756 réponses à ce sujet

[Adanu]

To those arguing that Cullen is not qualified to lead troops, let's remember that none of the Warden backgrounds, barring Dwarf and Human Nobles, were qualified to be leaders either. Yet they rose to the challenge and ended up saving the world from the Blight in record time. 

 

Every great general has started as a trainee. Don't discount him. 

 

Being a leader is about personality and sound judgment. Cullen has demonstrated neither quality.

 

He has a lot of work to do for me to consider him as anything but an incompetent Templar appointed because of his PTSD at the Fereldan tower making him biased against mages, thus making him easy to control for Meredith.

[Vilegrim]

In the same way that the fact that the GWs officially converted to the Andrastian as a show of support and favour to Orlais and Drakon for their contributions in the Second Blight did not make them a religious organization. 

 

 

So?  The correct position for the divine is limbless and screaming, not having her Hands in my business.  I'd rather the tears destroy Thedas than the Chantry survive.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

It is actually quite hilarious to find people here saying that Cullen is a good choice for military adviser. 

 

He is a decent Templar. Not even a good one. Good templar = Evangeline, Gregoir. 

 

He is also not a good strategist or a good military tactician or a good judge of character or a good judge of the situation.  

 

Cullen made bad judgement calls in Dragon Age Origins and in Dragon Age 2. 

 

He defended Meredith throughout DA2 right up until the end, even in Act 3, despite what she was doing. He openly advocates cleansing the Circle of Kinloch Hold without giving a second thought to the mages who might not play a part in it. 

 

He was even hired / assigned by Meredith to work in the Kirkwall Templar because she thought he shares her opinions on the mages. He was in Kirkwall because the head templar at the time thought it was a good idea of have someone like him. Someone who cracked under pressure, went of a killing spree and as such was easy to control.

 

Rash decision making =/= good military adviser. It does not make for good advising at all.

 

I will stand by the notion that Cullen would be better off with the free Templars / pro Chantry Templars / blue lyrium Templars, either leading a small band of them or doing something else. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Since I haven't seen anyone post the blurb from his character page, here it is:

 

Cullen has seen the worst that magic and corruption can do to innocent people. Trained from a young age, he has devoted more than half his life in service to the Templar Order. He saw the Ferelden Circle fall during the Blight and was witness to the mage-templar conflict that tore Kirkwall apart. In the aftermath, it was Cullen who rallied what remained of Kirkwall's templars to restore order to the devastated city. His leadership and integrity caught the attention of Cassandra Pentaghast, who recognized in him a vital component in forming the Inquisition. Now the world is falling into chaos. Cullen is through waiting for others to act, and he's determined that the Inquisition will make a difference for the people of Thedas.

[Ashelsu]

To those arguing that Cullen is not qualified to lead troops, let's remember that none of the Warden backgrounds, barring Dwarf and Human Nobles, were qualified to be leaders either. Yet they rose to the challenge and ended up saving the world from the Blight in record time. 

 

Every great general has started as a trainee. Don't discount him. 

Warden is recruited because Duncan saw potential in them to become a leader, not a military general. You are leader of a small strike team, your goal is to put Archedemon down, not to become Alexander or Bonaparte. You need charisma and strong personality to unite different fractions, but you don't command allies army.

And you don't have time to train someone. The war is upon us.

I'm sorry, I can't believe that Orlais, a country constantly in war, somehow doesn't have any generals. Did Celine just destroyed her own military personnel, or something?

I also don't like how pro-templar Hawke (what was the point of that character existing, again?) and Aveline are reduced to nothing to make Cullen look good.

[mordy_was_here]

Since I haven't seen anyone post the blurb from his character page, here it is:

 

In the aftermath, it was Cullen who rallied what remained of Kirkwall's templars to restore order to the devastated city. 

 

So here's how it splits.

 

1. Defending the mages: The Champion and Hawke's allies escape Kirkwall before templar reinforcements arrive. Hawke's name becomes a rallying cry for oppressed mages everywhere.

 

2. Siding with the Templars: The Champion supports templars in exterminating the mage threat. Gaining the respect of the Order, Hawke is appointed the new Viscount of Kirkwall. Hawke's name becomes a reminder of templar oppression for mages everywhere.

 

Regardless of what happens, Hawke is gone. Them's the facts. Saying it's a retcon that Cullen picked up the pieces after Kirkwall went through that ****storm is a stretch. How long was Hawke Viscount for, if they even sided with the Templars? Was it enough time for them to even institute some kind of semblance of order? We don't know. Maybe that will be answered in DA3. In fact, it most likely will.

 

On another note, why aren't people decrying Leliana's appearance as fanservice? Surely she has a huge fanbase as well, right? This is genuine curiosity, no sarcasm or maliciousness intended.

[In Exile]

So?  The correct position for the divine is limbless and screaming, not having her Hands in my business.  I'd rather the tears destroy Thedas than the Chantry survive.

 

Okay... I'm going to back away from this part of your post now. 

 

You asked how it can be that people affiliated with the Chantry can be involved in the Inquisition while it remains independent. Well, you have your answer, historically, for the setting. 

[Bayonet Hipshot]

So here's how it splits.

 

1. Defending the mages: The Champion and Hawke's allies escape Kirkwall before templar reinforcements arrive. Hawke's name becomes a rallying cry for oppressed mages everywhere.

 

2. Siding with the Templars: The Champion supports templars in exterminating the mage threat. Gaining the respect of the Order, Hawke is appointed the new Viscount of Kirkwall. Hawke's name becomes a reminder of templar oppression for mages everywhere.

 

Regardless of what happens, Hawke is gone. Them's the facts. Saying it's a retcon that Cullen picked up the pieces after Kirkwall went through that ****storm is a stretch. How long was Hawke Viscount for, if they even sided with the Templars? Was it enough time for them to even institute some kind of semblance of order? We don't know. Maybe that will be answered in DA3. In fact, it most likely will.

 

On another note, why aren't people decrying Leliana's appearance as fanservice? Surely she has a huge fanbase as well, right? This is genuine curiosity, no sarcasm or maliciousness intended.

 

Not decrying Leliana here because that would require a whole new thread. 

 

This one is just for Cullen and the fact that the devs have to retcon him like crazy and make plenty of storytelling gymnastics to get him to where he is in Inquisition, which a military adviser. 

 

On another note, it is rather funny that the characters who get the biggest retcons are people from the Chantry :- Cullen and Leliana. Those wackos...

[In Exile]

Warden is recruited because Duncan saw potential in them to become a leader, not a military general. You are leader of a small strike team, your goal is to put Archedemon down, not to become Alexander or Bonaparte. You need charisma and strong personality to unite different fractions, but you don't command allies army.

And you don't have time to train someone. The war is upon us.

I'm sorry, I can't believe that Orlais, a country constantly in war, somehow doesn't have any generals. Did Celine just destroyed her own military personnel, or something?

I also don't like how pro-templar Hawke (what was the point of that character existing, again?) and Aveline are reduced to nothing to make Cullen look good.

 

How exactly are you going to recruit one of those to your irrelevant book club? We're acting like Cullen is getting a job as a CEO of a fortune 500 company, as opposed to an organization that Cassandra and the Inquisitor basically start-up in their basement. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

How exactly are you going to recruit one of those to your irrelevant book club? We're acting like Cullen is getting a job as a CEO of a fortune 500 company, as opposed to an organization that Cassandra and the Inquisitor basically start-up in their basement. 

Not to mention those Orlesian generals are a little busy with something called the Orlesian Civil War. 

[mordy_was_here]

How exactly are you going to recruit one of those to your irrelevant book club? We're acting like Cullen is getting a job as a CEO of a fortune 500 company, as opposed to an organization that Cassandra and the Inquisitor basically start-up in their basement. 

 

On top of this, it is very likely that with the veil tears opening up all over Thedas, Celine may feel that she needs her generals to take care of her own country. And the Civil War, as Sasha pointed out above me. 

[Vilegrim]

Okay... I'm going to back away from this part of your post now. 

 

You asked how it can be that people affiliated with the Chantry can be involved in the Inquisition while it remains independent. Well, you have your answer, historically, for the setting. 

 

 

Anyone contaminated by the Chantry is not going to be independent. Like the cancer they are they need to be excised.

[In Exile]

As the Inquisition grows in prestige and manpower, Cullen could very well just open a book and study warfare. It's not like anyone else we have is more qualified. IB leading a band of mercenaries - like the Inquisitor himself/herself leads an elite strike team - doesn't mean he's an actual military tactician. Blackwall is the same - and GWs don't even fight in actual military conflicts. Killing darkspawn in the Deep Roads in teams of 10-20 is a different. Cassandra as a Seeker is in the same boat as Cullen. So who exactly does that leave? 

[In Exile]

Anyone contaminated by the Chantry is not going to be independent. Like the cancer they are they need to be excised.

 

Right. Which is why in that bizzaro world, the Tevinter Imperium and the GWs are both not independent. But in the actual world of Thedas, which doesn't ascribe to... that... they are independent. 

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Warden is recruited because Duncan saw potential in them to become a leader, not a military general. You are leader of a small strike team, your goal is to put Archedemon down, not to become Alexander or Bonaparte. You need charisma and strong personality to unite different fractions, but you don't command allies army.

And you don't have time to train someone. The war is upon us.

I'm sorry, I can't believe that Orlais, a country constantly in war, somehow doesn't have any generals. Did Celine just destroyed her own military personnel, or something?

I also don't like how pro-templar Hawke (what was the point of that character existing, again?) and Aveline are reduced to nothing to make Cullen look good.

 

OMG. Good points ! Whatever happened to military personnel in Ferelden, Orlais (the two nations we will be going to), Aveline Vallen (who has more experience in being a leader than Cullen) and pro-Templar Hawke ?

 

All these people..who are way more qualified...swept under the proverbial bus for Cullen...

 

Talk about being a revisionist...

 

Yeah, this is because Cullen was carefully picked and selected to be a member of the team. It doesn't have anything to do with the Cullenites and the 1900+ pages about how good he looks. 

 

The Inquisition is an organization whose purpose is to, essentially cancel the apocalypse in Thedas. You do that by having rational, logical and capable people on the team.

 

I would be very happy and very willing to have Cullen on the Inquisition team and being a military adviser if there is a rational and logical reason to do so. 

 

Problem is, there isn't any. 

 

He is not the best templar out there. He is good but there are better ones out there like Gregoir and Evangeline. 

 

He is being massively retconned both in Dragon Age 2 and Dragon Age Origins.

 

People who are far more capable and far more suited to the role of the adviser exist and they are all being thrown under the proverbial bus to make way for him.

[Vilegrim]

As the Inquisition grows in prestige and manpower, Cullen could very well just open a book and study warfare. It's not like anyone else we have is more qualified. IB leading a band of mercenaries - like the Inquisitor himself/herself leads an elite strike team - doesn't mean he's an actual military tactician. Blackwall is the same - and GWs don't even fight in actual military conflicts. Killing darkspawn in the Deep Roads in teams of 10-20 is a different. Cassandra as a Seeker is in the same boat as Cullen. So who exactly does that leave? 

 

 

Mercenary Great Captain, Ash Warriors or Red Irons almost certainly have several, tribal war leader from the Avvars (which would have been an awesome insight into this unexplored culture and religion) that's off the top of my head.

[Vilegrim]

Right. Which is why in that bizzaro world, the Tevinter Imperium and the GWs are both not independent. But in the actual world of Thedas, which doesn't ascribe to... that... they are independent. 

 

 

They kow-tow to andrastre so no, they are not, they do not oppose the chant of light, so no they are not.

[Faerlyte]

When I first started frequenting the forums again, after a long lay off, I honestly couldn't remember who Cullen was. Now that he figures so prominently into the third installment of the series, I still can't remember anything about him. 

 

It's probably just a popularity thing. He was well liked, apparently, and they're bringing him back because of it. 

 

I'd rather have the Arishok back personally, but alas, it was not to be. 

[Allan Schumacher]

So we aren't associated with the Chantry...but we have the Divines right and left hand in the inquisition, a templar as a military advisor...in what way are we not allied by design with that cult?  I mean seriously, I don't want any of these within a hundred miles of me, unless they are on fire at the time....

 

Then you can make an informed purchase decision based on your assumptions about how the plot must play out then?

[Vilegrim]

Then you can make an informed purchase decision based on your assumptions about how the plot must play out then?

 

 

I suppose it is more honest to straight out tell us 'fighting the chantry' is a lie, than ME3s 'not a, b or c' was.

[In Exile]

When I first started frequenting the forums again, after a long lay off, I honestly couldn't remember who Cullen was. Now that he figures so prominently into the third installment of the series, I still can't remember anything about him. 

 

It's probably just a popularity thing. He was well liked, apparently, and they're bringing him back because of it. 

 

I'd rather have the Arishok back personally, but alas, it was not to be. 

 

Astute Bystander: A qunari? How unexpected. How did you arrive at this peace conference. 

Arishok: Popular demand.

Astute Bystander: Don't you mean, demand of the Qun?

Arishok: No. 

[Allan Schumacher]

I suppose it is more honest to straight out tell us 'fighting the chantry' is a lie, than ME3s 'not a, b or c' was.

 

If you think we're lying, so be it.  I recommend you wait until feedback after the game is released then.

[Ashelsu]

As the Inquisition grows in prestige and manpower, Cullen could very well just open a book and study warfare. It's not like anyone else we have is more qualified. IB leading a band of mercenaries - like the Inquisitor himself/herself leads an elite strike team - doesn't mean he's an actual military tactician. Blackwall is the same - and GWs don't even fight in actual military conflicts. Killing darkspawn in the Deep Roads in teams of 10-20 is a different. Cassandra as a Seeker is in the same boat as Cullen. So who exactly does that leave? 

If you only command a small groupe of people you don't need military advisor. (Already have Cassandra if Inquisitor is a complete rookie. Why would you need such incompetent person as a head of Inquisition is another question. May be you are here just to look pretty while Cass makes decisions.)

I noticed you despise military commanders of the past. Their art is not that simple and talented general could make huge difference. Hannibal, Caesar, Gustav Vasa, Conde, Turenne... apparently all these people didn't exist in our history.

[Gtdef]

So here's how it splits.

 

1. Defending the mages: The Champion and Hawke's allies escape Kirkwall before templar reinforcements arrive. Hawke's name becomes a rallying cry for oppressed mages everywhere.

 

2. Siding with the Templars: The Champion supports templars in exterminating the mage threat. Gaining the respect of the Order, Hawke is appointed the new Viscount of Kirkwall. Hawke's name becomes a reminder of templar oppression for mages everywhere.

 

Regardless of what happens, Hawke is gone. Them's the facts. Saying it's a retcon that Cullen picked up the pieces after Kirkwall went through that ****storm is a stretch. How long was Hawke Viscount for, if they even sided with the Templars? Was it enough time for them to even institute some kind of semblance of order? We don't know. Maybe that will be answered in DA3. In fact, it most likely will.

 

On another note, why aren't people decrying Leliana's appearance as fanservice? Surely she has a huge fanbase as well, right? This is genuine curiosity, no sarcasm or maliciousness intended.

 

So Hawke becomes viscount in one hour after the events and stays viscount for another hour, the city guard magically disappears from the map and then heroic Cullen enters the picture to save Kirkwall from mage bandits that want to kill everyone.

 

Perfect sense. I see now why Cullen should be military advisor.

 

That's the problem, they had to tie Cullen's current position to Kirkwall. If they just said that Cullen proved himself capable and spend the next 3 years of his life learning military tactics I can accept it. But what they did just raises questions

 

"n the aftermath, it was Cullen who rallied what remained of Kirkwall's templars to restore order to the devastated city. "

 

What is the aftermath? Is it different than the one we know? And why did he "rally" the templars? isn't he the highest ranking officer at that time? What is extraordinary that explains the reason for one of the most important positions in the new Inquisition? Not only that but there were reinforcements impound (same page where you got your info). Why would the templars along with the guard have any problem restoring order? So many questions that could just be avoided if they never wrote something like that.

 

Also we know Cullen had psychological issues that seemed to have vanished in DA2. Was that a retcon? Or it was an one time thing? If I was the Inquisitor and knew of his history I wouldn't want to keep him around. 

 

Btw since when people don't complain about Leliana? it's pretty much the same as Cullen, with the difference that if you kept Leliana alive she makes perfect sense. Cullen hardly even makes sense if Hawke is pro-mage.