153433 réponses à ce sujet

[Moondreamer01]

For me, it's different in an RPG because the people that I'm harming by playing bad are actual characters.  I know them, so it hurts to harm them.  And when I do play bad, it's an interesting RP experience but I wouldn't always call it fun.  The first playthrough of my insane maleficar Hawke definitely messed with me for a bit.  But in Civ, I really couldn't care less about a bunch of units and numbers, so I can get my villain cackle going

 

 

*snips*

Think Solas thinks of modern Thedas the way you think of the "people" in games like Civ (Or at least did until he met the inquisitor)? A bunch of units and numbers that makes it easy to disassociate and play "evil"?

[Cee]

Think Solas thinks od modern Thedas the way you think of the "people" in games like Civ (Or at least did until he met the inquisitor)? A bunch of units and numbers that makes it easy to disassociate and play "evil"?

 

I am out of likes and I'm just going to blame it on Sable cruelly keeping them from us with her not-people dissociation.

[drosophila]

I want some cinnamon rolls. I bet Solas would like them. Imagine him sobbing and stuffing his face with sweet yummiest while crying, "vhenan!"

U do this to yourself, Solas.

Haha, one line that I thought Lavellan might say to him in my post-Trespasser fic was: "You just pretend you have agents, but in reality you're sitting alone somewhere, eating cake all by yourself and crying, aren't you?"

I decided it wasn't very fluffy, so I took it out.

[Illyria]

I'm a big villain fan here, but I find them so hard to RP. Usually my first characters for an RPG just tend to do what I'd do in those situations - so they blunder along, trying to be nice to everyone, and tend to be politically incompetent. There are just some options I have difficulty justifying - like selling Fenris to Danarius.

 

My fav. villains tend to be very Solas-esque - they have different ethical standards and prioritise different things, and occasionally they lack information (although not too much - I like them to be competent), and ultimately believe what they're doing is just and/or necessary. It's why I Loghain.

 

Solas is an interesting case in particular because of his continual conflict over what he's doing - yet he still trundles on and puts his plans into action. It's very like in real life - people often find it difficult to leave a cause they've committed to already, they're afraid they'll betray the people they've trusted, and ruin what they've worked on. So they sometimes continue on, even if they doubt what they're doing, until they reach breaking point.

 

 

Playing through DA:O again, got almost to the landsmeet and I've come to a... romantic predicament. Planned on romancing Leliana, all well and good, but flirted with Zev a bit early in the game (who doesn't? ), and now his approval is high enough that he's asking me to sleep with him. Conversations are queued, I think - so the jealousy ones will trigger later. I'm having massive trouble turning him down - like, RP wise, I think Tabris and Zevran make a better match than Tabris and Leliana, and plus I like Zev more. I might just headcanon them as having a polyamorous relationship and not talk to Leli for the rest of the gane. Thank god Morrigan isn't bisexual, or I'd truly be screwed.

 

*waves*

[Sable Rhapsody]

Yeah. Def don't give Sable ultimate power.

 

 

 

Okay... it's no secret that these two don't love one another for variety of reasons, but now I think I get exactly why Solas dislikes Vivienne as much as he does: it seems to me that she does a lot of things the reminds him directly of what Evanuris have done; heck, he pretty much implied that she may have been one of them back in 'good old times'.

 

Which in itself is an interesting thing to ponder... there are many parallels that can be drawn between many characters, organizations or events in Dragon Age - and I wonder if Vivenne isn't in the story not just for specific role in the plot or to provide a pretty unique perspective of a politically-skilled loyalist mage, but the mindset of Evanuris as well? (now I wonder if 'Evanuris' doesn't directly translate to 'Enchanters'...?)

 

Vivienne does what a lot of powerful people do: she justifies her elevated status by claiming that it's for the well-being of those below her station.  Whether it actually benefits others is up for debate; certainly Viv is the one who's most angered and upset by the treatment of the Tranquil at the hands of the rebel mages, and she does have a point about protecting the normal people in Thedas from magic.  But I think Solas is disgusted by her because her justification is just that: a justification.  Helping people is not her primary motivation, and the fact that she uses it to support personal ambition makes it twice as bad in his eyes.

 

Think Solas thinks od modern Thedas the way you think of the "people" in games like Civ (Or at least did until he met the inquisitor)? A bunch of units and numbers that makes it easy to disassociate and play "evil"?

 

The thought's rather uncomfortable, so it's probably true to some extent 

[Cee]

*waves*

Ha, me too. I like Zevran plenty as a character. But not interested in romancing him.

[Cee]

 The thought's rather uncomfortable, so it's probably true to some extent 

 

Do you have something you'd like to confess to us, Sable? How old are you, really? Do you like naps? What about tea?

[Moondreamer01]

Do you have something you'd like to confess to us, Sable? How old are you, really? Do you like naps? What about tea?

Are you... bald?

[drosophila]

Do you have something you'd like to confess to us, Sable? How old are you, really? Do you like naps? What about tea?

Don't do it, Sable. We are people. Remember the kindness we have shown you. I'm sure we can resolve the issue with research instead.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Do you have something you'd like to confess to us, Sable? How old are you, really? Do you like naps? What about tea?

 

*shifty eyes*

 

...I like naps and tea.  

[Sable Rhapsody]

Are you... bald?

 

And I have purple and black hair

[drosophila]

And I have purple and black hair

I liked you bald.

[Sable Rhapsody]

I liked you bald.

 

Alas, lethallan

 

(though maybe Solas had the right idea.  Bald would certainly be less work  )

[Cee]

Don't do it, Sable. We are people. Remember the kindness we have shown you. I'm sure we can resolve the issue with research instead.

 

 

 

*shifty eyes*

 

...I like naps and tea.  

 

Mmhmm. *places a frilly cake on a plate*

 

Still out of likes (thanks, Sable)

[midnight tea]

Vivienne does what a lot of powerful people do: she justifies her elevated status by claiming that it's for the well-being of those below her station.  Whether it actually benefits others is up for debate; certainly Viv is the one who's most angered and upset by the treatment of the Tranquil at the hands of the rebel mages, and she does have a point about protecting the normal people in Thedas from magic.  But I think Solas is disgusted by her because her justification is just that: a justification.  Helping people is not her primary motivation, and the fact that she uses it to support personal ambition makes it twice as bad in his eyes.

 

Yeah, but that's the thing - I always thought that Solas dislike of Vivienne stems from how in general she goes against many of his beliefs and principles... but now it turns out that it might be something more personal.

 

Like - at the time when he tried to school Sera at how to improve Red Jennies and she goes at the end 'why should I do that - just lop off the top? What would that do other than create a new one to frig it all up?' you can almost hear that it hit something Solas knows from experience... it likely reminded him of how things went before.

 

Now I get the similar vibe between his interactions with Vivienne. He doesn't just dislike her because she simply uses justifications for her staying in power or the greater good. It's like she reminds him of how things went in the past.

[MayriyaNoori]

Been listening to some recorded banter on YT to see if I missed something, and turns out than I did (since I haven't yet conscripted mages). Here's an interesting banter between Solas and Vivienne I just heard:

 

Vivienne: "You must be disappointed, apostate - your rebels have not found the freedom they hoped for."
Solas: "I've planted no seeds in your garden, Enchanter. You grew that fruit yourself."
Vivienne: "And I will once again ensure they are protected from a world that hates and fears them."
Solas: "While mages live in deprivation you do not share, you lord your mystique over those not so gifted! Well played, Enchanter - in another age you might have ruled an empire!"
Vivienne: "You are too kind my dear... But this age is still young!"

 

Okay... it's no secret that these two don't love one another for variety of reasons, but now I think I get exactly why Solas dislikes Vivienne as much as he does: it seems to me that she does a lot of things the reminds him directly of what Evanuris have done; heck, he pretty much implied that she may have been one of them back in 'good old times'.

 

Which in itself is an interesting thing to ponder... there are many parallels that can be drawn between many characters, organizations or events in Dragon Age - and I wonder if Vivenne isn't in the story not just for specific role in the plot or to provide a pretty unique perspective of a politically-skilled loyalist mage, but the mindset of Evanuris as well? (now I wonder if 'Evanuris' doesn't directly translate to 'Enchanters'...?)

 

(edit: Does this also mean that back in 'good old times' of Evanuris, they have locked those more magically gifted in something akin to Circles and lorded over others that only had minimal magical gifts? It would explain why Solas is so passionate about mages freedom, or why he says "how are mages going to be treated better?" when he's caught off-guard by a remark made by non-elf Inquisitor after events in Halamshiral...)

I bet the way they controlled more gifted mages was called high priest/priestess. Sell the illusions of freedom and such by making it work for you.

 

And if a mage didn't want to and couldn't make it to Solas......well, we all saw the lovely magical binding prison Cory made for that one guy. Forget his name.

[NeverlandHunter]

Been listening to some recorded banter on YT to see if I missed something, and turns out than I did (since I haven't yet conscripted mages). Here's an interesting banter between Solas and Vivienne I just heard:

 

Vivienne: "You must be disappointed, apostate - your rebels have not found the freedom they hoped for."
Solas: "I've planted no seeds in your garden, Enchanter. You grew that fruit yourself."
Vivienne: "And I will once again ensure they are protected from a world that hates and fears them."
Solas: "While mages live in deprivation you do not share, you lord your mystique over those not so gifted! Well played, Enchanter - in another age you might have ruled an empire!"
Vivienne: "You are too kind my dear... But this age is still young!"

 

Okay... it's no secret that these two don't love one another for variety of reasons, but now I think I get exactly why Solas dislikes Vivienne as much as he does: it seems to me that she does a lot of things the reminds him directly of what Evanuris have done; heck, he pretty much implied that she may have been one of them back in 'good old times'.

 

Which in itself is an interesting thing to ponder... there are many parallels that can be drawn between many characters, organizations or events in Dragon Age - and I wonder if Vivenne isn't in the story not just for specific role in the plot or to provide a pretty unique perspective of a politically-skilled loyalist mage, but the mindset of Evanuris as well? (now I wonder if 'Evanuris' doesn't directly translate to 'Enchanters'...?)

 

(edit: Does this also mean that back in 'good old times' of Evanuris, they have locked those more magically gifted in something akin to Circles and lorded over others that only had minimal magical gifts? It would explain why Solas is so passionate about mages freedom, or why he says "how are mages going to be treated better?" when he's caught off-guard by a remark made by non-elf Inquisitor after events in Halamshiral...)

Vivienne is a marvel. I love her, hate on her all you want. It matters little to her, the opinions of the common rabble. 

Empress Vivienne, you are so lovely, in another game you might actually have enough character development to make me think you actually had feelings beyond the utter sense of superiority.

O.O Love you!

[Illyria]

Ha, me too. I like Zevran plenty as a character. But not interested in romancing him.

 

I really wish I could roll a character who was interested in him romantically.  His intended Warden, my Brosca, ended up being perfect for Leliana.  Given how cheerful Zev is, and the fact that he's the only DAO LI to have a confirmed happy ending with the Warden it would be nice to romance him.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Now I get the similar vibe between his interactions with Vivienne. He doesn't just dislike her because she simply uses justifications for her staying in power or the greater good. It's like she reminds him of how things went in the past.

 

I can see that.  In the Trespasser codex entries, the Evanuris impress upon their followers to remember the gods who protect them.  And I'll bet their power grab started out as having the wisest and strongest rule for the benefit of all 

 

 

Mmhmm. *places a frilly cake on a plate*

 

Still out of likes (thanks, Sable)

 

Sweet things!  My greatest weakness!  That and buttons 

[Cee]

I really wish I could roll a character who was interested in him romantically.  His intended Warden, my Brosca, ended up being perfect for Leliana.  Given how cheerful Zev is, and the fact that he's the only DAO LI to have a confirmed happy ending with the Warden it would be nice to romance him.

 

Again....I agree. I think Warden + Zev off adventuring together all this time is adorable and happy and wonderful.

[Illyria]

I romanced him and it carried over into DAI. He's by my Warden's side. 

 

Whereas my Surana's boyfriend went to the Weisshaupt Fortress and hasn't been heard from since.  In an alternative reality her girlfriend became Divine. Slightly happier but not the ending I'd have wanted for her.

[NeverlandHunter]

I'm a big villain fan here, but I find them so hard to RP. Usually my first characters for an RPG just tend to do what I'd do in those situations - so they blunder along, trying to be nice to everyone, and tend to be politically incompetent. There are just some options I have difficulty justifying - like selling Fenris to Danarius.

 

My fav. villains tend to be very Solas-esque - they have different ethical standards and prioritise different things, and occasionally they lack information (although not too much - I like them to be competent), and ultimately believe what they're doing is just and/or necessary. It's why I Loghain.

 

Solas is an interesting case in particular because of his continual conflict over what he's doing - yet he still trundles on and puts his plans into action. It's very like in real life - people often find it difficult to leave a cause they've committed to already, they're afraid they'll betray the people they've trusted, and ruin what they've worked on. So they sometimes continue on, even if they doubt what they're doing, until they reach breaking point.

 

 

Playing through DA:O again, got almost to the landsmeet and I've come to a... romantic predicament. Planned on romancing Leliana, all well and good, but flirted with Zev a bit early in the game (who doesn't? ), and now his approval is high enough that he's asking me to sleep with him. Conversations are queued, I think - so the jealousy ones will trigger later. I'm having massive trouble turning him down - like, RP wise, I think Tabris and Zevran make a better match than Tabris and Leliana, and plus I like Zev more. I might just headcanon them as having a polyamorous relationship and not talk to Leli for the rest of the gane. Thank god Morrigan isn't bisexual, or I'd truly be screwed.

Zevran and my Tabris are my canon playthrough!

They are so awesome! Not flirting with Zevran is near impossible! All those people who complained they ended up in bed with him without any notice are saving face because they don't want to admit they couldn't help but to flirt with that sexy accented, tattooed elven rogue!

I LOVE Origins, but it's so hard to go from playing Inquisition back to it (at least for me) because of the difference in controls. Why can't I jump goshdarnit!? And the attacks are soooo slow. Oh, but I love you Origins and all your crazy quests and amazing companions!

[Sable Rhapsody]

Vivienne is a marvel. I love her, hate on her all you want. It matters little to her, the opinions of the common rabble. 

Empress Vivienne, you are so lovely, in another game you might actually have enough character development to make me think you actually had feelings beyond the utter sense of superiority.

O.O Love you!

 

I love Viv too.  She's the popular girl in high school who actually gives no f***s instead of just hiding it behind teenage bravado.

 

She does have glimmers in game where she expresses feels other than superiority, but she either quickly hides it or turns it to her advantage.  Like entertaining powerful guests after Bastien's death.  I still think she's a horrible Divine, but I can't help but admire her sheer confidence and audacity.  

 

 

Whereas my Surana's boyfriend went to the Weisshaupt Fortress and hasn't been heard from since.  In an alternative reality her girlfriend became Divine. Slightly happier but not the ending I'd have wanted for her.

 

I want a happy ending for either Warden/Alistair, or Solas/Lavellan.  Ideally both.  If I get neither, I'll start sending eggs with painted-on angry faces to Edmonton.