Aller au contenu

Photo

Solas Thread - NOW OFFICIALLY MOVED to Cyonan's BSN (link in OP)


153455 réponses à ce sujet

#130101
midnight tea

midnight tea
  • Members
  • 4 820 messages

Yes, true, but not as much as you think. Actually, the stuff about him hating blacks came after he was over and done with to get more people to side with the Jews against Nazi thinking, and to gain assistance. Not that they needed much convincing. He thought the Aryan race was superior, yes, but that doesn't translate to outright unacceptable if you weren't, especially since he himself wasn't even German. The confusion comes from the fact that not all Nazis hated in the same way, lol.

 

It's a bit more complicated than that - Germany wasn't the only country that viewed Jews unfavorably. Russia has been very antisemitic for a long time (also quite religiously motivated, ironically even in Soviet Union that was aggressively antisemitic as well) and AFAIK Catholic Church has not-very-secretly antisemitic overtones sewn into its rhetoric till sixties. All in all, it really is in large part about religious beliefs or stereotypes stemming from that.

 

Also - even long before Hitler Germany had issues with accepting the idea of black Germans. Hitler didn't really do anything to change that, in fact Aryans were strictly forbidden to mingle with black people via racial laws, while Hitler himself approved sterilization program for forced sterilization of Afro-Germans. Also, most of the blacks enlisted in German Army at that time served in Africa, in free Arabian Legion.



#130102
ThoughtlessRanter

ThoughtlessRanter
  • Members
  • 62 messages

Alistair? Prince Douchebag in DA 2?

Lol. You calling him Prince Douchebag says enough.

Alistair made my sister cry, I know game character, but she doesn't take any sort of break up well

 

It's not really about stability, it's more about complexity. Speaking in very generalized terms, women appear to be more interested in a tad more complex, emotional ride.

Why does complexity have to equal douchebaggery? Leliana was complex, but still sweet... in Origins.

Soooo, emotional masochism? 



#130103
Colonelkillabee

Colonelkillabee
  • Members
  • 8 467 messages

It's a bit more complicated than that - Germany wasn't the only country that viewed Jews unfavorably. Russia has been very antisemitic for a long time (also quite religiously motivated, ironically even in Soviet Union that was aggressively antisemitic as well) and AFAIK Catholic Church has not-very-secretly antisemitic overtones sewn into its rhetoric till sixties. All in all, it really is in large part about religious beliefs or stereotypes stemming from that.

 

Also - even long before Hitler Germany had issues with accepting the idea of black Germans. Hitler didn't really do anything to change that, in fact Aryans were strictly forbidden to mingle with black people via racial laws, while Hitler himself approved sterilization program for forced sterilization of Afro-Germans. Also, most of the blacks enlisted in German Army at that time served in Africa, in free Arabian Legion.

Those other countries may have been religiously motivated, but as was pointed out, Hitlers was more racial based on bullshit "science". Any superstitious or religious influence was simply used to gain support.

 

As far as black Germans go, there was a handful at best, and it was done by secret order, not by law, because most Germans were rather indifferent to blacks. Not like there was many around in Germany anyway.

 

I'm not saying Nazi Germany loved black people. I'm saying even they disliked Jews, and it's not about religion, this is something that is used by others to ignore the idea that Jew history is stolen history, in fear that antisemitism could grow. Like I said, despite the fact that Nazis simply used this and blacks, there is a community of blacks in America that are antisemitic for that reason. Even to the point that some stupidly ignore what Hitler did out of their own bitterness.



#130104
Colonelkillabee

Colonelkillabee
  • Members
  • 8 467 messages

Lol. You calling him Prince Douchebag says enough.

Being a douche doesn't make you crazy or unstable ;)



#130105
ThoughtlessRanter

ThoughtlessRanter
  • Members
  • 62 messages

Then I ask you this, something I brought up earlier in the thread -- what if millions of ancient elves are trapped and suffering, and will die if Solas doesn't act? He will trade the lives of the modern world -- to what degree, we don't know -- for those of his own time. Is he still bad? Would you do less? Really consider that question, and how no matter what way you choose a lot of people will end up hurt or dead. Granted, this may not be the case of what Solas is facing, but that we can speculate on this at all is why Solas is a great character. It makes us ask these questions and consider our own answers. Most of us wouldn't do it for a dozen people. Even a hundred. But if we had to choose between millions? There's no easy answer, and that is what I love about where the story left us. Whatever happens in the future, it made us stop and think and ask some interesting questions.

 

And to your other question of why stories like Twilight seem to be so popular, one way I saw it explained is that women are raised practically from birth to be modest, to act nice, not be sexual or sl*tty or anything that doesn't involve smiling pretty and acting like our carnal virtue is our only good point. But many people will still have the normal sexual thoughts and feelings and feel like they are bad for it. So then you get books like Twilight where the characters are kind of... not forced, but too caught up in things or helpless to really fight off the sexual awakening and release aspect of the main characters. It becomes "okay" for the person reading it to vicariously experience this. The shame is on the character, and not the person. You aren't a bad sexual s*ut because hey, it wasn't you! I'm sure there are other explanations, but that one makes at least some sense.

 

But honestly, if you can watch a video of two strangers grunting and moaning awkwardly, ain't no shame in someone reading a story and feeling the same things.

I don't think one peoples lives should be valued more than another ones. And I think "letting them die" is a lot better than "killing them". They both suck, I won't argue that, but it's still you acting like god judging that peoples lives as more important. 

Look at those poor savage barbarians. I'm going to kill them because my people are magical and not cut off like they are, but it is a pity. 

 

That makes sense... I guess? My parents were crazy conservative, so I definitely felt super guilty in my teens.. but it's definitely easier for boys to do "bad stuff" and it be okay.

 

They were made with much love by another forum user who's an incredibly kind-hearted person and the cinnamon roll of our thread. 

 

 

No need to apologize to me. You're my muse, my snarkspiration. I'm really enjoying myself. :)

 

But for everyone else, maybe make the observations 1) less general, 2) remove any offensive words that might make people feel attacked, 3) ask yourself, "Can I come up with some counter-argument's to my statements" and if yes, refine your statement before posting. 

Oh i'll take one than. Never let anyone say I can't be polite.

 

Ehh work. Can't you just be my little shoulder angel and badger me when I say something bad?

 

 

Guys I am really sorry I started a Nazi debate. Let's just they were evil bassterds and leave it at that.



#130106
Da'asha

Da'asha
  • Members
  • 51 messages
I'm off topic because I'm nowhere near caught up, but you people inspired me to read The Masked Empire. And I have to say, I get the Felassan love. And the Solas anger because how dare he touch that beautiful elf. And I like Briala more than I did from DAI, Gaspard got more likable as it went on, I still can't decide whether I hate Michel or not, but I definitely do hate Celene. But Felassan is the best and Im just depressed now.

As you were.
  • Missy_MI, Lunapur, Vlk3 et 7 autres aiment ceci

#130107
ThoughtlessRanter

ThoughtlessRanter
  • Members
  • 62 messages

Being a douche doesn't make you crazy or unstable ;)

He tries to take over Kirkwall! Crazy a**hole, what lunatic doesn't realize you should leave Kirkwall the eff alone, crazy people. Aveline bloodied that a**s nose though!



#130108
midnight tea

midnight tea
  • Members
  • 4 820 messages

They also made a convenient scapegoat to get Germans to unite behind him.

 

When the Nazi party first formed and Hitler first started speaking in public, no one really listened to them or took them seriously. When they started saying all of Germany's problems were the fault of the Jews (and others), people started listening to him. When he started declaring his intention to do something about the "Jewish problem" (and others), people started backing him.

 

Also, it wasn't mainly religious grounds. Not the main reason given, anyway. That was old-fashioned and superstitious. The Germans were far too advanced, intelligent, and enlightened to hate people over something as petty as religious differences. It was a matter of scientifically-based race research that "objectively" said that Aryans were the master race and all other races were not only as good as a separate species, but genetically inferior. Based on science and reason. Because they were so sophisticated and enlightened. [/sarcasm]

 

It's the religion - or rather the religious climate in western countries - that really gave the reason to single-out and hate Jews anyway, because there was hardly ever any other reason to single them out. It's a very complicated and century-, if not millenia-old issue though, and I'm not sure it's time and space for that^^;

 

Also no - sadly, intelligence and enlightenment doesn't protect one's country from teeming with superstitions, no matter how old-fashioned. Remember that after WWI and prior to WWII the situation in Germany wasn't really one that fostered enlightenment, really. Most Germans were frustrated - they were forced to pay massive reparations for World War I and then the Great Depression swept over the western hemisphere and made the economic situation worse. In times like that, it's really easy to entertain more and more extreme ideas, or even invent entire "scientifically-based" race research or listen to an impassioned leader who'd say that it's all other's fault that the nation is suffering...



#130109
Colonelkillabee

Colonelkillabee
  • Members
  • 8 467 messages

He tries to take over Kirkwall! Crazy a**hole, what lunatic doesn't realize you should leave Kirkwall the eff alone, crazy people. Aveline bloodied that a**s nose though!

Because Hawke spared a terrorist and everything went to hell.



#130110
ThoughtlessRanter

ThoughtlessRanter
  • Members
  • 62 messages

I'm off topic because I'm nowhere near caught up, but you people inspired me to read The Masked Empire. And I have to say, I get the Felassan love. And the Solas anger because how dare he touch that beautiful elf. And I like Briala more than I did from DAI, Gaspard got more likable as it went on, I still can't decide whether I hate Michel or not, but I definitely do hate Celene. But Felassan is the best and Im just depressed now.

As you were.

You're giving the thread dubbed Troll fuel.

 

See^ friendship matters little to Solass


  • kitcat1228 aime ceci

#130111
ThoughtlessRanter

ThoughtlessRanter
  • Members
  • 62 messages

Because Hawke spared a terrorist and everything went to hell.

That's why? I definitely shanked Anders and still got Sebastian attacking... now I have to recheck my Keep to all options Anders haaaaaaaatteeeeee.



#130112
Colonelkillabee

Colonelkillabee
  • Members
  • 8 467 messages

That's why? I definitely shanked Anders and still got Sebastian attacking... now I have to recheck my Keep to all options Anders haaaaaaaatteeeeee.

Ah, well I always let Anders live to troll him, so I thought it was the only time. He said he'd attack Kirkwall if you let him live.


  • Catfishers aime ceci

#130113
Uirebhiril

Uirebhiril
  • Members
  • 2 530 messages

I don't think one peoples lives should be valued more than another ones. And I think "letting them die" is a lot better than "killing them". They both suck, I won't argue that, but it's still you acting like god judging that peoples lives as more important.

 

I agree, no one life should be valued over others. But to me, if you have the knowledge to save someone from dying and refuse to do it, that's no better than sticking the knife in their ribs. Your inaction caused the death just as much as the action. Knowing that millions will die because you did not try to save them is going to cause crushing guilt to anyone, so... how does one really make that decision?

 

It's all hypothetical since we really have no idea what is driving Solas. It could just be the burden of guilt, or being compelled by Mythal or whoever. Whatever it is, it's not just mustache-twirling villandom or a belief that others don't deserve to live. We'll know more of the story eventually. But even so, I could only ever be disappointed if we end up with cheap writing where Solas is just "meh, whatevs." He's been built up to be way more than that as a person.


  • AllThatJazz aime ceci

#130114
midnight tea

midnight tea
  • Members
  • 4 820 messages

I don't think one peoples lives should be valued more than another ones. And I think "letting them die" is a lot better than "killing them". They both suck, I won't argue that, but it's still you acting like god judging that peoples lives as more important. 

Look at those poor savage barbarians. I'm going to kill them because my people are magical and not cut off like they are, but it is a pity. 

 

It's ironic what you say, because on one hand you claim that "I don't think one people's lives should be valued more than another ones"... and then you do exactly that. 



#130115
dawnstone

dawnstone
  • Members
  • 1 460 messages

I'm off topic because I'm nowhere near caught up, but you people inspired me to read The Masked Empire. And I have to say, I get the Felassan love. And the Solas anger because how dare he touch that beautiful elf. And I like Briala more than I did from DAI, Gaspard got more likable as it went on, I still can't decide whether I hate Michel or not, but I definitely do hate Celene. But Felassan is the best and Im just depressed now.

As you were.

Felassan is best elf. At least befriended/romanced Solas probably feels like an utter and complete piece of shit for killing him once he started seeing the world similar to what Felassan did - that they were people. Cole's words on the matter from Trespasser are chilling, but other things that both he and Solas said give me hope that Felassan's death wasn't in vain.

 

I also like Gaspard more than Celene (who let herself be goaded into a pointless massacre). If he didn't have every intention of invading Ferelden the first chance he gets, I probably would have let him rule instead of putting Briala in power over him in my canon playthrough (hopefully she can weather the political storm of a dissolved Inquisition).



#130116
Catfishers

Catfishers
  • Members
  • 386 messages

See^ friendship matters little to Solass

 

Well, Felassan did kinda betray Solas so...

 

I mean, I love Felassan as much as the next person, but he wasn't just Solas' buddy, he was his agent. He had a job to do and he not only failed, but willingly chose not to complete his mission. He was compromised. Killing him was just the most logical course of action. Not because of vengeance, but just because of practicality. I don't think it was something that Solas did happily. He did it because he had to.


  • AllThatJazz, Shari'El, Venus_L et 3 autres aiment ceci

#130117
ThoughtlessRanter

ThoughtlessRanter
  • Members
  • 62 messages
 

Ah, well I always let Anders live to troll him, so I thought it was the only time. He said he'd attack Kirkwall if you let him live.

No, you're right. I looked it up. Weird.

Sebastian realized how much I hated him and came to destroy my city out of revenge.

 

I agree, no one life should be valued over others. But to me, if you have the knowledge to save someone from dying and refuse to do it, that's no better than sticking the knife in their ribs. Your inaction caused the death just as much as the action. Knowing that millions will die because you did not try to save them is going to cause crushing guilt to anyone, so... how does one really make that decision?

 

It's all hypothetical since we really have no idea what is driving Solas. It could just be the burden of guilt, or being compelled by Mythal or whoever. Whatever it is, it's not just mustache-twirling villandom or a belief that others don't deserve to live. We'll know more of the story eventually. But even so, I could only ever be disappointed if we end up with cheap writing where Solas is just "meh, whatevs." He's been built up to be way more than that as a person.

Yeah, but if a bunch of people in your country were sick and the only way to save them was I don't know, heart transplants from people from an underdeveloped country (as in you have to kill them) and you do kill them that is horrible. Letting them die sucks, yes, yes it does, but killing to keep them alive isn't the answer.



#130118
Uirebhiril

Uirebhiril
  • Members
  • 2 530 messages

Yeah, but if a bunch of people in your country were sick and the only way to save them was I don't know, heart transplants from people from an underdeveloped country (as in you have to kill them) and you do kill them that is horrible. Letting them die sucks, yes, yes it does, but killing to keep them alive isn't the answer.

 

 

How did you judge the mayor of Crestwood?


  • AllThatJazz aime ceci

#130119
midnight tea

midnight tea
  • Members
  • 4 820 messages

Yeah, but if a bunch of people in your country were sick and the only way to save them was I don't know, heart transplants from people from an underdeveloped country (as in you have to kill them) and you do kill them that is horrible. Letting them die sucks, yes, yes it does, but killing to keep them alive isn't the answer.

 

... What if those underdeveloped countries were destined to be doomed and those that require heart-transplants had power or abilities to help and save them all, provided that they themselves survived first?



#130120
drosophila

drosophila
  • Members
  • 5 549 messages

Oh i'll take one than. Never let anyone say I can't be polite.

 

Excellent, my friend. You will be summoned when the time comes.

 

Ehh work. Can't you just be my little shoulder angel and badger me when I say something bad?

 

I'd be honored to :)


  • Onecrazymonkey1, Cee et ThoughtlessRanter aiment ceci

#130121
ThoughtlessRanter

ThoughtlessRanter
  • Members
  • 62 messages

It's ironic what you say, because on one hand you claim that "I don't think one people's lives should be valued more than another ones"... and then you do exactly that. 

Huh, I was pretending to be Solas with the barbarian part...

 

Well, Felassan did kinda betray Solas so...

 

I mean, I love Felassan as much as the next person, but he wasn't just Solas' buddy, he was his agent. He had a job to do and he not only failed, but willingly chose not to complete his mission. He was compromised. Killing him was just the most logical course of action. Not because of vengeance, but just because of practicality. I don't think it was something that Solas did happily. He did it because he had to.

Puh, and his excuse for me? He betrayed me, not the other way around. And I didn't read the book but that sounds really cold. He did this before the Inquisition?

 

How did you judge the mayor of Crestwood?

That a**hole! I locked his a** up!



#130122
Uirebhiril

Uirebhiril
  • Members
  • 2 530 messages
That a**hole! I locked his a** up!

 

Why?



#130123
Eivuwan

Eivuwan
  • Members
  • 1 834 messages

I am perplexed as to why everyone is people are engaging with someone who calls himself a thoughtlessranter.


  • Aroihkin, dragondreamer, neonmoth et 4 autres aiment ceci

#130124
Da'asha

Da'asha
  • Members
  • 51 messages

Felassan is best elf. At least befriended/romanced Solas probably feels like an utter and complete piece of shit for killing him once he started seeing the world similar to what Felassan did - that they were people. Cole's words on the matter from Trespasser are chilling, but other things that both he and Solas said give me hope that Felassan's death wasn't in vain.

I also like Gaspard more than Celene (who let herself be goaded into a pointless massacre). If he didn't have every intention of invading Ferelden the first chance he gets, I probably would have let him rule instead of putting Briala in power over him in my canon playthrough (hopefully she can weather the political storm of a dissolved Inquisition).


At the same time, I liked him enough by the end, I was going, "you know, maybe Gaspard's right. What has Fereldan ever done for me?" Which just goes to show that he's a capable and inspirational leader of he has me thinking like that.

Well, Felassan did kinda betray Solas so...

I mean, I love Felassan as much as the next person, but he wasn't just Solas' buddy, he was his agent. He had a job to do and he not only failed, but willingly chose not to complete his mission. He was compromised. Killing him was just the most logical course of action. Not because of vengeance, but just because of practicality. I don't think it was something that Solas did happily. He did it because he had to.


You aren't wrong, but it was still pretty cold when he did it. No preamble or anything, just bam. Dead. To a guy who he probably liked at least a little.
  • dawnstone et Neras aiment ceci

#130125
ThoughtlessRanter

ThoughtlessRanter
  • Members
  • 62 messages

... What if those underdeveloped countries were destined to be doomed and those that require heart-transplants had power or abilities to help and save them all, provided that they themselves survived first?

How are they destined to be doomed, because your elitist a** (not yours Solas's) says so? He's such a friggin hypocrite, one of my favorite banters is where he tells Bull that even people in crappy situations have choice and should have that choice! That's what that is! You can't be sure of anything, they may suffer and die, but they could pull through! And maybe they're finding happiness in their suffering lives too. Little things, like kissing their kids goodnight, or finding new love, or enjoying some fermented juice! People deserve their chance at happiness and life, no matter how slim, or how dire it is!

 

Excellent, my friend. You will be summoned when the time comes.

 

 

I'd be honored to :)

Thanks, quick question though, do you have some type of fly thing? 

...what are these raisins!?