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[Sable Rhapsody]

Spoiler

 

Depends on if they believe it or not.  A lot of the information is coming from confused spirits (the archivists) and Solas himself - who only the Inquisitor spoke with.  So whilst the Chantry folk will believe that Fen'Harel wants to remove the Veil they may just handwave the rest as being nonsense.  Like Cassandra does at the Temple of Mythal.

 

I think the Inquisitor should share the information.  Whether or not the Dalish will believe the Inquisitor is another thing entirely.

 

 

Spoiler

It does put Lavellan in a nasty bind.  I'm rereading the Harry Potter books ATM, and she's sort of in Book 5 Harry's situation.  She just doesn't have a lot of proof that isn't her word.  The sentinels at the Temple of Mythal are either dead or gone.  The eluvian there is gone.  And with Fen'Harel in total control of the eluvians, she can't even take people back to the crossroads.

 

Here's the thing, though: IMO the truth is the best weapon she could bring to bear against Solas, especially if he's recruiting other elves in the epilogue.  She needs to make it clear to them that ripping down the Veil will free the Enavuris, who were NOT NICE PEOPLE, and that whatever Solas might say or promise, there will be devastation.  She needs to break through the bitterness toward humans that might push some elves toward Solas's cause.  If she's going to change the Dread Wolf's heart, she may as well start with her fellow elves first.

[Elessara]

While I'm catching up, one quick thought I was going to say..

 

So, did anyone else think

Spoiler

That we would have been much better off with a Qunari spymaster? That woman really knew her stuff. When she stood there listing off all the crap Solas had pulled I was like...

"DAMN IT LELIANA"

 

Also, how many freaking spies were in that Inquisition? Nope. Just nope. I dismantled the hell out of it and I'll do it again with my other Lavellan. Bit weird that they tell you it'll make you weaker against Solas. Surely that doesn't matter? Surely he will be someone else's problem?

 

Although I do like the idea of my Lavellan becoming his nemesis. Not in a sinister laugh good vs evil way. But in a whole tragic romance kind of way.

Like Subaru/Seishirou from Tokyo Babylon/X if there are any manga fans. Although with less eyeballs and death. maybe.

 

I'm still really surprised her ending wasn't tragic. Ignoring the whole Solas is a total git thing, and that rather cruel end panel about the dream. I was expecting her to have the emo end and my male Lavellan to be happier. Oh my. Have I turned the tables? Time for feels round 2. He loved his Solas bro. 

His team are also way weaker than Niamh's, so er. Could be a challenge. Niamh has some kind of health regen thing going on so she never went down. It also helped me run through all that purple fire. There's probably a better way, but I am impatient. 

 

Oh, and bringing Thom, Sera and Varric everywhere did bring out the lols. Thom and Sera were a great team for keeping it light hearted. My Niamh deserved at least that.

 

So weird calling him Thom, but the game dictates! That is his name now.

 

One last thing...

...Damn Teagan. What happen to you, dude?

 

Spoiler

 

I'm not sure how much we can hold that against Leliana though.  The Qunari have had what, centuries? to imbed spies everywhere in Thedas.  And while she had the spynetwork she had created for Divine Justinia it was probably nowhere near what the Qunari had.

 

I did wonder why Teagan was in such a pissy mood though.  Calm down, bro!  We got the Venatori out of Redcliffe and helped rebuild and everything!

 

[MaidenM]

...Damn Teagan. What happen to you, dude?

 

Spoiler

Seconded. I did not remember him as a hat-wearing, frumpy-faced stick-in-the-mud.

 

I thought I got you married to that nice lady Teagan! You should dress nicer for her!

[Sable Rhapsody]

Spoiler

 

I'm not sure how much we can hold that against Leliana though.  The Qunari have had what, centuries? to imbed spies everywhere in Thedas.  And while she had the spynetwork she had created for Divine Justinia it was probably nowhere near what the Qunari had.

 

I did wonder why Teagan was in such a pissy mood though.  Calm down, bro!  We got the Venatori out of Redcliffe and helped rebuild and everything!

 

 

Spoiler

He was expressing a very Ferelden attitude, though.  Which basically boils down to "WTF YOU DOIN' IN DAWG TOWN"  Still, it's not as though he doesn't have a point.  Ferelden's still recovering from both the Blight and Corypheus, and here's the Inquisition on their doorstep with a scary (if compromised) intelligence network and a big honking army.

[Elessara]

Spoilery-ish stuff from Patrick's twitter...

 

Spoiler

Someone asked, "In the option where Inq says to Solas the Dalish stories are wrong about FH, what does "Ma ghilana" mean?"

 

...and Patrick responds that he wanted it to be player choice. Did he get mixed up and think it was another "did they bang" question, or has my coffee failed me and I just don't get how asking what that means has anything to do with player choice?

 

Spoiler

 

Yeah I think he's confused cause that doesn't make sense.  Also found this on the DA Wiki:

 

Fen'Harel ma ghilana: "Dread Wolf guides you" Indicates someone being mislead/making bad life choices.

 

I know the Inq says "Ma ghilana vhenan" so maybe she's telling him to let his heart guide him?

 

[drosophila]

I'm back. On the world ending:

 

Spoiler

I don't think that Solas means that the entire population of life is just going to go boom when he tries to take down the veil. I expect what he means is it'll throw the world into absolute chaos and most people will die. Kind of like a zombie apocalypse, right? Most of the population won't survive the demons- some will, some with power, pockets of survivors here or there. He thinks maybe it'd be better to let it all burn itself up, but I didn't get the impression it was straight up mass explosion that kills everyone on contact. At least, I hope not. 

 

Still catching up on the previous pages. Fast moving much?

 

Spoiler

 

I don't think he plans to do it by throwing the world into chaos, because that's what the Breach was doing. Why help close it and send Inky running around activating veil strengthening artefacts in that case?

 

I think there must be something different in the way Cory caused the Breach and the way Solas will attempt to remove the Veil. Two things that the Breach caused did not sit well with Solas. One was that it was harming spirits, and the other was that it was causing suffering for people. His plan may be different in that he's trying to minimize the harm caused on creatures of the Fade, and that modern people will not see it coming. (That's how he likes to kill them in battle too, isn't it? Most of his targets never even notice him.) Basically he wants to give people a moment of peace and comfort, followed by a death they won't see coming. You know, like slaughtering farm animals. *shudders*

 

He also mentioned that his plan was to go physically into the Fade first, and then remove the Veil. So there must be something he has to do in there that did not factor in the creation of the Breach. 

 

[Avejajed]

Spoiler

 

Yep, I posted that and you phrased it better than my initial sleep-deprived, feels-loaded post. While I appreciate the lore, I think it would've been great if we learned more about his plans but kept guessing: Is he trying to do something good or something bad? Or is it part good and part bad? And his goals right now seem like 90% bad, with the other 10% being that he clearly feels some regret for what he must do. 

 

I really do understand his motivation and his pain. I feel deeply for him. I still think his personality is a mix, but his role seems to be antagonistic. 

 

 

And I disagree. Somewhat.

 

Spoiler

Solas is obviously being set up for "something", but I think it's a ruse. His plan is really, really bad. He is really, really misguided and delusional. But there are a LOT of forces at work we still know next to nothing about. His plan might be cake. His plan may not even work. And for all we know, his plan may not even work the way he thinks it does and turns out that's exactly what HAS to happen, but there's another way to save the people. I can't possibly begin to guess, but I do know that Solas, misguided he is, isn't evil. He's not that kind of "big bad". He's totally operating where he can't see anything but his goal and he pushes everyone else deep, deep down so his guilt doesn't keep him from it. That's how much he believes in his goal being the right move. He's wrong. He's going off the deep end and he's going to get a lot of people killed. But I think setting him up as "big bad" is really a red-herring.

 

There are so many other factors at play, things we have no concept of yet. I saw 11 Elven Mages that had slaves in a codex- only 8 of which are considered Gods. What about the others? Is that the three we call the Forgotten ones? What's their story? Their plan? What about the last forbidden one? I saw a codex on them too. Not to mention how Titans fit into the whole mess anyway. Is the veil what cut off the dwarves from the Titans? Did Solas **** them over too?? What about the blight and the old gods??? 

 

Again, I'm going off on tangents. I apologize. I get where people maybe are disappointed or feel they've been let down or that he's just been set up, I just don't see it that way. It's way more complicated.

[tsunamitigerdragon]

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[Sable Rhapsody]

Spoiler

 

Yeah I think he's confused cause that doesn't make sense.  Also found this on the DA Wiki:

 

Fen'Harel ma ghilana: "Dread Wolf guides you" Indicates someone being mislead/making bad life choices.

 

I know the Inq says "Ma ghilana vhenan" so maybe she's telling him to let his heart guide him?

 

 

Spoiler

Ugh, elven language.  I'm so bad at it, but I like your translation of "Ma ghilana vhenan."  Also, that phrase about the Dread Wolf?  The Dalish are right about one thing; Solas does make terrible, horrible life choices

[Avejajed]

While I'm catching up, one quick thought I was going to say..

 

So, did anyone else think

Spoiler

That we would have been much better off with a Qunari spymaster? That woman really knew her stuff. When she stood there listing off all the crap Solas had pulled I was like...

"DAMN IT LELIANA"

 

Also, how many freaking spies were in that Inquisition? Nope. Just nope. I dismantled the hell out of it and I'll do it again with my other Lavellan. Bit weird that they tell you it'll make you weaker against Solas. Surely that doesn't matter? Surely he will be someone else's problem?

 

Although I do like the idea of my Lavellan becoming his nemesis. Not in a sinister laugh good vs evil way. But in a whole tragic romance kind of way.

Like Subaru/Seishirou from Tokyo Babylon/X if there are any manga fans. Although with less eyeballs and death. maybe.

 

I'm still really surprised her ending wasn't tragic. Ignoring the whole Solas is a total git thing, and that rather cruel end panel about the dream. I was expecting her to have the emo end and my male Lavellan to be happier. Oh my. Have I turned the tables? Time for feels round 2. He loved his Solas bro. 

His team are also way weaker than Niamh's, so er. Could be a challenge. Niamh has some kind of health regen thing going on so she never went down. It also helped me run through all that purple fire. There's probably a better way, but I am impatient. 

 

Oh, and bringing Thom, Sera and Varric everywhere did bring out the lols. Thom and Sera were a great team for keeping it light hearted. My Niamh deserved at least that.

 

So weird calling him Thom, but the game dictates! That is his name now.

 

One last thing...

...Damn Teagan. What happen to you, dude?

 

On Teagan.

 

Spoiler

I'd like to punch him! I flirted with that guy like 20 years ago! Maybe they could take grizzlied Teagan and make him a companion in the future, ala Blackwall, you can figure out wtf happened to him to make him all bitter and angry and you can love him to death and make him nice again.He'll need a beard first and also a makeover.

[Uirebhiril]

Teagan got hit with every ugly branch on the Way of Three Trees. What didn't hit his face ended up between his butt cheeks.

He so chapped the whole DLC. 

 

I laughed until I cried. Thank you so much for this.

[Janic99]

Spoiler

 

I was actually happy that my theory that his name was Solas before becoming Fen'Harel was correct.  I was like, woohoo finally I figured something out and it was right yay me!

 

I also had that thought regarding Solas and his scar and Mythal.  I wonder if we'll ever find out.

 

Also for other ppl haha XD

Spoiler

I also thought like.. why would he change his real name if he is fen'harel...

I felt like that is just his ''god'' name what ppl call him. I did not ever think it was his real name. :DDDDD I am also super bad at figuring many things out I mean.. I was so stupid when I played DAO and DA2 the first time through. I never read the lore or any history or stuff. I just listened some stuff they said and skipped things lol... so when I played DAI the FIRST time and I did not finish it I went to check other romances cause I wanted to romance Iron bull for fun at the time.. I checked Solas ending where Flemeth is like: '' Dread wolf '' I was like: ok... - goes to play -
then another time I saw a comment: '' yea he is an ancient elvhen god ''

I was like: wait... WHAT!?

and I started checking all out all the walkthroughs and played the games again and I understood the stuff and I actually think his romance is the best because it is not boring yes.. drama but well.. kinda nice drama.. for me.. I think if it would be just happy happy ending.. it would be kinda... well... a bit more boring XD I really liked the ending.. yes a nice ending is always good but still I liked it.. and I know now that this all makes sense after knowing who he is (I did want to romance him when I just saw a trailer of the inquisition but I was not sure and later on I got to know he would dump me and I did not know why so I thought there was no real reason)... now here we are... solasmancer crazy one.. with 812 subbers on youtube hahah XD I am going craaazy cause I need to make ( I want to ) make more vids and idk if I can x_x

Sorry for the long message!

[tsunamitigerdragon]

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[Elessara]

Spoiler

Thank you for commiserating. (I'm sorry for being such a selfish whiner... it's just so impossible!)

 

Aw man, you beat this game without a single mage who knows barrier? I taught Dorian every barrier and "barrier-booster" spell there is and I STILL can't get past the Antaam. I thought my team was pretty good--my mage Lavellan has many strong DPS AoE spells, Dorian has party-buffs and enemy-debuffs (plus Revive), Cassandra has maxed Tank for the Antaam and Templar abilities for the Saarabas, and Cole has Cole... and we're lucky if one party member survives a zERG rush of power.

 

Ugh, this makes me sad. 

 

(I've got a few tacticians renewals, maybe I'll also change it so characters will get increased guard per hit...)

 

Spoiler

 

You may also want to try crowd control.  Pull of the Abyss and Static Cage I used a lot.  Like a lot a lot.  And later on Mark of the Rift and the Anchor discharge as much as possible.  I have zero idea how I got through without barrier.

 

You're not being whiny or selfish.  Like I said, I thought it was really hard as well.

 

[tsunamitigerdragon]

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[Onecrazymonkey1]

Spoiler

I could get behind that. Sigh... I am surprised to find myself so alone in my reaction to his plans, compared to other thread regulars. I feel like I'm seriously "in need of re-education" as the vidassala put it, and I'm trying to understand, but his goals and where the story is going still make me a bit uncomfortable.

I wish there was something positive in his plan that I could cling to, other than he just feels really bad about it. I still can't see the logic or moral justification of righting the destruction of an entire race by destroying several more races. He probably doesn't either.

Spoiler

I completely understand where you're coming from and I'm actually pretty disgusted with Solas's plans. I even had someone harass me not to long ago for disagreeing with his methods; they literally said I didn't understand the character and lacked empathy (which I'm not going to lie, it hurt a little).

Here's the thing, as much as I dislike his plans I still love his character. I love Patrick Weekes writing; he writes hard characters and hard loves but he writes them beautifully. Solas makes me angry and depressed and yet I still can't help but love him and that just means how well written he is; I would honestly rather feel sadness or anger with a character than nothing at all. I also think it would be a disservice to his amazingly complex character not to mention his flaws. There will probably never be another romance like the Solas romance for me....

As for my feelings on the DLC, it was amazing and I have never been so attached to a group of bioware companions before. Hopefully in the future more of their DLC can focus on your companions because that's the biggest reason why I play bioware games. Honestly I really want to play as the inquisitior again or at the least have them as a major NPC in dragon age 4.

I think the Solas Fandom is one of the best so I hope fans don't tear each other apart in the future just for disagreeing with one another. I hope everyone remembers that you can still love a character while not loving their actions.

Oh and Cullen's Mabari made me squee! It looks just like my blue pit except mine doesn't have clipped ears. Just....so......cute

[Sable Rhapsody]

Spoiler

Thank you for commiserating. (I'm sorry for being such a selfish whiner... it's just so impossible!)

 

Aw man, you beat this game without a single mage who knows barrier? I taught Dorian every barrier and "barrier-booster" spell there is and I STILL can't get past the Antaam. I thought my team was pretty good--my mage Lavellan has many strong DPS AoE spells, Dorian has party-buffs and enemy-debuffs (plus Revive), Cassandra has maxed Tank for the Antaam and Templar abilities for the Saarabas, and Cole has Cole... and we're lucky if one party member survives a zERG rush of power.

 

Ugh, this makes me sad. 

 

(I've got a few tacticians renewals, maybe I'll also change it so characters will get increased guard per hit...)

 

Spoiler

If you have Varric, try the Elemental Mines/Leaping Shot/Poisoned Weapons build for him.  That's pretty much all I use on my endgame Lavellan, and the Elemental Mines can clear out just about any zerg rush.  Or at least soften it up enough for the others to kill it.

 

You do have to drive Varric, though, for mine placement.  The AI is terrible with traps and mines, and just throws them about willy nilly.

[Delphine]

Solas thread right now:

 

 

(I love that it's Leslie Knope saying it. Probably the only character more optimistic than my Lavellan.)

[Oswin]

Teagan got hit with every ugly branch on the Way of Three Trees. What didn't hit his face ended up between his butt cheeks.

He so chapped the whole DLC. 

What I wished we'd been allowed to do when he...

 

Spoiler

Railed us about taking that hold in Crestwood to protect Ferelden from raider attacks was ask him about his behavior in Redcliffe. Where was he when Alexius turned Redcliffe into a landing site for Venatori? Ohhh, that's right. "Banished" without a peep as all the mages in his nation under HIS protection were sold into "indentured servitude" (slavery). And then proceed to tell him for someone so incompetent at his job he talks an awful lot.

 

 

Spoiler

When he started bad mouthing the Wardens I was like..

Dude, seriously?

You wouldn't be here to bad mouth the Wardens if it wasn't for one in particular. And are you forgetting who your freaking KING is!?

 

And Crestwood was still a disaster from the Blight. Which at the time of taking the hold, was over ten years ago. He has the cheek to complain we are using a hold for two years when Crestwood was left a disaster zone for years previous. Oh man, he just.. No Teagan. I used to love that man in DAO and his little cameo in TME. But that Teagan was no Teagan of mine! Plus yeah, wow. He has no got the same aging serum as the other DAO characters.

 

[Avejajed]

Spoiler

I think you're on the money there. The Dwarves are SO connected to the stone - to the earth - that the creation of the veil very likely is what cut them off from the Fade. Before then, when the Fade and the physical world were one, they too were "whole". It would also explain why Solas seems to lament Varric and the state of the dwarves so much.

 

Spoiler

But think about the implications!!! Does he say everyone was Elvhen? If so, how did the other races come to be? Did dwarves exist then, in some form, like the titans? What about the other creatures? If they all existed, how is it that they all coexisted before but can't now? How come everyone has to die? What about the creatures that aren't elves? If Dwarves existed before Solas put up the veil, surely there's some way to take it down without destroying everyone, right? Does this make sense to anyone but me?

[drosophila]

Spoiler

Solas thinks of the people of now!Thedas being like the people in the dark future.  Like Dorian and Inky he wants to put the world back to way it was.  So he tries to see it as 'not real'. Leliana even calls Dorian out on seeing it like an academic problem because it's real to her, she had live it. 

 

Or rather, that's how he's trying to see it, but he also can't help but want to help the world.  That was why the romance with Lavellan threw him - if she's 'real' then everyone else could also have the potential to be 'real', not an academic problem that can be fixed.

 

We don't judge Inky's actions for resetting the dark future.  That's what Solas thinks he's trying to do.

 

Spoiler

 

Hey, thanks, that's a very interesting perspective, one I can actually see myself adopting. 

 

I guess it all comes down to me being used to seeing things from modern Thedas POV, according to which all he can do is harm. But if I force myself into POV, this would bring restoration and the hope of building a better world. And his plan basically confirms there are ancient elven colonies somewhere, right? Either that, or there's some way to make more elves once the Veil has been lifted. 

 

I guess I would feel much better if we could more of the ancient elven perspective. All we have now is Abelas and a bunch of codex entries. Ancient elves have been painted overly negative: a slave owning society with narcissistic god-mages who war upon each other endlessly. There are those codes entries in the beginning of DLC who talk about regular elven slaves and Solas rescuing them, but codex entries have limited emotional effect on me. If they'd brought in characters other than Solas, whom we could get to know and learn about their suffering, it would be easier to emphatize. Well, here's hoping for DA4!

 

[LliiraAnna]

And I disagree. Somewhat.

 

Spoiler

Solas is obviously being set up for "something", but I think it's a ruse. His plan is really, really bad. He is really, really misguided and delusional. But there are a LOT of forces at work we still know next to nothing about. His plan might be cake. His plan may not even work. And for all we know, his plan may not even work the way he thinks it does and turns out that's exactly what HAS to happen, but there's another way to save the people. I can't possibly begin to guess, but I do know that Solas, misguided he is, isn't evil. He's not that kind of "big bad". He's totally operating where he can't see anything but his goal and he pushes everyone else deep, deep down so his guilt doesn't keep him from it. That's how much he believes in his goal being the right move. He's wrong. He's going off the deep end and he's going to get a lot of people killed. But I think setting him up as "big bad" is really a red-herring.

 

There are so many other factors at play, things we have no concept of yet. I saw 11 Elven Mages that had slaves in a codex- only 8 of which are considered Gods. What about the others? Is that the three we call the Forgotten ones? What's their story? Their plan? What about the last forbidden one? I saw a codex on them too. Not to mention how Titans fit into the whole mess anyway. Is the veil what cut off the dwarves from the Titans? Did Solas **** them over too?? What about the blight and the old gods??? 

 

Again, I'm going off on tangents. I apologize. I get where people maybe are disappointed or feel they've been let down or that he's just been set up, I just don't see it that way. It's way more complicated.

Spoiler

I agree that Solas is misguided, and that his plans might spectacularly backfire - like they did so many times before. And yes, there are many forces at work and many potential threats, but Solas is the most direct and immediate one, in eyes of the Inquisitor at least. Besides, the games mostly concentrated at one threat at a time, and as much as I'd like for a big showdown between Solas, Mythal, other elven gods, the Forgotten Ones and *insert names here* to happen, I doubt it'll ever come to be x) 

 

There's definitely more going on than we see, but I doubt we'll ever be shown *everything*, let alone everything at once.

 

Also, while Solas's plan might not be totally foolproof, I don't think that he's *completely* ignorant of other potential threats. It may be more that he just doesn't care about them for the moment, hoping that they either get killed off (as he hoped will happen with Cory) or that he'll somehow deal with them later? Alternaively he might just not be interested in anything but returning the world to its former state and not care about his own life beyond that.

[tsunamitigerdragon]

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[Sable Rhapsody]

 

Spoiler

Also, while Solas's plan might not be totally foolproof, I don't think that he's *completely* ignorant of other potential threats. It may be more that he just doesn't care about them for the moment, hoping that they either get killed off (as he hoped will happen with Cory) or that he'll somehow deal with them later? Alternaively he might just not be interested in anything but returning the world to its former state and not care about his own life beyond that.

 

 

Spoiler

I dunno.  That smacks of Act 3 Anders and seems awfully irresponsible to me.  If you're going to reshape the world, at least have the courtesy to help it through the aftermath.  I think it's more that he thinks restoring the elvhen world is his top priority, and he can worry about everything else either as it comes, or later.  

 

Seriously, how did this guy stop the Evanuris in the first place?  He's so easily blinded to other opportunities and possibilities by his primary goal.