22 réponses à ce sujet

[filetemo]

I read about somebody thinking about how Solas maintains his head perfectly shaven at all times, being a temple rat and so on.

 

And then I thought: What if Solas is presented to us with long wild hair, and when we have interiorised his appearance, then he shocks us by shaving his head? On his own behalf

 

This has nothing to do with customisation or player agency, this is about followers being living breathing entities that, as regular humans, change their appearances based on their life experiences and on what others and themselves think they should look.

 

When companions follow you for a long time and live traumatic events that scar their souls and bodies, that should show. Patrick Weekes commented on Twitter that Bioware characters grow and evolve emotionally, but in reality all maturity changes come with changes in the way they look, think and dress.

 

Unexpected changes of looks are a win/win situation: not only do they show that a follower is alive, but can be reverted for gameplay reasons. After a while separated of the group, a follower can choose to wear certain type of armor because he feels it suits his style. You can override that decision since he's now in your party again.

 

A trickier situation would be hair and facial. Let's pretend one day, just like that, Sera decides to shave her head. That shows her rebellious side, and shows she's been scarred emotionally by past battles (I know it's a pretty one dimensional example, but it serves me). 

 

And then you dislike Sera because you do not like her new hair. Here we could give the player the option to say: "Grow your hair back". And of course, she could disagree. And of course some players would say "I'm the PC and I want her to do this! It's my follower, not Bioware's! And others would say: "Well, she's as alive as my Inquisitor"

 

Or we can have her say "OK,I'll grow it back". Everybody is happy. Except some people complaining that the followers are too "playercentric, playersexual and playerverything"

 

TL;DR: Companions should age, change haircuts, and change non-combat dresses on their own, as part of their character arc, just like maturing and changing their views on the world is currently part of their character arc. Different aeesthetic choices would be the result of player's past moral choices and story decisions.

[Maraas]

Would've been nice to have this feature, but must have? Uh-uh.

[dutch_gamer]

Would've been nice to have this feature, but must have? Uh-uh.

Everything that makes a game seem more like a real world is nice to have but in the end it is always about resources. Developers are bound by the budget and understand why it may be great to dream big it is just not always feasible. I wish gamers will some come to understand this as well instead of wanting everything never thinking about the limitations of development. Some ideas are just too resource intensive which doesn't add enough to a game to warrant the increased cost. Games have become increasingly more expensive to make, in part due to gamer demands.

[Maraas]

Everything that makes a game seem more like a real world is nice to have but in the end it is always about resources.

Yep. To quote askagamedev,

Spoiler

Here’s the thing about feature lists. Not every feature on a feature list is created equal. “Create female protagonist” is quite different than, say, “Implement tweakable cone of fire for handgun” or “Add Reset button to talent tree interface”. Every feature, no matter how big or small, is triaged. That is to say, at some point somebody somewhere will have a meeting, figure out how important that feature is and how much time it will take to implement it, and then rank it in terms of importance relative to other features on the list. The list is then broken down to the must-haves (which are necessary to ship, come hell or high water), the stretch goals (usually low-hanging fruit - stuff that adds more to the game relative to the amount of effort to do it), and the wishlist (maybe DLC, patch, or next game).

I’ve never worked on a game that didn’t have a wishlist that was as long or longer than the must-haves and stretch goals put together (and I’ve worked on a lot of games). If you think that you’ve got ideas for game features, let me tell you - developers really have ideas for game features. There are tons upon tons of ideas for features that we regularly go through and most of them are usually very doable (we’ve had lots of practice). But we still have to triage them and figure out what does and doesn’t make the cut, because our development resources are finite, and sometimes you really need that designer or engineer working on the core gameplay feature more than you need that nice-to-have extra, even if the nice-to-have extra would be cheap.

So it's not even about resourse intensive ideas, it's just that developers always have their hands full with critical stuff which already is in the game to handle additional "should haves" as well.

[happy_daiz]

Hmm, no thanks. I really don't see a value being added, and I'd rather the devs focus on whatever they see as a priority.

[Naktis]

You shouldve made this thread before DA2 , coz over period of years , companions didnt change to much!!!

[filetemo]

You shouldve made this thread before DA2 , coz over period of years , companions didnt change to much!!!

it's never too late. Besides, the hair styles of the CC could be used so followers do not need additional design and do not spend resources. If this feature was planned to be included from the ground up it wouldn't cost anything.

 

"From the start  of act 3 character xxx sports haircut number 0x000bxc"

 

Besides, too many times people invokes the "too resource expensive" to dismiss something they do not like. Fact is nobody knows how much would this cost, if any.

[Jawzzus]

Everything that makes a game seem more like a real world is nice to have but in the end it is always about resources.

 

Kinda off topic but personally I disagree about the first part of that sentence (second part is pretty true).  I want my games to not be like the real world, if I want the real world, I'll just go outside and stuff, I play games to get away and do things I can't do in the real world.

[In Exile]

Changes in appearance can be very symbolic. Tales of the Abyss had a moment like that when the protagonist cuts his hair.

[Lorien19]

That would be a nice feature indeed,although I imagine it'll be difficult to implement.

[In Exile]

That would be a nice feature indeed,although I imagine it'll be difficult to implement.

 

Hair you'd imagine isn't that hard, since there's the CC available for it. It would be costly only in the opportunity cost sense (whoever designs a second look for Solas isn't available to design an NPC) 

[hexaligned]

Eh, I don't really see it as reflection of reality.  In the last 5 years, I left the military, finished my masters, got a nice cushy civilian job, and got married.  Pretty big life changes, physically the only thing that changed is my  beard has some silver in it now.  People (over the age of 20) usually don't change, unless they are drug to it kicking and screaming the entire way.  Maybe I just don't associate with people with unstable ego's though I guess.

 

I know you mean it in terms of purely a literary device, I still prefer more subtle writing than just being beaten over the head with obvious symbolism though. If it was integrated into the mechanics of the game somehow (Fable's 1's scarring system as an example... only good), that might be alright, as it would be somewhat organic to how the story is playing out on any particular play-through.  

[Lucidae]

 

TL;DR: Companions should age, change haircuts, and change non-combat dresses on their own, as part of their character arc, just like maturing and changing their views on the world is currently part of their character arc. Different aeesthetic choices would be the result of player's past moral choices and story decisions.

 

 

I think this is happening but to a smaller extent. For example: for Solas there is a picture of him in different armors. The armor all stems from the basic version, but it gets more complicated and interesting. I think as we play the game and get better gear/progress through story our companions' clothing will "upgrade aesthetically" itself.

[Ascendra]

Unless the game spans a decade (like DA2), no, i dont think its necessary.
However there is a hidden morph in DA2 files showing corrupted Anders. Modders restored it at some point. Would have been cool if the change was there in the game.

[godModeAlpha]

Would have been nice to see which outfits Vivienne and Dorian decide to pick from a warrior armor inventory.

[filetemo]

.  Pretty big life changes, physically the only thing that changed is my  beard has some silver in it now.  

this bears more importance than you may think. If due to your decisions, Blackwalls life was so stressful that his beard turned grey you could say "holy hell this guy had it tough, partly thanks to me." The result of your actions influencing his aging would be as iconic as bioware has ever desired to make its characters look. 

 

It would be iconic to you, because you made it happen.

[In Exile]

Eh, I don't really see it as reflection of reality.  In the last 5 years, I left the military, finished my masters, got a nice cushy civilian job, and got married.  Pretty big life changes, physically the only thing that changed is my  beard has some silver in it now.  People (over the age of 20) usually don't change, unless they are drug to it kicking and screaming the entire way.  Maybe I just don't associate with people with unstable ego's though I guess.

 

I know you mean it in terms of purely a literary device, I still prefer more subtle writing than just being beaten over the head with obvious symbolism though. If it was integrated into the mechanics of the game somehow (Fable's 1's scarring system as an example... only good), that might be alright, as it would be somewhat organic to how the story is playing out on any particular play-through.  

 

You keep the same hairstyle and wear the same clothes? At any rate, that's more what I thought the OP was talking about. 

[Nefla]

You keep the same hairstyle and wear the same clothes? At any rate, that's more what I thought the OP was talking about.

Speaking only for myself, I don't change my style. Individual articles of clothing wear out yes, buy my theme is the same. I'm 30, I'm not going to randomly decide one day that I want a bunch of tattoos and to start dressing in punk fashion. I change my hair more than anyone I've met but that's because my hair grows so fast. Most people I know never change their hairstyle. My best friend has had the same hair since we met at age 11. Even with all of our modern conveniences, hair products, hairstylists, clothing stores, stationary and non combat lifestyle, etc...most people never change much.

That's not to say I'm against this idea, but extreme style change should be limited to one or two characters, especially if the game spans like a year (vs DA2's 7 years and stationary setting where change would have been welcome). I like the ideas of characters getting scars in something story related and similar. I'm not really on board with a bunch of characters having a fit and shaving their head.

We already don't control our companions looks, Dorian will still have that French waiter mustache no matter what you do, Solas will be bald no matter what you do, Vivienne will be fashionable and flamboyant no matter what, etc...the characters have already decided their hair and styles outside of our influence.

[In Exile]

Speaking only for myself, I don't change my style. Individual articles of clothing wear out yes, buy my theme is the same. I'm 30, I'm not going to randomly decide one day that I want a bunch of tattoos and to start dressing in punk fashion. I change my hair more than anyone I've met but that's because my hair grows so fast. Most people I know never change their hairstyle. My best friend has had the same hair since we met at age 11. Even with all of our modern conveniences, hair products, hairstylists, clothing stores, stationary and non combat lifestyle, etc...most people never change much.

That's not to say I'm against this idea, but extreme style change should be limited to one or two characters, especially if the game spans like a year (vs DA2's 7 years and stationary setting where change would have been welcome). I like the ideas of characters getting scars in something story related and similar. I'm not really on board with a bunch of characters having a fit and shaving their head.

We already don't control our companions looks, Dorian will still have that French waiter mustache no matter what you do, Solas will be bald no matter what you do, Vivienne will be fashionable and flamboyant no matter what, etc...the characters have already decided their hair and styles outside of our influence.

 

That's really interesting. I won't say that I change my fashion or hairstyle radically, but I change looks about every year or so. I remember I freaked out my best friend the other day when I showed up with longer hair and a t-shirt, because I hadn't worn (just) a t-shirt at all in the past two years (in the summer, it was always a short-sleeved polo). I just get bored of looking the same. 

 

The hardest part is finding the right hair product. Changing hairstyles means styling my hair differently, or going to get a hair cut more often, and that's annoying. 

[AresKeith]

This would've been cool during DA2

[Nefla]

That's really interesting. I won't say that I change my fashion or hairstyle radically, but I change looks about every year or so. I remember I freaked out my best friend the other day when I showed up with longer hair and a t-shirt, because I hadn't worn (just) a t-shirt at all in the past two years (in the summer, it was always a short-sleeved polo). I just get bored of looking the same. 

 

The hardest part is finding the right hair product. Changing hairstyles means styling my hair differently, or going to get a hair cut more often, and that's annoying. 

I guess it's pretty hard for me to get bored with women's clothing, there's just sooo much out there. So it's less of "I always wear a wrap dress" and more "I always wear clothes that are flattering, feminine, and fashionable with a bit of whimsical or unique details." So the clothes may change, the style or theme stays the same.

 

I really wish they had made an effort to change the characters in DA2. Aveline was the only one who made sense wearing the same thing for 8 years since it's a guard uniform. The rest of them just wore clothes and those clothes must have been mighty smelly and full of holes after 8 years. Everyone still had the same hair length too and you'd have expected Anders to grow a scraggly beard since he isn't exactly living the high life (unless you romance him and move him in I suppose). The time skips were really a missed opportunity.

[hexaligned]

You keep the same hairstyle and wear the same clothes? At any rate, that's more what I thought the OP was talking about. 

Well I don't "style" my hair, I get it cut when it's long enough to annoy me, and otherwise ignore it.  Unless running my fingers through it when I get out the the shower counts as a style.  As far as clothes go I'm either in jeans and a T, or jeans and a fleece, with hiking/combat boots.  Given I'm currently living in the Adirondacks, it's usually the latter.  As I said, when I was a kid I went through different phases and changed my look around, when you get to my age (nearing 30) you pretty much have what you care to present to other people figured out though.

 

REGARDLESS: I'd just rather companions personal conflicts be presented in a better way than, I'M SAD SO I SHAVED MY HEAD.  Or similar.

[adorkable-panda]

This would've been cool during DA2

Agreed, that's why when i played on PC i used mods to make it look like some characters aged, like Merrill and the HawkeSiblings. It would make sense considering that the game jumps over the course of ten years i believe. 

 

Back on topic, I highly doubt they'd invest resources on something like this, as cool as it'd be it's just not realistic. The farthest I would hope it would go would be probably growing a wee bit of hair and maybe even facial hair on the men but I don't think anything too radical is realistic.