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[Illyria]

I think we need to remember that even if a romanced Lavellan reacts really badly and rejects Solas' removal, he still loves her. The romance still goes on for the few moments before he freaks out and backpedals himself into orbit. 

 

Even if a friend also reacts badly, I don't think it would destroy his relationship with them. 

 

That probably is the case, but we also know that Solas is more comfortable with a romanced Lavellan than anyone else in the Inquisition (except Cole and he's a spirit aka the group of beings that Solas is already super comfortable with).

[Delphine]

This is the level headed kind of debate that we should always try to have, yes. In defense of Sunnie, though, it's possible she wasn't referring to this debate but earlier stuff. In that case, she was just trying to diffuse tensions she thought were present (while unknowingly causing more for others). We all just react differently to it all.

 

Yep, I like you.

[laurelinvanyar]

That probably is the case, but we also know that Solas is more comfortable with a romanced Lavellan than anyone else in the Inquisition (except Cole and he's a spirit aka the group of beings that Solas is already super comfortable with).

But how do we KNOW that? The only real difference between a friend inquisitor and a romanced inquisitor is some kissing action and the vallaslin/breakup scene. 

 

Anything beyond that is headcanon territory. 

[Sifr]

But Solas can hide information from Cole if he wishes. He chooses not to, that was my point. 

 

Solas being able to "shut up" Cole always bothered me though, because while I get that he wants to keep his secrets, at the same time, it does seem like he's exerting some kind of control and influence over him that's a little out-of-character?

 

We know that Solas hates it when people attempt to control Spirits, his extreme reaction to the idiot mages harming his friend in his personal quest, his dislike of Dorian mentioning how bound Spirits are used as servants in Tevinter, his anger at the Wardens for binding the demons as an army, as well as him being involved in Cole's quest to help him prevent being bound by anyone, all show this part of his character?

 

So, Solas working his mojo on Cole always seemed to me like he was breaking his own rules there?

 

I get that Solas isn't afraid to break the rules when he believes that he needs to, we know that he can and will, but pulling that little Jedi Mind Trick on Cole to stop him spilling the beans seemed a little excessive on his part?

[Illyria]

But how do we KNOW that? The only real difference between a friend inquisitor and a romanced inquisitor is some kissing action and the vallaslin/breakup scene. 

 

Anything beyond that is headcanon territory. 

 

Because he tells this.  I don't believe that anything he says about the romance is a lie.

[nikki-tikki]

Solas being able to "shut up" Cole always bothered me though, because while I get that he wants to keep his secrets, at the same time, it does seem like he's exerting some kind of control and influence over him that's a little out-of-character?

 

We know that Solas hates it when people attempt to control Spirits, his extreme reaction to the idiot mages harming his friend in his personal quest, his dislike of Dorian mentioning how bound Spirits are used as servants in Tevinter, his anger at the Wardens for binding the demons as an army, as well as him being involved in Cole's quest to help him prevent being bound by anyone, all show this part of his character?

 

Solas working his mojo on Cole seems like he's breaking his own rules there? I get that Solas isn't afraid to break the rules when he believes that he needs to, we know that he can and will, but pulling that little Jedi Mind Trick on Cole to stop him spilling the beans seemed a little excessive on his part?

 

Ummm. Or he could just block his own thoughts. So Cole can't see them. No jedi mind tricks required.

 

"*gasp* Where did it go?"

 

"I'm sorry Cole, that is not something you can fix." 

 

(paraphrasing because I'm way too lazy to look up the exact lines)

[Illyria]

Solas being able to "shut up" Cole always bothered me though, because while I get that he wants to keep his secrets, at the same time, it does seem like he's exerting some kind of control and influence over him that's a little out-of-character?

 

We know that Solas hates it when people attempt to control Spirits, his extreme reaction to the idiot mages harming his friend in his personal quest, his dislike of Dorian mentioning how bound Spirits are used as servants in Tevinter, his anger at the Wardens for binding the demons as an army, as well as him being involved in Cole's quest to help him prevent being bound by anyone, all show this part of his character?

 

So, Solas working his mojo on Cole always seemed to me like he was breaking his own rules there?

 

I get that Solas isn't afraid to break the rules when he believes that he needs to, we know that he can and will, but pulling that little Jedi Mind Trick on Cole to stop him spilling the beans seemed a little excessive on his part?

 

Are you talking about the 'forget' scene after the endgame or the breakup banter?  In the former he's started going down a pretty dark path to do whatever it is he's doing (he just killed his oldest non-spirit(?) friend) and in the latter I got the impression that he just blocked Cole out of his head.

[nikki-tikki]

Because he tells this.  I don't believe that anything he says about the romance is a lie.

 

He says what they had was real, but only if you break up with him nicely. 

[laurelinvanyar]

I just had a fairly ironic thought. JoH spoilers:

Spoiler

It turns out that the people who live closest to Solas' ideas about spirits are actually humans, not elves. I wonder how he feels about that, hmmm? Hopefully the avvar make him question his views on humans in general.

[Armdin]

I would say almost as deeply as I do for my bf...OF A DECADE. I tell them EVERYTHING.  Just because I don't sleep with them doesn't mean I don't love them or respect them.

 

I think this only proves you have less inhibitions about talking to your friends than Solas does.

I don't know if this is coming across as rude, just a little disclaimer that that's not how I mean it.

 

Or if it isn't, feedback from us might convince them to add the vallaslin talk for a non-romanced Lavellan even if it wasn't the original plan.

 

 

I jest. Even if I disagree that all Lavellan's should have gotten the vallaslin removal scene, I still think they should know.

[Illyria]

He says what they had was real, but only if you break up with him nicely. 

It's when you talk to him post-breakup (paraphrased because I just deleted all my saves)

 

'You don't let anyone past that polite front of yours.'

'You saw more than most'

[Sable Rhapsody]

I get that Solas isn't afraid to break the rules when he believes that he needs to, we know that he can and will, but pulling that little Jedi Mind Trick on Cole to stop him spilling the beans seemed a little excessive on his part?

 

 

Ummm. Or he could just block his own thoughts. So Cole can't see them. No jedi mind tricks required.

 

During the bit at the end where Solas talks "through" Cole, he does cause Cole to forget.  But I got the impression that he did it to protect Cole, because he thought there was a possibility that Cole might try to follow.  Especially likely IMO with spirit!Cole, whose whole purpose is to seek out and help those in pain.  Is it still a little troublesome?  Yes.  But as with a lot of Solas's more problematic life choices, it's done with a good intention.

[ChuChu]

 

 

This is adorable.  

 

 

Thank you. I donate every 'like' to Lavellan's "FIND SOLAS" fund. Your souls now fuel her reunion, BWAHAHAHA.

On topic: Oooh yes. Yes. These conversations are goooooooooooooooooood!

----> So in regards to discussion on the orb earlier and it being of Fen'Harel/Solas -- there was some data mined info that referred to the orb as that of Mythal. Could've been just an inside reference for simplicity, could've just been an asset name... OR it could have been something Mythal had locked away at one point. Who knows? :>

---> Solas absolutely has trust issues! I think there's more than enough dialogue to support this and that it is canon. I think it Fen'HALARIOUS that when he chickens out of telling her all, the first thing he thinks to say is the vallaslin bit. Because it is literally staring him in the face. Smooth move, Dread. But oh, how smooth he really was, because you're right: it is something both distracting and monumentally characteristic of him to want to educate you. He is a scholar. He is a fighter. He is a god -- but undoubtedly raised to that status much like how the Inquisitor is raised to the title of Herald. Not of his own free will. With this in mind, I support that he is vulnerable and wounded and accustomed to being shut out by those he tries to help (ie: Dalish clans who call him a madman) -- and thusly, he would indeed be fearful of telling an elfquizzy about the slave marks. She might shut him out too -- his friend, his vhenan. But when you romance him, that love establishes such a connection that he feels he can tell you anything. Anything. The fact he nearly spills his own truth reveals how strongly the romance affects him. So sad. 

As was mentioned earlier, he does say "you saw more than most".

 

---> Also, the magic he uses to renew Lavellan's face -- it's a very similar colour as the old god's spirit, yes? And that of Mythal's spirit/magic? Could be a connection to using the Dread Wolf's unique power, which would mean standard people couldn't remove vallaslin. Or it could just be your standard magic. I dunno. -shrugs-

---> Wouldn't it be fun to theorize who Mythal's betrayer was, and maybe they locked -that- power in to the orb? My money is on Elgar'nan!

---> Just throwing this out there since I'm commenting on other theories: what if the chant of light is a form of ancient elven magic, akin to the ones Solas mentions take ages to cast? If he was Shartan, as many theorize, he could have influenced this in Andraste. Then what magic does it do? Insert same questions for call of the stone/the song red lyrium spins/the calling/etc etc.

Or if you subscribe to him being Shartan, maybe he trusted in people before and was betrayed (ala Maferath, ala Mythal's killer). So him being uber secretive this time around would make sense. Uh. This is more of an answer to myself since I asked why not tell her the truth, earlier. :>

Carry on, carry on.

[laurelinvanyar]

Because he tells this.  I don't believe that anything he says about the romance is a lie.

Can you show me the scene/dialogue? It's been a while since I've played through the romance, and I might have just forgotten. 

 

Edit: Derp. You answered above. I'm not sure I read "You saw more than most" in the same way you do. After all, does a frienship quizzy also not see more than most?

[Heidirs]

Sorry but: hahaha. That was really important for you, huh?

 

I had editing issues. 

[Illyria]

Can you show me the scene/dialogue? It's been a while since I've played through the romance, and I might have just forgotten. 

 

Look a few posts up.  It's paraphrased though.

[Heidirs]

Yes. This. I still fail to see how killing a double agent, a direct threat to the Inquisition's security, should harden Leliana to the point of "I will kill anyone who gets in my way!!!"

 

Because that double agent was a friend of hers that she decided to kill for the benefit of the Inquisition. I'd say that's a legitimate hardening point.

[Illyria]

Fen'HALARIOUS

 

Solas: There's something you have to know.  I'm... Fen'Harel, the Dread Wolf.

 

Lavellan: D: That's not funny, Solas!

 

Solas: No, it's Fen'HALARIOUS.

 

*crickets*

[Delphine]

*crickets*

 

Tough crowd!

[laurelinvanyar]

Because that double agent was a friend of hers that she decided to kill for the benefit of the Inquisition. I'd say that's a legitimate hardening point.

It is a hardening point. It's just not a hardening point to the point of Muaha Princess Stabbity Stab Stab Kill Kill!

[Armdin]

---> Solas absolutely has trust issues! I think there's more than enough dialogue to support this and that it is canon. I think it Fen'HALARIOUS that when he chickens out of telling her all, the first thing he thinks to say is the vallaslin bit. Because it is literally staring him in the face. Smooth move, Dread. But oh, how smooth he really was, because you're right: it is something both distracting and monumentally characteristic of him to want to educate you. He is a scholar. He is a fighter. He is a god -- but undoubtedly raised to that status much like how the Inquisitor is raised to the title of Herald. Not of his own free will. With this in mind, I support that he is vulnerable and wounded and accustomed to being shut out by those he tries to help (ie: Dalish clans who call him a madman) -- and thusly, he would indeed be fearful of telling an elfquizzy about the slave marks. She might shut him out too -- his friend, his vhenan. But when you romance him, that love establishes such a connection that he feels he can tell you anything. Anything. The fact he nearly spills his own truth reveals how strongly the romance affects him. So sad.

 

I want to take this segment, print it, and frame it. I love your way with words.

Also I love the tiny optimism flag drawing. Take many hearts.

 

Edit: In fact I'm putting that on my profile to read when I want to feel sappy about Solas.

[ChuChu]

I want to take this segment, print it, and frame it. I love your way with words.

Also I love the tiny optimism flag drawing. Take many hearts.

 

Edit: In fact I'm putting that on my profile to read when I want to feel sappy about Solas.

edit: hearts also fuel Lavellan's search for Solas. She should make an inquiry at the Black Emporium.

[Heidirs]

I don't think that Solas and Cole ever actually had a dicussion where he revealed it to him, they didn't need to. Remember what Cole says about Blackwall during the conversation after his personal quest, where he asks if Cole is angry at him hiding he who was, only for Cole to reply, "You never hid from me"

 

Cole always knew that Blackwall was Thom Rainier, like he always knew that Solas is Fen'Harel.

 

I think that's why Solas and Cole are able to have those kinds of weird, inside, no-context conversations that we see throughout the game, since they're communicating on a level that everyone else lacks? It's also probably why Solas enjoys the company of Spirits to people, since they are the few friends of his that he's capable of being truly himself around and doesn't have to hide anything from, because they know what goes on in his head already?

 

I do think Solas prefers spirits to people. But, on that level, I wonder how much of himself Solas would have shared if Cole didn't already know it. Even with Cole, there are instances where Solas shuts Cole out. There's that one conversation where Cole gasps and as "where did it go?" because he loses whatever he's sensing from Solas. And then, of course, at the end of the game, he makes Cole forget whatever he's gleamed. 

 

Even with Cole, Solas hides things.

 

*wanders iinto Feedback and Suggestions*

 

*sees a thread about how Bioware isn't catering to female players by including too many women in powerful positions and not enough eyecandy men*

 

...

 

I....

 

Nope.  Got nothing.

 

*settles back down in the blanket fort*

 

You should wonder back in there and post this:

 

Spoiler

[Illyria]

I do think Solas prefers spirits to people. But, on that level, I wonder how much of himself Solas would have shared if Cole didn't already know it. Even with Cole, there are instances where Solas shuts Cole out. There's that one conversation where Cole gasps and as "where did it go?" because he loses whatever he's sensing from Solas. And then, of course, at the end of the game, he makes Cole forget whatever he's gleamed. 

 

Even with Cole, Solas hides things.

 

 

You should wonder back in there and post this:

 

Spoiler

 

I don't think that adequately shows my confusion.  I think Simon's reaction in Jaynestown is needed.

 

'So this is what going mad feels like'

 

I want to take this segment, print it, and frame it. I love your way with words.

Also I love the tiny optimism flag drawing. Take many hearts.

 

I second this.

[Illyria]

 

 

 

 

Thank you. I donate every 'like' to Lavellan's "FIND SOLAS" fund. Your souls now fuel her reunion, BWAHAHAHA.

On topic: Oooh yes. Yes. These conversations are goooooooooooooooooood!

----> So in regards to discussion on the orb earlier and it being of Fen'Harel/Solas -- there was some data mined info that referred to the orb as that of Mythal. Could've been just an inside reference for simplicity, could've just been an asset name... OR it could have been something Mythal had locked away at one point. Who knows? :>

---> Solas absolutely has trust issues! I think there's more than enough dialogue to support this and that it is canon. I think it Fen'HALARIOUS that when he chickens out of telling her all, the first thing he thinks to say is the vallaslin bit. Because it is literally staring him in the face. Smooth move, Dread. But oh, how smooth he really was, because you're right: it is something both distracting and monumentally characteristic of him to want to educate you. He is a scholar. He is a fighter. He is a god -- but undoubtedly raised to that status much like how the Inquisitor is raised to the title of Herald. Not of his own free will. With this in mind, I support that he is vulnerable and wounded and accustomed to being shut out by those he tries to help (ie: Dalish clans who call him a madman) -- and thusly, he would indeed be fearful of telling an elfquizzy about the slave marks. She might shut him out too -- his friend, his vhenan. But when you romance him, that love establishes such a connection that he feels he can tell you anything. Anything. The fact he nearly spills his own truth reveals how strongly the romance affects him. So sad. 

As was mentioned earlier, he does say "you saw more than most".

 

---> Also, the magic he uses to renew Lavellan's face -- it's a very similar colour as the old god's spirit, yes? And that of Mythal's spirit/magic? Could be a connection to using the Dread Wolf's unique power, which would mean standard people couldn't remove vallaslin. Or it could just be your standard magic. I dunno. -shrugs-

---> Wouldn't it be fun to theorize who Mythal's betrayer was, and maybe they locked -that- power in to the orb? My money is on Elgar'nan!

---> Just throwing this out there since I'm commenting on other theories: what if the chant of light is a form of ancient elven magic, akin to the ones Solas mentions take ages to cast? If he was Shartan, as many theorize, he could have influenced this in Andraste. Then what magic does it do? Insert same questions for call of the stone/the song red lyrium spins/the calling/etc etc.

Or if you subscribe to him being Shartan, maybe he trusted in people before and was betrayed (ala Maferath, ala Mythal's killer). So him being uber secretive this time around would make sense. Uh. This is more of an answer to myself since I asked why not tell her the truth, earlier. :>

Carry on, carry on.

 

 

Now I'm not making terrible jokes:

 

I love you, this post and your team optimism drawing.