentality is that everyone starts pointing fingers yelling sexism this, racism that. And we all leave the discussion dumber for it.

It's also a charge you can never defend against, because people can just lob it and don't need a reason. "You just hate her because she's female." Well, she is female, and I dislike her, so.... AHA! It must be true. Well what about all the female characters I really like? Irrelevant!

 

People dislike Cammen?

 

As for hate rival, Habren Bryland comes to mind.

Oh man. We're definitely not in the old forums anymore.

 

He should have been traded to the shems for scrap metal.

[ComedicSociopathy]

People dislike Cammen?

 

As for hate rival, Habren Bryland comes to mind.

 

Jowan gets the minor character hate prize for me. 

[ComedicSociopathy]

It's also a charge you can never defend against, because people can just lob it and don't need a reason. "You just hate her because she's female." Well, she is female, and I dislike her, so.... AHA! It must be true. Well what about all the female characters I really like? Irrelevant!

 

Yeah! You say it, Addai! It just like how people get accused for hating a character just because their an elf. Ridiculous, right. 

 

Oh man. We're definitely not in the old forums anymore.

 

He should have been traded to the shems for scrap metal.

 

Is it because he couldn't become a hunter? Traditions are important and all but that shouldn't come in the way of two people falling in love. 

 

Or is it because the female Warden can manipulate him into sleeping with her? The same can happen to Ghenya though. 

[BoscoBread]

I hope that his views become more moderate; sometimes I worry that it's more just an extraordinary level of exceptionalism though. Or that his views are becoming more moderate against his better wishes (Cole's lines about "it means everyone could be real but it can't" come to mind). Like the worst possible thing in the world would be that he's wrong. Which makes sense, because the last few times he's been wrong have been borderline-catastrophic.

 

Not really sure what I'm saying here. I agree with you, but also wonder if he's doing his best to ignore that his views are becoming more moderate because that's a challenge to his reasoning regarding his future plans.

I think that's going to be the key with his character growth later on.  I think - if you were friends with him/romanced - he may be able to be convinced that he's not always right and that's ok.  But  agree, I think that as his views become more...open-minded...he's going to be rejecting that even more.  He will have to face, sooner rather than later, his time with the Inquisition changed him.  I think it will be recognizing that he's not alone and that he belongs in this tims and this world.  Will probably be pretty powerful stuff if done well.  

 

 

Oh man. We're definitely not in the old forums anymore.

 

He should have been traded to the shems for scrap metal.

Haha. I laughed at that. Oh Cammen, you are the worst.

[Colonelkillabee]

 

Or is it because the female Warden can manipulate him into sleeping with her? The same can happen to Ghenya though. 

10/10 would hit that elven glory again XD

[BoscoBread]

Yeah! You say it, Addai! It just like how people get accused for hating a character just because their an elf. Ridiculous, right. 

 

 

Is it because he couldn't become a hunter? Traditions are important and all but that shouldn't come in the way of two people falling in love. 

 

Or is it because the female Warden can manipulate him into sleeping with her? The same can happen to Ghenya though. 

For me, it was the fact that he seemed to be a living breathing wet rag. Also that the felt his relationship issues were my problem. " I don't know you dude. I'm not your friend. I'm not your priest. "  Also I was a human, who was I to say that Gheyna was wrong.  Also he had a weird face.  And a weird voice. I mean...he was just the worst in every possible way that it would have been better if he shacked up with the crazy hermit in the woods.  There was so much hilariously wrong about Cammen.