153434 réponses à ce sujet

[Qun00]

Unless that particular love interest is a total ass, I believe it makes more sense to show that what you had mattered. Not necessarily through sadness, but somehow.

[dawnstone]

Can

 

 

 

Too bad Tevinter isn't the nation that's known for EVERYONE wearing masks. We could've had a "guess who's Solas" thing going on with literally every new NPC we encountered.

Can you just imagine it, you can't see his face, but that voice, and you just know. And maybe your character doesn't know it's him, but it hits you as the player like a ton of bricks.

[Melbella]

Can
 
Can you just imagine it, you can't see his face, but that voice, and you just know. And maybe your character doesn't know it's him, but it hits you as the player like a ton of bricks.

Actually, I would prefer the player not get any big reveals (like the original epilogue) that the character doesn't get. It would have been so much better to both find out at the same time that Solas was Fen'harel.

[Addictress]

Can

Can you just imagine it, you can't see his face, but that voice, and you just know. And maybe your character doesn't know it's him, but it hits you as the player like a ton of bricks.

That's what masquerades are truly for.

Oh the romantic intrigue ;___;


Shameless POTO fantasies wow

[midnight tea]

You don't understand!  Only the player is allowed to do the breaking up!  I mean, who does he think he is to dump the PC?!  HOW DARE HE!!!  And the PC can never be weak or vulnerable!  They are the hero of the story, the leader of the Inquisition, a super special snowflake not burdened by things like heartbreak or insecurities!

 

Yes, I'm joking.  And no, those are definitely not the only reasons someone might pick an angry option at the break up.  But that is exactly what some people think about their PC.

 

Yeah, it's just... bizarre... On one hand we hear the accusations of PC being Mary Sues, but then we hear complains that their character isn't an all-powerful, all-godly protag who can never really be wrong and they're all in control. Like... eh?

 

It's a similar situation with "oh, give us more complex stories and more complex villains/antagonists!" I think. Quite a few people complained that Corypheus was a so-so villain, but the moment Bioware actually surprises us with the reveal of a complex antagonist, quite a few people just want to sweep him to the bag with "simple, evil bastards" stamped all over it. Talk about "damn if you do, damn if you don't". There will always be people who are not pleased.

[Addictress]

EXCEPT THE MAGISTERIUM CAN STILL HIRE ORLESIAN THEATRE GROUPS TO ENTERTAIN THEM WITH masked operas and the opera will be about the Inquisitor's tale (which is controversial and not everyone agrees it's even true) regarding the real dread wolf.

Not only will it be hugely controversial suggesting Tevinter was not the undoing of the elves (or perhaps it will be embraced by the Imperium as it washes their hands of the sin), but could be a ploy by the inquisition to spread the gospel on how things really went down. (Remember that play Geralt had to put on in TW3 with a political purpose. Except that was a small play. This would be a huge opera house production in Minrathous).

And then Solas can infiltrate and play as the Dread Wolf, phantom-of-the-opera style YO

Just cause
He secretly digs sex and intrigue.
I mean. The...courtly essences of those things. Erm.

Of course. This writes itself.

[Addictress]

Pretty sure we need the top fanartists and writers to storyboard this and send it to Patrick Weekes by Fedex on the finest poster board. And I will pay the postage.

[dawnstone]

Pretty sure we need the top fanartists and writers to storyboard this and send it to Patrick Weekes by Fedex on the finest poster board. And I will pay the postage.

I like the way you think!

 

[Ghost Gal]

Do you think Fen'Harel can recruit races other than elves?

 

I always thought the dwarves might be good candidates. Restoring the world to the way it was when elves were at the height of their power means restoring dwarves to their former glory, right? Bringing back the world where they had power means bringing back the Titans, restoring their connection to the Titans (making them tall and magical again), clearing the Deep Roads, restoring their vast empire, etc.

 

Granted, surface dwarves who've assimilated into surface culture like Varric might not go for it, but those with "Stone-sense" like Bartrand or Orzammar dwarves might go for it.

 

Sometimes I'm amazed at how childish people can be.

I was watching a compilation with all dialogue options during the vallaslin cutscene and there were these comments from people saying they don't like the sad dialogue option because it makes Lavellan look weak.

 

Yeah, I'm not a real fan of "weakness-shaming" either. Assuming Lavellan wasn't indifferent or exceptionally mature or detached from the relationship--she just got her heart broken. She's in pain. She (supposedly) loves this man and doesn't want him to leave. For goodness's sake, it's okay to feel sad and grieve when yo're sad. It doesn't all have to be about looking "tough" or "independent" because icky girly emotions are inferior.

 

(I was actually just talking about this with my sister this afternoon.)

 

And the angry option is better because she gets to walk away first.

Really. At a moment like that, Lavellan's first concern would be to show him who's boss. I may be wrong, but that is the mindset you have when it's just a meaningless fling.

 

... Eh, not necessarily.

 

A meaningless fling, by definition, doesn't mean anything to you, so you can't be too upset by it. I mean, yeah, someone else getting to walk away after breaking up with you is an ego-crusher, so if you aren't too upset about the loss of the relationship then you might be pretty miffed about the injury to your ego. But by the same token, if you did just get your heart broken into a million pieces and then the person who broke your heart adds insult to injury by walking away first, so you're left standing there looking and feeling like an idiot as well as being in a lot of pain... it can add to the pain rather than replacing it. It's possible to want to save as much of your dignity, or at least lessen the hurt by saving your ego, as much as possible. Essentially, "You broke my heart, but you don't get to walk away."

 

Personally, this is what I always think of whenever I think of whether to let Solas or Lavellan walk away first. (Childish or not, if she knew what was coming, I think she'd react the way Rory does to Jess.) 

 

 

Yeah, it's just... bizarre... On one hand we hear the accusations of PC being Mary Sues, but then we hear complains that their character isn't an all-powerful, all-godly protag who can never really be wrong and they're all in control. Like... eh?

 

It's a similar situation with "oh, give us more complex stories and more complex villains/antagonists!" I think. Quite a few people complained that Corypheus was a so-so villain, but the moment Bioware actually surprises us with the reveal of a complex antagonist, quite a few people just want to sweep him to the bag with "simple, evil bastards" stamped all over it. Talk about "damn if you do, damn if you don't". There will always be people who are not pleased.

 

Well, it helps that the fanbase is filled with many individuals with different individual preferences and opinions. =/

 

But I pretty much agree. Just in terms of general numbers, I find it amazing by how the masses often cry for one thing but then decry it when they get it. People cry "Make my choices have consequences!" but then cry foul when those consequences aren't good ones. (Keeping Cullen lyirum-addicted and keeping Bull with the Qunari being prime examples.)

 

I also personally find it annoying that the same peanut gallery that tend to glorify or excuse Loghain's villainous actions because, "He honestly believed he was doing the right thing" (even though he committed literal war crimes) turn around and dismiss Solas with, "It doesn't matter whether he has good intentions or not, what matters are his actions." Nice double-standard. Or the same people that lectures non-Loghain fans with, "You can't treat people like they're pure good or pure evil; not everything is black and white, there are shades of grey" turn around and dismiss all complexities with Solas and insist that he's just a pure black villain with flat evil motivations and no redeeming qualities. What was that about reducing people to pure good or pure evil, again?

 

And I'm not even going to get into those that excuse Loghain because "he honestly thought he was doing good" but condemn Solas because, "he knows what he's doing is wrong--he even admits he's going to destroy this world to create a new one." Even though Loghain admits that he knows his actions were wrong (except enslaving "elves"--he'll defend that to his dying breath). Loghain also knew full well that his actions were horrible even when he was doing them, but he did them anyway because he "believed" (coughed*trickedhimselfintothinking*cough*) they would lead to a good outcome. If you're going to give Loghain a complete pass for committing travesties because he'd convinced himself it would lead to a good outcome, then do so for Solas. Or at least be honest and admit that you like one character more than the other for whatever personal reason. (Personally, I can't stand Loghain because I'm biased toward elves. I don't buy his bullsh*t self-deception excuses for his crimes, and any sympathy I might have had for his "I'm just trying to keep Ferelden independent" motive flew out the window when I saw that he sold Ferelden elves into slavery, showing that he was a racist hypocrite on top of being a liar, traitor, deserter, kingslayer, usurper, tyrant, etc.)

[Siha]

If the options they gave were satisfying to you anyway, then I don't see what the problem is.

I don't have a problem, I just engaged in discussion. Sorry. However, the options were not satisfying fire me because I never got them, only heard of them. I did not actually romance Solas.

And I gave examples of how they could have acknowledged the end of the relationship, so I still don't see how it would have been impossible.

The player could have picked actions to prevent further comments on that topic, like "I do not wish to discuss this further", which could have been used by the devs to prune all edges of the dialogue graph that would have led to similar nodes.

[maia0407]

Eh... well, I hope so... but I sort of have the feeling Solas hoped this would happen AFTER he created the Veil - and people proved him very wrong Wouldn't be surprised it was a second time his trust (this time in people in general) was broken and he grew really bitter about it. It could even be what he meant when he said "there are fewer regrets sharper than watching fools squander what you've sacrificed to achieve".
 
Then there's also a possibility that Solas wants to restore the world of the elves, but without certain element i it. I mean.. what if he plans to lock himself and all Evanuris/those who wield specific type of magic somewhere and isolate them from the world to never tempt anyone with such power?

Yes, this. Along with slave labor, I think that certain types of powerful magic are necessary to recreate the elven empire. Anyone wanting to recreate the elven empire would have to be able to wield or find people that can wield that magic and probably find sources to power it. Tapping the massive amounts of power needed (Titans?) may not be healthy for the world and might be what Solas was alluding to when he said the Evanuris were destroying the world.

Just as a note, I realize that Solas expects to die as a result of his actions and won't be able to control whether slavery returns. I made my comment about slaves in context to another comment about Solas bringing down the veil to bring back the elven empire buildings and all. I'm just pointing out that his goal probably isn't to recreate palaces and such as he abhors slavery and the methods the Evanuris used to build that empire. His goal more likely relates to restoring the elves connection to the fade while putting safeguards in place to prevent the rise of Evanuris (he says he has plans for the Evanuris after all).

[CapricornSun]

Art post.

 

Gorgeous artwork of Solas and Lavellan by ruxandralache.

Spoiler

Source: http://ruxandralache...ng-thank-you-so

 

 

Adorable Solavellan WIP.

Spoiler

Source: http://lystandthefan...crossing-things

 

 

“I am going to save you, I swear it.” Cadash vows to save Solas.

Spoiler

Source: http://ladyintheatti...-you-i-swear-it

 

 

WIP of Solas' lips. 

Spoiler

Source: http://spacetango.tu...the-new-brushes

 

 

Sketch of sad Solas.

Spoiler

Source: http://prodigal-san....oolwork-n-o-p-e

 

 

Solas sculpture!

Spoiler

Source: http://kistehvost.tu...ь-решила-только

 

[TheyCallMeBunny]

Sometimes I'm amazed at how childish people can be.

I was watching a compilation with all dialogue options during the vallaslin cutscene and there were these comments from people saying they don't like the sad dialogue option because it makes Lavellan look weak. And the angry option is better because she gets to walk away first.

Really. At a moment like that, Lavellan's first concern would be to show him who's boss. I may be wrong, but that is the mindset you have when it's just a meaningless fling.

Well, not that I'm suggesting that the Inquisitor should drop to her knees and beg, but a little vulnerability is harmless. Especially because although she doesn't know everything, it's easy to tell that it's difficult for Solas and he is not doing it out of whim.

 

I did the sad option first time around, and later I went back and tried the angry option - it felt very satisfying at the time to shove him around, but the sad response is my canon response. This was the first time my character was the one to be dumped (she had turned down Blackwall and dumped Iron Bull earlier) so it felt right that she would be shocked and sad to be the recipient of the breakup this time.

 

I personally think it's silly that a PC that on one occasion isn't the one "in charge" of the situation is somehow considered weak; it's probably because society has deemed sadness and/or crying as a female trait, and because female traits are weaker than male traits (anger being considered a male trait) it is more acceptable to display anger than sadness if you want to be looked upon as "strong".

[Baboontje]

Sometimes I'm amazed at how childish people can be.

I was watching a compilation with all dialogue options during the vallaslin cutscene and there were these comments from people saying they don't like the sad dialogue option because it makes Lavellan look weak. And the angry option is better because she gets to walk away first.

Really. At a moment like that, Lavellan's first concern would be to show him who's boss. I may be wrong, but that is the mindset you have when it's just a meaningless fling.

Well, not that I'm suggesting that the Inquisitor should drop to her knees and beg, but a little vulnerability is harmless. Especially because although she doesn't know everything, it's easy to tell that it's difficult for Solas and he is not doing it out of whim.

 

Seriously? There are people who think like that? The times I had the scene, -that- thought certainly never even crossed my mind. I tried all the options after doing it the first time and truth be told, I prefer the sad option for that scene.

The way I see it; It's a very private and intimate moment between the two and my Lavellan is totally caught off-guard when he ends it. And since it's so sudden, she doesn't understand. The one thing she does understand is that she doesn't want him to go. At that moment she had no walls up, nerves completely laid bare and being sad was her first reaction. Now of course, getting angry is also a valid reaction. Snap to hide the pain. But not for my Lavellan. In Trespasser however, she's had the time. Pulling back up all the walls. And it's been gnawing at her, she's had two years to have that sadness transform into anger. Plus all the stress from Ferelden and Orlais pulling at her, the Qunari trying to invade and on top of that the anchor playing up. So there, the angry option is my favourite one. Any angry option in Trespasser is, actually. She's just done.

[Siha]

He didn't give Corypheus the orb, one of his proxies did

 

Do we know this now? Because the last time I saw this discussed it wasn't yet clear how he gave the orb away. We only wondered why Corypheus had not recognized Solas. When and where/how was it revealed?

 

I was watching a compilation with all dialogue options during the vallaslin cutscene and there were these comments from people saying they don't like the sad dialogue option because it makes Lavellan look weak. And the angry option is better because she gets to walk away first.

 

The angry path, is that the one where she pushes him? Because I thought that one made her look really weak. Pushing somebody, physically attacking somebody, because you are too helpless and unable to cope in any other way... looked like she couldn't even contain herself. I thought that showed at least as much weakness and sadness as the "I don't want to lose you"... if not more. The sad Lavellan at least had enough strength to be honest (knowing she might be considered pathetic). The angry Lavellan just looked feeble, pushing him and shouting and running away.

 

Generally, walking away isn't necessarily strong, it can also be a sign of weakness. Not to be able to stand there and watch what's happening next, watch how the other one might just walk away without even another word.

 

Pretty sure we need the top fanartists and writers to storyboard this and send it to Patrick Weekes by Fedex on the finest poster board. And I will pay the postage.

 

If money's not an issue you should bring it to FedEx Memphis right away. No, wait, if money's not an issue you should bring it to BW and give a presentation too. Wrap up a few slides and maybe a short advertising film for bigger impact.

[Ellawynn]

Do you think Fen'Harel can recruit races other than elves? I mean, if he sets up shadow organizations, like Blackstone Irregulars or Mage Collectives, and then has them run a few non-Solas tasks alongside Solas tasks, then everyone will be game.

 

I was also thinking today... it seems Solas' physical identity is out now. The Viddasala and I'm sure the entire Qun knows what he looks like. Everyone in the South also knows what he looks like. As the final Exalted Council scene is loading, we hear Bann Teagan shout, "Because this SOLAS provoked them in the first place!"

 

His identity is out in the open. And although this is a medievalesque time that doesn't have photos or anything, I still feel like Solas should hide or wear a mask or something, right? He can't just walk around modern Thedas and blast swaths of people before him with stone-turning magic whenever he needs to head to the market. I imagine he needs to live in modern Thedas for a few years at least until he figures out how to bring down the veil.

 

Is his identity compromised? Presumably the Inquisitor and their agents all know who they're after, and maybe they've successfully convinced a few others, but I can't imagine that the majority of Thedas knows. I mean most of Thedas is Andrastian and wouldn't know the first thing about Dalish gods much less believe they exist, and that one of them's traipsing about stealing hands and trying to destroy the world.

 

Like that one ending slide that refers to the "mysterious" migration of elves - it's not really mysterious at all because we all know who's likely behind it, but Thedas at large knows nothing about Solas or his plans, so the sudden change seems apropos of nothing to them. Even Teagen's comment there - referring to him as Solas and not Fen'Harel - would seem to indicate that even people the Inquisitor has direct contact with haven't got a damn clue who he is.

 

Not to mention that, as has been pointed out both in game and by fans, Solas seems rather plain at first glance, to the point where I know one person who mistook him from an irrelevant NPC when they first saw his design. (And how many people have you heard say he looks like Shartan or Zathrian just because he's a bald elf? Hell, we just had a discussion where he was mistaken for some random bit character.) He's quiet and humble and not tremendously showy - I don't think he'd have much problem flying beneath the radar. It's what he did in Inquisition, if Bull's banter is anything to go by. Despite being in the Inner Circle, he seems to have been mostly ignored. Even seems to have been trying to downplay his own presence and involvement - just look at one of the first interactions you have with him, where he quickly passes off any credit for closing the rift to you. Which is ridiculous, because the Inquisitor would've died in their sleep without him, and wouldn't have known what to do with the Mark if they hadn't - but he probably knows he should be as anonymous as possible, so he forgoes recognition and praise as much as he can.

 

...But yeah, the Qun's probably got his number. Not that the Qun's about to buddy up with the rest of Thedas.

 

hhnnnggg

 

Too bad Tevinter isn't the nation that's known for EVERYONE wearing masks. We could've had a "guess who's Solas" thing going on with literally every new NPC we encountered.

 

God, that's such a hopeless cliche and I'm so completely on board with it. Although, going back to the anonymity thing (And going off of his comments at the Winter Ball) he'd probably try to pose as a servant if he ever needed to go to such an event.

[Elessara]

Do we know this now? Because the last time I saw this discussed it wasn't yet clear how he gave the orb away. We only wondered why Corypheus had not recognized Solas. When and where/how was it revealed?

 

 

I think in Trespasser Solas tells you that he allowed Corypheus to find the orb.  I'm pretty sure he says something like he didn't give the orb to Corypheus directly but his agents allowed the Venatori to find it.  I would have to go through the ending of Trespasser again to really be sure though.  No time right now  ><

[ChuChu]

Actually, I would prefer the player not get any big reveals (like the original epilogue) that the character doesn't get. It would have been so much better to both find out at the same time that Solas was Fen'harel.

But that reveal made us WANT. I definitely don't mind it (maybe I prefer it?) when the player knows something the protagonist might not. It just adds to the emotional tension. And tension in general. And fuels the Solas fan thread with hundreds if not thousands of speculation posts and theories. xD
 

 

 

Spoiler

Source: http://kistehvost.tu...ь-решила-только

 

Uh. Wow. That bust is pretty impressive. The perfect gift for your Solas-obsessed-friends-birthday xD

 

I think in Trespasser Solas tells you that he allowed Corypheus to find the orb.  I'm pretty sure he says something like he didn't give the orb to Corypheus directly but his agents allowed the Venatori to find it.  I would have to go through the ending of Trespasser again to really be sure though.  No time right now  ><

I think I remember something similar, but again, not entirely sure. Something about his agents letting him find it... and he didn't think Cory could resurrect (it was the flaw in his plan).

[Sifr]

Sometimes I'm amazed at how childish people can be.

I was watching a compilation with all dialogue options during the vallaslin cutscene and there were these comments from people saying they don't like the sad dialogue option because it makes Lavellan look weak. And the angry option is better because she gets to walk away first.

Really. At a moment like that, Lavellan's first concern would be to show him who's boss. I may be wrong, but that is the mindset you have when it's just a meaningless fling.

Well, not that I'm suggesting that the Inquisitor should drop to her knees and beg, but a little vulnerability is harmless. Especially because although she doesn't know everything, it's easy to tell that it's difficult for Solas and he is not doing it out of whim.

 

I concur, the sad dialogue is far more appropriate because look at what just happened to her;

 

Her boyfriend took her to a special romantic place.

Started to open up, but deflected to instead drop a major lore bomb.

Offered to remove her tattoos, after explaining what they mean.

Says regardless of what she chose, that she is still beautiful.

Some major snogging ensued.

And then... suddenly broke up with her.

 

Gorramit, even thinking of that scene makes me sad... stop toying with my emotions, you bald Fade nerd!

 

[Baboontje]

Can

 

Can you just imagine it, you can't see his face, but that voice, and you just know. And maybe your character doesn't know it's him, but it hits you as the player like a ton of bricks.

 

 

That's what masquerades are truly for.

Oh the romantic intrigue ;___;


Shameless POTO fantasies wow

 

[Qun00]

I did the sad option first time around, and later I went back and tried the angry option - it felt very satisfying at the time to shove him around, but the sad response is my canon response. This was the first time my character was the one to be dumped (she had turned down Blackwall and dumped Iron Bull earlier) so it felt right that she would be shocked and sad to be the recipient of the breakup this time.

I personally think it's silly that a PC that on one occasion isn't the one "in charge" of the situation is somehow considered weak; it's probably because society has deemed sadness and/or crying as a female trait, and because female traits are weaker than male traits (anger being considered a male trait) it is more acceptable to display anger than sadness if you want to be looked upon as "strong".

When did gender ever enter the picture? It is a baseless assumption.

[dawnstone]

I think in Trespasser Solas tells you that he allowed Corypheus to find the orb.  I'm pretty sure he says something like he didn't give the orb to Corypheus directly but his agents allowed the Venatori to find it.  I would have to go through the ending of Trespasser again to really be sure though.  No time right now  ><

Yes, this is what he tells you in Trespasser. Here's a chart with all of his branching Trespasser dialogue: http://i.imgur.com/iZmRPlS.png?1

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

 

Leliana's friend Sketch from Leliana's Song... well, his past is very shady, he was close to Tug, who might have associations with the Titans, they bothered to have a minor quest with him in it in DA2, and he's given attention to even in recent materials like WoT2. I almost want to say he could very well be ancient elf working for Solas.

He also had a war table mission in DAI. They're definitely keeping the guy around in the lore for some reason.

 

Do you think Fen'Harel can recruit races other than elves? I mean, if he sets up shadow organizations, like Blackstone Irregulars or Mage Collectives, and then has them run a few non-Solas tasks alongside Solas tasks, then everyone will be game.

 

I was also thinking today... it seems Solas' physical identity is out now. The Viddasala and I'm sure the entire Qun knows what he looks like. Everyone in the South also knows what he looks like. As the final Exalted Council scene is loading, we hear Bann Teagan shout, "Because this SOLAS provoked them in the first place!"

 

His identity is out in the open. And although this is a medievalesque time that doesn't have photos or anything, I still feel like Solas should hide or wear a mask or something, right? He can't just walk around modern Thedas and blast swaths of people before him with stone-turning magic whenever he needs to head to the market. I imagine he needs to live in modern Thedas for a few years at least until he figures out how to bring down the veil.

It wouldn't surprise me if Solas has non-elves working for him, likely without even knowing they're working for him. I wouldn't put it past him to have a Red Jenny-eqsue organization at his command that involves non-elves. If someone had figured out how to manipulate Red Jenny, the potential for abuse in that kind of anonymous setup Sera had was ridiculously high b/c the individuals involved are so in the dark about the consequences of their actions. Due to that, they're basically a loaded gun, waiting for someone clever enough to figure out how to direct them to tell them where to "point and shoot". He could easily set it up so no one even knows who it is that's giving the orders.

[thaali]

Runs in psstt I'm doing my first art give away just because I can.  If anyone is interested here is the tumblr thing for it http://solaslover.tu...t-ever-giveaway

 

Bring the Lavellans, I want to draw them all muhahahaha

 

Ok I'm done.

Back to regularly scheduled programming.  

[dawnstone]

Do we know this now? Because the last time I saw this discussed it wasn't yet clear how he gave the orb away. We only wondered why Corypheus had not recognized Solas. When and where/how was it revealed?

 

In Trespasser. Here's the full dialogue tree: http://i.imgur.com/iZmRPlS.png?1

 

And here's a screenshot of the branch of the dialogue tree with the pertinent bits, since it'll take me longer to go through my in game screenshots:

Spoiler