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Solas Thread - NOW OFFICIALLY MOVED to Cyonan's BSN (link in OP)


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#149676
Caritas_Lavellan

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Secondly, the orb drew my attention for some reason and made me think. I wonder if the lines carved into it are like wrinkles on the cerebral cortex of a brain. the brain has wrinkles so it can have more surface area and hold more information. Maybe the grooves are carved so that the orbs can hold and focus more magical "information" in the form of energy? It could be (and likely is) purely aesthetic, I know. But these are the thoughts my brain has at midnight on a Friday.

Have you tried jumping on the floor of the Raw Fade, either just after Adamant or if your world state allows you to follow Kieran in there? In some places it leaks blood. That feels like the inside of a brain/mind to me. It is entirely possible that the design of the orb is connected to this idea as well.

I just referenced this in Chapter 48 of Not that kind of wolf so it is on my mind.
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#149677
Sifr

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I vote Elgar'nan. He'd make a great spirit of vengeance. :D

 

I would love to see Patrick Stewart playing Elgar'nan.

 

I've recently begun to imagine Elgar'nan as the Elven equivalent to Wilson Fisk from Daredevil... someone capable of displaying extreme politeness, high intelligence and rationality one moment, but prone to fits of extreme rage the moment that something tiny causes him to lose his temper.

 

Could be a lot of fun to hear Patrick Stewart in a role that subverts the "Picard speeches" he's so famous for, where he begins a standard speech only to suddenly have it devolve into angry, incoherent ranting and yelling halfway through.

 

Basically I see Elgar'nan as Picard meets Wilson Fisk meets Malcolm Tucker.

 

:lol:


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#149678
Bayonet Hipshot

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I would love to see Patrick Stewart playing Elgar'nan.

 

I've recently begun to imagine Elgar'nan as the Elven equivalent to Wilson Fisk from Daredevil... someone capable of displaying extreme politeness, high intelligence and rationality one moment, but prone to fits of extreme rage the moment that something tiny causes him to lose his temper.

 

Could be a lot of fun to hear Patrick Stewart in a role that subverts the "Picard speeches" he's so famous for, where he begins a standard speech only to suddenly have it devolve into angry, incoherent ranting and yelling halfway through.

 

Basically I see Elgar'nan as Picard meets Wilson Fisk meets Malcolm Tucker.

 

:lol:

 

The prospect of an Elven Evanuris Kingpin is rather terrifying, if I am to be honest.


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#149679
Sifr

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The prospect of an Elven Evanuris Kingpin is rather terrifying, if I am to be honest.

 

Everything about Elgar'nan sounds terrifying from what we hear.

 

It's probably the only thing that the Elven legends didn't sugarcoat, because the Vir Dirthara and the history of the Dalish both are in complete agreement that he was a tyrant with a massive temper, who needed Mythal to be the rational one in the relationship and stop him breaking things.



#149680
CapricornSun

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Art post.

 

Gorgeous traditional artwork of Solas and the Dread Wolf.

 

Solas with a wolf skull on his head.

 

Tangled AU sketch of Dorian as Flynn Rider, Solas as Rapunzel, and Cole as Pascal the chameleon by kallielef. xD

 

Lavellan embracing Solas. (Don't know why Lavellan is a mermaid though.)


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#149681
dawnstone

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I would love to see Patrick Stewart playing Elgar'nan.

 

I've recently begun to imagine Elgar'nan as the Elven equivalent to Wilson Fisk from Daredevil... someone capable of displaying extreme politeness, high intelligence and rationality one moment, but prone to fits of extreme rage the moment that something tiny causes him to lose his temper.

 

Could be a lot of fun to hear Patrick Stewart in a role that subverts the "Picard speeches" he's so famous for, where he begins a standard speech only to suddenly have it devolve into angry, incoherent ranting and yelling halfway through.

 

Basically I see Elgar'nan as Picard meets Wilson Fisk meets Malcolm Tucker.

 

:lol:

Are you familiar with the Elgar'nan's Opinon blog, on tumblr? I think it's hilarious.


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#149682
Sifr

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Are you familiar with the Elgar'nan's Opinon blog, on tumblr? I think it's hilarious.

 

I've not come across it before, I tend to only step into the shallow end of tumblr, too many sharks and mines in the water!

 

Some of tumblr is hilarious though, I have to admit :lol:



#149683
CapricornSun

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Are you familiar with the Elgar'nan's Opinon blog, on tumblr? I think it's hilarious.

 

I do love how Elgar'nan speaks in all caps and loves children. :lol:


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#149684
ladyiolanthe

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Everything about Elgar'nan sounds terrifying from what we hear.

 

It's probably the only thing that the Elven legends didn't sugarcoat, because the Vir Dirthara and the history of the Dalish both are in complete agreement that he was a tyrant with a massive temper, who needed Mythal to be the rational one in the relationship and stop him breaking things.

 

I wonder if Mythal really was his wife, or whether she was just assumed to be, because she was always around him in case he threw a temper tantrum. Maybe in reality she couldn't stand the guy and just stayed close to him out of a sense of duty. Maybe she felt responsible for him in some way. She is described as the protector of the elves, but back in the dawn of time, what did they need to be protected from? Powerful spirits, and Elgar'nan, is all I can think of.

 

I can't really imagine why she'd put up with him, otherwise.


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#149685
NightSymphony

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Art Time

 

Solas and Lavellan - Old Magic

http://ladytheirin.d...ssion-600615204

 

Solas and Lavellan Portraits

http://kapiali.devia...ellan-600618809


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#149686
Brass_Buckles

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Ok, first that outfit is awesome.

 

Secondly, the orb drew my attention for some reason and made me think. I wonder if the lines carved into it are like wrinkles on the cerebral cortex of a brain. the brain has wrinkles so it can have more surface area and hold more information. Maybe the grooves are carved so that the orbs can hold and focus more magical "information" in the form of energy? It could be (and likely is) purely aesthetic, I know. But these are the thoughts my brain has at midnight on a Friday.

 

 

Have you tried jumping on the floor of the Raw Fade, either just after Adamant or if your world state allows you to follow Kieran in there? In some places it leaks blood. That feels like the inside of a brain/mind to me. It is entirely possible that the design of the orb is connected to this idea as well.

I just referenced this in Chapter 48 of Not that kind of wolf so it is on my mind.

 

Not sure where I read this, it might be in the art book...

 

The developers said that the "wrinkles" on the orb were meant to mimic a fingerprint pattern.  It's not a brain, it's a fingerprint...  The idea you have is interesting, but I personally wonder if the "fingerprint" is sort of like a lock.  Maybe it really is Solas's fingerprint and thus only he can actually use the magic without dying from it.  ... Which makes me wonder how many times Corypheus actually killed himself using that power, only to revive yet again.  Just once?  Or many many times?

 

As for why the Fade would bleed, it's probably because it's a nightmarish place--that's something pretty nightmarish to happen--and it may also have something to do with the betrayal theme that runs through DA:I.  So in short, it's probably atmospheric to make the Fade creepier.


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#149687
Ellawynn

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I wonder if Mythal really was his wife, or whether she was just assumed to be, because she was always around him in case he threw a temper tantrum. Maybe in reality she couldn't stand the guy and just stayed close to him out of a sense of duty. Maybe she felt responsible for him in some way. She is described as the protector of the elves, but back in the dawn of time, what did they need to be protected from? Powerful spirits, and Elgar'nan, is all I can think of.

 

I can't really imagine why she'd put up with him, otherwise.

 

We don't know a whole lot about Elgar'nan. He probably had his good points - I mean, I'd be a bit weirded out if the Dalish told legends of the All Father's rocking **** and bedsheet acrobatics. But I don't think we can assume he was just a bloodthirsty maniac that Mythal would've never cared for.

 

Not to mention Thedas' history is stupid with women being betrayed by their husbands (And Mythal's spirit may be attracted specifically to women who were.). So chances are good that this is another example.



#149688
In Exile

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I don't know why we're assuming Mythal is a universally positive figure.


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#149689
midnight tea

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I don't know why we're assuming Mythal is a universally positive figure.

 

Do we? I don't assume that she's universally positive. However I also assume that she's also not universally evil figure.


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#149690
In Exile

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Do we? I don't assume that she's universally positive. However I also assume that she's also not universally evil figure.

 

It's not about her being evil. We know far too little about the Evanuris, and their arrangements, to guess at the kind of being Elgar'nan was based on a relationship with Mythal. From the stories we hear, Mythal stood against the Evanuris and their excess quite frequently. It could be as simple as Mythal's companionship being the price for Elgar'nan curbing some other excess of the Evanuris. 



#149691
Elessara

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Do we? I don't assume that she's universally positive. However I also assume that she's also not universally evil figure.

 

Yeah I can't really assign a good/evil tag to her.  And I think she's a *lot* more manipulative than Solas realises.  She's pulling a lot of strings but for what end goal, I'm not sure.  Yeah she wants revenge/justice but what would her idea of that be?


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#149692
Ghost Gal

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I don't know why we're assuming Mythal is a universally positive figure.

 

Ever since Solas' crimes were exposed, she was absolved of hers.

 

Kind of like how everyone instantly forgave Corypheus for all his crimes and attempted atrocities just because Solas' were exposed.


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#149693
midnight tea

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Yeah I can't really assign a good/evil tag to her.  And I think she's a *lot* more manipulative than Solas realises.  She's pulling a lot of strings but for what end goal, I'm not sure.  Yeah she wants revenge/justice but what would her idea of that be?

 

I'd say that Solas may not be aware the extent of her plans, but I wouldn't assume that he doesn't realise how manipulative she can be. They've known each other for a very long time, after all and it seems that they've known each other well. And I remember than when disliked Inky drinks from the well Solas almost gloats at a prospect of seeing what creative way she's going to use her new pawn.



#149694
Elessara

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I'd say that Solas may not be aware the extent of her plans, but I wouldn't assume that he doesn't realise how manipulative she can be. They've known each other for a very long time, after all and it seems that they've known each other well. And I remember than when disliked Inky drinks from the well Solas almost gloats at a prospect of seeing what creative way she's going to use her new pawn.

 

They have known each other a long time, this is true.  But she isn't the same person she used to be.  She was murdered, became a wisp of her former self and then spent centuries basically merged with Flemeth.  I don't know, I just feel really ... hmm ... cautious?  about Mythal.

 

Edit to add:  Maybe "wary" is a better word than cautious.


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#149695
midnight tea

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Ever since Solas' crimes were exposed, she was absolved of hers.

 

Kind of like how everyone instantly forgave Corypheus for all his crimes and attempted atrocities just because Solas' were exposed.

 

I wouldn't say they "forgave" him, because I don't think that many people cared about Cory in the first place - but they were pretty eager to ascribe almost every crime Cory committed to Solas, as if Cory had no agency of his own at all, or were not shown to be a pretty elaborate schemer who has a flair for dramatic.


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#149696
midnight tea

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They have known each other a long time, this is true.  But she isn't the same person she used to be.  She was murdered, became a wisp of her former self and then spent centuries basically merged with Flemeth.  I don't know, I just feel really ... hmm ... cautious?  about Mythal.

 

Edit to add:  Maybe "wary" is a better word than cautious.

 

She's not - but neither is Solas, who spent thousands of years in the Fade and had time to become more introspective and less "hot blooded and cocky young elf who thought he knows everything". I think in this regard the field is somewhat evened out.

 

As for wary - I think everyone should be wary of ancient beings with more-or-less secret agenda ;D Seems kinda healthy.


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#149697
Bayonet Hipshot

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A few thoughts on the Evanuris.

 

1) I think they are called the Creators because they were the creators of the Elven race, not the creator of Thedas. In Trespasser, Solas mentions that the Evanuris were the "the first of my people".

 

2) The Evanuris are powerful spirits and more, just like how Sten in the comic 'Those Who Speak' says that the Old Gods are powerful dragon and more and the first Human kings were powerful Humans and more.
 

"The old gods were like unto dragons,as the first human kings were like unto ordinary men"

 

I would like to extend that statement to this:- "The Evanuris were like unto powerful spirits, as the old gods were like unto dragons, and as the first human kings were like unto ordinary men"

 

3) Statement 2 would explain the dual nature of the Evanuris. Spirits react differently to the world and the people they see. For example, a Spirit of Wisdom can become a Pride Demon under the appropriate circumstances. Similarly, those who come before the Evanuris with the purest of heart and intentions witnessed their spiritual nature and those who were malicious witnessed their demonic nature. Its why Mythal and Elgar'nan are what they are.

 

4) Solas was once part of the Evanuris, either as an actual deity, the God of Rebellion & the Trickster God before he choose to give that whole thing the middle finger, Either that or he was formerly Mythal's lieutenant or bodyguard or agent or champion and carried out her will. 

 

5) The Mythal that we know right now is but a wisp of her former self. The Evanuris Mythal is all but gone and the reason Mythal is hell-bent on vengeance can be understood when you read the Codex on Wisps:- http://dragonage.wik...dex_entry:_Wisp

 

Some that break through the cracks in the Veil into our world are known as wisps, a sliver of a thought that once was. A wisp is a demon that has lost its power; either it has existed in our world for too long without finding a true host or it has been destroyed—often, so we've found, by other demons. What remains of its mind clings tightly to the one concept that created it—a hatred of all things living.

 

Sounds familiar ? Mythal's wisp is far stronger than a conventional wisp because she was once an Evanuris.

 

6) Statement 5 means that it is possible to actually kill the Evanuris, but it is extremely difficult to do so. You will have to kill the Evanuris first, possibly with a powerful Ancient Elven weapon of some form and then destroy the Wisp..


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#149698
Elessara

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I wouldn't say they "forgave" him, because I don't think that many people cared about Cory in the first place - but they were pretty eager to ascribe almost every crime Cory committed to Solas, as if Cory had no agency of his own at all, or were not shown to be a pretty elaborate schemer who has a flair for dramatic.

 

Pretty much, yeah.  I kinda think Cory was more Random_BBEG_04 for a lot of people.

 

In my opinion, one of the most horrific things Corypheus did was create the Red Templars.  I know some of the templars took the red lyrium by choice but iirc a lot of the templars were also forced into taking it.  Felix said there were worse things than dying and to me what the red lyrium does to people is one of them.  And I think we can place the blame of the widespread red lyrium infection on Cory's doorstep.


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#149699
Bayonet Hipshot

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http://forum.bioware...n-the-evanuris/



#149700
Ghost Gal

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I wouldn't say they "forgave" him, because I don't think that many people cared about Cory in the first place - but they were pretty eager to ascribe almost every crime Cory committed to Solas, as if Cory had no agency of his own at all, or were not shown to be a pretty elaborate schemer who has a flair for dramatic.

 

*snaps fingers* There you go. That's the description I was looking for.

 

Yeah, I don't know what it is about our culture, but when someone is shown or described as evil, it's like people suddenly think, "Well, that's all they are and all they can ever be, so we shouldn't hold them responsible for their actions--we'll hold everyone around them responsible for not stopping them."

 

It's like Harvey Dent in The Dark Knight. He gets super mad and blames Gordon and Batman for Rachel's death because neither got to her in time, even though the Joker was the one who kidnapped her, tied her up, and blew her up. The Joker even convinces him, "I'm just a dog chasing a car, but they let me off my leash," and he buys it. Gordon and Batman even call him out on it later, basically saying, "Why are you mad at us? The Joker's the one who killed her!" and he said something like, "The Joker's just a dog, but you let him off his leash," holding them entirely responsible for the Joker's decisions. It's like, "he's evil, therefore he's not a thinking being who should be held accountable for his choices, therefore I'll blame his decisions and actions on others."

 

In fact, for my G.E. critical thinking class in community college, I remember we read a short story about an adulterous wife who was having an affair with the man across the river from her house. Every day while her husband was at work, she'd pay the ferryman to take her across, have sex, then then pay him to ferry her home for when her husband arrived. While there was a bridge up-stream, she never took it because she'd have to walk through a wood where a murderer was said to live. However, one day she stayed a little late and forgot the extra coin to pay the ferryman. She begged him to take her across with an IOU, but he refused. She banged on her lover's door hoping to borrow a coin, but he was enjoying a post-sex nap and ignored her. Desperate to get home before her husband found out, she finally resolved to walk through the murderer's forest to get to the bridge.

 

Afterwards, we were asked, "Who's directly responsible for the woman's murder?"

 

We had a ten-minute discussion of it, with some saying, "The ferryman because he wouldn't take her across," or "the lover because he wouldn't answer the door," or "the cheating **** for having the affair in the first place / choosing to cross the bridge knowing the risks" or even "the husband for making the woman so scared of what he'd do to her if he found out that she thought risking her life in the murderer's forest was better than him finding out."

 

At the end, my professor said: "The murderer. The murderer is directly responsible for the woman's murder."

 

And we all just sat there kind of stunned. Since the short story never showed him and only described him as "the murderer," we didn't really think of him as a character with agency, moral choices, etc. We kind of thought, "Oh, it's a murderer. Murderers kill people. It's what they do" and didn't think anything more about it. So we spent so much time exploring the morality, agency, and choices of other established characters, that we forgot that the murderer is a person who has agency and makes choices like anyone else, and should be held accountable for it.

 

And just like my classmates (and myself), everyone seems so stuck in the mindset that "Corypheus is a villain. That's all he is," that they fail to remember that in-universe he had agency and made the moral choices he did, and that he should be held responsible for his crimes rather than just those around him.


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