I made mine yesterday. He's a couple of pages back and will be giving Cassandra a nice mage boyfriend.
omg! I need to try to find him! 
I am so curious and omg I am so sorry I saw that you had a birthday some days ago! Happy birthday even though I say it too late T_T I am so sorry! I don't know how I missed that!
I think it's a bit more complicated than that. Like every higher form of being Solas is not just a regular spirit/demon, and the nature of such beings doesn't just shift between two black-and-white forms/concepts that seem opposite of one another, with one being good and another being bad.
I mean, "pride" isn't even any sort of negative thing in itself. People who are proud - or proud of something - aren't necessarily bad. It's excessive pride - hubris - that is bad; the extreme form of pride demons seem to embody.
And let's face it - "good" things aren't necessarily good in themselves as well. Nightmare is alluded to initially be a spirit of Compassion, who began taking too much from people, initially because it thought it helps them. Even sweet, innocent Cole killed people because he thought that's the only way to help them as well.
And Wisdom in itself seems to be inert - Solas's' spirit friend seemed to be content just hoarding information, and while it shares it happily with anyone who asks, it seems disinterested in venturing out to seek others out of its own will... which is likely why Solas is known as Pride and not Wisdom. He has enough of confidence and willingness to share what he knows (not unlike Cole, who had enough of personality and bravery to venture outside of the Fade in order to help people). For better or worse he's proactive - a trait I think everyone agrees Solas has in spades.
It's Solas' self-flagellation that makes him come across so negatively on occasion in my eyes. He's full of himself, but sometimes he can be so hard on himself too.
That's the thing that confuses me about Cole. The Nightmare is what Compassion can become as the Divine said, but Cole's fear is Despair. Is it because he was once represented Mercy more than Compassion with all those mercy killings?
Oh please do! I would love to have those sliders!
Where are you from? I am from Finland and it is 8pm here haha so I had to ask
Toinen suomalainen And (almost) same for English in case you don't understand, I am from Finland.
I would add to that that Solas clearly has self-awareness about his less positive traits. I think Pride and Wisdom actually lie on a spectrum. The Wisdom spirit is on one end, a Pride demon is on the other, and Solas is actually somewhere in between. So he is always aware that Pride is a strong characteristic within him, but strives to control it and not let it push him towards the demonic side. So he may have taken the name Pride the same way he appropriated the title of Dread Wolf - a badge of honor he wears for all to see.
I think it's like that with every spirit and concept - especially if they become more complicated than a mere reflection of one thing (that in itself can be vague).
It's a spectrum, more than a fixed, singular thing - which is exactly why spirits and demons are the same thing; the difference between them is whether they're pulled to one extreme or another. And those who develop enough consciousness and personality eventually find a sense of equilibrium, likely becoming more than a regular spirit when they do.
It's all very Aristotelian Golden Mean - https://en.wikipedia...an_(philosophy)
omg I finally created Male Lavellan and I was planning on romancing Dorian with him :3 I have wanted to do this for a long time hahaha
I just wanted to share him and ask what you guys think about his looks? Lol would Dorian like him? hmm OH And if you guys have male lavellans or male characters I would love to see them as well! IF you are willing to share :3
*snip*
*snip*
Dorian is gon be one lucky guy!
Male Lavellans? Oh boy, do I! I have two. There's my canon Inquisitor: Bruce 'Staches' Lavellan. Often depicted with fake moustaches.
And then there is Brayan Lavellan.
Am I the only one who tends to headcanon my characters in their 30's or more? ... Somehow, I can't play younger than myself.
Will suck in a time... I suppose.
Depends on the character. I'm almost 40, and I don't really care to play teenagers at all. I tend to think for a Lavellan to be given the responsibility of visiting the conclave, they have to have proven themselves fairly skilled already, and have enough life experience to deal with humans and to know what to look for. I mean, if you're sending spies into hostile territory, you don't send your greenest agents.
Luca Lavellan (canon Inquisitor) - Age 36, 2dagger rogue. Has 2 kids - son age 9, daughter age 13 - her bondmate is dead, so her sister and parents are minding. Though after Haven, Josie and Leliana encourage her to move her kids to a safe place where they can't be used against her, and her father goes with them to one of Josie's houses in Antiva. Good thing, since most of her clan gets killed in Wycome. Was not expecting to fall in love w/ Solas or anyone, but is going to save him and save the world, b/c she's just that good.
Dheassan "Des" Lavellan - Age 48, archer. Has a grown son with a woman in another clan but is not bonded, likes to wander, and is kind of an ******* with a short-temper. Allies w/ Templars, keeps Grey Wardens, makes friends with Gaspard, romances Josie, leaves Hawke in the Fade, won't drink from WoS. Probably going to kill Solas.
Laderalan "Lana" Lavellan - Age 25, mage. No kids, but was being strongly encouraged to settle down before she left for the conclave. She was her clan's First, so despite the fact that she's a restless sort of person, she expected to go back when this was over and shoulder her responsibilities. Then her clan got killed and so she becomes 100% a death dealing terror, and took Solas leaving pretty hard. Still going to save him.
I'll just drop this here. Incoherently, off topic.
I used to do this...
--
T-he best thing to keep in mind about Solas is that Cole believes he's worth saving.
-
-Also, it takes time to get feelings and thoughts in order. My first response to all the reveals was horror and hatred towards Solas (and the fact that I'd been a fan of his character).
How do we know that about Cole? Is it just the approval gain or does he also say something?
I absolutely believe Solas is worth saving. I'm much less sure we'll be able to do it. God, I really don't want to spend a game fighting an old friend who's now Corypheus 2.0. But what else would we do? Friends don't let friends destroy the world. 
I don't want to have to kill him, or - maker forbid, he realises he's wrong only after destroying half the world and then kills himself to save it. I DON'T WANNA GO THROUGH THAT. And also, if my Lavellan is now a 3rd-party character and she somehow ends up martyring herself to stop her ex-boyfriend, I swear ... OK, this must be the 'hellspiral' somebody mentioned. I will stop now.
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-After Trespasser, it took a couple of hours to get my feelings in order. A lot of us here have had a couple of weeks to settle. There is a lot of nuance, and Solas has many layers.
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When you ask how can he be willing, well, it makes me think of the dialogue option where you can tell him "I never thought of you as someone who would do that, Solas" and his response i-s "Thank you."
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It-'s heartbreaking and says so much, and I think sums up some people's feelings on the matter, but if it's still fresh for you, you'll be able to sort through it with some time and blanket fort -kittens.
Thank you. I am sorting away. Some great fic links in this thread have helped a lot. I'm in the middle of 'The Dread Wolf's' Heart' by Feynite, which is blowing my mind. I don't know if the author is on these boards, but this is saving my life right now. So good.
I remember taking that dialogue option you mentioned. Solas' 'thank you' shredded my heart into a gazillion tiny pieces.
And that's just the thing. He's not a monster in the sense that I would recognise one, even in fiction. And that's what is doing my head in and probably Lavellan's too. Are we both such bad judges of character that we are finding this so hard to believe about Solas? I knew that Solas had a streak of fanaticism in him, but then so do characters like Cass and Leliana. At some point, their capacity for compassion and their connection to others overrides their ruthlessness, desperation and/or anger, which in my mind separates them from a too-damaged character like Loghain or an all-out crazy like Coryphenus. You see an abundance of that compassion and connection in Solas as well ... don't you? I'm pretty sure I didn't imagine it. And while he does hold himself apart from others sometimes, does he truly see himself as SO removed from or even above the living beings of modern Thedas that he finds it acceptable to destroy them all? It's one thing to be arrogant enough to believe that it's down to you to save the world and that your course alone is right - and Solas is not the most humble of characters - it's another thing altogether to feel so little for living beings that you are willing to kill so many to restore something that doesn't exist anymore. I am unable to reconcile these two versions of Solas. I need to understand!
OK, back to fic-reading. I'm really just here while my phone charges so I can read curled up in bed.
Toinen suomalainen
Mahtavaa!! I will still write in English because I feel like it would be rude to speak our own language here but it is fantastic to meet another person from Finland I've seen few here already! It is amazing to meet you haha so yeah just if you are kind to upload the sliders then do so when ever you have time or want to :3 I thank you already! Your male lavellan was so gorg<3
omg I finally created Male Lavellan and I was planning on romancing Dorian with him :3 I have wanted to do this for a long time hahaha
I just wanted to share him and ask what you guys think about his looks? Lol would Dorian like him? hmm OH And if you guys have male lavellans or male characters I would love to see them as well! IF you are willing to share :3Spoiler
Wow! Your male Lavellan is gorgeous! 
(I think Dorian would approve.)
As for sharing male characters, here's my Luc Trevelyan. 2H warrior, Templar spec, romanced Cassandra. 
(Sorry for the poor quality of the pics btw)
And here's my male Lavellan, Riel, twin brother of Tala, and a mage. I haven't gone far with him and I'm going to redo his entire look when I get the Game of the Year Edition of DAI for my PS4. 
I'm planning to have him romance sweet Josie.
Depends on the character. I'm almost 40, and I don't really care to play teenagers at all. I tend to think for a Lavellan to be given the responsibility of visiting the conclave, they have to have proven themselves fairly skilled already, and have enough life experience to deal with humans and to know what to look for. I mean, if you're sending spies into hostile territory, you don't send your greenest agents.
Luca Lavellan (canon Inquisitor) - Age 36, 2dagger rogue. Has 2 kids - son age 9, daughter age 13 - her bondmate is dead, so her sister and parents are minding. Though after Haven, Josie and Leliana encourage her to move her kids to a safe place where they can't be used against her, and her father goes with them to one of Josie's houses in Antiva. Good thing, since most of her clan gets killed in Wycome. Was not expecting to fall in love w/ Solas or anyone, but is going to save him and save the world, b/c she's just that good.
Dheassan "Des" Lavellan - Age 48, archer. Has a grown son with a woman in another clan but is not bonded, likes to wander, and is kind of an ******* with a short-temper. Allies w/ Templars, keeps Grey Wardens, makes friends with Gaspard, romances Josie, leaves Hawke in the Fade, won't drink from WoS. Probably going to kill Solas.
Laderalan "Lana" Lavellan - Age 25, mage. No kids, but was being strongly encouraged to settle down before she left for the conclave. She was her clan's First, so despite the fact that she's a restless sort of person, she expected to go back when this was over and shoulder her responsibilities. Then her clan got killed and so she becomes 100% a death dealing terror, and took Solas leaving pretty hard. Still going to save him.
Mahtavaa!! I will still write in English because I feel like it would be rude to speak our own language here
I had someone from Finland follow me on Twitter last night. All of the tweets are in Finnish. It was confusing.
It's great to see how many people from all different places are here though.
Wow! Your male Lavellan is gorgeous!
As for sharing male characters, here's my Luc Trevelyan. 2H warrior, Templar spec, romanced Cassandra.
(Sorry for the poor quality of the pics btw)
Spoiler
And here's my male Lavellan, Riel, twin brother of Tala, and a mage. I haven't gone far with him and I'm going to redo his entire look when I get the Game of the Year Edition of DAI for my PS4.
Spoiler
OMG your trevelyan... can I marry him? XD and your lavellan is also so beautiful *_* I want to take everyone's male characters and put them in my pockets<3 and thank you for your comment x3 
Dorian is gon be one lucky guy!
Male Lavellans? Oh boy, do I! I have two. There's my canon Inquisitor: Bruce 'Staches' Lavellan. Often depicted with fake moustaches.
Spoiler
And then there is Brayan Lavellan.
Spoiler
HOW did you make that hair work so amazingly on them! I love that hair!
I found this last night while discussing creepy dolls with someone on Twitter and I suggested he look up Blythe dolls.
I found someone's custom Blythe and it reminded me a bit of my Lavellan. Her hair is clearly not THIS red, but whatever.
HOW did you make that hair work so amazingly on them! I love that hair!
Thanks. I have no idea. It was just the only hair option that seemed to work for both of them.
ToP: Solas is trying to eat his armor...
It's Solas' self-flagellation that makes him come across so negatively on occasion in my eyes. He's full of himself, but sometimes he can be so hard on himself too.
That's the thing that confuses me about Cole. The Nightmare is what Compassion can become as the Divine said, but Cole's fear is Despair. Is it because he was once represented Mercy more than Compassion with all those mercy killings?
Well, let's face it - what seems to motivate him more to do what he thinks needs to be done is his overwhelming sense of guilt, rather than pride itself.
As for Cole - I don't really think it's that confusing, if what I think they're doing is correct.
Like in our world, the concepts and emotions (like Compassion, Love, Desire, Pride, etc) AREN'T just one, fixed thing that can be easily categorized - even if we try, just for the sake of quick identification. They can mean many things or can be pulled in different directions. Same with spirits IMO - the emotions or concepts they embody lie on a complex spectrum scale. It's not just Compassion - Despair or Wisdom - Pride. There are other directions they can be pulled, especially if they gain enough nuance, or intersect or resonate with other concepts.
I think instead of visualizing the whole thing as separate, linear graphs, we should think about it sort of like emotion wheel.
... or perhaps even something more complicated than that, with some things being closer to others, but never really separate. It's all inter-connected
IMO, the spirits (like, regular, simple spirits) sort of embody the purest idea or a concept - in that sense they're pure and light, but also fragile. They don't have enough complexity/personality to grasp things beyond their narrow concept of the idea they like to stick to, which is why they can also be easily twisted.
The more they develop personality and understanding, the stronger they become, and while it helps to understand things more, it also 'muddles' the original concept - it expands and resonates with other things. The more they understand the world, the more things become complex, but also muddled, until the initial concept they've stuck to becomes more of a driving force or strongest personality trait, rather than a thing that defines everything they do. At one point or another a simple spirit likely becomes so complex, that they likely cross the vague boundary between a regular spirit and a person.
It's likely important that a person shouldn't forget what lies at their core, so they could retain what makes them THEM, and not become twisted, but they have other things that define them as well.
omg I finally created Male Lavellan and I was planning on romancing Dorian with him :3 I have wanted to do this for a long time hahaha
I just wanted to share him and ask what you guys think about his looks? Lol would Dorian like him? hmm OH And if you guys have male lavellans or male characters I would love to see them as well! IF you are willing to share :3
*snip*
Dorian Greatly Approves.
Your male Lavellan is gorgeous!
Alas, I have no male Lavellans (yet), but I created a Maxwell Trevelyan yesterday! He marks my first DAI male War Boy Inquisitor. I originally wanted to make him an elf, but I figured that I would switch things up on this new play through.
And just so this post doesn't go too off topic, here's an early screenshot of Solas and my Lavellan -- waaay back when she had hair, and she didn't realize how much heartache he would cause her. Whoops.
I had someone from Finland follow me on Twitter last night. All of the tweets are in Finnish. It was confusing.
It's great to see how many people from all different places are here though.
Oh wow! That is so cool! I also like the fact that there are people around the world here I've always loved English as a language and United States + United Kindom. Of course I love all the countries yes! I don't have favourites haha but as a language I have always loved English so much so whenever I can just write it or speak it to someone I am so happy. I personally have so many American + Finnish + other foreigners as friends on fb so I always post things with both languages haha I feel like English and Finnish both are my languages but obiviously I make mistakes and I have an accent
*yawn* I fell asleep right after my last post. << >> Looks like the discussion has moved on. In order not to interrupt the flow of conversation...
I personally have an easier time making characters younger than me than older. I was young once, so I can remember what it's like. I'm not at that stage of life for 30-something and 40-something characters, so it's harder to imagine. For Thedas in particular, since most elves live hand-by-mouth, and "you grow up quick when you grow up poor," I imagine them being emotionally or culturally more mature from their harder lifestyle and increased responsibilities than teenagers in our own comparatively more sheltered lifestyles.
Depends on the character. I'm almost 40, and I don't really care to play teenagers at all. I tend to think for a Lavellan to be given the responsibility of visiting the conclave, they have to have proven themselves fairly skilled already, and have enough life experience to deal with humans and to know what to look for. I mean, if you're sending spies into hostile territory, you don't send your greenest agents.
That's honestly why I headcanon that my girl's a city elf who joined the Dalish as a child. Part of it's to explain the non-Dalish accent, but also as to why they sent their second-in-command alone into hostile territory and risk losing one of the precious few mages the Dalish have. Since she was originally from the city, her mother was a city elf who raised her on city elf values, and she can still slip into the city elf accent, she was often deemed most suited to deal with humans since she would understand them best.
Are we talking about our past PCs? Here is my main PT anyway. *Posts mine despite being late* 
:
Here have a picture, drawn by Paperwick:
How do we know that about Cole? Is it just the approval gain or does he also say something?
I absolutely believe Solas is worth saving. I'm much less sure we'll be able to do it. God, I really don't want to spend a game fighting an old friend who's now Corypheus 2.0. But what else would we do? Friends don't let friends destroy the world.
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Thank you.
I remember taking that dialogue option you mentioned. Solas' 'thank you' shredded my heart into a gazillion tiny pieces.
And that's just the thing. He's not a monster in the sense that I would recognise one, even in fiction. And that's what is doing my head in and probably Lavellan's too. Are we both such bad judges of character that we are finding this so hard to believe about Solas? I knew that Solas had a streak of fanaticism in him, but then so do characters like Cass and Leliana. At some point, their capacity for compassion and their connection to others overrides their ruthlessness, desperation and/or anger, which in my mind separates them from a too-damaged character like Loghain or an all-out crazy like Coryphenus. You see an abundance of that compassion and connection in Solas as well ... don't you? I'm pretty sure I didn't imagine it. And while he does hold himself apart from others sometimes, does he truly see himself as SO removed from or even above the living beings of modern Thedas that he finds it acceptable to destroy them all? It's one thing to be arrogant enough to believe that it's down to you to save the world and that your course alone is right - and Solas is not the most humble of characters - it's another thing altogether to feel so little for living beings that you are willing to kill so many to restore something that doesn't exist anymore. I am unable to reconcile these two versions of Solas. I need to understand!
OK, back to fic-reading. I'm really just here while my phone charges so I can read curled up in bed.
Several of Spirit!Cole's lines when adventuring and at Halamshiral reference Solas and how worried he is about him. There's one Halamshiral line where he says he's going back to the Fade when everything is over because there's a friend there who is hurting and needs to be reminded of who he is.
OMG your trevelyan... can I marry him? XD and your lavellan is also so beautiful *_* I want to take everyone's male characters and put them in my pockets<3 and thank you for your comment x3
Thanks! I might have a slight crush on my Trevelyan as well. It took me a while to realize that he has this Enrique Iglesias look going on. xD
As for my male Lavellan, I feel like his overall look could use a bit of tweaking but I'm glad you find him beautiful,
Helena Amell would be 30, Ginny Hawke would be 38, Sophia Lavellan would be 33. I find it funny that they all started the same age as me or much younger, but now they're older. Amell and Lavellan are still in the same stage of life, but Hawke must be much wiser by now. Some day I'll spend some time to think how her jokester personality could evolve realistically.
My Hawke is probably not surprisingly, kind of a nurturer and with the whole family theme running through everything, though stll, I imagine her decisions and the life she chose have had their weight, especially being on the run and helping keep Anders together while still loving each other. Even though it has only been several years, I imagine 38 to her would feel older.
omg! I need to try to find him!
Thank you
Thanks!
As for my male Lavellan, I feel like his overall look could use a bit of tweaking but I'm glad you find him beautiful,
Totally! Omg I also thought the same thing about your Trevelyan looking kinda like Enrique! hahah omg I love him so much! Do you have sliders also so later on ( I will make some chars to romance other chars haha ) I could use him :333 so I can have some eye candy going on ya know? XD if not it is totally fine!
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