153455 réponses à ce sujet

[midnight tea]

How do you know there weren't?

Yes, a question with a question and I avoided your question, I'm a**

 

There's always other options though, if you don't see them it's because you refuse to look.

The mass murder of innocent people can never ever ever in a million years call me an idealist but I'm just being a moral human being ever be justified. Especially if you're doing it out of some shriveled up sense of duty and supremacism! 

 

This is the oldest cop-out in the world... "Oh, there are ALWAYS other options!" people say, and then refuse to provide any - unless it's either too late or it turns out there was actually no choice at all... or every other alternative was worse.

 

You're living in a fantasy world if you think that life ever provides easy ways out if you search or want it enough. Now, I'm not saying that I don't want to find another solution to save the world or elves, but I don't necessarily expect that what I will find to be easy, or satisfy my idealist self in every way, even in a world full of magic and miracles. Likely, there will be sacrifices on the way.

 

edit: What about a choice in game about who we pick as allies and effectively save - mages or templars? We only were given time to save one.

[Colonelkillabee]

Doesn't mean they can't in the future, and there's already some human/elven friendships, so it isn't impossible. 

This ain't the future, and "some" are in a very small minority. While people are blathering about unity, elves are dying out slowly. Just saying, I may kill Solas if necessary, but I understand why he thinks this is necessary. It's not insane, it's preservation and correcting what he thinks is his mistake.

[Garnet]

Thedas has magic... I think it's a bit short on miracles though. 

[ThoughtlessRanter]

This is the oldest cop-out in the world... "Oh, there are ALWAYS other choices!" people say, and then refuse to provide any - unless it's either too late or it turns out there there was actually no choice at all... or every other alternative was worse.

 

You're living in a fantasy world if you think that life ever provides easy ways out if you search or want it enough. Now, I'm not saying that I don't want to find another solution to save the world or elves, but I don't necessarily expect that what I will find will be easy, or satisfy my idealist self in every way, even in a world full of magic and miracles. Likely, there will be sacrifices on the way.

Well call me a special little optimistic unicorn because I do see choices! Maybe not easy ones but are you telling me Solas doesn't have any? WE DON'T KNOW FOR SURE OF COURSE BECAUSE HE TELLS US ZILCH!! But see, right there a choice, one to show some common decency and at least try to explain things to us!

AND MASS MURDER IS NEVER JUSTIFIABLE!

[Ghost Gal]

Corypheus was released and planning to do something anyhow. For all we know, he didn't need the orb to convince Venatori, corrupt the Templars, almost conscript Southern mages and have a Nightmare demon amplify false Calling in Wardens to make them create an army of demons for him to command.

 

He'd tear the world in one way or another - and if it wasn't for the Mark, he likely would be unstoppable.

 

Mass elven blood sacrifices like the first time he did it!

[ThoughtlessRanter]

This ain't the future, and "some" are in a very small minority. While people are blathering about unity, elves are dying out slowly. Just saying, I may kill Solas if necessary, but I understand why he thinks this is necessary. It's not insane, it's preservation and correcting what he thinks is his mistake.

Progress is slow but it happens.

People are people are people! 

That mentality is why they fight!

 

Thedas has magic... I think it's a bit short on miracles though. 

My Inquisitor is going to wake his with his arm and Solas sitting next to him explaining he was stuck in the Nightmare.

[Ghost Gal]

Thedas has magic... I think it's a bit short on miracles though. 

 

Tell that to the masses worshiping our Inquisitors as "The Herald of Andraste." Remember what Varric says at the start of the game? "Heroes are everywhere. I've seen that. But the hole in the sky... that's beyond heroes. We're going to need a miracle." And then we do it and a dragon attacks Haven and we cover Haven with falling rocks and then we survive and then people start calling it a miracle...

 

In Thedas, one person's dumb luck is another person's miracle.

[Uirebhiril]

How do you know there weren't?

Yes, a question with a question and I avoided your question, I'm a**

 

There's always other options though, if you don't see them it's because you refuse to look.

The mass murder of innocent people can never ever ever in a million years call me an idealist but I'm just being a moral human being ever be justified. Especially if you're doing it out of some shriveled up sense of duty and supremacism! 

 

Were we still talking about the mayor of Crestwood?

[Aroihkin]

Uh, why do I get yelled at for being uncivil when people keep commenting like this? Please kind ser (spelling it like DA so it works for either gender) what have I done to personally offend you? Let it be known so I may protect my honor and humbly apologize.

 

 

I've been watching you come in here and be a clown all night on your "whole ^_[new] account". If comparing you to the 'loud and proud haters' we used to get in Zev-thread offends you, perhaps you should re-examine your tactics.

 

In the meanwhile, this is all the engagement you're gettin' out of me tonight.

 

[Colonelkillabee]

Progress is slow but it happens.

People are people are people! 

That mentality is why they fight!

Too slow. I don't think the elves will last long enough for your "progress". Native Americans are a good example. We made progress but the damage has pretty much been done as far as they're concerned.

 

People being people means squat. You're too naive Nothing will get done if people sit around waiting for "progress" to happen. That's why revolutions spark.

[ThoughtlessRanter]

Were we still talking about the mayor of Crestwood?

Uh, I don't know. When I got all riled up to argue I was thinking you guys would argue why you can change Solas's mind, or how this evil action doesn't make him an evil dude. I did not expect to argue whether or not genocide was justifiable.

 

Oh the humanity

[midnight tea]

Well call me a special little optimistic unicorn because I do see choices! Maybe not easy ones but are you telling me Solas doesn't have any? WE DON'T KNOW FOR SURE OF COURSE BECAUSE HE TELLS US ZILCH!! But see, right there a choice, one to show some common decency and at least try to explain things to us!

AND MASS MURDER IS NEVER JUSTIFIABLE!

 

 

I repeat my question again - did we or did we not have a choice to save both mages AND templars? No, we only had time and opportunity to save one, ultimately condemning hundreds if not thousands of people, many of them innocent.

 

Also - nobody justifies the mass murder, not even Solas. From the looks of it, he expects to pay the ultimate price for doing what he plans to, for all of eternity. He does what he thinks he must, for his people to survive.

[TheEggCrusher]

@ThoughtlessRanter

 

 

you know this is a solas fan thread. if you want to talk sh*t, go to another thread please. We are proud here of being some of the few people left that don't hate him. We don't need more people telling us that we're wrong and blinded by our fangirl emotions, which is not true at all. We just choose to look at Solas from a more morally grey point of view. Stop insulting us and our opinions. Bye

[ThoughtlessRanter]

 

I've been watching you come in here and be a clown all night on your "whole ^_[new] account". If comparing you to the 'loud and proud haters' we used to get in Zev-thread offends you, perhaps you should re-examine your tactics.

 

In the meanwhile, this is all the engagement you're gettin' out of me tonight.

 

...

Really I'm not sure how I'm supposed to react. 

I made the account so I could rant about my feelz.

I might be abrasive but I don't know why that completely dismisses my arguments to clowning or trolling.

I like Zevran by the way, guys kissing does not bother me, and Zevran can do so much better than that homicidal a**.

[Uirebhiril]

Uh, I don't know. When I got all riled up to argue I was thinking you guys would argue why you can change Solas's mind, or how this evil action doesn't make him an evil dude. I did not expect to argue whether or not genocide was justifiable.

 

 

It isn't justifiable. No one here would argue that it is. What we're discussing is the nuance behind the character and the story itself. My questions about the mayor of Crestwood were honestly being curious how you decided in a case where one man decided that to save his village, he had to drown a lot of sick people that were a serious threat to them. Locking the guy up is fair, since he did make the decision that resulted in death and then tried to hide it. But to say it was a clear cut good or bad decision is really, truly missing the point.

 

And just in case you missed it, Solas himself does not like or agree with what he is doing, even if he thinks he has to. He's the first to tell you that. He is not looking forward to what he is planning to do and probably already hates himself for deciding to do it. This doesn't make it better that he is still planning to do it, but you really can't portray him as an evil no f's given about death genocidal maniac when the reality of the game and story say otherwise. We are defending that aspect of his character, not what he plans to do.

[CapricornSun]

....

 

*cough* I'll just leave these here... 

 

Art break. 

 

Trespasser: Beautiful Lavellan card and Solas card by shalizeh7.

Spoiler

Source: http://shalizeh7.tum...-to-my-lavellan

 

 

Trespasser: Solas and Lavellan.

Spoiler

Source: http://jobertrowneyd...-did-to-deserve

 

 

Post-Trespasser (DA4?): Showdown between elven god Solas and Tevinter Magister Dorian. (Dorian's looking great!)

Spoiler

Source: http://kingnugking.t...-the-two-in-da4

 

 

Post-Trespasser: Fenris vs Solas. Inspired by this post.

Spoiler

Source: http://aethergeologi...ons-they-always

 

 

Lavellan and dark!Solas.

Spoiler

Source: http://niklisson.tum...ase-crawls-back

 

 

Adorable Solas and (drunk?) Lavellan.

Spoiler

Source: http://artistictyran...ed-working-on-a

 

 

May the Dread Wolf take you. (NSFW)

 

 

EDIT: Top Solas!

 

Source: http://lyriumloveson...st/130201548381

 

[ThoughtlessRanter]

Too slow. I don't think the elves will last long enough for your "progress". Native Americans are a good example. We made progress but the damage has pretty much been done as far as they're concerned.

 

People being people means squat. You're too naive Nothing will get done if people sit around waiting for "progress" to happen. That's why revolutions spark.

Naive... or preciously optimistic?

 

@midnight tea for some reason I can't quote you. Solas is taking an active role in murder. Making a conscience decision that this ideal world is more valuable than the lives in Thedas. But you know the answer to your question, however it does not translate to Solas's actions. If he knows what he's doing is so terrible he shouldn't do it.

 

@TheEggCrusher I was told that differing opinions were welcome. Not gonna deny I've been talking sh*t about Solas, the a**hole deserves it in my opinion. Please put the effing pitchforks away. I am so god awfully sorry that I have strong feelings about Solas and wanted to vent. 

[Colonelkillabee]

Naive... or preciously optimistic?

Naive Sorry. Optimism doesn't apply to people. You're looking for idealistic. I'm optimistic, but cynical. Don't trust the human race worth a damn, only certain individuals that prove worthy of it.

[flabbadence]

Augh. Finally caught up with the thread. How is everyone posting so quickly?

 

As to current discussion, I am with The Beard on this:

 

No one deserves to survive. People simply do or they don't. Solas is looking out for his own, can't fault him for that. Nor can anyone fault me for looking out for mine by killing him in the process, if necessary.

 

This is a war. And if it's a war between ancient elves and every other race in Thedas? Then I can't fault Solas for fighting for his own. If a low approval Inquisitor calls him out on his bloody bullshit plan by saying, "You would murder countless people?!", Solas replies with, "Wouldn't you to save your own?"

 

And he would have gotten that right about my Lavellan. The main reason why she didn't just run away when people started calling her the Herald of Andraste was because using the Anchor really did look like the only way the Breach could be closed, and she knew running away would just endanger everyone in the world, her family and her people included. But if, say, the Breach didn't spew out demons from the sky, and only made humans sick, and if human nobles were especially susceptible? Well, she still would have saved them, but she would have been sorely tempted to book it every time. And if humans reacted by blaming this new sickness on the elves and started attacking them left and right, as they most likely would have? Then she would have blown that Breach right open to encompass the whole sky.

 

Point being, your people are your people. The world isn't fair and equal. History is full of blood and filth. And sometimes, you just have to fight others for your own, because absolutely no one else will.

 

So yeah, Solas has chosen his side, and my Lavellan has chosen hers. She will do everything within her power to make him change his mind and try to come up with a better solution than what he already has planned (because heck, she knows Thedas isn't looking so hot right now either). But if either option fails, and the opportunity presents itself, then she will take up that blade and drive it right through his heart. As much as that thought pains me, and as much as that hurt to type. Solas isn't the only one willing to become a monster for his people in this game.

[dawnstone]

Anyone up for a fic rec?

 

Looking Glass by Feynite

 

Warning, it is a WIP, but this writer does have a history of finishing their longfics. If you aren't reading this yet please do yourself a favor and start. I wasn't sure about it at first because time-travel is like one of my least favorite tropes, but so far this works. It is a heartwrenching look at a Lavellan who couldn't stop Solas in the present, but gets thrown into the past, where she has one more chance to stop the whole thing from starting. So good, so full of feels, and really lovely descriptions of ancient Elvhenan using the new lore from Tresspasser.

[ThoughtlessRanter]

Uhhhhhhhhhhh

THIS IS NOT HOW YOU VENT STRESS!

 

I'll leave, the welcoming Solas thread has obviously decided I wore out my welcome.

 

To those that were nice Drosophila and Garnet, Long U name, Colonel, and midnight tea too even tho I super disagree with your opinions, thank you and goodnight!

 

May you enjoy sharing stories of the crazy ranter who came onto the thread and left in a huff

 

 

 

 

huff

[RynJ]

No one deserves to survive. People simply do or they don't. Solas is looking out for his own, can't fault him for that. Nor can anyone fault me for looking out for mine by killing him in the process, if necessary.

 

Pretty much this. It confuses me that people are so bewildered by Solas. What's the point of getting mad at him for valuing his own people more? Who WOULDN'T? Is elitist really the right word for that? And it's not even just a "we're better nyah nyah" thing; he regarded the people of modern Thedas as akin to Tranquil, living miserable lives (and I suppose people get pissy hearing this, but we really don't know enough about how elves used to be and how people used to feel and think before the Veil enough to say that this comparison isn't somewhat apt. Not that it would matter to anyone but Solas, but I'm talking about Solas pov so whatevs). Why wouldn't he think to just rescue his people instead, who wouldn't be effectively tranquil?

 

And yes, if you help him, Solas now knows that everyone isn't a gremlin. Which is why on that path, he's now clearly doubting himself. However, he still values his people over modern Thedas'. Which still makes complete sense. And this isn't even factoring in the incredible guilt he feels and his sense of duty to fix his "mistake".

 

I don't support Solas' plan in the least. Like you say, he wants to look out for his own, and my Inquisitor wants to look out for hers. And killing people isn't exactly A okay, but this IS Dragon Age where everyone we know has who knows how much blood on their hands!

 

Plus, unless there really are people trapped and suffering that need freeing, he's trying to restore people that were long wiped out and that isn't worth destroying everyone alive now. But yeah, I truly don't understand how people don't understand his motives. They make perfect sense to me, and as I've said elsewhere, I'd venture to say that many people would do exactly what Solas is doing in his situation, and probably with less hangups than he has at that. Good thing nobody will ever have to find out if that's the truth! 

 

To make it clear once again just in case: understanding Solas does not mean agreeing with him. He makes perfect sense to me and none of his motives confuse me, but it's still BAD. BAD WOLF. BAD. WOLF. 

[Colonelkillabee]

Augh. Finally caught up with the thread. How is everyone posting so quickly?

 

As to current discussion, I am with The Beard on this:

Not ignoring the rest of what you said, just wanted to point out that I love this nickname I approve.

 

Oh, and completely agree with the rest of what you said too

[flabbadence]

Anyone up for a fic rec?

 

Looking Glass by Feynite

 

Warning, it is a WIP, but this writer does have a history of finishing their longfics. If you aren't reading this yet please do yourself a favor and start. I wasn't sure about it at first because time-travel is like one of my least favorite tropes, but so far this works. It is a heartwrenching look at a Lavellan who couldn't stop Solas in the present, but gets thrown into the pas,t where she has one more chance to stop the whole thing from starting. So good, so full of feels, and really lovely descriptions of ancient Elvhenan using the new lore from Tresspasser.

 

I LOVE THIS FIC AND ALL HER OTHER FICS OH MY GOD EVERYONE READ THIS NOW PLEASE DO YOURSELVES A FAVOR AND READ IT NOW!!!!!

[TheEggCrusher]

Anyone up for a fic rec?

 

Looking Glass by Feynite

 

Warning, it is a WIP, but this writer does have a history of finishing their longfics. If you aren't reading this yet please do yourself a favor and start. I wasn't sure about it at first because time-travel is like one of my least favorite tropes, but so far this works. It is a heartwrenching look at a Lavellan who couldn't stop Solas in the present, but gets thrown into the past, where she has one more chance to stop the whole thing from starting. So good, so full of feels, and really lovely descriptions of ancient Elvhenan using the new lore from Tresspasser.

Sounds great

 

I was actually in the middle of looking for some DA fics to read, so thanks for the rec

 

here's one of my favorites right now that I keep recing on here: http://archiveofouro...hapters/9883370(it's just so good and I want everyone to read it   )