315 réponses à ce sujet

[efd731]

I have this "thing" when I play dragon age and mass effect games, where I let everyone live who can, just in the hope that they add more content to the playthrough in the future. If I can spare them I usually do. Having said that, I have only been able to spare anders once.....and that took a lot of willpower. Even ignoring that he's a hypocritical mass murderer with a messiah complex and poor impulse control, once he and Justice are fully "In tune" like at the end of DA2, what role could he play in future games? He can't go back to being anything resembling a sane character, he'd be a murderous madman wandering absently, killing whatever he perceived as injustice.

[efd731]

Even if people that like his character......who usually seem to view the mages collectively as a self insert and him as their true husbando......defend his actions, his character as a whole has been destroyed. He kills a Mage girl if you don't stop him because she wants to go back to the circle, imagine the endless demon rage if he meets anyone who's not dropping everything to stop the destruction of the world? Templars and mages are fighting, what would he do to both sides for causing chaos and harming innocents? The sad answer, is retcons, changing his behaviour, mellowing him out. Despite his entire arc in DA2 being about slipping farther and farther into justice's "clutches" and losing himself.

[Sports72Xtrm]

I have this "thing" when I play dragon age and mass effect games, where I let everyone live who can, just in the hope that they add more content to the playthrough in the future. If I can spare them I usually do. Having said that, I have only been able to spare anders once.....and that took a lot of willpower. Even ignoring that he's a hypocritical mass murderer with a messiah complex and poor impulse control, once he and Justice are fully "In tune" like at the end of DA2, what role could he play in future games? He can't go back to being anything resembling a sane character, he'd be a murderous madman wandering absently, killing whatever he perceived as injustice.

 

Why would you think he'd be a wandering madman? Maybe when he killed someone for committing injustice, perhaps we should entertain the idea that the person he killed actually was committing injustice. He can also go around healing people and helping the downtrodden just like he was before in Kirkwall in Act 1. Plus he's a grey warden, he has like 20 to thirty years tops before he dies fighting darkspawn or dies fighting for mage freedom, both good ways to go imo and to "atone" for what he's done.

[Sports72Xtrm]

Even if people that like his character......who usually seem to view the mages collectively as a self insert and him as their true husbando......defend his actions, his character as a whole has been destroyed. He kills a Mage girl if you don't stop him because she wants to go back to the circle, imagine the endless demon rage if he meets anyone who's not dropping everything to stop the destruction of the world? Templars and mages are fighting, what would he do to both sides for causing chaos and harming innocents? The sad answer, is retcons, changing his behaviour, mellowing him out. Despite his entire arc in DA2 being about slipping farther and farther into justice's "clutches" and losing himself.

Vengeance only comes out when Anders tries to turn a blind eye towards injustice. Notice before he decided to intervene with Ella, he tried to rationalized the templars were in the right and his helplessness by saying, "No. This is their place." If Anders accepts he is justice, it is his responsibility to defend the weak and downtrodden, I believe he can control it. The only ones who need fear him are those who are "unjust".

[ajramsey]

I like Anders but i feel like i have had my fill of Anders. He is a bit..exhausting unless you play an off the wall character (like I did)  If he is in DAI I personally just want it to be with Hawke or a mention of him with Hawke, if he ran off with him/her. other than that I don't think I want to see him again, let someone else baby sit him for a while. 

[Chernaya]

Even if people that like his character......who usually seem to view the mages collectively as a self insert and him as their true husbando......defend his actions, his character as a whole has been destroyed. He kills a Mage girl if you don't stop him because she wants to go back to the circle, imagine the endless demon rage if he meets anyone who's not dropping everything to stop the destruction of the world? Templars and mages are fighting, what would he do to both sides for causing chaos and harming innocents? The sad answer, is retcons, changing his behaviour, mellowing him out. Despite his entire arc in DA2 being about slipping farther and farther into justice's "clutches" and losing himself.

 

C'mon, people have reasons to like a radical fictional character more than just the one you said. That's not really fair to group all of his fans together like that.

[efd731]

I said usually, because honestly, usually they are like that. There are exceptions....but they are exceptions.

If you were to divide the anders fan base by people who support mages almost all the time/self identify with/as them, and then divide the remainder of the fan base by people who wuv him dearly and need to have teh virtual sex with his demon infested body.....your left with a very tiny percentage of the original number of fans.

[efd731]

Apparently I single-handedly killed this thread. Cool.
Also, sorry for possible hurt feelings anders fans.

[Chernaya]

Apparently I single-handedly killed this thread. Cool.
Also, sorry for possible hurt feelings anders fans.

 

I doubt you killed it, no worries. There wasn't a lack of people not fond of Anders in here to start with lol

[Elite Midget]

I wonder what will occur with Anders if he was killed. At least a mention?

 

The spirit lives on either way and it would be odd if Anders doesn't appear if he's not killed but allowed to run. After all, he did cause the mess to boil over into all out war.

[Feybrad]

The Demon of Vengeance is the Big Bad and opened the Breach.

 

There, I said it.

[Lucidae]

So, if the Dalish are right and humans are radioactive, what does that imply for the romance between Merril and Hawke?

 

Their child will have 3 hands and only 7 toes.

[Amaror]

I don't even hate him for what he did, but rather for how he did it.

It's just so mindboogling retarted. He wants to incend a war between templars and mages. FINE.

But why blow up the chantry? When he could have blown up, oh i don't know, the freakin Templar Headquarters. You know hurting his ACTUAL enemies. It would have not only caused a war but made it more likely for the mages to win.

But no, anders is a retard and has to blow up the chantry.

 

Additionaly i just hate the Anders character of DA 2 just because how much they retconned him. Justice and Anders were so AWESOME characters in DA:A and they managed to screw up BOTH of them at once.

[Lucidae]

I don't even hate him for what he did, but rather for how he did it.

It's just so mindboogling retarted. He wants to incend a war between templars and mages. FINE.

But why blow up the chantry? When he could have blown up, oh i don't know, the freakin Templar Headquarters. You know hurting his ACTUAL enemies. It would have not only caused a war but made it more likely for the mages to win.

But no, anders is a retard and has to blow up the chantry.

 

Additionaly i just hate the Anders character of DA 2 just because how much they retconned him. Justice and Anders were so AWESOME characters in DA:A and they managed to screw up BOTH of them at once.

 

I think it is because the Chantry controls the Templars, and since Elthina wasn't taking any action to help the oppressed mages in Kirkwall he took out his Vengeance on her (oh ho ho puns). He also hates the Chantry as much as or more than the Templars based on how I know him.

[Grieving Natashina]

I think we're gonna start seeing a lot of tranquil mages come out of tranquility because of the fade tear, and Anders will likely be perma-Justice.

I think for a lot of the more extreme Templars, the time for Tranquility has passed.  The Circles are dissolved and now all mages could be technically called apostates, so it's pretty much kill on sight at this point.  Also, I'd call it perma-Vengence, if Vanders appears does reappear somehow.

[Lucidae]

Oh uh, after catching up on the thread.

 

Why does everyone think that Wynne is entirely complacent to the circle? She says that she believes that change is needed, but doesn't think there shouldn't be a circle. In Asunder she basically tells Rhys what her plan was for the change and he was kinda like, "damn that was actually a good idea, but too late now."

[Grieving Natashina]

Oh uh, after catching up on the thread.

 

Why does everyone think that Wynne is entirely complacent to the circle? She says that she believes that change is needed, but doesn't think there shouldn't be a circle. In Asunder she basically tells Rhys what her plan was for the change and he was kinda like, "damn that was actually a good idea, but too late now."

To be fair, it really hasn't been "everyone."  There has been a few posters that have claimed that, but truthfully a lot of the pro-Mage/pro-Templar/pro-compromise groups have been shaking their heads at that one.

[Lucidae]

To be fair, it really hasn't been "everyone."  There has been a few posters that have claimed that, but truthfully a lot of the pro-Mage/pro-Templar/pro-compromise groups have been shaking their heads at that one.

 

I should correct myself then and say that from what I've read in this thread that it seems to be the general consensus amongst the posts here. Thanks.

[Grieving Natashina]

I should correct myself then and say that from what I've read in this thread that it seems to be the general consensus amongst the posts here. Thanks.

No worries.  

[Inquisitor7]

Omg I will kill him sooo bad like I'm not even joking I would throw him in an abandoned shack and blow it up 5 times

[Grieving Natashina]

Omg I will kill him sooo bad like I'm not even joking I would throw him in an abandoned shack and blow it up 5 times

Don't hold back, tell us how you really feel.  

 

_{Just teasing, promise.}

[Fialka]

He can't go back to being anything resembling a sane character, he'd be a murderous madman wandering absently, killing whatever he perceived as injustice.

Am I the only one who immediately thought of Samara from Mass Effect when they read this?  Just want to point out that she's a very popular character, and yet what she does could be perceived as the same thing.  Don't want to derail the thread by starting a debate over her character (who I also love), it's just interesting to think about the fine line where justice ends and something more sinister takes its place.

 

Even if people that like his character......who usually seem to view the mages collectively as a self insert and him as their true husbando......defend his actions, his character as a whole has been destroyed. 

You know, that's a bit like saying most people only like Merrill because she's cute, or that they like Isabela because she's got big boobs and tells sex jokes and will sleep with you right away... or Fenris because he's hot and has that broody/'emo' thing going on, or, whatever... Sure, there's a few that might be like that, but to say 'most' is insulting to the majority of fans, who I think look deeper than that when they decide they love these characters.  Also, I want to point out that few of Anders' fans 'defend' his actions... most condemn them.  Explaining why his actions don't make you hate his character is not the same as condoning them.

[Fialka]

Also, I can't find the post now, but someone mentioned how the Fade tears could make it so Justice becomes the dominant personality in Inquisition.  I actually would find this really interesting, if only to see how he would develop when allowed control, rather than only being allowed out when he rages enough.  Would he be a simple Vengeance demon, hell-bent on destruction?  Or might he regain that bit of humanity he started to find in Kristoff's body and gain a better understanding of the world, a bit like how Cole might?

 

I was disappointed that in DA2 my character could never actually converse with Justice in any meaningful way - if I remember right it's either 'back off, demon,' or appealing to Anders to take back control.  I loved Justice in Awakening and enjoyed hearing his perspective, and I always hear out the demons in the game when I get a chance (with every intention of rejecting whatever 'deal' they propose, or finding some way to out-maneuver them) if only to gain more insight into their nature and motivations.  

 

I just find all things Fade and spirit/demon related really fascinating lore-wise, and it would have been cool to play a Hawke who had at least some interest in understanding Justice better.  Hated that my only options were to either condemn Anders as a yucky abomination or be like 'la dee da... I don't get it, but it's all good because I lurve you!'

[Lucidae]

Also, I can't find the post now, but someone mentioned how the Fade tears could make it so Justice becomes the dominant personality in Inquisition.  I actually would find this really interesting, if only to see how he would develop when allowed control, rather than only being allowed out when he rages enough.  Would he be a simple Vengeance demon, hell-bent on destruction?  Or might he regain that bit of humanity he started to find in Kristoff's body and gain a better understanding of the world, a bit like how Cole might?
 
I was disappointed that in DA2 my character could never actually converse with Justice in any meaningful way - if I remember right it's either 'back off, demon,' or appealing to Anders to take back control.  I loved Justice in Awakening and enjoyed hearing his perspective, and I always hear out the demons in the game when I get a chance (with every intention of rejecting whatever 'deal' they propose, or finding some way to out-maneuver them) if only to gain more insight into their nature and motivations.  
 
I just find all things Fade and spirit/demon related really fascinating lore-wise, and it would have been cool to play a Hawke who had at least some interest in understanding Justice better.  Hated that my only options were to either condemn Anders as a yucky abomination or be like 'la dee da... I don't get it, but it's all good because I lurve you!'

Justice always seemed too consumed by rage to ever be calm again like he was in DAOA, but that would be really interesting to see. I always just imagined a Vengeance dominant Anders would just roam around killing all that he felt did mages wrong. If Vengeance roamed around more sentient than that though, that's be even more interesting.

[Fialka]

Justice always seemed too consumed by rage to ever be calm again like he was in DAOA, but that would be really interesting to see. I always just imagined a Vengeance dominant Anders would just roam around killing all that he felt did mages wrong. If Vengeance roamed around more sentient than that though, that's be even more interesting.

If you take Anders into the Fade with you during Feynriel's quest, Justice takes control and he's actually pretty reasonable.  The fact that he's not too keen on talking and that your character can't push for a conversation always seemed like a wasted opportunity.