153429 réponses à ce sujet

[Eurowande]

The thing im afraid of the most is the we will have to fight Solas ( i dont really see it comming but small part of me just do want to let me be) , so if this fck happen ill let him kill my char and imagine this is the end of the DLC .

yes pl do this, i wont be able to play the DLC myself for a long time, so ill have to watch it in youtube anyway

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

There's a theory floating around tumblr that Cory can't affect Carver (or Bethany) due to the whole Hawke blood thing.

They can bring Baby Brother (or Sister, if that was your jam) back, right? No "well players will expect so much from their Carver, we couldn't possibly" excuses, right?

 

In my playthrough I collected his bottle of "wine", and recently had Varric reference him in banter, and I'm gonna deal with Hawke soon, and I just am having a major feels attack over my virtual little bro. I want to see him again! 

[Jayla]

I don't think I or anyone was saying that Solas was more important than the discussion about mental illness. My suggestion was that maybe it was better had in a more appropriate venue. Sure, the conversation is important, but just because someone say it would be cool to see a character with a mental illness doesn't mean they suggested it not be done in a both serious and respectful way.

Sometimes, and I'm guilty of it, we can't look past being offended long enough to see what the real issues are anyway.

Do what you want, I'm not the moderator. I just think emotions are way too high to have this conversation respectfully.

 

I'm glad you have the articulation I completely lack. xD

[FrankWisdom]

This is something we discuss a lot around here.  Personally I'm firmly on Team Lone Wolf - Solas is Fen'Harel, no body jumping involved.

 

First: there is no way that BW would give us a romance in which we were sleeping with a possessed person without knowing it.  They gave us Anders but it was very clear from the start he was possessed.  The poopstorm over Blackwall not really being Blackwall was bad enough - what would it be like if they gave us an LI who really, really wasn't who he said he was and had murky consent issues into the bargin (fun fact: in the TV show Supernatual this is why Ruby No2 was shown to be possessing a body the second it had flatlined - the writers were aware of the issues involving Sam sleeping with a demon and its unconsenting human host and deliberatly avoided this trope.  It's one of the few things I actually like about SPN).

 

Second: the whole idea of 'Fen'Harel is really TEH EVILS and it was the Solas part that loved Lavellan' BOOOOOOOOOOOOORING (sorry, been playing Skyrim and now channelling Shegorath in my way of speaking).  What makes Solas a fastinating character is that every experience in his long, long life has led him to the point where he is the man he is now.  The experiences he speaks about are his experiences.  They weren't gained second hand.

 

Third: Mythal's senario is implied to be completely unprecedented.  The ancient elves were immortal (but not invulnerable) and Mythal was killed.  But part of her soul hung on long enough and strongly enough to possess a human woman, and then continue to possess her decendents (something that was considered a great honour, given the way Yavana shows envy towards Morrigan being the favourite).  If every elf was doing this it dimishes how completely awesome Mythal was for being able to hang on like this.

 

 

I see it a bit differently.

 

I honestly think it could go either way. We clearly don't have enough information on the Elvhen Pantheon to make a decisive distinction between Flemythal's situation as compared to Fen'Harel's/SolaFen's situation.

 

It is true that she claimed to have been murdered (this was also confirmed by Abelas) and was said to have held on to a piece of her essence and powers while searching for a "physical" host. Given these comments however, it is clear that these "Gods" are not simply of the Elvhen people, or rather they have transcended the aspect of what they were and now cannot be compared to whatever that was.

 

The way Flemeth describes how it feels to be "bonded" to Mythal, the discrepancy between them being "separate" beings is a slight one. They share everything, so I don't see this comment:

 

"The experiences he speaks about are his experiences.  They weren't gained second hand."

 

necessarily being the best way of putting it.

 

I don't think it's as simple as living through a god but rather being one with a god, sharing everything, where one's feelings is as the other's.  The process for Mythal's "possession" is stated to be based on choice. This would make it completely different from the possession we are familiar with a.k.a. demons. Demons possess from the Fade and control Bodies from The Fade. Their essence cannot cross over to become the entity they possess, unlike the way Flemythal describes her own situation, where Mythal's "essence" wandered and eventually "bonded" with Flemeth. They simply see through the host's eyes and manipulate their body like a puppet master, keeping the spirit of the host hostage within The Fade.

 

I also consider Kieran's comments about the Elvhen people i.e.  why they "want to look like that" and that their blood is "very old".

 

This would seem to imply that even ancient Elvhen people had the capacity to shapeshift, further reinforced by the Codex entry: Ancient Elven Writing

 

This then has me wonder about the Pantheon's nature and abilities. It also brings into question the reason this was lost to time . I believe it has to do with the creation of the veil as well as the imprisonment of the Pantheon, much like the loss of immortality and the "appearance" of humans in Thedas.

 

 

As for Geldauran's claim

 

exert from Geldauran's claim: "There are no gods. There is only the subject and the object, the actor and the acted upon. Those with will to earn dominance over others gain title not by nature but by deed"

 

I don't see this necessarily pertaining to the Pantheon's nature, but rather giving us insight into The Forgotten Ones' perception of them and their disdain for what they represent. I don't see them as freedom fighters, but anyways I'm not going to delve into that as I already have a thread that goes in detail about my theories. What I will say is that the Pantheon could be a type of spirit/Elvhen hybrid and "The Forgotten Ones" a type of Elvhen/demon hybrid. They could all be powerful Elvhen mages or the pantheon could be of a different nature while "The Forgotten Ones" altered their own nature through their deeds to match the Pantheon. No matter what we believe,

 

 

Saying this:

 

"If every elf was doing this it dimishes how completely awesome Mythal was for being able to hang on like this."

 

is implying that Fen'Harel was like every other ancient Elvhen at the height of Elvhenan and that you know what the Pantheon's aspect and "true" nature actually was.

 

So far the information we have seems to imply that Fen'Harel was their (the pantheon's) kin and regarded as a brother. Which would mean he is "of" them i.e. his nature, while "The Forgotten Ones" see his attitude and rather than judging him by his "nature" they accept him through his "deeds" i.e. cunning ways.

 

Being of the god's does not mean he is like them. I think he saw both sides of the coin and realized those who truly suffered were the Elvhen people, thus he decided to rebel against those who would ignore the "little people" as Sera would so simply put it. The warring lead to casualties and he knew that eliminating one side wasn't enough, the shift of power would destroy the people, he had to stop the warring but also had to deal with both sides as they were keeping each other in check.

 

Back on track, I feel like Mythal's strength of character and uniqueness is quite intact despite Fen'Harel's disposition.

 

To put it like Geldauran: Those with will to survive gain title not by nature but by deed".

 

It's not about how she survived i.e. thanks to her nature, but why she survived i.e. her deeds. Her will is what I see as special, not her nature.

 

As for Fen'Harel and Solas. Again Solas could have been a dreamer who encountered or even woke Fen'Harel. They could have developed a kinship which led to their "union".

 

I'll finish with these, copy pasted from my theories thread:

 

This leads me to my next topic... SolaFen. First of all, let me start by explaining what I think of his origins. I believe Solas to be a willing "vessel", much like Flemeth. I also think the stories he's told us (the inquisitor) and his humble origins could be the truth, just not the whole truth.
 

Lelianna: "But he did give the name of the village where he grew up, noting that it was small, unlikely to appear on any map."

 

Lelianna: "They recently located the village... or what remains of it. It is a ruin, as it has been for centuries, its name preserved only in degraded form in Ancient Tevinter mysteries"

I believe Solas (or whatever his name was at the time) encountered Fen'Harel during his time exploring The Fade. He must have been in agreement with Fen'Harel and gave his body willingly. Given the conversation between SolaFen and FleMythal (When SolaFen explains that he didn't have enough power to unlock the Elvhen orb given his long slumber and recent awakening), I'm guessing the village he said he was born in was simply misdirection and that Solas is not in fact centuries old.  I also say this because Mythal's vessel (Flemeth) is growing quite old physically and has already lived centuries. She needs willing replacements in order to sustain herself. If centuries mean nothing to Fen'Harel and Mythal however, than a long slumber might be millenia and being awake for a few centuries might be a recent awakening. I might be stretching it, but even if that was the case then SolaFen should also look as old as FleMythal does. Since that's not the case, I'll assume Solas was lying about his birth place and he bonded with Fen'Harel recently. If I had to guess, I'd argue that the location was in fact a place he visited while in the Fade, which is probably where he found its name.

 

and this:

 

That could be the case, but then why didn't Abelas recognize Fen'Harel while they were speaking, If Fen'Harel was a figurehead during the rebellion. Clearly Abelas was around during the time of the Elvhen Pantheon given his statements about Mythal and her "murder". For that to be explained, then no matter what, the physical body (Solas) would've had to be altered somehow. Either Fen'Harel can shapeshift into another humanoid being (unseen so far) or he can create illusions of some kind. Then there's also the why and how Fen'Harel "woke up". Also, we don't really know what the Elvhen Pantheon really were, the same way we know nothing about "The Forgotten Ones" (though Geldauran's claim could imply they were of the Elvhen people). They could have been similar to spirits (Elvhen Pantheon) and demons (The Forgotten Ones) who become something similar to Cole. Anyways a lot of ifs in here, so I'll stick to SolaFen for the time being.

 

Anyways just something to think about.

 

Oh and sorry for the very long response. I just like to be thorough.

[Jayla]

I see what you mean, but I think there are reasons that we can either banish or take them under and nothing else.

Their actions require some sort of response, so you either banish them from Orlais or you decide to take them under.

I think not taking a stance is not an option because (besides making the Inquisition look bad), letting them run free in Orlais might cause an uproar, there is no stopping them from acting stupid again. No one guarantees they'll act stupid, but the citizens of Orlais wouldn't really care (they'll be pissed off at the possibility something might happen) unless you can guarantee them they have protection.

That's what I think at least, you can't take the middle ground here, it gives the Wardens too much freedom.

 

That's a good point actually. My immediate thought in response was to say "Well if Orlais don't want them, they can banish them!" but it does make the Inquisition look bad, and since we were there at the time with the Wardens, we got the crappy end of the stick to decide what to do with them.

 

It's a sucky choice I'm never really happy with either way, but it makes more sense now. ^^

[Hanako Ikezawa]

The thing im afraid of the most is the we will have to fight Solas ( i dont really see it comming but small part of me just do want to let me be) , so if this fck happen ill let him kill my char and imagine this is the end of the DLC .

Bioware said this isn't the end of Solas' story, so killing him or bringing him in won't be an option(unfortunately). 

[Cee]

Hello guys i fainally decide to jump right in. 

i was reading the thread for 2 days and i want to say a lot of things so if this post get too long im sorry.

Wow i dont even know from where to begin hahaha...

So i love Solas so much and talk about his so much that my BF actually got jealous ( i cant make him play the games so no sympathy from him )

I cant way for the DLC its 4 days for you but it will be much longer for me as i can not buy it atm ( if i knew its coming so fast i was going to try and finally find my self a jub last 2 months instead of playing DA:I )

Im terible at choosing romance option in DA. I romaced Alistair and he dump me cuz i made him king ( i fix this late ofc but still ...) At D2 i was like lol Anders was so fun in awakening so i go for him and he fcked up everything ( and bcz i still love him i let him go and run with him, thats before i found Fenris)

At DA3 ( after waiting months to play it and not spoiling myself , even i dont know how i resisted) i was like ok i love the elves but my first DA 1 char was elf and it go poorly with my love life, so i decide to choose a human. Now you can imagin my reaction when i found out i cant romance Solas, i was torn apart. I almost started a new game but i waited so long to play so i go for Cullen and imgine its Solas. So my 3rd choise got to be elven God who seem to always fck up things.

I swear if there is DA 4 im not romancing anyone, im afraid what my choice will be this time.

Trespasser makes me afraid i so dont want to get more heartbroken , but i had the bad feeling this just might happen.

 

' I suspect you have question' 

DAMN RIGHT I HAVE QUESTION and ill ask all of them just give me a min to decide what io want to do first - to kiss you or to slap you or both , and in what order.

Why you guys write sad fics , damn you all im crying the whole day.

 

Hi, and welcome. You fit in very well with the rest of us.

 

I also went for Alistair, then Anders, and then Solas.  I think people's reactions do seem to fall along the line of hug, slap, question, everything.

 

I know sad fics help me get out both feelings and creative energy. They just wander out of my head.

[LinaMeta]

Thanks to you I will be hearing this song the rest of the week LOL 

I foolishly listened to that on YouTube, thought it was nice and then got recommended this song. Solaaaaas

[Cee]

They can bring Baby Brother (or Sister, if that was your jam) back, right? No "well players will expect so much from their Carver, we couldn't possibly" excuses, right?

 

In my playthrough I collected his bottle of "wine", and recently had Varric reference him in banter, and I'm gonna deal with Hawke soon, and I just am having a major feels attack over my virtual little bro. I want to see him again! 

 

 

Now I'm kind of sad I didn't bring Varric around much and never got a Bethany reference.

[FrankWisdom]

I see what you mean, but I talked about excusing the GW entirely in the first line, not the actual decision.

It's just something I noticed that exists in the forum and I'm kinda confused by that

 

As for Nightmare, while I get what you are saying about the Nightmare demon no longer amplifying Corypheus' calling, but he can still affect GWs. From what I (think I) know from the lore, the imprisoned Corypheus affected the GWs' minds, they sometimes forgot what they were doing when were taken away from him, when he was "asleep" he still had power over GWs, less, but enough to help him the end escape from his prison. What I'm trying to say is that he can still affect GWs in close proximity to him.

 

Anyhow, as said, I had no issue with the choice itself, more with the mentality behind it.

 

Well, that's why I explained the reasoning behind the decisions, the "mentality" behind the choices, as you put it. 

 

As for Corypheus. The point I was trying to make is that he is limited in his ability to influence the wardens based on distance and scope (the amount of Grey Wardens he can influence at one time).  If he needed to employ the nightmare demon in order to extend his reach, then obviously there is a significant limitation involved with his own abilities, even when fueled by red lyrium and the Elvhen Orb. So being in close proximity to him was what I was referencing when talking about using our spy network to track both the grey warden's as well as our enemies' movements.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

With the exception of Dorian, romancing a Mage always ends in heartbreak or longing.

The romance will Merrill doesn't end in heartbreak or longing. 

[Eurowande]

Tnx for the welcome guys you are all alsome.

And i think i hit a new low now im crying on happy ending fics too

[drosophila]

I still get a little surprised when I come back to Skyhold and Lavellan is wearing her fancy formalwear outfit instead of pajamas. 

 

Also main hall decorated Tevinter style absolutely rocks combined with Dalish drapery and Inquisition heraldry. This is one crazy playthrough. 

[drosophila]

And i think i hit a new low now im crying on happy ending fics too

 

Most of my weekends end up like this. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Not for me. I wouldn't help her in her insane quest. She hated me and I don't like to rivalmance her. Only Fenris I enjoyed rivalmancing. It's pretty heated! lol

But then that's not romancing her. You said Dorian is the only mage romance that doesn't end in heartbreak or longing, so I was saying there is another mage romance that doesn't. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

True but I just never felt the friendmance and rivalmance were secure romances (fun though) and it's still so heartbreaking to watch her go through all that pain for a cause that's fruitless. I always hoped there was a 3rd option to help the Keeper. It's quite an emotionally intense quest!

Merrill is the most secure romance in DA2. She's the only one of the four who doesn't leave you or use your relationship with them for their own ends.

[S.W.]

I don't think I or anyone was saying that Solas was more important than the discussion about mental illness. My suggestion was that maybe it was better had in a more appropriate venue. Sure, the conversation is important, but just because someone say it would be cool to see a character with a mental illness doesn't mean they suggested it not be done in a both serious and respectful way.

Sometimes, and I'm guilty of it, we can't look past being offended long enough to see what the real issues are anyway.

Do what you want, I'm not the moderator. I just think emotions are way too high to have this conversation respectfully.

 

I don't want to stir the pot, and nor is this reply aimed at you in particular (not at all!), but...

 

In general, I take issue with being told too much when and where to have discussions about sensitive, and very political subjects, like mental illness. Sometimes it is a very quiet way of telling people to stop talking about it. Particularly, I think it's troubling when those who have struggled with mental illness are being told to change the subject, because those people often have the best, most accurate insight on the problem.

 

I think if someone has said or done something ableist - something which someone has a (quite rightly) principled opposition to - then I think it's wrong to change the subject just to ensure the perpetrator doesn't feel too uncomfortable. Offence isn't always subjective - sometimes, you just get it wrong, and I would prefer people to accept that they might be wrong, even if it is uncomfortable. If we can't point out when people are talking and thinking about mental illness in an insensitive or offensive manner, when will people's attitudes towards mental illness ever get better?

 

/hops off soapbox.

 

Nobody needs to reply to this - not everything I've said applies to what's happened. I'd just prefer for people to think about it, actually.

 

Bioware said this isn't the end of Solas' story, so killing him or bringing him in won't be an option(unfortunately). 

 

Solas has the thickest plot armour possible right now. Of all the things we can do, I think killing him is the last possibility.

 

I would quite like an [Attack Solas] option where you try to kill him, but ultimately get outplayed because Solas is a powerful elven deity and you're not.

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

Now I'm kind of sad I didn't bring Varric around much and never got a Bethany reference.

It was only Varric talking, no others, and it occured on the Storm Coast, heading to the beach from the blades of Hessarian camp. Post-skyhold. If that helps. lol

[Jewlie Ghoulie]

Random thought popped in my head and I thought it would be an interesting discussion:

Since trespasser is two years after the end game , Would your Lavellan (I'll say the first one you plan on playing the dlc with) still care / pine for Solas?

Alternately, if only a friend , how do you think your Inquizzy would feel?

Lastly, is there anything you want or fear for the two year time skip as to what's happened with your Inquizzy?

[S.W.]

The romance will Merrill doesn't end in heartbreak or longing. 

 

Unless you concede Merrill did wrong and take responsibility for her actions at Sundermount, with the Pride Demon, then you will have to butcher her clan. Whilst this doesn't actually impact the romance, it doesn't really spell 'happy ending'.