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Of course with one specialisation there will actually be less abilities overall won't there?
In DAO I often lost track of what all the things did and usually used a smaller subset in practice.
Yeah, I actually prefer to use the face buttons to map abilities and spells. I don't think I've ever used or cared about more than eight, anyway.
For Origins particularly, after Awakening and all the DLC I had so many freaking abilities that I didn't know what I was doing.
If the specializations are permanently unlocked for all playthroughs once you get it like in DAO then.. yeah. Now, if that's the case I wont mind if you can 'also' unlock it via MP, as long as it's always unlockable in SP. If they actually have story MP co-op (that is, friend joins your game with his own char) it would make sense to have account-bound specialization unlocks like DAO was. I thought it was going to require questing each time though... guess we'll find out later.
I don't think they are, they said during one of the QandA's that at some point you have to make a choice about a specialization you want to pick, for some reason that stood out to me, usually it was just a fixed thing that appeared and you picked in the previous games, but the way Mark Laidlow made it sound, it was like a particular moment in the game, they even mentioned you'd have a chance to look at all the possible specializations before making a choice. Sounds like the process is going to be more involved this time, and thus wouldn't make sense if in subsequent playthroughs you simply just pick one whenever you reach the right level.
I don't think they are, they said during one of the QandA's that at some point you have to make a choice about a specialization you want to pick, for some reason that stood out to me, usually it was just a fixed thing that appeared and you picked in the previous games, but the way Mark Laidlow made it sound, it was like a particular moment in the game, they even mentioned you'd have a chance to look at all the possible specializations before making a choice. Sounds like the process is going to be more involved this time, and thus wouldn't make sense if in subsequent playthroughs you simply just pick one whenever you reach the right level.
Maybe the unlocking of the specializations in MP is tied to your choices in SP?
Something like the Templar abilities being locked until a player selected them in their SP save?
It would be slightly annoying if true, but the incentive to play the campaign to unlock stuff for MP would be a great way to tie both game modes together, while also avoiding the ME 3 debacle.
Yeah, I actually prefer to use the face buttons to map abilities and spells. I don't think I've ever used or cared about more than eight, anyway.
For Origins particularly, after Awakening and all the DLC I had so many freaking abilities that I didn't know what I was doing.
As long as I don't have to waste these 8 slots on sustained abilities and can keep them all to "attack" ones.
Maybe the unlocking of the specializations in MP is tied to your choices in SP?
Something like the Templar abilities being locked until a player selected them in their SP save?
It would be slightly annoying if true, but the incentive to play the campaign to unlock stuff for MP would be a great way to tie both game modes together, while also avoiding the ME 3 debacle.
That wouldn't go over well with MP players, even ones that are "SP players too!"
"So I can't play a Templar in MP for a 20-30 minute game until I waste 40 hours in the SP as a Templar?" :/
But the way I'd handle a SP -> MP crossover would be that if I unlocked Reaver in SP, then I don't have to open packs/chests to get Reaver for my MP.
Anything more involved than a one way SP -> MP street like that is probably not going to go over well. Especially with how EA just neutered the NHL franchise and, at least in Canada, having a lot of crossover in the player base.
strangled by the controller cord
I had to giggle at this. Last gen consoles are wireless and they've been around for 10 years.
Seriously though - nobody cares what YOU play on. Don't worry about what I play on. Blaming every change that you don't like on consoles is obnoxious.
That wouldn't go over well with MP players, even ones that are "SP players too!"
"So I can't play a Templar in MP for a 20-30 minute game until I waste 40 hours in the SP as a Templar?" :/
But the way I'd handle a SP -> MP crossover would be that if I unlocked Reaver in SP, then I don't have to open packs/chests to get Reaver for my MP.
Anything more involved than a one way SP -> MP street like that is probably not going to go over well. Especially with how EA just neutered the NHL franchise and, at least in Canada, having a lot of crossover in the player base.
Oh sorry if I wasn't clear in my post. 
I meant that maybe we could be using the choices in SP as an alternate to the unlocking MP content via the RNG store, just like you said in your post.
Maybe the unlocking of the specializations in MP is tied to your choices in SP?
Something like the Templar abilities being locked until a player selected them in their SP save?
It would be slightly annoying if true, but the incentive to play the campaign to unlock stuff for MP would be a great way to tie both game modes together, while also avoiding the ME 3 debacle.
I'd accept that over the opposite idea.
Maybe the unlocking of the specializations in MP is tied to your choices in SP?
Something like the Templar abilities being locked until a player selected them in their SP save?
It would be slightly annoying if true, but the incentive to play the campaign to unlock stuff for MP would be a great way to tie both game modes together, while also avoiding the ME 3 debacle.
Yes, I think that would be plus:
SP unlocks MP - not MP unlocks SP.
That was would tie MP into the story rather than it being irrelevant.
(And I suspect the Scouts are your MP classes once unlocked in SP but that is seriously a hunch on top of a hunch...)
Yes, I think that would be plus:
SP unlocks MP - not MP unlocks SP.
That was would tie MP into the story rather than it being irrelevant.
(And I suspect the Scouts are your MP classes once unlocked in SP but that is seriously a hunch on top of a hunch...)
I speculated on that idea a few pages ago. Like if you recruit some Avvar warriors, then an Avvar warrior class is unlocked for you in MP versus the standard unlock system
I speculated on that idea a few pages ago. Like if you recruit some Avvar warriors, then an Avvar warrior class is unlocked for you in MP versus the standard unlock system
That would be an interesting way to tie SP progression to MP unlocks, rather than vice versa, though I'm sure there'd be some other way to unlock character kits via the RNG.
Also makes sense story-wise too.
Re changing skills: my assumption is that you won't be able to remap skills during combat. I may be mistaken but that makes the most sense for this change.
So not only do you not have access to talents that you didn't put any points in, you also will not access to talents which are not on your quickbar during combat? That's just sad.
Re changing skills: my assumption is that you won't be able to remap skills during combat. I may be mistaken but that makes the most sense for this change.
That's how I feel, too. It wouldn't make sense to exclude the radial menu if you could just map things while in combat.
That would be an interesting way to tie SP progression to MP unlocks, rather than vice versa, though I'm sure there'd be some other way to unlock character kits via the RNG.
Also makes sense story-wise too.
It would be a way to "tie" the SP and MP together in a way that makes sense. Then Bioware could say, much like in ME3, that the MP was your forces doing recon missions or whatever.
I'm not sure how to bring bonuses back across from MP to SP. Gold/items could break the game economy, XP could break the leveling system, anything like Galactic Readiness would make people burn Edmonton to the ground.
Maybe it could serve as some sort of alternative or way to resupply the "power points" or whatever they were. Or reduce the timer when you send an adviser off. Still not sure if that would be a good idea.
It would be a way to "tie" the SP and MP together in a way that makes sense. Then Bioware could say, much like in ME3, that the MP was your forces doing recon missions or whatever.
I'm not sure how to bring bonuses back across from MP to SP. Gold/items could break the game economy, XP could break the leveling system, anything like Galactic Readiness would make people burn Edmonton to the ground.
Maybe it could serve as some sort of alternative or way to resupply the "power points" or whatever they were. Or reduce the timer when you send an adviser off. Still not sure if that would be a good idea.
There's no way to link it that wouldn't get people to rage. Even if they just reduced the timer (which I like the idea of) people would be pissed - even though you could avoid MP completely and get the same outcome.
That wouldn't go over well with MP players, even ones that are "SP players too!"
"So I can't play a Templar in MP for a 20-30 minute game until I waste 40 hours in the SP as a Templar?" :/
But the way I'd handle a SP -> MP crossover would be that if I unlocked Reaver in SP, then I don't have to open packs/chests to get Reaver for my MP.
Anything more involved than a one way SP -> MP street like that is probably not going to go over well. Especially with how EA just neutered the NHL franchise and, at least in Canada, having a lot of crossover in the player base.
You're assuming MP and SP are equal. They aren't. SP has a higher priority than MP, DA was a SP game first and MP (if it exists) is tacked on, after the fact. 'MP Gamers' have about as much say on what should happen in DA as 'SP gamers' do on a CoD game. If they are going to tie SP and MP together then the vast majority of players would prefer SP informs MP, rather than the opposite.
However, your idea about multiple unlock paths (one is earning it in MP, the other is earning it in SP) to my mind works the best. That way MP is informed by SP, but not dependent upon it. As long as SP is neither dependent on, nor informed by (at all) MP I'm happy.
That way MP is informed by SP, but not dependent upon it.
), but I love your wording. Reminds me of what I say to undergrads in historiography class about the relationship between individuals and the community.
I'm not sure how to bring bonuses back across from MP to SP. Gold/items could break the game economy, XP could break the leveling system, anything like Galactic Readiness would make people burn Edmonton to the ground.
Maybe it could serve as some sort of alternative or way to resupply the "power points" or whatever they were. Or reduce the timer when you send an adviser off. Still not sure if that would be a good idea.
As people have said before, best to make it a genuine alternative.
If it's used to gain Inquisition power points (or influence, or whatever that mechanic is called), make sure it's possible to do the same thing via singleplayer exploration or sidequests. It should be presented as two valid ways of doing the same thing.
I don't think people would've had a problem with the ME3 MP if (like was promised) it really was possible to get maximum galactic readiness via singleplayer alone.
As people have said before, best to make it a genuine alternative.
If it's used to gain Inquisition power points (or influence, or whatever that mechanic is called), make sure it's possible to do the same thing via singleplayer exploration or sidequests. It should be presented as two valid ways of doing the same thing.
I don't think people would've had a problem with the ME3 MP if (like was promised) it really was possible to get maximum galactic readiness via singleplayer alone.
That could have been so simple. Go to the war assets console in the ship, "train Turians" or "send Turians new intel" or something or the sidequests that used the MP maps granting "8% galactic readiness"
That could have been so simple. Go to the war assets console in the ship, "train Turians" or "send Turians new intel" or something or the sidequests that used the MP maps granting "8% galactic readiness"
Or those missions that were SP versions of the MP maps ( I forget what they were called, N7 missions maybe). Have each of those give 10% GR (since base is 50% and there were 5 iirc) to this campaign only. Sure as sure.
I had to giggle at this. Last gen consoles are wireless and they've been around for 10 years.
Seriously though - nobody cares what YOU play on. Don't worry about what I play on. Blaming every change that you don't like on consoles is obnoxious.
Its funnier than that. I have a wireless XBox 360 controller for certain types of games. I like it.
I just also like it when a game remembers what a mouse can do and takes advantage. Just once I'd like to be able to click and drag my mouse across the inventory items or type in the search filter. For that matter, it would be nice if there was a version of Dragon Age Origins that looked for the extra RAM on my machine and took advantage of it and I could play my house, Bag End.
There's no way to link it that wouldn't get people to rage. Even if they just reduced the timer (which I like the idea of) people would be pissed - even though you could avoid MP completely and get the same outcome.
Its funnier than that. I have a wireless XBox 360 controller for certain types of games. I like it.
I just also like it when a game remembers what a mouse can do and takes advantage. Just once I'd like to be able to click and drag my mouse across the inventory items or type in the search filter. For that matter, it would be nice if there was a version of Dragon Age Origins that looked for the extra RAM on my machine and took advantage of it and I could play my house, Bag End.
I think most feel that way, honestly. But it's pretty clear from some of the comments in this thread that we'd get the complaints that because if MP, some people were able to so more than others in the same amount of time - even if what's accomplished is the same. There's just no way to please everyone, so hopefully they can at least please the majority.Here's the thing, for me: If I can achieve everything in the game through SP, I don't care what MP can do. It's when I can't that it becomes an issue. MP in ME 3 no longer bothers me, I can miss half the stalker quests, or more, and half the galaxy is "unexplored", and I can still get all the endings. Galactic Readiness still chaffs, but it's no longer the issue it was.
I get that. I just think if you're looking for a pc tailored experience you should be looking for a pc exclusive game instead of expecting Devs to make an entirely separate interface for one group of people (not you personally). People take the 'dumbed down for the console' nonsense waaaaay over the top - especially when it's something they don't like. But with this, they changed stuff for the console players too!
I think most feel that way, honestly. But it's pretty clear from some of the comments in this thread that we'd get the complaints that because if MP, some people were able to so more than others in the same amount of time - even if what's accomplished is the same. There's just no way to please everyone, so hopefully they can at least please the majority.
Actually, speaking as one of the SP advocates, in this hypothetical "You can do it through SP or MP scenario" I wouldn't mind if it was faster in MP than it is in SP as long as its not some ridiculous disparity where its a tooth-grinding 10 hour chore to do the SP equivalent of what, say, 30 minutes of MP will get you.It does make some sense narrative wise that if you're calling in the aid of other players, you'll get things done faster.
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