153429 réponses à ce sujet

[BoscoBread]

Just finished. Really liked the DLC overall.

 

Now... Rambly I-don't-know-what-I'm-feeling Trespasser spoilery stuff below.

 

I mean it. Don't click below if you don't want to be spoiled for Trespasser.

 

Spoiler

Solas really is a fantastic character. I don't agree with the destroy the world thing, but I can get behind the idea that he does kind of want to be stopped. Redemption makes for some interesting characters... I mean, look at the love Loghain still gets. What I really like is that you do see the layers within the individual and it's not just a good-bad divide. He has bad plans, but they started from good intentions when he tried to save people. Now he's so bent on a task that he could probably lay the blade down for because, as someone above said, it tries to make up for the bad outcome of his decisions. One that he didn't have an understanding of the consequences of at the time, and one that doesn't necessarily have to be righted.

 

And then we have Corypheus, the bad guy who put a damper on the plans of the world ending. Hilarious. Good people can do bad without realizing, and bad people can sometimes save the world. Go figure.

 

I need to read some more and think about this a bit to fully understand what I'm feeling. I'm pretty overwhelmed at the moment.

 

And a not horribly spoilerish question about the ending/credits:

 

Spoiler

Was there supposed to be another stinger? I watched the credits and listened to Cassandra read Varric's book, then the screen went to a "thank you for playing" screen and then back to the loading menu. I disbanded the Inquisition, but plan to go back after I've settled down a bit and had dinner to see the outcome if you keep it. Does that make difference? Or is there not actually a stinger?

 

And above all... just how the eff are we supposed to have a new character in DA4? Unless it takes such a turn that has nothing to do with events in the DLC - which would be odd - I just can't get behind the idea of a new protagonist getting involved with certain things and people and stuff.

 

Spoiler

no i think the stinger was that you go to tevinter and the hint that the inquisitor is the next protag. and yes. i can agree - no new protags!

[BoscoBread]

Spoiler

I'd also like to know how Solas defeated 7 people with equal or greater power to him. 

 

I'd also like to know what's going on with the forgotten ones.

 

Spoiler

YES the forgotten ones. i think they support my meta - given the Xebenkeck codex - that they were rebels and that solas worked with them in some capacity to undo them. i don't think he did it on his own - he had the fogotten ones...me thinks.

[midnight tea]

Also, can i say just say in non-spoilery way just how beautiful the music was, especially at the end  ?

[S.W.]

Okay, finished Trespasser. Spoilers under the cut.

 

Spoiler

seriously. big spoilers.

Spoiler

I'm a big mess of feelings at the moment. Most of what was revealed - that Solas created the veil to imprison the elven gods, and that his grand plan was to remove it again - was something I feel like I could have maybe guessed. That doesn't bother me, so much, as much as how much darker it was in implementation. I just assumed that removing the veil wouldn't, y'know, kill absolutely everybody - I need to replay the scene again, but I hope he just mentioned it as a possibility, rather than a certainty, but the fact that he's willing to kill absolutely everybody.... ehhhhh. No, Solas. That's not cool. (ALSO HE KILLED FELASSAN HOW COULD YOU YOU ****** JERK).

 

Up until that point I was gazing in absolute wonderment at the idea of a fade-world library and how incredible that sounds (magical internet, anyone?), and thinking, hell, if Solas wants to restore this beautiful world then why wouldn't you say yes? *sigh*

 

****, I'd probably be fine if the cost involved lives, just not that many, and preferably nasty people's lives. Kill all the magisters? Kill all the snotty human nobles? My Lavellen could go along with it, probably a bit reluctantly. But this plan is just going to get lots of little people (to use Sera's phrase) who hurt nobody killed very fast.

 

I'm mildly disappointed, actually, I thought Solas was better than that. I wanted him to be better than that. I was still kind of in love - a bit infatuated - with his character whilst the scene played, I just... urgh, I wish there had been a "follow Solas into the eluvian" option. I think perhaps I'm channelling my quizzy's feelings - who's a lot softer than me, and I think too forgiving of Solas - who just wanted to jump into the next world with him then and there, screw everything else. Willfully ignore the costs, because the consequences trump that. I think, for my Inquisitior, the events of Trespasser was a reminder that yes, she was an elf, she couldn't just grow her hair out to cover her ears, to go policking with nobles and ignore all the magical heritage she'd discovered, ... honestly, after going through so many wonderful and torn-up worlds in the eluvians, I think Solas could have said anything, and as long as he'd ended his sentence with 'vhenan', he would have bought it. I might have bought it.

 

However, I don't think this will stop me liking him as a character, I probably just need to adjust to liking him as a villain and an antagonist instead of a companion. I think he could be a fascinating villain, given his conflict over his task - he basically does everything Corypheus doesn't in terms of being intruiging, conflicted, where the protagonist has a (very personal) stake in stopping him. And I'm comparing him to Cory deliberately, because he's attempting to do the same thing with a bit more competence, without all the illusions of grandeur and godhood.

 

If there's a possible way to change his mind, I think a romantic redemption arc could honestly be pretty beautiful. Although I do doubt how that'd be possible with switching protagonists.

[MayriyaNoori]

Spoiler

I'd also like to know how Solas defeated 7 people with equal or greater power to him. 

 

I'd also like to know what's going on with the forgotten ones.

Spoilerzzzz

 

Spoiler

 

Well, legend says he did trick them with the promise of a weapon right or something like that right? A weapon that would end the war with the forgotten ones? I wonder if he tricked them all into casting the spell that constructed the Veil. I mean......to construct the Veil is a huge feat.....I think 7-8 super powerful mages sounds about right to do such a thing.

 

Ouch.

 

[SamanthaJ]

And above all... just how the eff are we supposed to have a new character in DA4? Unless it takes such a turn that has nothing to do with events in the DLC - which would be odd - I just can't get behind the idea of a new protagonist getting involved with certain things and people and stuff.

 

Spoiler

I've said this elsewhere, but the only way I could get behind a new protagonist is if we're like an agent for the Inquisitor. We could be one of the new people Solas doesn't know about or something. Maybe we could be a faction leader working under Inquisitor or a random agent who ends up having to make a lot of decisions that are available based on past decisions. Basically I'd accept a new protagonist if the Inquisitor was heavily involved. You can't just tell people you're going to save the world again and save your boyfriend from himself and then stab a map and then disappear into obscurity. It's just rude.

[BreBoo]

This is how I feel right now...

[Aren]

Spoiler

I'd also like to know how Solas defeated 7 people with equal or greater power to him. 

 

I'd also like to know what's going on with the forgotten ones.

Spoiler

i can only speculate that he not defeated the others gods (forgotten ones and elven gods)

I believe that the Dalish legend on that account are true,he tricked  them into going into the fade for some ancestral power and when they were there he created the veil,bingo!

Mythal transgressor was probably already punished,so i don't know on why Flemeth still seek revenge a reckoning,an eternal imprisonment isn't enough?

I bet my money that Anduril and Elgar nan had attacked Mythal

because they may have some resentment toward her.

Anduril lose against Mythal and Mythal stole her knowledge about the void,Elgar an because i believe that Mythal went to Flemeth for this whole husband resentment thing,that's the only thing Mythal and Flemeth have in common

[MoonDrummer]

Spoiler

YES the forgotten ones. i think they support my meta - given the Xebenkeck codex - that they were rebels and that solas worked with them in some capacity to undo them. i don't think he did it on his own - he had the fogotten ones...me thinks.

Spoiler

I thought that they would probably help him, but then what happened to them afterwards? Solas turn on them? Maybe they're still working as his agents.

[Rabbitonfire]

Spoiler

I'd also like to know how Solas defeated 7 people with equal or greater power to him. 

 

I'd also like to know what's going on with the forgotten ones.

Kaiju. 

[BoscoBread]

Spoiler

I thought that they would probably help him, but then what happened to them afterwards? Solas turn on them? Maybe they're still working as his agents.

 

Spoiler

Possibly turned on some, it appears let others get caught and potentially executed.  Some appear to still be alive (we've killed i think 2 -- they were demons) Regardless they were a means to an end. Much like everything else.

[Kaydreamer]

Spoiler

 

I have a horrible feeling that taking down the Veil will actually release the Blight fully into the world.  Look what happened when Corypheus and Co. went there?  I mean, the Chant is wrong that the Maker cursed them but it seems it was right that they brought the Blight back when they went into the Black City.  So Solas wouldn't be able to get back the world he had because Blight everywhere.

 

Or I'm completely wrong.

 

 

Some team optimism headcanon on the above, which I also shared in the spoiler thread. Concerns the blight and the nature of the veil. Tresspasser spoilers ahoy.

 

Spoiler

Optimistic-ish headcanon regarding Solas's motives and the veil.  

 

Regarding Solas expressing the desire to destroy the world, despite the fact that the very idea of it obviously causes him enormous distress and runs so contrary to everything we know about him... what if there truly is no other option?

 

Think of it this way. The veil has obviously caused a great deal of damage to the world. It blocks magic, which means that the magic in Thedas has steadily been dwindling and may eventually cease to exist entirely. (There was something somewhere mentioning that fewer mages are being born into Dalish clans. Mages as a whole are becoming rarer.) On the other hand we have the taint, which has been infesting the world at a steady rate. Magic is often described as a 'song'. The taint is also described as a corrupted song, and there's still the question of 'silence' and what that means. (Possibly the death of the world via the removal of all magic?) What if the taint is the direct result of the veil either a ) blocking magic, or  b ) corrupting it as it passes through from the fade to the physical world? As the magic in Thedas weakens, the blight grows stronger.

 

The veil might even be the void, stretched thin and covering the world. The magic passing through is corrupted by whatever it is in there that sent Andruil bonkers. It could also explain why passing through the veil is so traumatic for demons. They're directly exposed to whatever poison dwells within the void. Shattering the veil a la Corypheus seemed to unleash blight over the whole world at once - whatever was contained within got out. Possibly, Solas has a less blighty but no less catastrophic option for getting rid of it.

 

It could be that lifting/destroying the veil is the only way to eliminate the blight at it's source. Such a connection would also explain why Solas despises the Grey Wardens so much; he knows more about the blight than they do, and their actions may actually be making it worse. If the true source of the blight isn't stopped, eventually it will consume the world, leading to death and ultimate silence. Solas may regard destroying the world as being the only way to save it. (Conveniently restoring the Elves in the process.) However he knows that the act required to save the world will devastate the mortal races, hence his pain and turmoil over what he must do. (Also compounded with the fact that he knows he wants the old world back at the expense of the current one.)

 

Basically, I think there's much more here at stake than Old vs New and Elvhen vs Everyone Else. MUCH more.

[MayriyaNoori]

No no, it's cool guys. We got this figured out. Spoilers abound.

 

Spoiler

 

June is coming back and fixing all this. I demand it.

 

[S.W.]

Trespasser spoilers:

Spoiler

thought: epilogue mentions elves across Thedas joining his cause. That must involve a large amount of deceit on his part - a promise of a better world, knowing that they'll all die (unless elves are magically exempt somehow? I'm currently assuming only ancient elves will manage it), or at least the non-mages will (which is most of them), to bring it. Surely he must be spinning some sorry tales to manage that? Perhaps he's encouraging the legend of his godhood? I'd hope not - but if so, that's completely vile and despicable and gross.

 

You're becoming what you sought to destroy Solas. Stop it.

 

 

Spoiler

After seeing the ending,i'm most curious on how Solas intend to deal with the false gods when they will be released with the fade,also how he managed to lock all the  others elven gods by himself?

He underestimated Corypheus and now he probably will underestimate the elven gods.

 

 

Spoiler

he underestimated Corypheus likely because he was human - he has a very, very low opinion of most people born after his era, which only comes across occasionally (such as the balcony conversation).

I doubt, given that he's fought the elven gods before, he'd make that mistake again.

 

Spoiler

Yes you do- he loves you- he admits as much- and if you look at history (not video game history but actual real history) love is a great weapon- it has been used against many of the greatest historical figures of all time as a means of destroying them either literally as in killing them or in terms of destroying their power base and their reputation and many of those people like Julius Caesar are would be seen as godlike in Thedas just as Fen-Solas is  

 

Spoiler

I actually think this is genuinely a pretty good point.

 

Solas set up a perfect opportunity to kill the Inquisitor then and there. Had he just left, even with no words, the elven magic in the different parts of the ruins would have caused the anchor to kill the Inquisitor. easy, painless, no implications. With the Inquisitor dead, and nobody blaming him, he'd have eliminated a powerful opposing faction.

 

The fact that he didn't is a weakness on his part. Or perhaps testament to how twisted his sense of right and wrong has to be in order to justify destroying the world in order to make a better one.

[midnight tea]

Spoiler

Also, can I just say - OMG, Dorian and Bull and their relationship   I've been torn on romancing Bull because of their budding love in base game and now I'll have even more problem romancing IB with my Rogue quizzy! I SO hope this pair will continue in some way into DA4, PLZ Bioware!

 

Also, Krem and the bard? Sera and Dagna? D'AWWW!

 

... Anyway, did anyone notice that when Lavellan chooses "we must save Solas"/heart option, Cole Greatly Approves?

[Jaderail]

Welp, I just finished Trespasser...

 

Trespasser ENDING spoilers!!

Spoiler

 

And I can't believe that ending... after all this time and the romance ends pretty much the exact same way it ended in the base game. "I love you, but I have this really important redemption thing going on and I can't afford to bang care for you. Kbye." 

 

Not to say that it wasn't an amazing scene, just not really the way I expected it to end the romance. 

 

There was a choice near the end of the dialogue between quizzy and Solas. It was one of those "important" decisions, give up and vow to fight Solas, or don't give up on him. But it didn't seem to have any effect on the scene or ending as far as I can tell. 

 

All in all, if this really was the ending, would have liked to have had the choice to go with him. 

 

I wonder if this really is the end?!

[Renmiri1]

I just asked PW on twitch, who killed Felassan and he said spoilers

 

So answer might still be coming

 

not to spoilery but just in case, here is the twitch chat

 

Spoiler

[S.W.]

Also, please sign me up to Team June.

 

Some team optimism headcanon on the above, which I also shared in the spoiler thread. Concerns the blight and the nature of the veil. Tresspasser spoilers ahoy.

 

Spoiler

Optimistic-ish headcanon regarding Solas's motives and the veil.  

 

Regarding Solas expressing the desire to destroy the world, despite the fact that the very idea of it obviously causes him enormous distress and runs so contrary to everything we know about him... what if there truly is no other option?

 

Think of it this way. The veil has obviously caused a great deal of damage to the world. It blocks magic, which means that the magic in Thedas has steadily been dwindling and may eventually cease to exist entirely. (There was something somewhere mentioning that fewer mages are being born into Dalish clans. Mages as a whole are becoming rarer.) On the other hand we have the taint, which has been infesting the world at a steady rate. Magic is often described as a 'song'. The taint is also described as a corrupted song, and there's still the question of 'silence' and what that means. (Possibly the death of the world via the removal of all magic?) What if the taint is the direct result of the veil either a ) blocking magic, or  b ) corrupting it as it passes through from the fade to the physical world? As the magic in Thedas weakens, the blight grows stronger.

 

The veil might even be the void, stretched thin and covering the world. The magic passing through is corrupted by whatever it is in there that sent Andruil bonkers. It could also explain why passing through the veil is so traumatic for demons. They're directly exposed to whatever poison dwells within the void. Shattering the veil a la Corypheus seemed to unleash blight over the whole world at once - whatever was contained within got out. Possibly, Solas has a less blighty but no less catastrophic option for getting rid of it.

 

It could be that lifting/destroying the veil is the only way to eliminate the blight at it's source. Such a connection would also explain why Solas despises the Grey Wardens so much; he knows more about the blight than they do, and their actions may actually be making it worse. If the true source of the blight isn't stopped, eventually it will consume the world, leading to death and ultimate silence. Solas may regard destroying the world as being the only way to save it. (Conveniently restoring the Elves in the process.) However he knows that the act required to save the world will devastate the mortal races, hence his pain and turmoil over what he must do. (Also compounded with the fact that he knows he wants the old world back at the expense of the current one.)

 

Basically, I think there's much more here at stake than Old vs New and Elvhen vs Everyone Else. MUCH more.

 

Spoiler

The one thing I was disappointed about (and not really, but I'd hoped for it), was no mention of the blight. I think that's the one missing piece of the puzzle here - I'm pretty sure it pre-dates Corypheus and the magisters entering the fade physically. If removing the veil can somehow deal with the blight permanently, then I think Solas' plans are (slightly) less murderously batshit. (seriously, he makes murderpope Leliana look as harmless as a mouse, in comparison.)

 

I would hope it comes down to more than elven supremacist who struggles to see us as people vs. everything else.

 

Spoiler

I miss the days when I thought Solas was just an antisocial fade nerd who was unexpectedly sweet and kind and compassionate.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Spoiler

no i think the stinger was that you go to tevinter and the hint that the inquisitor is the next protag. and yes. i can agree - no new protags!

 

Dorian Pavus.  Best Mage.  

 

That is all.

[Uirebhiril]

Also, please sign me up to Team June.

 

 

Spoiler

I miss the days when I thought Solas was just an antisocial fade nerd who was unexpectedly sweet and kind and compassionate.

 

Maybe good to put the above spoiler into its own spoiler. Just sayin'.

 

But...

Spoiler

I'm always a bit confused why people think that if someone does bad things or has evil plans, they are automatically puppy kicking people full of hate who like watching others suffer. Solas does care for others, and that's evidenced by his actions through DAI. He doesn't want people to suffer, even if he ends up seeing the as collateral damage. That doesn't make him right, and doesn't make his actions good, but he's still the same person that helped an injured woman in the Hinterlands. We just know more of who he is than we did then.

 

And this is why I appreciate writers who can make a character nuanced. It makes you pause, makes you think, and it offers a more broad understanding to the world the character exists in. Maybe even your own. Whatever becomes of Solas and the future, I still stand by my belief that Weekes will do the character and story justice, and not just have a superbad evil villain OR a pushover goody goody who will give up his driving goal and beliefs just from a finger being shaken in his naughty face. I really am looking forward to the future now.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Also, please sign me up to Team June.

 

 

Spoiler

The one thing I was disappointed about (and not really, but I'd hoped for it), was no mention of the blight. I think that's the one missing piece of the puzzle here - I'm pretty sure it pre-dates Corypheus and the magisters entering the fade physically. If removing the veil can somehow deal with the blight permanently, then I think Solas' plans are (slightly) less murderously batshit. (seriously, he makes murderpope Leliana look as harmless as a mouse, in comparison.)

 

I would hope it comes down to more than elven supremacist who struggles to see us as people vs. everything else.

 

I miss the days when I thought Solas was just an antisocial fade nerd who was unexpectedly sweet and kind and compassionate.

 

Spoiler

& I am sure X-Men fans miss the days Magneto was just an innocent victim who had difficulty controlling his powers. But **** happened and we have to deal with Theodosian Bald Magneto trying to destroy the world.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Someone needs to draw Solas with Magneto's outfit. In fact, I think the Dread Wolf's outfit should look like Magneto's outfit. Except its colored in ancient Elven armor colors and there is a wolf skin draped over it.

[S.W.]

Dorian Pavus.  Best Mage.  

 

That is all.

 

Spoiler

oh god, high friendship Dorian was just the cutest in this DLC. Like in the epilogue, where he mentioned he was constantly in touch with the quizzy through the crystal...

 

now I have extra motive to reload a pre-cory save and attempt to get him and Bull together.

[Taelaa]

Trespasser Spoilers?

Spoiler

How can I be more broken now than I was at the end of the base game?

[MaidenM]

Spoiler

oh god, high friendship Dorian was just the cutest in this DLC. Like in the epilogue, where he mentioned he was constantly in touch with the quizzy through the crystal...

 

now I have extra motive to reload a pre-cory save and attempt to get him and Bull together.

 

Spoiler

AdoriBullxADorian forever!