153434 réponses à ce sujet

[Mims]

I... dislike sexuality being left to headcanon.  I've seen people use this to erase the sexuality of canonically bi characters due to 'well, if I played an m!Hawke, and didn't hear any of Bela's banters about women then she's straight' (yes, seriously.  This exact argument.  About Isa freaking bela).

 

If you don't include headcanon, Solas is canonically straight. There's no other way to really look at it, since stating otherwise without patching in a romance path for Male!Lavellan would be cruel. 

 

You can certainly debate as far as what happened in the meta writing process. But if you're taking a strict approach to it, then the ruling has already been made. 

[SamanthaJ]

Well, here's my "they didn't do it" canon twin again!  I also prefer the gating as it's more realistic.

 

Yeah, when they said Solas was gender and race gated for "plot reasons" (now we know it was largely for time and budget reasons) I immediately thought about babies. I'm not usually keen on babies, but I think it fits this romance. Solas doesn't want to die alone. He's been the last of his kind for so long. The guy needs a family. My Lavellan's clan is dead, so she'd like a family too. She wouldn't mine popping out a couple elflings as long as Solas gets his act together. Of course if there are to be actual babies there will have to be actual "elven glory!", not just headcanon at some point.  

 

As a side note, given the whole Solas and Mythal might have been an item thing maybe the fem elf only romance could have other plot tie ins. Perhaps Lavellan could become a vessel for Mythal instead of Morrigan. The whole "you two'd make a cute couple" line you could interrupt with while Morrigan and Solas were arguing at the Temple of Mythal originally made me wonder if something weird was being foreshadowed. It gave me a bad feeling even though I was completely unspoiled at the time.

 

I really, really don't think there is any reason for Solas being straight other than it just being his sexuality. People aren't straight because they want to have babies or because they meet a girl who reminds them of another girl.

 

And I seriously doubt we're going to become a vessel for Mythal. Not only is that too plot specific for one version of the Inquisitor, if that was the reason for Solas being gated it would be kind of gross.

[Illyria]

You have a good point there. I'm in the line of why does it even matter, but I guess to some folks it does. People will headcanon he's bi if they want though. And then we're left with thinking, is it wrong to believe he is straight after he shows no interest in male elves but romances a female Lavellan? I'm going with what the game shows, but isn't that the same thing people are doing if they play male Hawke and don't hear Isabela talking about women?

 

I'm confused now.

 

I don't mind headcanon at all.  Fans will be fans and they can headcanon anything they want.  It's if the devs actually came out and said 'yeah, headcanon this character to be whatever' then I'd be a little more upset.  If you open that door then it lets people say 'well, Sera never said she didn't like men in my game so she's straight'.

[Ardent Blossom]

You have a good point there. I'm in the line of why does it even matter, but I guess to some folks it does. People will headcanon he's bi if they want though. And then we're left with thinking, is it wrong to believe he is straight after he shows no interest in male elves but romances a female Lavellan? I'm going with what the game shows, but isn't that the same thing people are doing if they play male Hawke and don't hear Isabela talking about women?

 

I'm confused now.

Wasn't that something they intentionally did in DA2? If you were a female Hawke romancing Anders he didn't mention the true nature of his relationship with Carl (maybe it was Karl). I thought that was stupid, but they were trying to cater to fans I guess. 

[Sable Rhapsody]

^Nice.

 

Regarding mounts, I pair my Lavellan with the Hunter Shade dracolisk. It's not the elfiest nor the prettiest but I do like it. (What can I say, I'm a sucker for dragon-like creatures.)

 

Also, Kestrel wrote a little fanfic some time back with my Tala Lavellan and Solas with regards to Tala's choice of mount as part of of a trade with me.  It pretty much showcases my Lavellan's reasons for loving her dracolisk. 

 

If anyone wishes to read it: http://kestrelsansje...98379/dracolisk

 

D'awww.  Adorable...terrifying dragon lizard mount!  

 

Solas does not strike me as an animal person.  I don't think he'd be mean to them or anything, but he probably wouldn't get people like me who coo and make baby noises at cats.

[NeverlandHunter]

I... dislike sexuality being left to headcanon.  I've seen people use this to erase the sexuality of canonically bi characters due to 'well, if I played an m!Hawke, and didn't hear any of Bela's banters about women then she's straight' (yes, seriously.  This exact argument.  About Isa freaking bela).

Yeah, it doesn't matter how unlikely it would be for all the romances to be bisexual. They were made that way, it's like the modders who made white Isabela or Vivienne.

No. Just No.

 

Now you can headcanon preferences. I always imagined that Merril and Fenris prefer women while Anders and Isabela prefer men. 

[SamanthaJ]

You have a good point there. I'm in the line of why does it even matter, but I guess to some folks it does. People will headcanon he's bi if they want though. And then we're left with thinking, is it wrong to believe he is straight after he shows no interest in male elves but romances a female Lavellan? I'm going with what the game shows, but isn't that the same thing people are doing if they play male Hawke and don't hear Isabela talking about women?

 

I'm confused now.

 

It's not the same thing, because canonically Solas is straight. He only shows interest in female Lavellan and was written that way. Isabela is not canonically straight. She is canonically bi whether people get that dialogue showing she is or not. She was written that way. It is the same with Anders. Even though they didn't include his dialogue about Karl on the female path it still happened and he is still bi. The characters are what they are.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Wasn't that something they intentionally did in DA2? If you were a female Hawke romancing Anders he didn't mention the true nature of his relationship with Carl (maybe it was Karl). I thought that was stupid, but they were trying to cater to fans I guess. 

 

David Gaider addressed this after DA2's release.  He acknowledged the situation was not ideal, but given the constraints they were under for DA2, making everyone bisexual and slightly tweaking the dialogue for male vs. female Hawke seemed like the most equitable solution.  Ideally, they would have had characters with a variety of different sexualities, like in DAI.

[NeverlandHunter]

Well, here's my "they didn't do it" canon twin again!  I also prefer the gating as it's more realistic.

 

Yeah, when they said Solas was gender and race gated for "plot reasons" (now we know it may have been largely for time and budget reasons) I immediately thought about babies. I'm not usually keen on babies, but I think it fits this romance. Solas doesn't want to die alone. He's been the last of his kind for so long. The guy needs a family. My Lavellan's clan is dead, so she'd like a family too. She wouldn't mind popping out a couple elflings as long as Solas gets his act together. Of course if there are to be actual babies there will have to be actual "elven glory!", not just headcanon at some point.  

 

As a side note, given the whole Solas and Mythal might have been an item thing maybe the fem elf only romance could have other plot tie ins. Perhaps Lavellan could become a vessel for Mythal instead of Morrigan. The whole "you two'd make a cute couple" line you could interrupt with while Morrigan and Solas were arguing at the Temple of Mythal originally made me wonder if something weird was being foreshadowed. It gave me a bad feeling even though I was completely unspoiled at the time.

I think... you might be overthinking it. I really really don't think there will be a "having a kid option with Solas" in any of the future games. But that's awesome if that's what you want to headcanon!

[Ardent Blossom]

I really, really don't think there is any reason for Solas being straight other than it just being his sexuality. People aren't straight because they want to have babies or because they meet a girl who reminds them of another girl.

 

And I seriously doubt we're going to become a vessel for Mythal. Not only is that too plot specific for one version of the Inquisitor, if that was the reason for Solas being gated it would be kind of gross.

No, I didn't say the character is straight because he wants to have babies. I said they possibly wrote him as straight so that a PC could have biological children with him. That would be a plot reason. I KNOW gay people aren't gay because they don't want to have babies, and straight people aren't straight just because they do want to have babies. People are what they are because it is what they are. I'm straight, and I never want to have a baby. Please don't make this unnecessarily political. I'm not that ignorant honestly. 

[SamanthaJ]

David Gaider addressed this after DA2's release.  He acknowledged the situation was not ideal, but given the constraints they were under for DA2, making everyone bisexual and slightly tweaking the dialogue for male vs. female Hawke seemed like the most equitable solution.  Ideally, they would have had characters with a variety of different sexualities, like in DAI.

 

I think someone even said that though Anders is canonically bi, the writer just didn't include the dialogue about Karl on the female path because they didn't think it was something a guy would do...not because the relationship didn't happen or he could be interpreted as straight.

[Uirebhiril]

Wasn't that something they intentionally did in DA2? If you were a female Hawke romancing Anders he didn't mention the true nature of his relationship with Carl (maybe it was Karl). I thought that was stupid, but they were trying to cater to fans I guess. 

 

There was some backlash to that, as I recall. I suppose that's why they were being so careful with it this time. Mod and headcanon whatever, it doesn't change my game, or the actual nature of the character is I guess what I am saying. The problem then is when people demand that headcanon be validated, or fight with people who are saying "...but that's not what was stated" or something. if we take the game at face value, Solas is straight and has a preference for elves. He shows no romantic interest in a male elf, and certainly not in other races. But then some people get angry and say that "what, just because he didn't flirt with a male you assume he's straight?" Well.. yes?

 

Nope, still confused. I'm getting more coffee.

[AutumnOracle]

Codex text

The pages of this book—memory?—describe a pair playing, colliding in the air, bodies formed for kissing, stroking lines of heat as molten as the sun. The dance is fluid, roiling, never ending, lovers tangled in a laughing knot that rolls on for years, a promise never to be parted, whatever ages come.

 

An annoyed thought intrudes, from one who marked this memory after it was recorded:

"By the gods, find a private chamber!"

 

Here we go.

 

And yes, it was romantic....but also amusing. It's beautiful imagery though. I guess that's what you do when immortal.

 

 

Headcannoning that this is Solas & Lavellan's spirits.  They got separated somehow and now they are trying to reconnect.  At least till the next game when I'm proven wrong...but dangit it's everything I want for them. 

[Illyria]

Wasn't that something they intentionally did in DA2? If you were a female Hawke romancing Anders he didn't mention the true nature of his relationship with Carl (maybe it was Karl). I thought that was stupid, but they were trying to cater to fans I guess. 

 

No, they're all bisexual (except Sebastian).  Karl/Anders is very much canon whatever gender you play Hawke as (there's quite a heartbreaking account in World of Thedas 2).

 

Yeah, it doesn't matter how unlikely it would be for all the romances to be bisexual. They were made that way, it's like the modders who made white Isabela or Vivienne.

No. Just No.

 

Now you can headcanon preferences. I always imagined that Merril and Fenris prefer women while Anders and Isabela prefer men. 

 

I've always thought Anders prefers women.  He's much more open about liking women, anyway (he flirts with Velanna and an f!Warden quite openly compared to how he flirts with Nate, and he's slept with Isabela at some point in the past).  Yay!  Different headcanons.

 

Isabela totally prefers the ladies, though.  If she's romanced and Hawke flirts with Talis then she suggest a threesome if it's m!Hawke but get pretty jealous if it's f!Hawke ('she likes rogues.  Rivianni rogues')

[SamanthaJ]

No, I didn't say the character is straight because he wants to have babies. I said they possibly wrote him as straight so that a PC could have biological children with him. That would be a plot reason. I KNOW gay people aren't gay because they don't want to have babies, and straight people aren't straight just because they do want to have babies. People are what they are because it is what they are. I'm straight, and I never want to have a baby. Please don't make this unnecessarily political. I'm not that ignorant honestly. 

 

I'm not trying to make it political, and I never said you were ignorant.

 

I am just trying to hit it home that there is no plot reason for Solas being gated for females. 

 

Making sexuality a plot point (rather than it being part of how a character experiences the world and how the world experiences them such as in Dorian's case) takes things to place I'd rather they not be taken. :/

[AutumnOracle]

 

In a way, it's comforting that he thinks his plan will destroy the world... he thought his previous plan would destroy Corypheus, after all.

 

I was already TO.  But seriously....this is perfect.  My flag just got even higher 

[Catfishers]

I think someone even said that though Anders is canonically bi, the writer just didn't include the dialogue about Karl on the female path because they didn't think it was something a guy would do...not because the relationship didn't happen or he could be interpreted as straight.

 

I've always figured this was the case. Even though he's less forthcoming with the details of his relationship with Karl when speaking to a female PC, it always still seemed to me that they were definitely more than friends.

 

With regards to Solas, I figure the romance being gated only for females was a resource issue. Which would seem to have resulted in a straight character, regardless of the 'behind the scenes' reasoning. If someone wants to mod the romance for males as well, more power to them.

[dawnstone]

As a side note, given the whole Solas and Mythal might have been an item thing maybe the fem elf only romance could have other plot tie ins. Perhaps Lavellan could become a vessel for Mythal instead of Morrigan. The whole "you two'd make a cute couple" line you could interrupt with while Morrigan and Solas were arguing at the Temple of Mythal originally made me wonder if something weird was being foreshadowed. It gave me a bad feeling even though I was completely unspoiled at the time.

The biggest problem I have with Mythal and Solas having once been involved romantically is that Morrigan straight up said that Flemeth killed all the men she slept with once she used them - and Solas is still alive. Of course, that was before we knew she was Flemythal, and could have been a result of her personality being twisted after she was betrayed by her husband/the gods -  but it stands that she has a history of killing her lovers.

 

I feel more like Solas was more in a master/servant sort of relationship with her (and the suggestions that he was literally her dog (or wolf) are not far from the truth).

 

I really hated that line with Morrigan and Solas; just because two people fight doesn't mean they are attracted to each other in some sort of tsundere way (though I will make an exception for Varric/Cassandra). If they go there it will literally make me feel ill, just like Solas walking away after telling you he's going to kill you and everyone you love if you don't find a way to convince him otherwise. Sigh.

[Sable Rhapsody]

I've always thought Anders prefers women.  He's much more open about liking women, anyway (he flirts with Velanna and an f!Warden quite openly compared to how he flirts with Nate, and he's slept with Isabela at some point in the past).  Yay!  Different headcanons.

 

I remember the spat in the Anders thread over M!Hawke/Anders vs F!Hawke/Anders.  It's like...it's goddamn Hawke.  Anders is in love with you because of your penchant for spectacular destruction and chaos over anything else 

 

*sigh* I dunno.  On one hand, I'm part of the privileged straight majority, so every time I open my mouth on this topic, it's with a feeling of maybe I shouldn't, or someone is going to leap down my throat for this.  On the other hand, I've never been much bothered about the sexualities of the various characters.  If I want to romance a particular character, I just roll a PC to match their in-game, depicted orientation (M!Adaar for Dorian, F!Lavellan for Solas, etc.)

[Miss This or That]

*sigh* I dunno.  On one hand, I'm part of the privileged straight majority, so every time I open my mouth on this topic, it's with a feeling of maybe I shouldn't, or someone is going to leap down my throat for this.  On the other hand, I've never been much bothered about the sexualities of the various characters.  If I want to romance a particular character, I just roll a PC to match their in-game, depicted orientation (M!Adaar for Dorian, F!Lavellan for Solas, etc.)

 

I just hope that we will one day get a canon asexual companion, that would be cool! We have come a long way and I looove Krem especially, but I just hope that people of the asexual spectrum like myself (though I'm demi) get something to feel represented one day, too.

[S.W.]

I don't mind headcanon at all. Fans will be fans and they can headcanon anything they want. It's if the devs actually came out and said 'yeah, headcanon this character to be whatever' then I'd be a little more upset. If you open that door then it lets people say 'well, Sera never said she didn't like men in my game so she's straight'. .

This is the reason why I'm uncomfortable with people asking 'well, why is x straight and not bi?'. Because you can easily flip the question towards gay and lesbian identities as well. For similar reasons, I tend not to like arguments which pose that more open-minded, cerebral, spiritual relationships will be bi or pan because 'anyone can be attracted to a personality'... because that's not true. And can be erasive of gay men and lesbian's sexualities, especially if they're not too fond of sex, or sex isn't that important, or maybe they even fall into the ace spectrum. Sexuality isn't all to do with doing the deed, despite what the name suggests.

Sexuality doesn't need to make sense or align with a character. It's a preference. It just is. And that's okay.

/rant. Not directed at anyone here btw.

That said, I do feel sorry for male lavellans/male elf fans who wanted to romance Solas. I wish they had enough time to write flirt options, as well as a line where Solas turns them down nicely.

[Ardent Blossom]

I've always figured this was the case. Even though he's less forthcoming with the details of his relationship with Karl when speaking to a female PC, it always still seemed to me that they were definitely more than friends.

 

With regards to Solas, I figure the romance being gated only for females was a resource issue. Which would seem to have resulted in a straight character, regardless of the 'behind the scenes' reasoning.

I just don't like that the only reason I know Anders is bi is because I also played a male Hawke. It felt like the devs were trying to "protect" the player from something they thought the player couldn't handle.  

 

As far as Solas possibly being bi...Kaidan in Mass Effect could only be romanced by femShep...that is until Mass Effect 3. I guess Solas could show interest in a male Inquisitor in the future, should the Inquisitor be the protagonist again. Ok, it's not likely, but it is technically possible.

[NeverlandHunter]

No, they're all bisexual (except Sebastian).  Karl/Anders is very much canon whatever gender you play Hawke as (there's quite a heartbreaking account in World of Thedas 2).

 

 

I've always thought Anders prefers women.  He's much more open about liking women, anyway (he flirts with Velanna and an f!Warden quite openly compared to how he flirts with Nate, and he's slept with Isabela at some point in the past).  Yay!  Different headcanons.

 

Isabela totally prefers the ladies, though.  If she's romanced and Hawke flirts with Talis then she suggest a threesome if it's m!Hawke but get pretty jealous if it's f!Hawke ('she likes rogues.  Rivianni rogues')

Haha, yeah and her comment to Bethany about all the things the women can do.  I just leaned towards males because of her relationship with Fenris, and after watching both the m!HAwke and f!Hawke Isabela romances I prefer the male a lot more. But maybe that's just the voice actor.

 

He definitely does flirt more with women openly but I always attributed to that being more of a facade. Even in a place as open as Thedas I imagine he might be nervous about being judged/stigmatized.

[AutumnOracle]

 

OMG.  I can't stop laughing.  I'm at work!!!

[Jayla]

In regards to Solas/Mythal, I am heavily leaning towards the whole guardian relationship more than a romantic one, although I really wouldn't be surprised if it was. And I don't think I'd be too bothered about it either. If Solas was finally spurred into action against the Evanuris with Mythal's death, then he was acting with his heart. But his desire to bring down the Veil in Trespasser seems to be him thinking with his head, to fix a perceived mistake he made in the past, and even though we know he loves Lavellan deeply, he broke up with her specifically so he could carry on thinking with his head, and not with his heart.

 

I've been thinking more recently about how Solas reacts to drinking an Inquisitor drinking from the Well*. He knows it would bind the Inquisitor to Mythal's will, and he knows this not because Abelas told us, but because he knows what it's like being bound to her, and this is leading me to think of a whole bunch of sad thoughts. Solas clearly held Mythal to high regard despite the fact she kept slaves too, Abelas and his sentinels were incredibly dedicated...

 

What if the relationship, and the whole binding-business, extends to more... brainwashyness? Like the slaves of the Evanuris were brainwashed into wanting to serve these people as gods over a time when the Evanuris collectively went insane with power and had to find some means of keeping their people in check?

 

Any thoughts?

 

*Or was supposed to react, the whole "begged you not to do it" dialogue is a bug, but it shows he was supposed to be a lot more dramatic about it, but for whatever reason they left it out. Probably because it'd make him too obvious.