108 réponses à ce sujet

[Rawgrim]

20? You sure you haven't installed a modpack and forgotten about it? I can't find that many, romance tracks excepted.

 

I never install any mods. But I think 20 conversations, including during their personal quests and all through ToB is about right.

[Rawgrim]

important question...  what mods are you use because I have BG and BG 2 it does not look that good. also bad news friends BG is also an action rpg a slow, clumsy, story heavy one, but one nonetheless

 

Tactial rpg.

[Morroian]

BG has around 350 spells, for instance. DA has around 30? Your companions can actually die in BG. Only spellcasters can do magic in BG. Loads really. + DA:I is being marketed as an action rpg, and that implies a leaning towards hack and slash.

 

30 spells? Maybe 30 that you can spec into but there are over 200 to choose from.

 

As for the action rpg thing, I recently played DA2 after having played quite a few action rpgs since I last played DA2 and there really is no comparison, the fact that at low difficulty levels the combat can run itself doesn't make it an action rpg. Even DA2 is what I would call a tactical rpg especially on the 2 highest difficulty levels. Its not a fluid action experience. Even if you want to call it an action rpg so what, its hardly a pejorative term, or a sign of it being a bad game. The Witcher series is more of an action rpg than the DA series and look at the general acclaim it gets.

[n7stormrunner]

I know I'm fighting a hopeless battle here but name one tactical element in BG or dragon age.... they aren't even turn based with tactical rpgs are by definition. and no  pause and play is not turn based. they are action rpgs.

[Zazzerka]

I know I'm fighting a hopeless battle here but name one tactical element in BG or dragon age.... they aren't even turn based with tactical rpgs are by definition. and no  pause and play is not turn based. they are action rpgs.

 

Well, I thought the tactics were pretty tactical.

[n7stormrunner]

Well, I thought the tactics were pretty tactical.

 

 

you can use tactics in devil may cry. don't make it a tactical game.

[Zazzerka]

you can use tactics in devil may cry. don't make it a tactical game.

 

Not as defined by elitists, obviously. Any tactician worth his tactical salt would tactically tell you that there is more to tactical tactics than isometric grids.

[n7stormrunner]

Not as defined by elitists, obviously. Any tactician worth his tactical salt would tactically tell you that there is more to tactical tactics than isometric grids.

 

 

I'm still wanting for you to name one. here I'll help fl...... 

 

and no ****. it also isn't defined by being slow and clumsy. but and I know this will come as a shock to many people things have definition and they don't change because because we want them to. and I said nothing about grids. I said turn based.

[Zazzerka]

If the only thing that defines a tactical RPG is that you can leave the game running while you take a piss, then they're not very tactical.

 

Maybe they should've thought up a better sounding name. But I can see how, "I only play tactical RPGs for tactical gamers," would be good for the ego.

[n7stormrunner]

If the only thing that defines a tactical RPG is that you can leave the game running while you take a ******, then they're not very tactical.

 

Maybe they should've thought up a better sounding name. But I can see how, "I only play tactical RPGs for tactical gamers," would be good for the ego.

 

 

it is the only thing but it's one of the big ones. personally don't care what genre the games I play are,

 

but it annoyes the hell out me when when people bash on games for being to much like the genre the game actually is. bioware fans can be really bad about that... I don't think bioware has ever actually made a tactical rpg.

[Rawgrim]

30 spells? Maybe 30 that you can spec into but there are over 200 to choose from.

 

As for the action rpg thing, I recently played DA2 after having played quite a few action rpgs since I last played DA2 and there really is no comparison, the fact that at low difficulty levels the combat can run itself doesn't make it an action rpg. Even DA2 is what I would call a tactical rpg especially on the 2 highest difficulty levels. Its not a fluid action experience. Even if you want to call it an action rpg so what, its hardly a pejorative term, or a sign of it being a bad game. The Witcher series is more of an action rpg than the DA series and look at the general acclaim it gets.

 

Having enemies rain down on your form the ceilling and all that made it a hack and slash game with dialogue. The spawning\raining enemies made positioning your characters a non-factor. You couldn`t even equip or spec your followers to suit your own "combat style" in the game.

 

I wasn`t having a go at DA2, though. I mentioned that DA:I was marketed as an action\rpg. It says so on the main page.

[Vilegrim]

important question...  what mods are you use because I have BG and BG 2 it does not look that good. also bad news friends BG is also an action rpg a slow, clumsy, story heavy one, but one nonetheless

no, it isn't, unless the definition of action rpg just became an rpg with combat....

 

30 spells? Maybe 30 that you can spec into but there are over 200 to choose from.

 

As for the action rpg thing, I recently played DA2 after having played quite a few action rpgs since I last played DA2 and there really is no comparison, the fact that at low difficulty levels the combat can run itself doesn't make it an action rpg. Even DA2 is what I would call a tactical rpg especially on the 2 highest difficulty levels. Its not a fluid action experience. Even if you want to call it an action rpg so what, its hardly a pejorative term, or a sign of it being a bad game. The Witcher series is more of an action rpg than the DA series and look at the general acclaim it gets.

 

Witcher is more action based yes,  but then so is Dark Souls (in fact held up as the paragon, and I flat out despise that series.  Can't get into the story, controls feel clunky, don't like the art style (except the armour and weapons, those are good, at least in the few hours I managed to force myself thru) and the ninja rolling shenigans I could just about tolerate in the witcher are turned up to 13 and destroy immersion (The problem with studying how medieval weapons actually get used I suppose, if someone rolled, especially in armour they deserve the painful beat down they just asked for) 

[n7stormrunner]

no, it isn't, unless the definition of action rpg just became an rpg with combat....

 

 

action rpg is real time. also a mix of rpg and Action Adventure. almost all western rpgs are action rpgs.

[Vilegrim]

How? They lowered the needed specs?

 

 

it works will modern OS, irons out a load of bugs, adds some more content and companions, (of varying quality admittedly) converts BG1 to use the same character creation as BG2, generally does a great job of bringing BG up to date as much as possible, it doesn't look that different, but the native support for higher resolution and tidied up spell effects make a massive difference in quality of life.   If you have a computer that can't run BG or BG2 vanilla...when exactly did you buy it? 1872?

 

 

action rpg is real time. also a mix of rpg and Action Adventure. almost all western rpgs are action rpgs.

 

 

That is a very loose definition, and BG isn't really real-time, you can have it not pause between turns...if you like dying, but pretty much nothing is based on twitch gameplay, which would be a better starting point for a definition.

[Piwi Imytholian]

no, it isn't, unless the definition of action rpg just became an rpg with combat....

 

 

Witcher is more action based yes,  but then so is Dark Souls (in fact held up as the paragon, and I flat out despise that series.  Can't get into the story, controls feel clunky, don't like the art style (except the armour and weapons, those are good, at least in the few hours I managed to force myself thru) and the ninja rolling shenigans I could just about tolerate in the witcher are turned up to 13 and destroy immersion (The problem with studying how medieval weapons actually get used I suppose, if someone rolled, especially in armour they deserve the painful beat down they just asked for) 

It's actually perfectly possible to roll in full plate armor. It won't be the same as doing it in a sweatsuit, but armor is meant to fight. Realistic medieval armor wasn't that heavy or else knights wouldn't have been able to even move around.

[n7stormrunner]

 

That is a very loose definition, and BG isn't really real-time, you can have it not pause between turns...if you like dying, but pretty much nothing is based on twitch gameplay, which would be a better starting point for a definition.

 

no it's not... thats has nothing to do with the definition at all. aand the only thing you need to in BG is pick a target and when things are really dire maybe cast a spell. I've had wet dreams with more tactics then BG.

[Rawgrim]

no it's not... thats has nothing to do with the definition at all. aand the only thing you need to in BG is pick a target and when things are really dire maybe cast a spell. I've had wet dreams with more tactics then BG.

 

Try that vs any of the bossfights in BG2.

 

Are you saying you don`t try to dispel the spells enemy spellcasters cast on themselves and your party? Or use spells to lower magic resistances from Dragons etc?

 

An action rpg is more focused on the player`s reflexes and timing, rather than the stats and skills of the character itself. The focus is heavily aimed at combat, and the flashy movements added to it.

[Rawgrim]

action rpg is real time. also a mix of rpg and Action Adventure. almost all western rpgs are action rpgs.

 

Betrayal at Krondor, Return to Krondor, Ultima 1-7, Might and Magic 1-8, Planescape Torment, Baldur`s Gate 1-2, Drakensang 1-2, Knights of the Old Republic 1-2 + ++ + + +. They have combat in them, sure. But they arn`t action rpgs by a long shot.

[Vilegrim]

It's actually perfectly possible to roll in full plate armor. It won't be the same as doing it in a sweatsuit, but armor is meant to fight. Realistic medieval armor wasn't that heavy or else knights wouldn't have been able to even move around.

 

 

IT is possible, it is also asking for a kicking, you CAN do star jumps in full armour, or press ups, the battlefield however is not the place for them, you roll, I lunge, you get a spear point some where you don't want it, I win.  That is if you don't get stuck in the gory, sucking mud mess, roll into a bunch of snapped arrow shafts, get tangled in a corpse etc etc.  There is a reason why alot of fights end with 'and when he is on the ground stab him in the balls'  Bullock daggers have that name for a reason.

[leaguer of one]

1. the choices is about sticking to your aligment and your character's beliefs. So personal consequence is a factor since the aligment can change. That has a severe effect on rangers, druids and paladins, for example. Since your god stops granting you spells and abilities if your aligment changes. You can add this to the tactical bit you adress too. Since you might be playing the remainder of the game with your character being all out of spells.

 

2. Cutting someone's brain out might not have been something you didn't shy away from. Certainly. But my paladin certainly had issues with that act. Its cold blooded murder and mutilation, caused by blackmail.

 

3. You can hand Valygar over to the authorities for money, or rather that corrupt wizard fellow. That leaves him in a position of power, you give him even more power too. Due to the planar sphere. You can also convince Anomen not to take revenge on a corrupt noble, for "probably" having killed his sister. And you can avoid helping Nalia, and leave her to her fate when she gets imprisined. That will give the Roenal family her lands and they will rule her lands (very poorly). Is this what you feel the game lacked?

 

4. The dreams were explained in the game. You get hints at first, then the game tells it to you flat out. You were comunicating with the essence of Bhaal inside you. More or less. Very very much tied to the entire core of the story.

 

5. Irenicus isn`t about power for the sake of power. He lost his "immortallity" due to something he did. and he wants it back + revenge. Have a look at his journal and things like that, and you will see that the story is actually a bitter-sweet one. I agree with you on Sarevok. Cardboard black-armoured badguy.

 

6. Yes. Games have given villains more depth over the years. And choices are more deep too. I just don`t agree with you that the BG games didn`t have them. Bg2 anyway. I don`t think BG1 had too much of that.

1. Again , not getting it. Having a choice to stay to your alignment or not is pointless if their is no motivation to change your Alignment. If you have a choice to stay on your alignment with nothing but pros and a choice to change you alignment with pro's and con's then why would  you do the choice that would change your Alignment?  Let's say in place of the deep gnome choice in bg2 their was instead a choice where you had to pick saving a small group of people who are leaders and letting more die or letting more die to save a small group of people. In that choice you have to deal with the pro's and con's on the issue. It more then just a choice based on alignment but with many more issue. None of the choices in BG1 or 2 has any of that.

 

2.A paladin would have issues killing off an evil creature? Added you do have ways around being forced to do it.

 

3.And none of that have conflict of morality in them. It an issue were the game just tempt you to do a immoral choice with no push to get the play to make that choice out side player greed. It not about what choice you can pick it about why you picked that choice. 

 

4.The being pretending to be your sister in the dreams was the essence of Bhaal not Irenicus.

 

5.Yes he is doing it for power sake. He lost is immortality because of his bid for power. Even before the story of BG2 he tried to become a god and got punished for it. Revenge ties to it because he was upset with the degree of the punishment. It was still an issue over power regardless.

 

6.Bg1 and 2 never really put the issue of the player morality to the test. All they did was tempt the play to change their morality, it never put the play in a positions that they may have to do something morally conflicting to do something based on their morality.

[leaguer of one]

I know I'm fighting a hopeless battle here but name one tactical element in BG or dragon age.... they aren't even turn based with tactical rpgs are by definition. and no  pause and play is not turn based. they are action rpgs.

Why does it matter if it's turn based or not?

[leaguer of one]

no it's not... thats has nothing to do with the definition at all. aand the only thing you need to in BG is pick a target and when things are really dire maybe cast a spell. I've had wet dreams with more tactics then BG.

....Have you even played the game?

 I love to see you do that against mindflyers, the undead, demons, dragons, and mages. BG1 and 2's combat is all about preparation and prevention. It not about running in, enduring everything that hit's you and trading blows like modern rpg's. That will always get you killed to by bg like a modern rpg.

[Vilegrim]

Why does it matter if it's turn based or not?

 

 

Because that is usually the sign of character skill with player tactics, vs player reactions and player tactics.

[leaguer of one]

action rpg is real time. also a mix of rpg and Action Adventure. almost all western rpgs are action rpgs.

Wrong. Action rpg are when the player has the majority of control pc action in combat and gameplay were traditionally that is controlled by stats.

 

If ME was an traditional rpg, aiming would be controlled by stats, the shot hitting would be controlled by stats, avoiding shot's would be controlled by stats. Stats in an action rpg support and buff the pc actions. It increases attack power, allows the player to move the character faster,hits are endured more, and you get more power to do attacks. Turn base has nothing to do with it being an action rpg or not.