153434 réponses à ce sujet

[Caddius]

Spoiler

I get the feeling that 'burn in the chaos' is a bit more literal than we'd all like. Solas seems to see it as genocidal. The Codex entries in the Crossroads talk about how everything fell apart when the Fade and the Earth were sundered, how reality crumbled, killing most of them. I imagine that the reverse happening, the Veil being ripped away, would have a similar effect.
What would happen to the spirits, to the demons, to the mages? How would the world handle the change? How would the Titans? If all of that wasn't enough, the Evanuris would be unleashed to drown humanity in glitter and death. It doesn't sound like regular mortals will actually be able to live in this world. It's also possible that, as Liz suggested, he plans to use the chaos of this Uber-Breach to roll back time.
All of which sounds like it'd make an unusually crazy and intense ending to a Dragon Age game. Just sayin'.

DustyTullip:

Spoiler

We also got the glitch with Gaspard being referred to as Emperor, but Celene and Briala living it up in the Codex entries, and, y'know, Gaspard being executed back in Lavellan's actual playthrough. Hopefully they'll fix it soon.

[drake2511]

 

Spoiler

Okay, I really like this theory.
I just have one problem with it. Why does he insist Cole stays a spirit then? Why say "I'm no a spirit." or "I didn't think it is possible." (when Cole becomes more human)

Hrm, but maybe, he doesn't want Cole to be more human b/c he saw what the gods did.

 

 

Spoiler

I think he's insistent that Cole remain a spirit because if he becomes more human, he'll be a casualty. It does seem like he plans on making spirits the new People, along with his elven followers. If Cole became more physical then, then he'd be fine. As is...*grimace*

 

Spoiler

I agree with Caddius. Regarding the theory posted before, I just wanted to add that before the game came out, Wekees tweeted that Solas was sweeter to Cole than with any other companion (or something similar), and we got a confirm of that by playing the game.

 

Solas isn't clear at all when he talks about "his people". We still don't know who "his people" are, but I am more convinced now that he means spirits with it. He's kind to them, while he's harsh with the Dalish and treats them (and any other living being, tbh) as they're not his equals. Not until he befriends/romances the Inquisitor, at least.

[TheEggCrusher]

well that took a while ....

 

I finally put up the first 3 parts of my elvhen lore theory complilation on my thread 

 

it's all about spirits and the elves (duh) and there will be much Solas. Much, much Solas. 

 

for anyone who wants to take a look, here's the link: http://forum.bioware.../#entry19672344

 

(btw it's all about what happened in Trespasser and how that relates to the lore. so spoilers ahead)

[Kittn]

WHY SOLAS WHY!!!
 

Spoiler

So, I love this character. However, every time time I play through the ending and he pretty my tells me that in order for his people to live he has to kill mine and that I should not worry about that, but the inquisition. I want to through the worst *itch fit ever!

In response:

Spoiler

Haha. I think I'm in this camp too. I like to imagine that if my elfy's hand didn't hurt like hell and wasn't actually killing her, she'd have grabbed him and tried to literally shake some sense into his endearingly bald headed self. He could have said we should be concerned about anything else there and it would be no less ridiculous.

Solas: "I take no joy in this, but the return of my people means the death of yours. It is my fight. You should be more concerned about being present when the UPS man arrives with your amazon book order. You know how aggressive they are with their yellow InfoNotices, Vhenan. Don't give them the opportunity to leave one."
Tiger Festival: "Oh. Okay." <frowny face>

I really needed a slightly more motivated response there.

Now that I've had some sleep, and gotten some chores done, I've given more thought to the future of the franchise. I'm probably not the first to mention this stuff, but it's a bit difficult to keep track of what's going on in this thread at the moment, especially when most posts are under a clicky thing. Not that I'm complaining about that. Really happy everyone is respecting the spoiler free zone. It's just more evidence that Team Solas is truly the best part of this community.

So, more thoughts on the future:

Spoiler

I recall it being mentioned somewhere, ages ago, that Dragon Age will be a 5 game series. I conveniently don't remember where of course, but I seem to recall it being at least a somewhat official source. If that's true and whatever Solas is doing brings about the end of the era, then our final confrontation with him won't take place in the next game.

I imagine DA4 will be dealing with Qunari and changing the Imperium for better or worse while the threat of world's end lingers in the back of our minds.

If that is the case, we could be playing a new agent of the Divine Inquisition or the not-inquisition. I'm calling my not-Inquisition the Calamity Five. Starring the undercover Divine (Cass), Leliana, Harding, Tiger Festival and an unknown agent, we'd double as a girl band that gets ridiculously famous thanks to the Inquisitor's vocals and the Divine's killer enchanted guitar solos. We'd go to Tevinter under the pretense of a world tour while we spend our free time righting wrongs and seeking Solas.

Or you know, something like that anyway. :3

So, I could see the inquisitor being at least an option for the next protagonist. I really hope she is. And it makes me grumpy when people insist that it absolutely can't happen that way. I was under the impression that Hawke was originally going to be the Inquisitor? Doesn't that mean they were considering the idea of a carry-over protagonist already?

At the very least I need her to be there at the end. Whether it's in DA4 or 5. And she better not be an NPC with scripted dialogue. If she shows up, give me back the wheel. The Hawke they presented in DAI felt like such a huge deviation from the one I played. It makes it that much easier to leave her in the fade every playthrough. She's just not my Hawke.

Come what may, I need Tiger Festival to face Solas in the end and I need her to be mine. Nothing else will do.

[Aviena]

Spoiler

Can anyone actually imagine a scenario in which Solas actually does bring down the Veil? In terms of how Bioware could in any way continue making DA games for that world state? I've been seeing people elsewhere referring back to Sandal's prophecy about all the magic coming back, and Flemeth talking about the inevitable plummet into the abyss... they can't both be wrong!!

[TheEggCrusher]

Spoiler

Can anyone actually imagine a scenario in which Solas actually does bring down the Veil? In terms of how Bioware could in any way continue making DA games for that world state? I've been seeing people elsewhere referring back to Sandal's prophecy about all the magic coming back, and Flemeth talking about the inevitable plummet into the abyss... they can't both be wrong!!

Spoiler

woah what's this about plummeting into the abyss? I haven't heard that before

 

[FernRain]

Spoiler

woah what's this about plummeting into the abyss? I haven't heard that before

 

Spoiler

When she meets Hawke: "We stand upon the precipice of change. The world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment... and when it comes, do not hesitate to leap. It is only when you fall that you learn whether you can fly."

[Kittn]

Spoiler

Can anyone actually imagine a scenario in which Solas actually does bring down the Veil? In terms of how Bioware could in any way continue making DA games for that world state? I've been seeing people elsewhere referring back to Sandal's prophecy about all the magic coming back, and Flemeth talking about the inevitable plummet into the abyss... they can't both be wrong!!

Well...

Spoiler

I'm thinking he will succeed and the prophecies come true. I like to think our actions over the course of all of this and the next games will allow us to save the world when it happens. Our heroes will find a way to protect the masses from the intial chaotic fade surge or whatever it will be, and we will personally deal with Solas afterwards.

The event itself sounds like it would be large enough to be officially noted on a time line. So I imagine it would be the actual end of the Dragon Age. Any games after that would be dealing with the aftermath in a new age. An age where god-like elven mages harrass each other and try to re-enslave the world, and a new batch of mundane and magical heroes must rise to make things better, putting down these jerks once and for all. I wonder what they'd call it.

Revelation Age?
Evanuris Age?
Crazy Arse Mage Age?

Eh. I'm not so good at naming Eras it seems, but that's one way I can imagine them continuing the series.

[Caddius]

Spoiler

I believe the five games things came from an interview where they were talking about how much of the storyline they'd hashed out. Evidently, even by the time Origins came out originally, Solas and that whole backstory and the basis of Inquisition was there. They said they had five games planned out, but, if the writing spark was still there and the fans wanted more, they'd left themselves plenty of material to work with. Worth noting that DAII was an interquel that came into being during meetings discussing Inquisition, so we have at least three games left, assuming they're sticking to that plan.

[TheEggCrusher]

Spoiler

When she meets Hawke: "We stand upon the precipice of change. The world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment... and when it comes, do not hesitate to leap. It is only when you fall that you learn whether you can fly."

Spoiler

ooooh that line. yea i remember that. I saw it as more metaphorical than literal. good to keep in mind, though

 

[Illyria]

*shrug* Just my observations.

 

 

 

Case and point.

 

Masculine and "Badass" (even if morally degenerate) = good.

 

Perceived softer, gentler, more vulnerable (like historically oppressed slaves) = bad.

 

 

I also have a theory that modern fantasy elves are generally dislike hated because they threaten people's perceptions of humanity. If elves are shown to be morally equal or superior to humans, it threatens a commonly held belief that humans are so freaking awesome that we're the best race ever, both in the real world and any fictional world, so they automatically hate elves or pick the elves' faults apart to reassure themselves that humanity is still the best.

 

I think a lot of the hatred of Thedas elves also comes from suppressed guilt. Yes, Thedas elves are oppressed victims, but humans are the oppressors. Admitting that the elves deserve better means admitting that humanity did wrong (and that there's something fundamentally flawed with humans that we oppressed and destroy everything we can't control), so it's easier to assure themselves that elves suck, elves deserve their fate, elves did the same to each other, elves would do the same in human shoes, etc. etc.

 

I mean, given some of the revelations in The Masked Empire and Dragon Age Inquisition alone, it's amazing how many people jump to say, "See? The elves oppressed each other, so that makes it okay for us to oppress them!"

 

I didn't mean to sound like I was dismissing your arguments.  I agreed with what you said.  I just immeditatly started picturing how Gyrff would react to those statements.

 

That last paragraph is why I feel so wary of people who go the 'lol, let's kill the elves' route in their arguments.

[tsunamitigerdragon]

. 

[Yaslana]

Spoiler

I believe the five games things came from an interview where they were talking about how much of the storyline they'd hashed out. Evidently, even by the time Origins came out originally, Solas and that whole backstory and the basis of Inquisition was there. They said they had five games planned out, but, if the writing spark was still there and the fans wanted more, they'd left themselves plenty of material to work with. Worth noting that DAII was an interquel that came into being during meetings discussing Inquisition, so we have at least three games left, assuming they're sticking to that plan.

Spoiler

Oh I hope they stick to the plan and more. I totally see myself as old granny getting excited about a new game while my grandkids roll their eyes at me...

[TheEggCrusher]

Spoiler

I believe the five games things came from an interview where they were talking about how much of the storyline they'd hashed out. Evidently, even by the time Origins came out originally, Solas and that whole backstory and the basis of Inquisition was there. They said they had five games planned out, but, if the writing spark was still there and the fans wanted more, they'd left themselves plenty of material to work with. Worth noting that DAII was an interquel that came into being during meetings discussing Inquisition, so we have at least three games left, assuming they're sticking to that plan.

Spoiler

good stuff good stuff. 

 

if they can't fit in closure for the solasmance into at least a small part of those 3 games i'm going to be highly disappointed 

 

even if it's just "Ma vhenan, we will be together after death in the fade" to Lavellan right before he dies or something, that would be enough. or at least a reference from him about how he hopes he can one day be with Lavellan if he must die.

 

honestly, anything is good enough. my optimism flag is so small by this point that i'll take anything.  

[ChuChu]

I had some flycam fun with the ending.

You may remember (or not, so many comments and spoiler tags these days!)... but my computer is dying. I'm just waiting for the Skylake chipset to be released and I'll bring her to life again!  Took some screenies regardless, though... can never have too much oogling at Solas in massive pelt and tight shiny armor:

Spoiler

1: first off, I loved how he kneels. 

Spoiler

2: The Mythal eyes suit him, yes?

Spoiler

3: All I can see looking at this is the shape of a heart :<

Spoiler

And to go with the above one, he holds her hand and braces her head. It's so sweet. 

Spoiler

Lastly, that map at the end was pretty. So here it is all stitched together.

Spoiler

Ok LAST lastly... some more appreciation for that fine elven workmanship. 

Spoiler

Edit: had to add one more :>

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I suppose I have a decent memory and I am sure some of you here do too.

 

Remember back in the old post DAO days, where everyone hated Loghain Mac Tir for doing the crap he did ? Yeah I remember that time quite well.

 

Remember how many of Loghain's haters were converted and sympathized with him when The Stolen Throne came out ? Yeah I remember that well too.

 

Remember how quite a few people are okay with sparing the Architect ? I remember those moments.

 

Remember how these same people decided that they hate the Architect and want to kill him after The Calling ? I remember those too.

 

With regards to Solas, I will say this...

 

Spoiler

I am willing to bet good money on the fact that if someone at Bioware published a well written novel detailing the time of ancient Elvhenan, what was it like, what happened, what were the stakes and why Solas had to create the Veil and there was little alternative...Many would either start loving Solas back or sympathize with him instead of blindly hating him now...

 

I am not saying I support the Wolfgod Egghead, I don't but blindly hating him without any context is ridiculous. As for his plans to tear down the Veil, I think it will backfire like it always has. He will inadvertently cause Titans to wake up, cause Great Dragons to regain sentience, release some or all of the Evanuris by accident on top of killing lots of people...But blind hatred of him is foolish...Tis' better to try to talk him out of it or to try and depower him or try and lock him away or send him somewhere else using Time Magic...

 

Killing Solas will not stop the problem or solve anything. For one, Solas can be as powerful as the Evanuris and the Evanuris do not die so easily. Neither will Solas. Secondly, Solas' plans can always be carried out by someone else, preferably another Ancient Elf who is his agent. Yes his agent might not have Solas' power but as we saw from In Your Heart Shall Burn, you do not really need a single individual with the power. You can draw from multiple power sources to obtain sufficient power for your goals.

 

To effectively stop Solas, you will have to kill him and every ancient Elf that exists in Thedas. That amounts to genocide and makes us no different than he is.

 

In the movie Justice League The Flashpoint Paradox, Nora's Allen who is Flash's mother says this in the beginning of the animated movie:- "...when I was a little girl, Grandma taught me a prayer: Accept the things you cannot change. Have the courage to change the things you can... and have the wisdom to know the difference."

 

That is the lesson Solas needs to ultimately learn. He cannot change anything and everything without serious consequences, especially unexpected consequences

 

Humans really do have short memories and fickle stances, don't we ?

[Illyria]

I am currently analysing all of the companion's talks featuring Solas and...damn, the one if the Inquisitor romances Blackwall hits hard!

Thoughts under the spoiler cut, btw. Because, well, Trespasser spoilers.

Spoiler

• Solas: So, you and the Inquisitor are together.
• Blackwall: Yes. Is that a problem?
• Solas: Far from it. People should seize any chance for a moment's respite in times such as these. I am glad you've allowed yourself some happiness.
• Blackwall: I expected you to think that I should keep punishing myself.
• Solas: I would be concerned if you forgot your past, but that seems unlikely. Beyond that, guilt is a distraction. One we can ill afford.
• Blackwall: What of you, then? Have you found someone to share a moment's respite?
• Solas: I find my peace elsewhere.

It has become very clear to me that Solas, though being filled with guilt, clearly tries to shove it away from himself in order to go through with his plan. Then there is the famous 'the healer has the bloodiest hands' and also, how he says to Blackwall that he will remember the people of Thedas. Ugh, Solas!

 

Edit:

 

Spoiler

• Cassandra: It is interesting to hear a mage's perspective of our abilities, Solas.
• Solas: I am pleased you find it so.
• Cassandra: I am taught my abilities come from the Maker. You probably think it silly.
• Solas: Your abilities declare the world real. Who, if not the Maker of this world, could grant such a gift?
• Cassandra: You believe in the Maker?
• Solas: I am always open to new ideas.

OMG, hints everywhere.

 

Spoiler

Be open to new ideas, then.  DON'T DESTORY THE WOLRD.  Find a home in the now, and move on.

 

[Aramintai]

I'm worried with these Solas revelations about comes next, the world is starting dangerously spiraling into ME3 endings:

Spoiler

Red ending: Destroy the Fade and kill all spirits and old elves

Green ending: Merge the world with the Fade non-violently (everyone is possessed by the spirits, lol) 

Blue ending: Control of the world by the old elves who return as gods

I really hope devs are not going this route, or it's gonna be a disaster all over again.

[drake2511]

I suppose I have a decent memory and I am sure some of you here do too.

 

Remember back in the old post DAO days, where everyone hated Loghain Mac Tir for doing the crap he did ? Yeah I remember that time quite well.

 

Remember how many of Loghain's haters were converted and sympathized with him when The Stolen Throne came out ? Yeah I remember that well too.

 

Remember how quite a few people are okay with sparing the Architect ? I remember those moments.

 

Remember how these same people decided that they hate the Architect and want to kill him after The Calling ? I remember those too.

 

With regards to Solas, I will say this...

 

Spoiler

I am willing to bet good money on the fact that if someone at Bioware published a well written novel detailing the time of ancient Elvhenan, what was it like, what happened, what were the stakes and why Solas had to create the Veil and there was little alternative...Many would either start loving Solas back or sympathize with him instead of blindly hating him now...

 

Humans really do have short memories and fickle stances, don't we ?

 

Trying to like. Can not like. 

Have a quote instead.

[Illyria]

Spoiler

 

Imagine that happening on a meta level. Like, the devs weren't planning on giving Solas a "changed his mind and got redeemed" path, then they made the romance and people liked it. Then the devs kind of wanted the fans to woo them so they can write the Solas redemption path; it's still kind of not in the cards yet, but enough Solas fans and Solas romancers responded well (fan comics and fan art and jokes and Solas x Lavellan romance music videos and letters pleading), that they think, "Eh, what the heck. Throw it in. Give the fans what they want."

 

I kind of like the idea that Solas will get to be wooed into changing his mind about Thedas by persistent Lady Lavellans, which itself mirrors how the devs will get wooed into writing the redemption path by persistent Solas fans and fangirls. 

 

Spoiler

I have no doubt there was always a Solas redemption path planned.  The devs have been open about the fact that they worked hard to make it clear that Solas wasn't Evily McEvil, and even included a romance with him to make him more tragic.  They want fans to understand why he wants to do what he's doing, and that it's not just a 'lol, destroy the world' plot.   They did all this and gave everyone who was a friend or a lover the chance to save him from himself.

 

[Kittn]

I had some flycam fun with the ending.

You may remember (or not, so many comments and spoiler tags these days!)... but my computer is dying. I'm just waiting for the Skylake chipset to be released and I'll bring her to life again!  Took some screenies regardless, though... can never have too much oogling at Solas in massive pelt and tight shiny armor:

Spoiler

1: first off, I loved how he kneels. 

Spoiler

2: The Mythal eyes suit him, yes?

Spoiler

3: All I can see looking at this is the shape of a heart :<

Spoiler

And to go with the above one, he holds her hand and braces her head. It's so sweet. 

Spoiler

Lastly, that map at the end was pretty. So here it is all stitched together.

Spoiler

Oooh. I gotta get the cinematic tools working again. Different angles are sure to increase appreciation of the whole thing. You know...

Spoiler

Instead of making me laugh during what was supposed to be a very deep and moving moment, because my Inquisitor decides her last kiss with Solas is a good time to attempt that duck face fad from sometime ago. She looked so silly I didn't notice anything else going on that moment. Clearly I missed the good stuff. Like his glowy eyes.

But most of all..

Omg guys, Antiva! How did I not know it was RIGHT THERE beside Tevinter? I'll pretend I knew and forgot. Bouncing around in my chair right now! I hope we get to go there! Ahhh!

[Aramintai]

Spoiler

I am willing to bet good money on the fact that if someone at Bioware published a well written novel detailing the time of ancient Elvhenan, what was it like, what happened, what were the stakes and why Solas had to create the Veil and there was little alternative...Many would either start loving Solas back or sympathize with him instead of blindly hating him now...

 

Humans really do have short memories and fickle stances, don't we ?

No matter what happened I don't I will ever sympathize with a guy who wants to

Spoiler

kill all my beloved characters from previous games and the whole world of sentient races in order to bring back a bunch of long dead elves.

 

[Yaslana]

Okay I have a question how you all decided

Spoiler

About the Inquisitions fate. Disband or did you work with your divine?

[Ajna]

Okay I have a question how you all decided

Spoiler

About the Inquisitions fate. Disband or did you work with your divine?

 

Spoiler

I disbanded, but you know that already right?

[Illyria]

Spoiler

I can relate to this so well. I had an inkling he would be trying to restore the elves, just in a slightly less destructive fashion, maybe conquering back the Dales or something... I don't know, maybe I just didn't want to see it.

 

But now I just keep going back to all these little moments in game that suddenly don't mean what I thought they meant. 

• That screenshot someone posted just a couple of days ago of Solas kneeling to help a refugee at the Crossroads.
• Solas saying how he will remember the people when it is all over and how they courageously fought against the tide.
• "It would be kinder in the long run."
• Remembering that one mission in the Emerald Graves where Inky scattered somebody's ashes and Solas said, "That was a kind thing you did."
• All this talk about how he values wisdom.

All this time... He was just trying to give everyone a moment of peace before destroying them. The thought still horrifies me. 

 

Dread Wolf's pretty accurate for him, I think. 

 

Don't think of it like that, then.

 

Spoiler

Think of it was being part of Solas' struggle between wanting to bring back his world, and live in this one.  Use it to remind him that he's a good person and he has friends here.