756 réponses à ce sujet

[Vilegrim]

No it not. It's a speculation. No proof means speculation.

 

ahh I see you aren't speaking english, you are speaking torture apologist, right.  Seriously he says 'put the mages to the question' who much clearer does he have to be?

[leaguer of one]

Fan girls be like 

Why you have to show that psycho pedo?

[Vilegrim]

Defined 'meaningful way'. 

 

 

 

Treat them the same way they treat the Dalish.

[leaguer of one]

ahh I see you aren't speaking english, you are speaking torture apologist, right.

It's English. You just want to push your point with out having any proof. Sorry, your point is a speculation. It's like saying Cassandra tortured Virric when she question him simply because she question him.

[Vilegrim]

It's English. You just want to push your point with out having any proof. Sorry, your point is a speculation. It's like saying Cassandra tortured Virric when she question him simply because she question him.

 

 

'Put someone to the Question' is a clear command to torture.  Interrogate someone isn't.  Interrogate then would have been ambiguous, put them to the question is clear.  

[Boomshakalakalakaboom]

'the question' is a standard euphemism, and we have seen that torture is used in the DA verse.  This is like claiming the 'Tranquil Solution' isn't refering to forced tranquility of mages who passed the test.

Yeah we have seen that torture can be pretty rife within the Templar Order but there is absolutely no evidence of Cullen torturing anyone, well none that I am aware of. If there is some then feel free to point it out to me.

Just because there is evil within a certain group doesn't mean you can accuse all of the people in the group of the same morally wrong acts, which is, funnily enough, people's arguments for Mages. Just because some Mages choose to give themselves to a demon and/or mess around with blood magic doesn't mean they all do. Cullen saw that at the end. Maybe you could come to see the same for Templars.

[Nyeredzi]

Why you have to show that psycho pedo?

This is what fan girls are on the inside...

[leaguer of one]

'Put someone to the Question' is a clear command to torture.  Interrogate someone isn't.  Interrogate then would have been ambiguous, put them to the question is clear.  

Virric was put to question..... Was he tortured?

 

Sorry but the saying put to question and interrogate have the same meaning. They are equally ambiguous. So being that it is ambiguous you have to show "proof" that they were tortured. Not speculate it.

[Vilegrim]

Yeah we have seen that torture can be pretty rife within the Templar Order but there is absolutely no evidence of Cullen torturing anyone, well none that I am aware of. If there is some then feel free to point it out to me.

Just because there is evil within a certain group doesn't mean you can accuse all of the people in the group of the same morally wrong acts, which is, funnily enough, people's arguments for Mages. Just because some Mages choose to give themselves to a demon and/or mess around with blood magic doesn't mean they all do. Cullen saw that at the end. Maybe you could come to see the same for Templars.

 

Yeah we have seen that torture can be pretty rife within the Templar Order but there is absolutely no evidence of Cullen torturing anyone, well none that I am aware of. If there is some then feel free to point it out to me.

Just because there is evil within a certain group doesn't mean you can accuse all of the people in the group of the same morally wrong acts, which is, funnily enough, people's arguments for Mages. Just because some Mages choose to give themselves to a demon and/or mess around with blood magic doesn't mean they all do. Cullen saw that at the end. Maybe you could come to see the same for Templars.

 

 

Cullen knowingly joijned a group whose SOP is torture and oppression, a mage is born that way, that is the difference right their.  It's akin to blaming all Russians for something (which would be wrong) as opposed to holding a KGB agent responsible for joining that agency, which is a legitimate stand point.

[leaguer of one]

This is what fan girls are on the inside...

"Gon, why do you have to stare at me when I'm so "excited"."

 

 

.....

*Runs for the hills

[Boomshakalakalakaboom]

'Put someone to the Question' is a clear command to torture.  Interrogate someone isn't.  Interrogate then would have been ambiguous, put them to the question is clear.

I actually find the word "interrogate" to be more connected to torture than "question".

[NoForgiveness]

Yeah we have seen that torture can be pretty rife within the Templar Order but there is absolutely no evidence of Cullen torturing anyone, well none that I am aware of. If there is some then feel free to point it out to me.

Just because there is evil within a certain group doesn't mean you can accuse all of the people in the group of the same morally wrong acts, which is, funnily enough, people's arguments for Mages. Just because some Mages choose to give themselves to a demon and/or mess around with blood magic doesn't mean they all do. Cullen saw that at the end. Maybe you could come to see the same for Templars.

 

Redemption. People are being tortured in Kirkwall. I think its a dalish elf to be specific. I assume it takes place in act 1/2 because of the qunari being there. And I don't see how Cullen couldn't have known about it. Unless there was a group going against what their superiors wanted(which we didn't see any sign of until act 2....)
 

[leaguer of one]

Cullen knowingly joijned a group whose SOP is torture and oppression, a mage is born that way, that is the difference right their.  It's akin to blaming all Russians for something (which would be wrong) as opposed to holding a KGB agent responsible for joining that agency, which is a legitimate stand point.

You well know not all Templers in Kirkwall were like that. Seriously, you need "proof" to prove you point. This is a guy who let an apostate run free for over 6 years. 1 of those years that apostate was a nothing with no power.

[Mister Sunshine]

Well... Orsino did keep his mouth shut about this on mage....

Spoiler

[

Fair point. 

 

I blame Orsino for not stopping the blood mages he knew about.

 

I blame Cullen for not stopping the Rites of Tranquility, for following orders during Merediths madness.  'Just Following Orders' has NEVER been a defence.

Okay. I was just wondering.

I don't know how much of a position Cullen or anyone was in to resist Meredith, though. She doesn't strike me as the type to take criticism of her leadership well. After a while, I think it stops being 'just following orders' and becomes 'can't resist orders'. 

[leaguer of one]

Redemption. People are being tortured in Kirkwall. I think its a dalish elf to be specific. I assume it takes place in act 1/2 because of the qunari being there. And I don't see how Cullen couldn't have known about it. Unless there was a group going against what their superiors wanted(which we didn't see any sign of until act 2....)
 

Each knight captian act on their own excepts when the knight commander says other wise. What would he do about it?

[NoForgiveness]

Each knight captian act on their own excepts when the knight commander says other wise. What would he do about it?

 

Condone it I assume?
 

[Lost_In_Anarchy]

Cullen knowingly joijned a group whose SOP is torture and oppression, a mage is born that way, that is the difference right their.  It's akin to blaming all Russians for something (which would be wrong) as opposed to holding a KGB agent responsible for joining that agency, which is a legitimate stand point.

*puts on Alistair voice* Hmm, I missed the torture and oppression clause when I was sent to the Chantry.

 

I'm sorry, but while I dislike Templars that is not their SOP. For some it may be, but there are those like Cullen and Alistair, remember him loveable smart alek Grey Warden, thinks swooping is bad? He was a Templar before Duncan recruited him. I point again to the Standford Prison study I posted earlier about how something with the best intentions can go horribly wrong, but to declare that the purpose was always evil is just... blind.

[Vilegrim]

I actually find the word "interrogate" to be more connected to torture than "question".

 

 

 

The question or torture, a means sometimes used in important criminal cases to bring the accused to confess to the crime he is accused of or to disclose the names of his accomplices.

The accused undergoes violent torture, which is nonetheless not ordinarily liable to cause his death.

Such torture is called the question because as the accused is made to suffer, he is asked questions about his crime and his accomplices, if it is suspected that there are some

http://quod.lib.umic...n;view=fulltext

 

The definition of 'put to the question' taken from  'The Question or Torture' by Antoine-Gaspard Boucher d'Argis  Translated by Malcolm Eden for the University of London.  

[BabyFratelli]

Debating is great but let's not start insulting fan bases or anything, especially the Cullenites. They're simply cute and excited, and generally very respectful of dissenting opinions. Leave them alone. 

[Boomshakalakalakaboom]

Cullen knowingly joijned a group whose SOP is torture and oppression, a mage is born that way, that is the difference right their.  It's akin to blaming all Russians for something (which would be wrong) as opposed to holding a KGB agent responsible for joining that agency, which is a legitimate stand point.

I think Cullen knowingly joined a group that he was naive enough to believe were noble knights keeping people safe from mages and mages safe from people as per his upbringing in the andastrian faith, but that is just my speculation --just as your comment is your speculation-- But I could be wrong.

[Vilegrim]

*puts on Alistair voice* Hmm, I missed the torture and oppression clause when I was sent to the Chantry.

 

I'm sorry, but while I dislike Templars that is not their SOP. For some it may be, but there are those like Cullen and Alistair, remember him loveable smart alek Grey Warden, thinks swooping is bad? He was a Templar before Duncan recruited him. I point again to the Standford Prison study I posted earlier about how something with the best intentions can go horribly wrong, but to declare that the purpose was always evil is just... blind.

 

 

Who said I forgave Alistair?

[leaguer of one]

Condone it I assume?
 

Or just focus on what he could do.

[leaguer of one]

Who said I forgave Alistair?

*facepalm

 

He was not even a real Templer.

[Lost_In_Anarchy]

Redemption. People are being tortured in Kirkwall. I think its a dalish elf to be specific. I assume it takes place in act 1/2 because of the qunari being there. And I don't see how Cullen couldn't have known about it. Unless there was a group going against what their superiors wanted(which we didn't see any sign of until act 2....)
 

*cough* Alrik *cough* Anders: "The Divine... rejected his idea. Meredith rejected his idea." Yet Alrik went about his Grand Solution under his superiors noses. Just saying.

[NoForgiveness]

I think Cullen knowingly joined a group that he was naive enough to believe were noble knights keeping people safe from mages and mages safe from people as per his upbringing in the andastrian faith, but that is just my speculation --just as your comment is your speculation-- But I could be wrong.

 

I agree, I  actually think when he joined he was the "wanted to be a hero" type.