48 réponses à ce sujet

[TheMadHarridan]

So, I was playing Return to Ostagar yesterday, and after reading Cailan's documents, it got me to wondering about the lack of a Cailan/Anora heir. Is Anora really barren as people and the documents suggest? Or is it actually Cailan who is, shall we say, shooting blanks? Anora herself says that Cailan "had his women," and since we don't hear anything about a bunch of Cailan's little bastards running around, it makes me think that Cailan is the one who is infertile and not Anora.

 

Now I haven't read the books or the comics and I haven't seen the movies (I know, I'm deprived), so perhaps this has been addressed, and I just don't know it. What does everyone think?

[Althix]

... i don't really care to be honest. besides isn't that Alistair now? because Cailan is very dead, and last time i checked Anora rules with Alistair as background.

[TheMadHarridan]

Well, I'm curious about it, which is why I asked. I'm well aware that Alistair or the Warden can take over the job of heir-producing, but Anora being "barren" is mentioned enough in the game that it made me wonder.

[caradoc2000]

It is not confirmed anywhere. If your Warden marries Loghain, he does tell you to make some babies, pronto, so at least he thinks Anora can have kids.

[Ananka]

It is not confirmed anywhere. If your Warden marries Loghain, he does tell you to make some babies, pronto, so at least he thinks Anora can have kids.

 

Uh...

 

Alistair disapproves -1000?

 

Edit: I get that it was just a mistake but I mean oh ****. What an end to that Landsmeet.

[Han Shot First]

The suggestion that Anora might be barren originates with Arl Eamon. The problem is that he's not the most objective source. He needs Anora to be barren, because Cailan needs to sire an heir. Cailan not siring an heir would be a disaster both for the kingdom and for Arl Eamon or his heirs, because it would guarantee a succession crisis, and threaten his own family's power and influence in the kingdom. While Eamon derives some of his influence from his control of strategic Redcliffe, part of his political power is also derived from the fact that the ruling monarch is a blood relative. If the problem producing an heir is with Anora rather than Cailan, Eamon still would have the hope of getting that royal heir by convincing Cailan to divorce Anora and take another bride.

 

In short, I think the suggestion that Anora is barren is mostly wishful thinking on Eamon's part. We don't know for sure whether the problem was with Cailan or Anora. Given that Cailan apparently has had dalliances with other women however, none of whom has sired bastards that we know of, there is perhaps a bit more reason to suspect that Cailan was the problem rather than Anora. It is by no means certain though.

[sylvanaerie]

I think in the end it's kind of moot. Maybe both are unable to have children, as the ending for Anora as queen has her either not marrying, marrying Alistair or the Warden, and no children anyway due to Grey Warden infertility.

 

Regardless of who rules, I think Bioware is heading in this direction: No kids to follow the current ruler, prompting a lot more story potential in the future.

 

The OGB as a potential heir wouldn't be viable since 1) it may not exist at all 2) may be the result of a tryst with the PC and Morrigan 3) may be Loghain's child.  Too many variables there, and that's if you can pry Morrigan's steely grip from her little pawn.

[caradoc2000]

Uh...

 

Alistair disapproves -1000?

 

Edit: I get that it was just a mistake but I mean oh ****. What an end to that Landsmeet.

Huh? Your HN male Warden can marry Anora.

[sylvanaerie]

Huh? Your HN male Warden can marry Anora.

You said  the warden marries Loghain, not Anora.

[caradoc2000]

You said  the warden marries Loghain, not Anora.

Considering how much Loghain is meddling into his daughter's affairs, HNM might as well marry him.

[Han Shot First]

I think in the end it's kind of moot. Maybe both are unable to have children, as the ending for Anora as queen has her either not marrying, marrying Alistair or the Warden, and no children anyway due to Grey Warden infertility.

 

 

Wardens aren't completely sterile/infertile. They can have children, they just have a very low probability of it.

[Milan92]

It does sound like Ferelden will collapse into another cival war eventually no matter who sits on the throne. Though, I hope it won't become a main story point for a next game, since we already had a civil war in DAO.

[Han Shot First]

It does sound like Ferelden will collapse into another cival war eventually no matter who sits on the throne. Though, I hope it won't become a main story point for a next game, since we already had a civil war in DAO.

 

I'm hoping they won't go that route either, since we've already had a Civil War and a Blight in Ferelden. Assuming the series ever moves far foward enough in the timeline that Alistair, the Warden, and Anora should have died, I'm hoping there is an heir to assume the throne and a succession crisis is avoided. Have an heir be produced in all outcomes.

[ShadowLordXII]

I'd argue that she's being scapegoated for Cailan's infertility. He had some women on the side and yet Alistair is the only royal bastard to emerge from the wood-works? 

 

That or she's not necessarily barren, but her fertility is lower than average which has people worried.

[Beerfish]

Anora......ever see 'The Crying Game'?

[Jeffonl1]

So, I was playing Return to Ostagar yesterday, and after reading Cailan's documents, it got me to wondering about the lack of a Cailan/Anora heir. Is Anora really barren as people and the documents suggest? Or is it actually Cailan who is, shall we say, shooting blanks? Anora herself says that Cailan "had his women," and since we don't hear anything about a bunch of Cailan's little bastards running around, it makes me think that Cailan is the one who is infertile and not Anora.

Now I haven't read the books or the comics and I haven't seen the movies (I know, I'm deprived), so perhaps this has been addressed, and I just don't know it. What does everyone think?

Even the suggestion that Anora is infertile is good grounds for divorce, especially in favor of a politically powerful marriage to Celene the empress of Orlais (to Loghains intense joy lol)
As the Therin line might die out there would, I think, be strong motivation to blame anyone else except Cailan himself.

[ShadowLordXII]

It does sound like Ferelden will collapse into another cival war eventually no matter who sits on the throne. Though, I hope it won't become a main story point for a next game, since we already had a civil war in DAO.

 

It would also make the whole Landsmeet basically pointless. The whole point of the Landsmeet was to bring Ferelden back together and I'm going to call it cheap for the throne to become empty again despite our efforts.

 

If Fiona, an elven Grey Warden (two combined traits which make child-bearing with a human difficult by themselves) can have a kid with Maric, then Alistair (whose already potentially knocked up one woman so he's fertile for at least a while longer) or Anora (I think Awakening implied that she's already with the Warden-King's child? Just something I saw based on Loghain's dialogue in his cameo) should be able to have at least 1 heir in the next 10 years. Even the F'WardenxAlistair coupling shouldn't be left in the dust despite it's stark nigh-impossibility, just come up with a logical reason why their case was the exception to the rule (Avernus, fertility idol, or just lots of coitus)

 

We've got enough bleakness, having yet another succession crisis is just asking for people to call bull$#@&.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Either she's infertile, Cailan's shooting blanks, or they're just unlucky as a couple.

Or plot.

[sylvanaerie]

Conceivably, it could be BOTH of them were infertile.  Many people dismiss one or the other, but the fault may lie there.  And Warden hasn't knocked up Anora by Awakening. Loghain's convo is *paraphrased* better get her with child soon, not 'when is she due'.

 

Alistair will say to a HNF he's going to marry that all the GW's he knew with kids had them prior to the Joining.  He's never heard of 2 grey wardens having one.

 

This topic has been done over many times on the boards.  I seem to recall something like it's going to be nigh impossible for the PC to have a kid, either with Anora or Alistair.

 

Frankly, my Cousland ruler would just leave it to Fergus' little ones and be done with the whole damn thing altogether when the warden heads out to his/her calling.

[theskymoves]

Maybe they just weren't doing 'it'. (At least not with each other.) 

[Mike3207]

I think Gaider is just tiptoeing around the possibility of a royal heir.It won't really be addressed until the last game in the DA series.

I don't remember the exact quote, but I think Gaider implied you'd need strong magic to make a child between 2 wardens possible.A good comparison would be the magic used in the Dark Ritual.

[ShadowLordXII]

I think Gaider is just tiptoeing around the possibility of a royal heir.It won't really be addressed until the last game in the DA series.

I don't remember the exact quote, but I think Gaider implied you'd need strong magic to make a child between 2 wardens possible.A good comparison would be the magic used in the Dark Ritual.

 

Yet another reason to spare Avernus. Seriously, that guy is probably the most powerful mage in Ferelden (if not the world) by virtue of being more experienced and knowledgeable than any other mage alive.

[Xetykins]

Maybe they just weren't doing 'it'. (At least not with each other.) 

Or wrong target :-p

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Considering how much Loghain is meddling into his daughter's affairs, HNM might as well marry him.

I only had one HNM who married Anora, and Loghain wasn't really an issue by the end of that playthrough. *slice*