153434 réponses à ce sujet

[Mlady]

True, but we're talking about a choice that will likely define a lot in the future game as well as what happens after it. Therefore I don't think they'd give us an option just to pretend that there is one - even if eventually booth roads will be similar (but likely play out differently at the very end of the main story arc), all this effort to befriend and understand Solas... I don't see how they'd write it so it will basically amount to nothing (other than flavor/PC approach).

 

... I mean it CAN happen, but can't say I'd be too excited about such solution, for variety of reasons.

 

They also added in the game "if we can" and in the Keep "if possible" so we don't get a positive yes that we will succeed, but that might be due to fear of spoiling the upcoming story as well as adding hype.

[Janic99]

I will go to the fade soon so I will say good night people

[Elessara]

Solas is psychic.  He was standing in a doorway I wanted to go through and he wouldn't move.  I thought, omg Solas move or I swear I'm choosing to kill you at the end of Trespasser!   And he moved!

 

Ok, I suppose I could have just controlled him and moved him.  But that would be rational.

[Mlady]

Solas is psychic.  He was standing in a doorway I wanted to go through and he wouldn't move.  I thought, omg Solas move or I swear I'm choosing to kill you at the end of Trespasser!   And he moved!

 

Ok, I suppose I could have just controlled him and moved him.  But that would be rational.

 

Solas in my current game is creeping out my Trevelyan. They keep using the same magic attacks and target the same enemy as if it's a competition to see who will freeze them first.

[CapricornSun]

Art break.

 

Lovely Solavellan art WIP.

Spoiler

Source: http://chenria.tumbl...the-picture-for

 

 

'The Moon' Solavellan tarot card. (NSFW for boobies.)

 

Roadstory AU. Solas and Lavellan wrapped in a blanket. (Slightly NSFW for a bit of nudity.)

Spoiler

Source: http://ladytheirinsb...our-roadstoryau

 

 

Solas done for Inktober.

Spoiler

Source: http://full-of-freck...eenshot-used-as

 

[Cee]

Really enjoying the Inktober stuff. Lots of variety in sketch styles.

[midnight tea]

He did seem more upset over what had happened to the elves than anything.  Like they started aging and "lost themselves" and such.

 

Well.. they did lose themselves - if what many suspect is right (and I think there's enough evidence in the game that we're mostly right) and elves, as well as most people, are either spirits or closer to spirits than many Thedosians think they are, then they've indeed utterly lost what they were before.

 

They've basically become alien and fearful of themselves - of their past, of the Fade, of their connection to it. They even stopped recognizing spirits as sentient being (much less people) - which is utterly ironic, if you think about it, not just because of Solas's initial approach to Thedosians... It's like they've became the utter opposites of themselves.

 

And most countries and races - aside from Tevinter, ironically, again - approach magic with suspicion, when to elves at one point it was part of them and something as natural as breathing. 

 

So I can't really blame him for being horrified... and if it turns out that the Veil will keep deforming the world and strengthening, either by itself or with help (we do know that the Qunari researched Crossroads and elvhen locations in attempt to destroy magic and strengthen the Veil), it likely means that eventually it will destroy both waking and dreaming world - since we do know from Cole's comments that spirits and Fade is dependent on minds of the living. Without them, they've got nothing and we see what happens to people sundered from the Fade, which basically turns them into meat golems with hardly any individuality or sense of self-preservation...

[midnight tea]

They also added in the game "if we can" and in the Keep "if possible" so we don't get a positive yes that we will succeed, but that might be due to fear of spoiling the upcoming story as well as adding hype.

 

Well, hey - they can't really be very specific about that option now, otherwise they'd turn it into a spoiler It would ruin the tension if we now knew with 100% certainty that he CAN be saved.

 

At the same time I have no problem with us failing IF we overlook something crucial. There were already many choices in the game that decided someone's fate or course of events based on us making right choices or digging enough for answers - some companion quests, war table missions... heck, the peaceful resolution of Halamshiral leadership crisis depends largely on court approval, and to raise that Inquisitors have to be smart and thorough.

 

By all means, I'm actually looking forward to the redemption path being significantly more difficult - I just hope that the reward will be worth all the effort

[Mlady]

Well, hey - they can't really be very specific about that option now, otherwise they'd turn it into a spoiler It would ruin the tension if we now knew with 100% certainty that he CAN be saved.

 

At the same time I have no problem with us failing IF we overlook something crucial. There were already many choices in the game that decided someone's fate or course of events based on us making right choices or digging enough for answers - some companion quests, war table missions... heck, the peaceful resolution of Halamshiral leadership crisis depends largely on court approval, and to raise that Inquisitors have to be smart and thorough.

 

By all means, I'm actually looking forward to the redemption path being significantly more difficult - I just hope that the reward will be worth all the effort

 

As long as he can be saved at least through 1 option, I'm fine with messing it up. 

[Elessara]

Well.. they did lose themselves - if what many suspect is right (and I think there's enough evidence in the game that we're mostly right) and elves, as well as most people, are either spirits or closer to spirits than many Thedosians think they are, then they've indeed utterly lost what they were before.

 

They've basically become alien and fearful of themselves - of their past, of the Fade, of their connection to it. They even stopped recognizing spirits as sentient being (much less people) - which is utterly ironic, if you think about it, not just because of Solas's initial approach to Thedosians... It's like they've became the utter opposites of themselves.

 

And most countries and races - aside from Tevinter, ironically, again - approach magic with suspicion, when to elves at one point it was part of them and something as natural as breathing. 

 

So I can't really blame him for being horrified... and if it turns out that the Veil will keep deforming the world and strengthening, either by itself or with help (we do know that the Qunari researched Crossroads and elvhen locations in attempt to destroy magic and strengthen the Veil), it likely means that eventually it will destroy both waking and dreaming world - since we do know from Cole's comments that spirits and Fade is dependent on minds of the living. Without them, they've got nothing and we see what happens to people sundered from the Fade, which basically turns them into meat golems with hardly any individuality or sense of self-preservation...

 

I wasn't disagreeing that they had lost themselves, I used the quotes only because that's what Solas himself had said.  Probably shouldn't have used the quotes.  I agree with you though and my main point was that he seemed more horrified over that than over the loss of the elven empire.

[midnight tea]

As long as he can be saved at least through 1 option, I'm fine with messing it up. 

 

Yep... though I hope it won't be fake "saving", as if - he'd be so miserable, that it'd be better to let him die, or something of the sort  ...

[midnight tea]

I wasn't disagreeing that they had lost themselves, I used the quotes only because that's what Solas himself had said.  Probably shouldn't have used the quotes.  I agree with you though and my main point was that he seemed more horrified over that than over the loss of the elven empire.

 

Oh, I wasn't disagreeing - I was merely expanding my point Sorry if it came out wrong^^;

[Mlady]

Yep... though I hope it won't be fake "saving", as if - he'd be so miserable, that it'd be better to let him die, or something of the sort  ...

 

I could just see it. We have to say and do stuff in a certain order (like softening Leliana) and one wrong choice gives a bad ending.

[figment_]

I unfortunately don't have the time to go back over everything you wrote (being at work and all ), but I wanted to say something : a person's motivations will normally never be completely logical or rational. The same will happen for fictional character (unless you're talking of a robot perhaps), so I don't think it's wrong for people to say his motivation are racist, or driven by grief (which are both emotionnal and/or irrational reason). I don't believe he is racist at his core, but from all information we've been given he certain appear grief-stricken at the consequences of his mistakes.

 

Although it's not impossible to come up with a character that is, always, completely rational, most people just aren't like that. Not even millenia-old mages So, trying to find a completely logical reason for him to come up with his plan is, I think, the wrong way to look at it.

 

As for if it is a bad plan. Heck yes, it is. but I think he's too caught up in it to see it, at least for the moment.

 

 

The thing with Solas is part of him knows his plan is not a good plan and that he is wrong but it's such a wrought, complicated decision that, for reasons, he feels resigned to. Different if he doesnt like you, but if he's a friend or romanced, there's room in what he says and his body language that he's not 100% committed and would welcome the chance to be proven wrong again and/or stopped.

 

I think it was a friend Inquisitor who chooses to try and redeem him that he says that he welcomes the chance for you to prove him wrong again. IIRC - correct me if wrong, someone.

 

 

 

I don't consider him to be a villain either, mostly because slapping him with an "evil" label is too easy. Even at the end of Trespasser the information he gave to the Inquisitor was practically nothing. 

 

"I'm Fen'harel, our god-kings were bastards, I created the veil, and now I'm removing it. Oh, and that won't go well for anyone currently living on the world. Sorry."

 

Solas, you vague SOB, get back here. 

 

So yeah, there's definitely more to his plan.

 

I feel that we know so very little of his "plan", that making a valid negative judgement call is impossible, irrational, and illogical. We're seeing only the tip of the iceberg, so making a hasty generalization like this is, at best, presumptive, necessitating that we're making a lot of (perhaps unfounded) assumptions to validate this POV.

 

We know that he wishes to remove the veil and "bring back the Magic" to the world...Is that so bad? In my opinion, it's not. He wants to fix a broken world (which he feels he broke), that "he destroyed" , supposedly, by the heroic act of putting up the Veil to prevent the world from being destroyed by the Evanuris. Note that he doesn't take credit for "saving the world", which he did, but instead he can only see the negative, unintended collateral damage that his act of "saving the world" incurred.

 

He is so broken, so remorseful for these indirect consequences of his actions, that his name "Pride" becomes ironic. He has no pride left, after all this time, for anything he has done, even freeing the slaves and leading a noble rebellion that likely lasted hundreds, if not thousands of years. My opinion is that he seeks only to make amends, to compensate the world for what was lost, by removing the Veil, restoring the natural order of things, and restoring the world to what "life or living was like before the Veil". As shown by his other dialogue, he has no misconceptions about or, IMO, no intention to literally restore the Ancient Elves and/or Arlathan, and he realizes (in an overly-pessimistic manner) that there will be collateral damage.

 

It is my fondest hope, that in DA4 we'll be given the opportunity to soften the blow, and minimize the potential damage through education and reform, paving the way for change...Change is not necessarily a bad thing.

[Sable Rhapsody]

And I've never really been a fan of the devs giving us a chance to try something but never giving us the option to succeed.  It's like, oh I can try but if I'll always fail then why even bother?  Yes, I love being sent on elaborate quests just to always fail in the end or I love going through a bunch of cutscenes just to be told lolnope.  Ugh, bothers me!

 

I think it can be well done, but most of the time it isn't.  So a lot of us are very gun-shy about situations like that in our games.

 

For example, I think Anders' Act 3 plot is a badly-done example of setting up the PC to fail.  We can't stop him, but neither can we take any of the very obvious and reasonable precautions to stop him.  Tipping off the templars does nothing.  Tipping off Elthina does nothing.  We can't kick him out of our parties, detain him ourselves, whip out the murder knife, anything.  And that, IMO, is what makes so deeply frustrating.

 

On the other hand, I think In Your Heart Shall Burn was a very well-done example.  We can defend Haven tooth-and-nail, but it's never enough.  Corypheus has too many forces compared to the fledgling Inquisition, which has committed almost all of its precious resources to sealing the Breach.  There was no way we could win, but at least to me, it didn't feel contrived.  It felt like it made sense.  And I was given a wide range of options for how I reacted to the inevitability of losing the Inquisition's base, so I was fine with it.

[susanwb]

I feel that we know so very little of his "plan", that making a valid negative judgement call is impossible, irrational, and illogical. We're seeing only the tip of the iceberg, so making a hasty generalization like this is, at best, presumptive, necessitating that we're making a lot of (perhaps unfounded) assumptions to validate this POV.

 

The problem is, even he says it's a bad plan.

 

To my friendly Trev Inqi, who challenges him with "Whatever you want, this world dying is not the answer!" he replies with "Not a good one, no.  Sometimes terrible choices are all that remain."

 

Solas thinks that none of his options are good.  He knows this plan will bring a lot of pain and destruction, but he ultimately believes that it's the best option, and the others are even worse.

 

What fate does he foresee that makes him believe that "this world dying" is not the worst option?  That's what I worry about.  There's something nasty hiding under the bed, and Solas knows it.

[Mlady]

The problem is, even he says it's a bad plan.

 

To my friendly Trev Inqi, who challenges him with "Whatever you want, this world dying is not the answer!" he replies with "Not a good one, no.  Sometimes terrible choices are all that remain."

 

Solas thinks that none of his options are good.  He knows this plan will bring a lot of pain and destruction, but he ultimately believes that it's the best option, and the others are even worse.

 

What fate does he foresee that makes him believe that "this world dying" is not the worst option?  That's what I worry about.  There's something nasty hiding under the bed, and Solas knows it.

 

Interesting word choice. That's exactly what he said about creating the Veil.

[Sable Rhapsody]

What fate does he foresee that makes him believe that "this world dying" is not the worst option?  That's what I worry about.  There's something nasty hiding under the bed, and Solas knows it.

 

This world may be dying anyway, according to his definition.  Morrigan mentions it in the Temple of Mythal; magic becoming less and less common, old knowledge being lost, everything becoming mundane.  So why not flip the switch early?

 

The problem with Solas's plan is that Thedas is not a math problem.   Adding the Veil, then subtracting it, is not the same as never adding the Veil in the first place. 

[susanwb]

Interesting word choice. That's exactly what he said about creating the Veil.

 

I know.  And at that time, he was trying to stop the Evanuris from destroying the world (probably by releasing the Blight or the whatever causes the Blight).  What's he trying to stop now?  My money's on it still having to do with the Blight, because this is a Dragon Age game, and Blight is their main story.  It always comes back to the Blight, to the very thing DA:O opened with.  What I can't figure out is how dropping the Veil or bringing all the magic back is going to help against the Blight, if creating the Veil was supposed to help contain it in the first place.  Ack.  Makes my head hurt.

[Elessara]

This world may be dying anyway, according to his definition.  Morrigan mentions it in the Temple of Mythal; magic becoming less and less common, old knowledge being lost, everything becoming mundane.  So why not flip the switch early?

 

The problem with Solas's plan is that Thedas is not a math problem.   Adding the Veil, then subtracting it, is not the same as never adding the Veil in the first place. 

 

Sure it is.  He's just forgetting to carry the one.

[Mlady]

I know.  And at that time, he was trying to stop the Evanuris from destroying the world (probably by releasing the Blight or the whatever causes the Blight).  What's he trying to stop now?  My money's on it still having to do with the Blight, because this is a Dragon Age game, and Blight is their main story.  It always comes back to the Blight, to the very thing DA:O opened with.  What I can't figure out is how dropping the Veil or bringing all the magic back is going to help against the Blight, if creating the Veil was supposed to help contain it in the first place.  Ack.  Makes my head hurt.

 

Chances are the Black City is where whatever the black thing is, is sealed. It looks like a sun surrounded by black and trapped inside the City far below. Someone inverted a pic of it and it really does look like a city behind the eyeball thing. I found it interesting that those eye things are like bird feathers with eyes and both Morrigan and Flemeth wear them.

[Elessara]

*blinks*

 

I just bought something from the Black Emporium and Xenon said:

 

"More Inquisition gold to sensually press against my dessicated flesh. .....  Joking. Hehehehe."

 

I love that character.

[Shari'El]

Fans just dug up some audio of Lavellan translating stuff in the Temple of Mythal.  Be nice if that was patched back in (*glances over at the PS4's suspiously large new patch*)

 

Wat

Maybe you've already answered that, but where?

[Mlady]

*blinks*

 

I just bought something from the Black Emporium and Xenon said:

 

"More Inquisition gold to sensually press against my dessicated flesh. .....  Joking. Hehehehe."

 

I love that character.

 

I love him too lol except that part where he asks for my hand! LOL Male Hawke is great, but his VA just nails Xenon's voice.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Sure it is.  He's just forgetting to carry the one.

 

So remedial math is the key to redeeming Solas.

 

DA4 protagonist: Math Wizard.  Sold.