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[vertigomez]

I'm just gonna pretend he only ever romanced spirits >.>

Spoiler

Well, he said "it's been a while". Since... spirits? Ooooor has it been centuries since he's been with a flesh and blood lover?

It's all good, Solas. Lavellan will help ya out.

[Tielis]

Spoiler

To be fair, I sort of get the feeling he's tried in the past and it only ended with him being royally burned for his efforts. Merrill's talk about the Dread Wolf was posted earlier and it's pretty clear that not only do the Dalish have completely the wrong image of him, but it's hard to reconcile him with the lore as we used to know it. (the thing she says he hates the most are his most valued and respected aspects to a person) Solas very much reads as a character who has in part given up on a lot of matters, the Elvhen being just one such aspect and he's frankly not alone in his sentiments. Abelas and his people at the temple emphatically state that the Dalish are NOT their people as well, and even grow angry if you even suggest that they help the wandering clans. Something is missing here, some piece that we haven't seen that connects it all as to why the Dread Wolf and his fellow god's most ardent supporters all have given up on the Dalish. Sadly we won't see it for awhile.

 

Spoiler

It could simply be that they are stuck up, after all, the Dalish are all "slaves" to them.  God-syndrome, I guess.  But I also hope that it's not as simple as that.

 

Maybe it's because the Dalish choose to believe their own stories instead of the truth?

[beckaliz]

Sandal in Act 3 says, "One day the magic will come back. All of it. Everyone will be just like they were. The shadows will part, and the skies will open wide. When he rises, everyone will see."

 

Spoiler

I'm actually wondering if he might not be talking about the Dread Wolf, and not Corypheus. Because the skies have opened wide, yes, but the magic hasn't come back. Everyone is not just like they were.

[RynJ]

Spoiler

It could simply be that they are stuck up, after all, the Dalish are all "slaves" to them.  God-syndrome, I guess.  But I also hope that it's not as simple as that.

 

Maybe it's because they choose to believe their own stories instead of the truth?

 

Spoiler

Personally I think his big beef with the Dalish is that they've made him out to be a villain when clearly it's more complicated than that. Nothing like making huge sacrifices to try to change things for the better, as Solas hints that he's done, only to wake up and find out that it all meant nothing and you're painted as the villain by a people that don't even truly know their own heritage. I think he's more bitter than stuck up.

[Nyaore]

Spoiler

It could simply be that they are stuck up, after all, the Dalish are all "slaves" to them.  God-syndrome, I guess.  But I also hope that it's not as simple as that.

Spoiler

I don't think it will be, as Abelas and his crew all wore Vallaslin in spite of their words. I'm wondering if some of the Vallaslin weren't always marks of slavery at all, but of deference in some aspects. Or meant to designate those who went into the service of a specific god and are now 'their creatures', as Solas would say. A form of slavery to be sure, but with figurative chains as opposed to metal ones. Abelas acts like he willingly went to his duty, though he regrets parts of it regardless.

[Tielis]

Spoiler

Personally I think his big beef with the Dalish is that they've made him out to be a villain when clearly it's more complicated than that. Nothing like making huge sacrifices to try to change things for the better, as Solas hints that he's done, only to wake up and find out that it all meant nothing and you're painted as the villain by a people that don't even truly know their own heritage. I think he's more bitter than stuck up.

 

Bitter AND stuck up.  

[Solas]

Sandal in Act 3 says, "One day the magic will come back. All of it. Everyone will be just like they were. The shadows will part, and the skies will open wide. When he rises, everyone will see."

 

Spoiler

I'm actually wondering if he might not be talking about the Dread Wolf, and not Corypheus. Because the skies have opened wide, yes, but the magic hasn't come back. Everyone is not just like they were.

Spoiler

Cole talks about a time 'when everything sang the same' when he's referencing Solas...

[RynJ]

Bitter AND stuck up.  

 

Well to be fair, the Dalish treat everyone else terribly over history they don't even truly know. It's kiiiiind of hard to feel sorry for them.

[zambixi]

Well to be fair, the Dalish treat everyone else terribly over history they don't even truly know. It's kiiiiind of hard to feel sorry for them.

 

Spoiler

I really wonder how they managed to forget something as big as the vallaslin. Their culture must have been completely destroyed to misinterpret something that poorly.

 

The old elves might have treated others terribly, but I'd never gotten the impression that the modern Dalish were that bad (more rude than anything). They haven't enslaved anyone at least. I sort of do feel sorry for them still.

[Tielis]

Well to be fair, the Dalish treat everyone else terribly over history they don't even truly know. It's kiiiiind of hard to feel sorry for them.

 

Not all of them.  Solas does say that the clans vary very widely.  I guess the thing that bugs me the most is that these were the people he was trying to save, and they are scattered and broken and he still talks down to them?

[DragonFr0st]

Spoiler

I don't think it will be, as Abelas and his crew all wore Vallaslin in spite of their words. I'm wondering if some of the Vallaslin weren't always marks of slavery at all, but of deference in some aspects. Or meant to designate those who went into the service of a specific god and are now 'their creatures', as Solas would say. A form of slavery to be sure, but with figurative chains as opposed to metal ones. Abelas acts like he willingly went to his duty, though he regrets parts of it regardless.

 

Spoiler

I agree with this. They wear Vallaslin because they know what it entails, that their servitude is something they agreed upon. It's a mark of slavery to some, who owned the slaves and perhaps those who chose to serve their god. The god marking their followers with their symbols. It's still a sort of slavery. Abelas definitely seemed to be willingly there -- or, he paid the price for a boon and understands his duty.

 

I think the hate towards the Dalish could be because they are so blind to the truth, changing things to make happier stories and blinding themselves from the bad. There's no way that those who first became the Dalish didn't know what the markings meant -- yet, they allowed their children to take the markings upon themselves and it becomes a rite of passage. I think because they refuse to see the truth, to hear what someone has to say on the past is what causes those who know to be so bitter and hateful towards them.

 

You cannot just ignore the faults of your people's past, yet, the Dalish are. 

 

 

 

Solas: It is said Falon'din's appetite for adulation was so great, he began wars to amass more worshippers. The blood of those who wouldn't bow low filled lakes as wide as oceans. Mythal rallied the gods, once the shadow of Falon'din's hunter stretched across her own people. It was almost too late. Falon'din only surrendered when his bretheren bloodied him in his own temple. 
Inquisitor: My clan never told a story like that about Falon'din.
Solas: The further the Dalish spread, the further their stories branch and grow. Never mistake them for arbiters of "true" Elvhen culture.

 

 

 

 

Inquisitor: I have not become Mythal's slave.
Solas: Not yet, but if you remove the layer of nostalgia from stories of the elven gods, you might see the danger. They were arrogant and fickle. They warred amongst themselves. They had feuds, vendettas. And you are bound to one of them now.

[Mims]

I definitely think it is a little bit of both.

 

Spoiler

I think Solas had good intentions when he sealed away the elven "gods", whether they were ancient spirits or just extremely powerful and immortal mages. He probably thought that elven society would be the better for it. To sacrifice the company of people who were his peers would have to take a lot- he had to have hope that the 'mortals' were able to handle things on their own.

 

...but they couldn't. I think he does resent them a bit for that. If we are correct on his reasoning for sealing them away, then Solas might even feel as though he traded a vastly superior society that had some problems for nothing. The Dalish, in his eyes, squandered the inheritance and hope he might have put in them. And to make things even worse, they tossed all the blame on his shoulders.

 

Which plays into Cole's line of 'if she's real, then everyone might be real.' Lavellan might be a Dalish-hobo, but she's clearly worthy of that inheritance. If she's worthy, then so might other elves. But then that puts a wrench in his plans. I think its a lot easier for Solas to just focus on restoring the old ways, rather than the possibility of building something new.

 

As for the vallaslin;

 

Spoiler

We don't know too much about how slaves were treated. It might not have been so poorly. Or, it could have even been a cultic type set up where the Solasian upper tier fostered the idea that they were gods upon the slaves.

[Addai]

I did as well! Haha. Though, Solas makes it very clear that he has nothing to do with the Dalish people.

 

Stuck up arse.  For all he knows, some could be his descendants.

At the beginning when he says "your people" to Lavellan and she corrects him that it's "our people," he sounds surprised and says the other Dalish he encountered didn't feel the same way. He approached them wanting to share knowledge and they called him flat ear and drove him away.

 

To be honest, the Dalish are kind of pricks. Of course it's from their suffering, but it leads them to act like wounded animals sometimes- lashing out violently at anything that comes near.

[DragonFr0st]

At the beginning when he says "your people" to Lavellan and she corrects him that it's "our people," he sounds surprised and says the other Dalish he encountered didn't feel the same way. He approached them wanting to share knowledge and they called him flat ear and drove him away.

 

To be honest, the Dalish are kind of pricks. Of course it's from their suffering, but it leads them to act like wounded animals sometimes- lashing out violently at anything that comes near.

 

I think Solas may have approached them openly, sharing his knowledge. And, when questioned, I doubt he would have lied? Which could be the reason as to why he is so closed off from them now.

 

The Dalish are definitely pricks. Regardless of their suffering, they do seem to make things worse by being so harsh. But then again, humans can definitely drive them into responding that way.

[Dr. Doctor]

Spoiler

From the sound of his banter with Varric, Solas desperately wants to fight against the fate that befell the ancient elves. At the same time though he seems to seriously doubt himself after what happened the last time he tried helping.

Does anyone else have the mental image of Kill Bill Solas starring Lady Lavellan as the Bride? Note to self, attempt to make Uma Thurman elfquisitor.

[Nyaore]

Have I ever told you all how much I love you for these extremely interesting topics? Especially since not everyone has the same idea of what might have happened, and went that's shared rather than slam it down like in the other parts of the forums it's acknowledged and perhaps expanded upon or makes people rethink their stances? You guys are wonderful. All of you, and I'm proud to visit this thread each and every day.

 

*breaks out the cake again because wow that was a flowery speech and thus needs to be drowned out with figurative sugar attacks*

[DragonFr0st]

Have I ever told you all how much I love you for these extremely interesting topics? Especially since not everyone has the same idea of what might have happened, and went that's shared rather than slam it down like in the other parts of the forums it's acknowledged and perhaps expanded upon or makes people rethink their stances? You guys are wonderful. All of you, and I'm proud to visit this thread each and every day.

 

*breaks out the cake again because wow that was a flowery speech and thus needs to be drowned out with figurative sugar attacks*

 

Actually, this is why I haven't participated in any of the other threads! I love this Solas' thread so much, and went to look at some of the other places to post at... And just found some fighting that I didn't feel inclined to join in on.

 

This thread has been super welcoming for ideas and theories. I love seeing them expanded upon, or hearing the thoughts of others. Thank you all!

[zambixi]

I think Solas may have approached them openly, sharing his knowledge. And, when questioned, I doubt he would have lied? Which could be the reason as to why he is so closed off from them now.

 

The Dalish are definitely pricks. Regardless of their suffering, they do seem to make things worse by being so harsh. But then again, humans can definitely drive them into responding that way.

 

I don't think the games do a good job of showing just how awful their lives are though. In the novels pretty much every time a noble is dealing with elves an elf gets killed, injured, oppressed, etc. They've been enslaved and had an exalted march forced upon them just because they kept their traditions. I can understand how they'd be suspicious and prickish towards everyone - even other elves.

[vertigomez]

[[devours lore though I have nothing to contribute]]

[Mims]

Have I ever told you all how much I love you for these extremely interesting topics? Especially since not everyone has the same idea of what might have happened, and went that's shared rather than slam it down like in the other parts of the forums it's acknowledged and perhaps expanded upon or makes people rethink their stances? You guys are wonderful. All of you, and I'm proud to visit this thread each and every day.

 

*breaks out the cake again because wow that was a flowery speech and thus needs to be drowned out with figurative sugar attacks*

 

I like to think that the Solas thread is 60% weeping over fictional boyfriend breakup, and 40% mad conspiracy theory. There would be posts all over the walls, with little strings attempting to connect the dots. 

 

We're getting close. 

[DragonFr0st]

I don't think the games do a good job of showing just how awful their lives are though. In the novels pretty much every time a noble is dealing with elves an elf gets killed, injured, oppressed, etc. They've been enslaved and had an exalted march forced upon them just because they kept their traditions. I can understand how they'd be suspicious and prickish towards everyone - even other elves.

 

Oh, agreed. They don't do a good job of it. Humans respond violently quite often. My clan was killed in my game, as well as the alienage. It was depressing. The Exalted March happened for a variety of reasons, and one being that they didn't worship the Maker. It wasn't the triggering point, no, but it was their intent. The Chantry easily decides on doing Exalter Marches... Constantly. They had considered having one on Kirkwall! Yes, it was bad... But Exalted March? Really?

 

Human nobles blame the elves every time something goes wrong. And all elves suffer for it. I do understand them being wary, especially towards other elves. But, I imagine Solas likely didn't expect such response from those whom had lost their past and one who offered to share more knowledge. But, this is grasping at straws and context clues. It's hard to say what really happened to him to make him feel as if the Dalish are all wrong.

[RynJ]

Spoiler

From the sound of his banter with Varric, Solas desperately wants to fight against the fate that befell the ancient elves. At the same time though he seems to seriously doubt himself after what happened the last time he tried helping.

Does anyone else have the mental image of Kill Bill Solas starring Lady Lavellan as the Bride? Note to self, attempt to make Uma Thurman elfquisitor.

 

Spoiler

His banter with Varric definitely gave some evidence that he really is the god of rebellion.

[zambixi]

Starting the game with a F!Human to force myself to romance Cullen and just met Solas. My first thought: Nooo let me go re-make my character I want to be an elf again!

 

 

On an unrelated note, any guesses on whether Solas went to sleep pre-Chantry? And how long he's been awake? I'm trying to remember if he has any Chantry-related dialogue other than saying "are you serious" when you ask Varric if he's with the Chantry in the beginning.

[Nyaore]

I like to think that the Solas thread is 60% weeping over fictional boyfriend breakup, and 40% mad conspiracy theory. There would be posts all over the walls, with little strings attempting to connect the dots. 

 

We're getting close. 

With a big 'WOULD YOU KINDLY, VHENAN' spray painted in the middle... Damn it I have Bioshock on the brain.

[DragonFr0st]

Starting the game with a F!Human to force myself to romance Cullen and just met Solas. My first thought: Nooo let me go re-make my character I want to be an elf again!

 

 

On an unrelated note, any guesses on whether Solas went to sleep pre-Chantry? And how long he's been awake? I'm trying to remember if he has any Chantry-related dialogue other than saying "are you serious" when you ask Varric if he's with the Chantry in the beginning.

 

I do recall him talking on the Chantry a few times. But, none of those times are instances that I've recorded, unfortunately...

 

I'll see if I come across anything on another play through. It's hard to discern an approximate time since his awakening...