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[roselavellan]

Spoiler

Sera does, after you complete the first quest - she'll ask you about whether the elven gods things you discovered in Fen'Harel's sanctury bothered you, after which she'll say that she was sorry Solas was left. It's a really sweet moment.

 

So does Vivienne, as well, in her first cutscene (it totally threw me, we were in the middle of spa day and everything).

 

Combined with some of Cole's dialogue in some of the 'Listen to Cole' sections - he mentions Solas at least once - I always felt like his absence was being felt during the DLC, even if only mildly.

 

 

Spoiler

 

Sera does.  She'll say she's sorry he didn't come back but no she isn't but she is sorry that Solas hurt you.  Vivienne will also ask if you do the spa day.

 

 

Edit:  Ninja'd by Shallow waters!

 

Thanks, Shallow waters and Elessara! I don't have Vivienne in my playthrough but I'll try to talk with Sera more. I don't know if it's approval-dependent because I wasn't successful the first time.

[S.W.]

Spoiler

No-one here has really defended Solas' plan. Mostly we've spent time trying to understand his motivation and peel back the layers of the pain onion.  A lot of Anders fans, however, will say there was nothing wrong with what he did.

But yes, Anders' personality is grating, and that is what leads to a lot of hate (sorry, Cee). It's the main reason I don't like him anyway. Plus, there's his fairly offensive dismissal of Hawke and Fenris' relationship and Nice Guy attitude towards her if unromanced.

 

I'm thinking more of those fans who go out of their way to make hate threads - I think they'd do it regardless of whether we defend Solas, or just peel back layers of the pain onion and cry and post cute wolf .gifs.

 

I forgot about Fenris though, Anders is quite nasty to him for petty reasons

[Illyria]

'I don't hate you because you're a mage.  I hate you because you wont shut up about it.'

 

I quoted that line after reading your post but before I realised you'd edited your post to add it in.  It's my favourite Carver line.  Aside from every single line Carver has.

[Uirebhiril]

I think the most jarring is that people go out of their way to make hate threads. I mean, let's make hate threads for every characters we dislike, that will go well right? I could make an thread about my negative feelings on Vivienne, but that would be petty, so I choose to refrain. It's just so stupid and pointless.

 

We've had people come to this thread and say they don't like Solas. I don't recall there being birmstone and armageddon as a result, because as long as the person is respectful about it and just wanting to discuss the character or his plans or whatever it's all been good. It's those that come by (or, as you said, make hate threads) who then want to start acting like the real-life people who are enjoying a character and story are insane for, er, enjoying a character and story that things get really touchy. Make fun of the character all you want, hate him all you want, but at least be civil about it and leave real life people out of your feelings. 

[Jayla]

Hypothetical question.

Spoiler

What if Solas had told Lavellan of his real identity in Crestwood? Would he still have been all "This wolrd mus die" or would he have been more open to discussion? I sometimes think that taking Mythal's power was a point of no return for him. He HAS to do it now or Flemythal would've died for nothing (IF she died).

 

Spoiler

Pulled from the wikia:

Solas had actually been planning on telling the Inquisitor the truth about who he was and his involvement with the elves and Corypheus when he brought the Inquisitor out with him to the secluded cove in Crestwood. However, at the last second he lost his nerve, and used the truth about the vallaslin as an excuse as to why he brought her out there instead. When he kisses the Inquisitor, he is fully ready to lose himself in her and forget about the mission he has dedicated himself to. However, when he pulls back, he realizes that he cannot do that lest he betray himself. He decides right then that he needs to break off his emotional entanglement with the Inquisitor, as much as it hurts him.

 

The emboldened part tells me that he was fully ready to not go through with it, but decides against it and breaks up with Lavellan instead. We were that close to pulling him out of it. In some ways it leaves me hopeful, in other ways it leaves me gross sobbing. D:

[Sable Rhapsody]

I quoted that line after reading your post but before I realised you'd edited your post to add it in.  It's my favourite Carver line.  Aside from every single line Carver has.

 

Little bro is bestest.  And yes, I remembered the line right after I hit post.

 

I have more conflicted feelings on Anders as a character than I do on Solas.  Anders I love as a character, but I also find him very hard to stomach, just during normal gameplay.  Whenever he opens his mouth, I want to hit him.  Or hug him.  Can't decide which.

 

Solas has his flaws, and I want to hit him almost as often as Anders.  But I don't find him nearly as disagreeable to be around.

[Jaison1986]

I think it's personality as you say.  Like...if he was more affable or calm and chill he'd probably have less hate.  I understood why he did what he did.  And gave him actual consideration. I just really could not stand him. 

 

Spoiler

As for Solas - his past crimes are incredibly past.  They were horrible but potentially the only way. But regardless they are an abstract pain to a modern thedosian and likely to most players. They don't see that immediate hurt.  So it's like 'why should i care?'

 

As for future...he hasn't actually done anything yet.  You could potentially still stop them. Or he won't go through with them yet.  Yes you can have rage at him, but like...he didn't actually do much of anything and he can stop. And to be fair to Solas, he tells you he is doing this and giving you time. Anders manipulates you and never says anything until it's too late.

 

Also, honestly, his fandom is notoriously awful.  I think - at this point - a lot of the rage at him is spite over the fandom. I have seen some NASTY Anders defenders. I mean vile.  That's not everyone obviously but it's the unfortunate and ugly public face of the fans. 

 

Spoiler

Oh yes, I once saw some Anders fans on tumblr. They were *toxic*. But, in the end many fandoms have their bad elements.

 

Part of me thinks Solas wants you to stop him. At least in a world were you are his friend. His last words are "I would cherish the chance to be wrong once again, my friend". It sounds like he wants to be proven wrong. And that's the charm of that scene. An antagonist that deep down wants to change. I suppose that's why he left the Inquisition as soon as Corypheus was slain. He was getting too attached, and it was only a matter of time were he wouldn't be able to go further and would give up. The irony is that in the end he became just like Felassan.

[Jayla]

I'm thinking more of those fans who go out of their way to make hate threads - I think they'd do it regardless of whether we defend Solas, or just peel back layers of the pain onion and cry and post cute wolf .gifs.

 

I forgot about Fenris though, Anders is quite nasty to him for petty reasons

 

It takes energy to hate someone, just as it does to love them. I think the people who go out of their way to make hate threads are just getting stuff out of their system, same as we do here. It's negative, and there's better ways, so I'm not saying it's right or just they do it, but I can understand it, with that it doesn't bother me. Hate a character all you like, just be respectful with those who don't and there's no trouble.

 

I'm pleased to say while I've been here, I've not seen anyone go to extremes like that.

 

I was pretty ambivalent towards Anders until he suggested Fenris kill himself. I actually gasped out loud. Too far, man.

[Uirebhiril]

On another note, since we are speaking of characters we don't like... Blackwall left me feeling skeeved all through DAI, even though I did like the character. But after finishing Trespasser I feel better about him. It feels that he

Spoiler

finally accepted what he did and went on a path of redemption and forgiveness for real, and not just because that was the "correct" thing to do just so he can pretend at doing the noble right think like Blackwall would have done. He accepted himself as Thom and that, to me, made all the damn difference.

[Cee]

Spoiler

Sera does, after you complete the first quest - she'll ask you about whether the elven gods things you discovered in Fen'Harel's sanctury bothered you, after which she'll say that she was sorry Solas was left. It's a really sweet moment.

 

So does Vivienne, as well, in her first cutscene (it totally threw me, we were in the middle of spa day and everything).

 

Combined with some of Cole's dialogue in some of the 'Listen to Cole' sections - he mentions Solas at least once - I always felt like his absence was being felt during the DLC, even if only mildly.

 

Spoiler

 

Vivienne being the first to ask jarred me. It was like...we're not even friends, really, but you're the FIRST one who asks about Solas?

 

Did anyone take the "maybe I could get married" line when talking to Cassandra? I didn't but wondering if it resulted in snark or if there was any Solas mention.

 

Sera's was sweet.

 

Just found this addition if Bull is still part of the Qun and betrays you.

 

 

Cold, Solas. Very cold.

 

[_Lucinia]

I've been wondering some of these things for a while.  In light of Trespasser, and some of today's discussion... conjecture and speculation ahoy!  I am probably reaching for some of it, maybe all of it. 

 

Spoiler

I have to go back to the stinger at the end of the main game.  I remember my initial reaction from how my brain saw the scene.  "Oh my god Mythal just took over Solas.  I am so devastated."  Of course I rewatched it a few times.  Read the forums.  Ok no Solas took Mythal's power.  Phew.  Ok crazy time!  Maybe my initial reaction to it was closer to the truth. 

I can't help but feel that Flemythal could possibly be the actual puppet master.  We know she's been putting things into motion for centuries.  She's playing a long game.  And she's out for a reckoning that will make the world shake.  Hell hath no fury like that of a woman scorned.  I feel like all of the focus on Solas right now is a slight of hand.  We're too busy focused on him to see the real threat that's coming.  The real one behind the machinations.  He's complicit, for sure, but to what extent? 

 

ALL of this could be Mythal's plans.  Possibly the only one that can take down the Veil is its Maker; Solas.  She needs Solas.  So the stinger... what if that really was Mythal taking over Solas, but Flemeth never saw it coming?  Yeah I know I have officially lost my mind and spent too much time over thinking.  Maybe she lets Solas be in control most of the time? 

 

Just conjecture and speculation.  But ever since I finished the game last year, my mind always circles back to these thoughts.  Mythal endures, and all. 

[BoscoBread]

On another note, since we are speaking of characters we don't like... Blackwall left me feeling skeeved all through DAI, even though I did like the character. But after finishing Trespasser I feel better about him. It feels that he

Spoiler

finally accepted what he did and went on a path of redemption and forgiveness for real, and not just because that was the "correct" thing to do just so he can pretend at doing the noble right think like Blackwall would have done. He accepted himself as Thom and that, to me, made all the damn difference.

Spoiler

Yeah.  I loved Blackwall's ending. i didn't even take him a long that much but his whole arc was great.  I got the prisoner reformer thom ranier ending and i teared up.  

 

I love what Blackwall represents for Solas too. The possibility and temptation of forgiveness. I think Solas sees that and is actually envious of it.   Sees that Blackwall works through his guilt on his own and doesn't demand forgiveness, just hopes for it and most importantly he forgives himself in a way and allows his guilt to be a force for good.  I think to truly appreciate Solas you HAVE to appreciate blackwall's arc -- not like --- just appreciate.  

[roselavellan]

I was happy to see my other friends, companions and advisers, but it did feel like something was missing, yes.

 

Spoiler

Blackwall mentions Solas?! 0_0

 

I missed that. I maxed his approval and gave him complete mercy in his personal quest, yet he didn't mention Solas when I talked to him. 

 

Vivienne did, though. Much to my surprise. She was the last one I talked to since I didn't like her (we mutually loathed each other in the main game), but she surprised me by treating me to spa day, then mentioned how she knew how disappointing it was when Solas left. And I was like, "Finally, someone acknowledges my heartbreak... and it's from the woman I hate, and who hates me! Come on, guys. You're supposed to be my friends. Step it up."

 

Spoiler

You can talk to Blackwall about it with one of the dialogue options after the first cutscene. I really hated Blackwall in the main game, but have come to like him now. Him giving little toys to children was a nice touch too  

[BoscoBread]

I've been wondering some of these things for a while.  In light of Trespasser, and some of today's discussion... conjecture and speculation ahoy!  I am probably reaching for some of it, maybe all of it. 

 

Spoiler

I have to go back to the stinger at the end of the main game.  I remember my initial reaction from how my brain saw the scene.  "Oh my god Mythal just took over Solas.  I am so devastated."  Of course I rewatched it a few times.  Read the forums.  Ok no Solas took Mythal's power.  Phew.  Ok crazy time!  Maybe my initial reaction to it was closer to the truth. 

I can't help but feel that Flemythal could possibly be the actual puppet master.  We know she's been putting things into motion for centuries.  She's playing a long game.  And she's out for a reckoning that will make the world shake.  Hell hath no fury like that of a woman scorned.  I feel like all of the focus on Solas right now is a slight of hand.  We're too busy focused on him to see the real threat that's coming.  The real one behind the machinations.  He's complicit, for sure, but to what extent? 

 

ALL of this could be Mythal's plans.  Possibly the only one that can take down the Veil is its Maker; Solas.  She needs Solas.  So the stinger... what if that really was Mythal taking over Solas, but Flemeth never saw it coming?  Yeah I know I have officially lost my mind and spent too much time over thinking.  Maybe she lets Solas be in control most of the time? 

 

Just conjecture and speculation.  But ever since I finished the game last year, my mind always circles back to these thoughts.  Mythal endures, and all. 

Spoiler

Out of likes but yes.  I think Solas may think he's in control but I think Mythal is the one pulling the strings. I think she would know him so well, she would know how he would react to certain things and is nudging him along for her revenge.  I think that's what this is. She is not happy with his chosen punishment for the pantheon and wants to do it herself. 

[Jayla]

On another note, since we are speaking of characters we don't like... Blackwall left me feeling skeeved all through DAI, even though I did like the character. But after finishing Trespasser I feel better about him. It feels that he

Spoiler

finally accepted what he did and went on a path of redemption and forgiveness for real, and not just because that was the "correct" thing to do just so he can pretend at doing the noble right think like Blackwall would have done. He accepted himself as Thom and that, to me, made all the damn difference.

 

Spoiler

Same! In my first PT on the PS4 I left Blackwall in the cell, and the codex entry for "Blackwall and the last few years" or whatever it was seemed to indicate he'd handed himself in... again. And hasn't been seen since. But my current playthrough, I promised him to the Wardens and the dialogue with him in Trespasser made me regret leaving him behind in my first. It feels right, he's finally being true to himself; he's a real Warden, he's going by Thom Rainier now, he seemed less solemn and more playful. It was amazing to see, and warmed me to his character.

 

Spoiler

 

Vivienne being the first to ask jarred me. It was like...we're not even friends, really, but you're the FIRST one who asks about Solas?

 

Did anyone take the "maybe I could get married" line when talking to Cassandra? I didn't but wondering if it resulted in snark or if there was any Solas mention.

 

Sera's was sweet.

 

Just found this addition if Bull is still part of the Qun and betrays you.

 

 

Cold, Solas. Very cold.

 

 

Spoiler

I did, and she just says "Maybe I should get married". I can't remember what Cass replies with but it was leading her towards being happy for me and I should seize happiness where I could. It was pretty jarring, in all honesty. I ended up reloading the save and telling her being flustered looks good on her. xD

[Sable Rhapsody]

I was happy to see my other friends, companions and advisers, but it did feel like something was missing, yes.

 

 

Spoiler

I admit, I was too busy having feels over Dorian and pranking with Sera and squeeing over the key to Kirkwall to be fussed about Solas's absence.  The warmth and affection that I felt from everyone else more than outweighed not having Solas around.

 

Plus, I headcanon that my Lavellan had a fling or two during that time skip.  I may even be writing smut in that vein  She's not a nun, and she's not going to spend two years pining for someone she can't even find.  Of course, as soon as she starts to get an inkling that Solas is involved in what's going on (which is pretty early in Trespasser), all the feels come rushing right back.

 

 

On another note, since we are speaking of characters we don't like... Blackwall left me feeling skeeved all through DAI, even though I did like the character. But after finishing Trespasser I feel better about him. It feels that he

Spoiler

finally accepted what he did and went on a path of redemption and forgiveness for real, and not just because that was the "correct" thing to do just so he can pretend at doing the noble right think like Blackwall would have done. He accepted himself as Thom and that, to me, made all the damn difference.

 

I did a 180 on Blackwall too.  He can join the team for realsies now!

 

Spoiler

I made him a Warden, and I love that epilogue.  A lot of my problem with his main campaign quest was that he just didn't seem like he learned anything from it.  It was all over so quick: "I'm Thom Rainier, I'm really f***ing sorry, what is your decision?"  Maybe it would've been different with a romance, but I left feeling cheated in terms of his character development.

 

But I was so, so proud of him in Trespasser.  He learned to balance accepting his past, and moving on to a better future.  Still gonna mock his stupid Pringles mustache, though

[Jayla]

I've been wondering some of these things for a while.  In light of Trespasser, and some of today's discussion... conjecture and speculation ahoy!  I am probably reaching for some of it, maybe all of it. 

 

Spoiler

I have to go back to the stinger at the end of the main game.  I remember my initial reaction from how my brain saw the scene.  "Oh my god Mythal just took over Solas.  I am so devastated."  Of course I rewatched it a few times.  Read the forums.  Ok no Solas took Mythal's power.  Phew.  Ok crazy time!  Maybe my initial reaction to it was closer to the truth. 

I can't help but feel that Flemythal could possibly be the actual puppet master.  We know she's been putting things into motion for centuries.  She's playing a long game.  And she's out for a reckoning that will make the world shake.  Hell hath no fury like that of a woman scorned.  I feel like all of the focus on Solas right now is a slight of hand.  We're too busy focused on him to see the real threat that's coming.  The real one behind the machinations.  He's complicit, for sure, but to what extent? 

 

ALL of this could be Mythal's plans.  Possibly the only one that can take down the Veil is its Maker; Solas.  She needs Solas.  So the stinger... what if that really was Mythal taking over Solas, but Flemeth never saw it coming?  Yeah I know I have officially lost my mind and spent too much time over thinking.  Maybe she lets Solas be in control most of the time? 

 

Just conjecture and speculation.  But ever since I finished the game last year, my mind always circles back to these thoughts.  Mythal endures, and all. 

 

I liked the comment, but I had to quote it so I could give you a heart too (here it is: ). I didn't even think of that! Super cool!

[Illyria]

Little bro is bestest.  And yes, I remembered the line right after I hit post.

 

I have more conflicted feelings on Anders as a character than I do on Solas.  Anders I love as a character, but I also find him very hard to stomach, just during normal gameplay.  Whenever he opens his mouth, I want to hit him.  Or hug him.  Can't decide which.

 

Solas has his flaws, and I want to hit him almost as often as Anders.  But I don't find him nearly as disagreeable to be around.

 

It's got to the point with Anders that I actually can't take him anywhere with me in DA2.  The only times I have him in my party is if he's required for a quest.  Solas, however, always has a spot in my party.  And still does, even after Trespasser.

 

I was happy to see my other friends, companions and advisers, but it did feel like something was missing, yes.

 

Spoiler

Blackwall mentions Solas?! 0_0

 

I missed that. I maxed his approval and gave him complete mercy in his personal quest, yet he didn't mention Solas when I talked to him. 

 

Vivienne did, though. Much to my surprise. She was the last one I talked to since I didn't like her (we mutually loathed each other in the main game), but she surprised me by treating me to spa day, then mentioned how she knew how disappointing it was when Solas left. And I was like, "Finally, someone acknowledges my heartbreak... and it's from the woman I hate, and who hates me! Come on, guys. You're supposed to be my friends. Step it up."

 

Spoiler

I headcanon that everyone very deliberatly doesn't mention Solas when exploring the elven ruins. But then Lavellan will make an offhand comment that Solas would've loved seeing this and everyone is relieved that they didn't have to be the first to mention him.

 

It takes energy to hate someone, just as it does to love them. I think the people who go out of their way to make hate threads are just getting stuff out of their system, same as we do here. It's negative, and there's better ways, so I'm not saying it's right or just they do it, but I can understand it, with that it doesn't bother me. Hate a character all you like, just be respectful with those who don't and there's no trouble.

 

I'm pleased to say while I've been here, I've not seen anyone go to extremes like that.

 

I was pretty ambivalent towards Anders until he suggested Fenris kill himself. I actually gasped out loud. Too far, man.

 

He didn't suggest Fenris kill himself.  He asked if he'd considered it.  He does, however, compare him to a wild animal and approve if Hawke sells him back to Danarius.  Which, no matter what Anders fans try to argue, is totally in character for the person that Anders was by that point.  He was more Justice/Vengance than Anders and to him Fenris is someone that stands in the way of mage freedom.  Therefore it's good that Hawke gets rid of him.

[Moondreamer01]

I've been wondering some of these things for a while.  In light of Trespasser, and some of today's discussion... conjecture and speculation ahoy!  I am probably reaching for some of it, maybe all of it. 

 

Spoiler

I have to go back to the stinger at the end of the main game.  I remember my initial reaction from how my brain saw the scene.  "Oh my god Mythal just took over Solas.  I am so devastated."  Of course I rewatched it a few times.  Read the forums.  Ok no Solas took Mythal's power.  Phew.  Ok crazy time!  Maybe my initial reaction to it was closer to the truth. 

I can't help but feel that Flemythal could possibly be the actual puppet master.  We know she's been putting things into motion for centuries.  She's playing a long game.  And she's out for a reckoning that will make the world shake.  Hell hath no fury like that of a woman scorned.  I feel like all of the focus on Solas right now is a slight of hand.  We're too busy focused on him to see the real threat that's coming.  The real one behind the machinations.  He's complicit, for sure, but to what extent? 

 

ALL of this could be Mythal's plans.  Possibly the only one that can take down the Veil is its Maker; Solas.  She needs Solas.  So the stinger... what if that really was Mythal taking over Solas, but Flemeth never saw it coming?  Yeah I know I have officially lost my mind and spent too much time over thinking.  Maybe she lets Solas be in control most of the time? 

 

Just conjecture and speculation.  But ever since I finished the game last year, my mind always circles back to these thoughts.  Mythal endures, and all. 

Spoiler

You're mostly right, I suspect, but for one thing. Mythal let Solas have her powers, destroying the vessel of Flemeth in the doing, but she isn't directly controlling Solas' actions. She's nothing if not subtle in her nudging the world's fate. It's nothing as "simple" as a geas, or possessing, I figure. Knowing how against binding of any kind Solas is, she wouldn't have been able to "catch" him if that had been the plan and she knows him too well. Rather, she gave him the great big push he needs to complete his plan by offering him the power to do so, and is probably now waiting for said plan to come to fruition somewhere safe where she can recuperate the loss of power she's had.

[Cee]

 

Spoiler

I did, and she just says "Maybe I should get married". I can't remember what Cass replies with but it was leading her towards being happy for me and I should seize happiness where I could. It was pretty jarring, in all honesty. I ended up reloading the save and telling her being flustered looks good on her. xD

 

Spoiler

 

Thanks. It just seemed like it would be awkward/not character appropriate. I chose the flustered one and it made me miss Cass flirts. She is adorable, really. 

 

[Elessara]

Spoiler

 

Vivienne being the first to ask jarred me. It was like...we're not even friends, really, but you're the FIRST one who asks about Solas?

 

Did anyone take the "maybe I could get married" line when talking to Cassandra? I didn't but wondering if it resulted in snark or if there was any Solas mention.

 

Sera's was sweet.

 

Just found this addition if Bull is still part of the Qun and betrays you.

 

 

Cold, Solas. Very cold.

 

 

Spoiler

 

Not sure if anyone's answered about the Cassandra bit, but I did just to see what would be said.  My stupid Inquisitor said, "I might get married.  I've thought about it."  (Like wtf really?!) and Cassandra smiles and says something like she thought I had been.  Like really?  And who exactly would my inquisitor be thinking of marrying since her boyfriend split 2 years ago, hasn't been heard from and there's been no one else since?