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[drosophila]

I am sure you're enjoying the graphics of the PS4 very much this playthrough.

 

Especially those wind effects

[dreadwoof]

Hi thread. There's this one thing that's been on my mind for a while and I was wondering if anyone else has any thoughts on this.

 

At the end of Trespasser, it states that, "​After the events at the Winter Palace, elves left the Inquisition under mysterious circumstances, as did elven slaves across Thedas. None could say where they went, but those who believed the Inquisitor's story about Fen'Harel wondered just how large the Dread Wolf's forces were and what the ancient elven rebel had planned."

 

​​​So, my main question here is why would so many elves decide to go ahead and join the Dread Wolf, especially after hearing the Inquisitor's story? I mean yes, one could argue that some of them are agents of Fen'harel and thus ancient elves finally blowing their cover, but I think the end slide implies that this might a movement on a far larger scale, something which even the elves of present have decided to partake in. Which next brings me to wonder if the elves are really that curious and that desperate for change that they'd willingly aid the Dread Wolf in tearing down the Veil and violently remaking the world as they know it. Or​, it just might be that the Inquisitor hasn't told anyone except the inner circle what Solas has planned in favour of not creating unnecessary panic (though I kind of doubt the writers would create something so crucial without mentioning it). And then, of course, there's the chance of Solas accidentally forgetting to mention that the new recruits might or might not die a burning death.

 

​So yeah guys, any theories as to why the heck elves are packing up to join Solas? Is it for discount wolf pelts?

[Addictress]

Hi thread. There's this one thing that's been on my mind for a while and I was wondering if anyone else has any thoughts on this.

 

At the end of Trespasser, it states that, "​After the events at the Winter Palace, elves left the Inquisition under mysterious circumstances, as did elven slaves across Thedas. None could say where they went, but those who believed the Inquisitor's story about Fen'Harel wondered just how large the Dread Wolf's forces were and what the ancient elven rebel had planned."

 

​​​So, my main question here is why would so many elves decide to go ahead and join the Dread Wolf, especially after hearing the Inquisitor's story? I mean yes, one could argue that some of them are agents of Fen'harel and thus ancient elves finally blowing their cover, but I think the end slide implies that this might a movement on a far larger scale, something which even the elves of present have decided to partake in. Which next brings me to wonder if the elves are really that curious and that desperate for change that they'd willingly aid the Dread Wolf in tearing down the Veil and violently remaking the world as they know it. Or​, it just might be that the Inquisitor hasn't told anyone except the inner circle what Solas has planned in favour of not creating unnecessary panic (though I kind of doubt the writers would create something so crucial without mentioning it). And then, of course, there's the chance of Solas accidentally forgetting to mention that the new recruits might or might not die a burning death.

 

​So yeah guys, any theories as to why the heck elves are packing up to join Solas? Is it for discount wolf pelts?

 

I like how the elves are joining the Dread Wold in spite of the destruction he will cause because it sticks to that point in the DA universe where elves are no more noble than humans. They really are desperate. You cage a human and abuse them enough and they will grow to hate you and lose respect for you, and will plot against you. Ruling races who continue to mistreat elves will eventually get what's coming to them. A disparate race of elves are now able to unify - just think, Solas is not just recruiting. He is rallying. Like he did in the days of Arlathan, he became an inspiring leader, freeing slaves. He will now touch on that sentiment again to unify the modern elves. ..Maybe he's downplaying the fact that they will die, though. Because when he says the Inquisitor's world will be destroyed, doesn't that also mean the modern elves will die too?

 

We are still not sure how the world will be destroyed. It could be as some said that there will be general havoc like in the alternate-future with red lyrium but theoretically you could be protected from the 'raw chaos' if Solas makes a special refuge or barrier for a select chosen people during the transition.

[Addictress]

Omg look at these hot screenshots by deepfungladiator 

 

Spoiler

What is that armor ???

[Qun00]

I am sure you're enjoying the graphics of the PS4 very much this playthrough.

That's the reason why I haven't done a Solavellan PT yet.

That is to be my canon run and I'd rather do it on the new gen which I haven't upgraded to.

[dawnstone]

Hi thread. There's this one thing that's been on my mind for a while and I was wondering if anyone else has any thoughts on this.

 

At the end of Trespasser, it states that, "​After the events at the Winter Palace, elves left the Inquisition under mysterious circumstances, as did elven slaves across Thedas. None could say where they went, but those who believed the Inquisitor's story about Fen'Harel wondered just how large the Dread Wolf's forces were and what the ancient elven rebel had planned."

 

​​​So, my main question here is why would so many elves decide to go ahead and join the Dread Wolf, especially after hearing the Inquisitor's story? I mean yes, one could argue that some of them are agents of Fen'harel and thus ancient elves finally blowing their cover, but I think the end slide implies that this might a movement on a far larger scale, something which even the elves of present have decided to partake in. Which next brings me to wonder if the elves are really that curious and that desperate for change that they'd willingly aid the Dread Wolf in tearing down the Veil and violently remaking the world as they know it. Or​, it just might be that the Inquisitor hasn't told anyone except the inner circle what Solas has planned in favour of not creating unnecessary panic (though I kind of doubt the writers would create something so crucial without mentioning it). And then, of course, there's the chance of Solas accidentally forgetting to mention that the new recruits might or might not die a burning death.

 

​So yeah guys, any theories as to why the heck elves are packing up to join Solas? Is it for discount wolf pelts?

After eight-hundred years of having your people violently oppressed, watching your friends and family suffer and die under human rule, being treated like animals - and then someone comes to you, and says 'Guess what, you are stronger than you think, you can do more, be more. The time is ripe, if we do this together, we can change the world for our people.'. And then you're taken through an eluvian where an army of elves is camping on the other side... This is just what I'm imagining, but my guess is that it wouldn't take most elves much convincing. Solas can pretty easily demonstrate that there exists a way to get the boot off of their necks.

[midnight tea]

Hi thread. There's this one thing that's been on my mind for a while and I was wondering if anyone else has any thoughts on this.

 

At the end of Trespasser, it states that, "​After the events at the Winter Palace, elves left the Inquisition under mysterious circumstances, as did elven slaves across Thedas. None could say where they went, but those who believed the Inquisitor's story about Fen'Harel wondered just how large the Dread Wolf's forces were and what the ancient elven rebel had planned."

 

​​​So, my main question here is why would so many elves decide to go ahead and join the Dread Wolf, especially after hearing the Inquisitor's story? I mean yes, one could argue that some of them are agents of Fen'harel and thus ancient elves finally blowing their cover, but I think the end slide implies that this might a movement on a far larger scale, something which even the elves of present have decided to partake in. Which next brings me to wonder if the elves are really that curious and that desperate for change that they'd willingly aid the Dread Wolf in tearing down the Veil and violently remaking the world as they know it. Or​, it just might be that the Inquisitor hasn't told anyone except the inner circle what Solas has planned in favour of not creating unnecessary panic (though I kind of doubt the writers would create something so crucial without mentioning it). And then, of course, there's the chance of Solas accidentally forgetting to mention that the new recruits might or might not die a burning death.

 

​So yeah guys, any theories as to why the heck elves are packing up to join Solas? Is it for discount wolf pelts?

 

Well.. here's the thing - we don't really know if the elves are leaving under the instructions of Fen'Harel, nor if they are supposed to join their cause. 

 

We do know that the elf servant in Val Royeaux tells his master that he wakes up screaming in the night because there's a woman in his dreams who calls herself Mythal. We can hear this dialogue as early as completing ToM and as late as finishing the main campaign. So, unless the dialogue firing after ToM is a bug, Mythal from elf's dreams is unlikely to be Solas disguising himself as Mythal.

 

... What if those are actually Evanuris? What if the undermining of Veil's strenght made them able to communicate with elves?

 

What if the one urging the elves to run and hide was actually the Inquisitor? Not because of some ulterior motives, but because they figured that after the elven spies almost helped the Qunari conquer the South there could be a backlash against them, nevermind help Solas with his crazy Veil-tearing plan?

 

Also - personally I don't think Inquisitor told much, or attempted to clarify things to the public. Why? Because the Chosen of Andraste telling the whole, predominantly Andrastian, South "hey folks! Guess what? Everything you knew about the world is wrong! The Maker didn't create the Veil - Fen'Harel did! Oh, and the Fade and the world were once one!" would likely instigate a bloody religious war (also - why would Inky be all secretive about them chasing after Solas?). I assume nobody really wants that, especially that now is the time to rest and rebuild, rather than exhaust oneself in another conflict.

 

Of course, it could always be Solas - we don't know what he told those elves, or if they still don't prefer remaking the world after so many years of oppression...

 

Then there's this song (from Trespasser):

Spoiler

Mercy for the elves who guard their lives with faith

Our hands do weight them down, but their kind hearts will forgive the weight

Arlathan fell so deep onto the ocean floor

Currents of hate will so challenge their fate

 

Mercy for the elves who marched with us through fire

Stood with Andraste as she rose against the empire

Can we pay the cost for the allies we have lost in fear?

Our hands of pain will so threaten their name

 

If we climb through our doubt we can sympathize

When the slightest unite, then a giant will rise

Slightest unite then a giant will rise

 

Mercy for the elves who wander through the night

Dalish farther roams, will the Dalish son survive the fight?

How can we deny what their number can supply the Realm?

Slightest unite then a giant will rise

When the slightest unite then a giant will rise

 

When the slightest *unite*, then a giant will rise... Sounds to me like a pretty massive hint.

 

Still, I am not entirely sure it's Solas: at no point in Inquisition he seemed to favor elves, nor seemingly made contacts that would guarantee that every elf would follow him, especially considering that most of city elves are Andrastians, and most Dalish are scattered, differ between one another and Solas generally doesn't seem to have a good opinion about them, more that likely stemming from past encounters when perhaps he tried to unite them.

[Ghost Gal]

After eight-hundred years of having your people violently oppressed, watching your friends and family suffer and die under human rule, being treated like animals - and then someone comes to you, and says 'Guess what, you are stronger than you think, you can do more, be more. The time is ripe, if we do this together, we can change the world for our people.'. And then you're taken through an eluvian where an army of elves is camping on the other side... This is just what I'm imagining, but my guess is that it wouldn't take most elves much convincing. Solas can pretty easily demonstrate that there exists a way to get the boot off of their necks.

 

I've been waiting for someone to bring this up so I can share this poster I found long ago! 

 

Who can turn down that sale's pitch?  

 

 

..Maybe he's downplaying the fact that they will die, though. Because when he says the Inquisitor's world will be destroyed, doesn't that also mean the modern elves will die too?

 

To be fair, Solas never said that everyone in the world will definitely die or that his followers would surely perish too. All he really said was he planned to tear down the Veil, which would/could cause the world to "burn in the raw chaos," which he would soon end by using the Fade to reshape reality. It's possible that his followers would be out of the blast zone, though, as they have access to the Eluvians and Crossroads.

 

He also only really says, "The return of my people means the end of yours," but he doesn't elaborate on what that means. Most people choose to interpret it as "GENOCIDE!", but I always thought he meant, "The return of my people as a world power (if non-elven)/predominant elven culture (for Dalish) means the end of yours as a world power/predominantly elven culture." I think humans, dwarves, and possibly Qunari (though that one's iffy) will still be around, it's just their societies and cultures (and thus their "people") won't be the same because the world won't be the same.

 

Most of the BSN scoffs at me for thinking so, but I interpret Solas' vague description of the Veil going down to mean the elves' old immortality and magic would return, as shown in this goofy little comic. I speculate that Solas telling an Elven Inquisitor "the return of my people means the end of yours" is due to your people becoming his people. Elves restored to what they were before the Veil, Solas using the reality-altering powers of the Fade to restore the world to what it was before the Veil.

 

If that is the case, to people who've lost everything--their magic, immortality, language, culture, nationality, freedom, place in the world; who've been conquered, enslaved, degraded, oppressed, shortly freed, then re-conquered and re-subjugated and kept as slaves, second-class citizens, and/or home wanderers for centuries, I think the Dread Wolf's offer would sound like a preferable alternative to many.

[FernRain]

Dreamt about Solas, tried going back to sleep to dream more and ended up oversleeping..

[naddaya]

To be fair, Solas never said that everyone in the world will definitely die or that his followers would surely perish too. All he really said was he planned to tear down the Veil, which would/could cause the world to "burn in the raw chaos," which he would soon end by using the Fade to reshape reality. It's possible that his followers would be out of the blast zone, though, as they have access to the Eluvians and Crossroads.

 

He also only really says, "The return of my people means the end of yours," but he doesn't elaborate on what that means. Most people choose to interpret it as "GENOCIDE!", but I always thought he meant, "The return of my people as a world power (if non-elven)/predominant elven culture (for Dalish) means the end of yours as a world power/predominantly elven culture." I think humans, dwarves, and possibly Qunari (though that one's iffy) will still be around, it's just their societies and cultures (and thus their "people") won't be the same because the world won't be the same.

 

Most of the BSN scoffs at me for thinking so, but I interpret Solas' vague description of the Veil going down to mean the elves' old immortality and magic would return, as shown in this goofy little comic. I speculate that Solas telling an Elven Inquisitor "the return of my people means the end of yours" is due to your people becoming his people. Elves restored to what they were before the Veil, Solas using the reality-altering powers of the Fade to restore the world to what it was before the Veil.

 

I took it that way too. He doesn't exactly know what will happen once he brings down the veil, he simply assumes it will be pretty destructive. That's what happened last time. Confused spirits roaming around, possessions, mages becoming more powerful all of a sudden, government instability, and a big initial blast probably.

The elves would become more powerful and probably subjugate the other races and he wouldn't be there to stop them even if he wanted to (from his dialogue it's pretty clear he doesn't expect to survive the destruction of the veil). He refers to his creation of the veil as "destruction of the elvhen" as well, despite them surviving. They lost power and their immortality, sure, but they weren't destroyed as a race. I don't think the other races in Thedas would die this time either. 

 

Anyway, he was wrong about a lot of things. He didn't think a mortal would survive the mark, or even survive physically in the fade, but in Here Lies the Abyss everyone was fine. Goddamnit Solas. 

[Ellawynn]

 or even survive physically in the fade, but in Here Lies the Abyss everyone was fine. Goddamnit Solas. 

 

Yeah, that always bugged me. Makes me wonder if the thing mortals aren't supposed to survive is passing through the Veil (Which would mean that everyone was fine because the anchor allowed them to do it safely.) or if it's another hint towards that "non-elves can't survive in the Fade/Fade-y places for very long," which means everyone was fine only because their exposure was limited, but then that would make the comment he made really silly when the Inquisitor is an elf. Of course, as has been documented, the base game wasn't exactly great at acknowledging differences between human Quizzies and non-human Quizzies. 

 

I mean, I don't think he was flat-out wrong, because we do have evidence that Fade-yness is toxic to non-elves. But still, it's pretty weird.

[midnight tea]

Yeah, that always bugged me. Makes me wonder if the thing mortals aren't supposed to survive is passing through the Veil (Which would mean that everyone was fine because the anchor allowed them to do it safely.) or if it's another hint towards that "non-elves can't survive in the Fade/Fade-y places for very long," which means everyone was fine only because their exposure was limited, but then that would make the comment he made really silly when the Inquisitor is an elf. Of course, as has been documented, the base game wasn't exactly great at acknowledging differences between human Quizzies and non-human Quizzies. 

 

I mean, I don't think he was flat-out wrong, because we do have evidence that Fade-yness is toxic to non-elves. But still, it's pretty weird.

 

Umm... it is implied that people around Inquisitor have survived thanks to the protective energy of the Anchor. It was the reason why Corypheus wanted it and why Solas initially created it. He'd have entered the Fade thanks to the Mark in a scenario where Cory died and he obtained the orb.

 

Of course, question remains how did Flemeth, Morrigan and Kieran entered it, but those are close-to-gods or people raised by close-to-gods, so I assume their very nature allows them so.

[Cee]

 

The elves would become more powerful and probably subjugate the other races and he wouldn't be there to stop them even if he wanted to (from his dialogue it's pretty clear he doesn't expect to survive the destruction of the veil).

 

It's still vague as to why he doesn't seem to expect he'll come out of this alive. Lowering the Veil might cost him power or strength, but it could also be fallout from those who want revenge, or the escaped Evanuris, or any number of other factors we're not even introduced to just yet.

[Addictress]

I've been waiting for someone to bring this up so I can share this poster I found long ago! 

 

Who can turn down that sale's pitch?  

 

 

 

To be fair, Solas never said that everyone in the world will definitely die or that his followers would surely perish too. All he really said was he planned to tear down the Veil, which would/could cause the world to "burn in the raw chaos," which he would soon end by using the Fade to reshape reality. It's possible that his followers would be out of the blast zone, though, as they have access to the Eluvians and Crossroads.

 

He also only really says, "The return of my people means the end of yours," but he doesn't elaborate on what that means. Most people choose to interpret it as "GENOCIDE!", but I always thought he meant, "The return of my people as a world power (if non-elven)/predominant elven culture (for Dalish) means the end of yours as a world power/predominantly elven culture." I think humans, dwarves, and possibly Qunari (though that one's iffy) will still be around, it's just their societies and cultures (and thus their "people") won't be the same because the world won't be the same.

 

Most of the BSN scoffs at me for thinking so, but I interpret Solas' vague description of the Veil going down to mean the elves' old immortality and magic would return, as shown in this goofy little comic. I speculate that Solas telling an Elven Inquisitor "the return of my people means the end of yours" is due to your people becoming his people. Elves restored to what they were before the Veil, Solas using the reality-altering powers of the Fade to restore the world to what it was before the Veil.

 

If that is the case, to people who've lost everything--their magic, immortality, language, culture, nationality, freedom, place in the world; who've been conquered, enslaved, degraded, oppressed, shortly freed, then re-conquered and re-subjugated and kept as slaves, second-class citizens, and/or home wanderers for centuries, I think the Dread Wolf's offer would sound like a preferable alternative to many.

Oh believe me, this is what I earnestly hope that it means.

[Addictress]

If they make Solas an un-redeemable villain in DA4, and I won't be able to continue the romance with him as Lavellan in DA4, I will sneeze anime blood from my nose I will be so distraught.

[ladyiolanthe]

I just hope that Solas isn't calling the elves to him in order to use them in blood magic rituals to get enough power to reshape the world. His orb is broken and he needs to get an immense amount of power somehow. I know he has never practiced blood magic because it would restrict his ability to enter the Fade, but he thinks he's going to die anyway... Elves seem to be favoured blood magic sacrifices in Tevinter and there are a few lore bits that suggest they have more magic in their blood than the other races. So. Yeah. I hope that isn't what he is referring to when he says he is walking the Din'an Shiral and when he says he doesn't want a romanced Lavellan to see what he will become.  

[Addictress]

Yeah, that always bugged me. Makes me wonder if the thing mortals aren't supposed to survive is passing through the Veil (Which would mean that everyone was fine because the anchor allowed them to do it safely.) or if it's another hint towards that "non-elves can't survive in the Fade/Fade-y places for very long," which means everyone was fine only because their exposure was limited, but then that would make the comment he made really silly when the Inquisitor is an elf. Of course, as has been documented, the base game wasn't exactly great at acknowledging differences between human Quizzies and non-human Quizzies. 

 

I mean, I don't think he was flat-out wrong, because we do have evidence that Fade-yness is toxic to non-elves. But still, it's pretty weird.

It should be the "passing though the veil" like Lord Erimond said in the Western Approach

[Addictress]

Solas probably felt kind of bad that he had to take away romanced Lavellan's anchor because in effect he was taking away the one thing that would make her immune to the fatality of passing through the veil when he brings it down.

[dawnstone]

Solas probably felt kind of bad that he had to take away romanced Lavellan's anchor because in effect he was taking away the one thing that would make her immune to the fatality of passing through the veil when he brings it down.

If he'd have waited much longer, she'd have been dead anyway. The anchor was killing her.

[Addictress]

If he'd have waited much longer, she'd have been dead anyway. The anchor was killing her.

I kno ;____; That said, Lavellan was able to bring a whole squad with her into the fade at Adamant - how do you think that was?

[midnight tea]

I kno ;____; That said, Lavellan was able to bring a whole squad with her into the fade at Adamant - how do you think that was?

 

As it was already explained - it WAS the Anchor. The Anchor has protected all the companions, just like it likely has protected Justinia (real Justinia) at the very beginning of the game.

[dawnstone]

I kno ;____; That said, Lavellan was able to bring a whole squad with her into the fade at Adamant - how do you think that was?

Personally, I just took it as a proximity thing, as long as they were close to the person who held the fixed point of the anchor's power, they were safe. We know that the Fade can shift and change with just a stray thought, when you're just dreaming there. It has to be so much worse to be there in person.

 

I think the Inquisitor was literally the anchor that held the Fade together around them, and kept it from shifting wildly, until they left. I mean that's why I thought they called it that, since it's whole purpose is to access something that is fundamentally unstable.

[midnight tea]

Personally, I just took it as a proximity thing, as long as they were close to the person who held the fixed point of the anchor's power, they were safe. We know that the Fade can shift and change with just a stray thought, when you're just dreaming there. It has to be so much worse to be there in person.

 

I think the Inquisitor was literally the anchor that held the Fade together around them, and kept it from shifting wildly, until they left. I mean that's why I thought they called it that, since it's whole purpose is to access something that is fundamentally unstable.

 

Yup - that, plus Spirit!Justinia calls Inquisitor "The needle that pulls the thread". Inquisitor pierces the Fade like a needle with the Anchor and the rest is "the thread", connected to them likely by proximity, not necessarily anything more metaphysical or ephemeral.

[Addictress]

So then why can't Solas just make another anchor and shield people close to it

[midnight tea]

So then why can't Solas just make another anchor and shield people close to it

 

Very likely because it takes tremendous energy and time in order to create it? He did say that his orb has been soaking in power while he was sleeping and he was sleeping through entire millenias.