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[Icy Magebane]

WALKING BOMB SWORD.

You better hope you remember to turn off friendly fire...

[Adhin]

Hah that is 'exactly' what I thought when I saw that Icy, 'well I wont be using that proc, ever...'. Also, no skill tree for the whole stream... bummer.

[Icy Magebane]

Hm... looks like the rest of the specs and skills will remain a mystery for a bit longer... :/

[karushna5]

Ah... just in case you didn't know, the only healing spell in the game (Resurgence) is in the Knight Enchanter tree... There may be some kind of buff spells in Rift Mage, but so far we've only seen what look like offensive abilities (Stone Fist, Firestorm Focus, possibly Ensare, and one other).  Spirit magic has Barrier, however, which is available to any mage.  Beyond that, I can't think of any buff spells... there are some in Battlemaster, but that's a Warrior tree...

I saw one video and was able to pause and Rift mage has buffs to barrier, and a couple other stuff, also Revival I think counts as a healing spell in its own way. Getting allies up is nothing to shake a stick at.

[Icy Magebane]

I saw one video and was able to pause and Rift mage has buffs to barrier, and a couple other stuff, also Revival I think counts as a healing spell in its own way. Getting allies up is nothing to shake a stick at.

Excuse me?  There are known Rift Mage skills out there?  If you can find the video, you should try to take a screenshot or post descriptions of them in this thread... we're starving for new info! 

[Adhin]

Yeah only specialization passives we've seen that has anything to do with Barrier so far was last weeks twitch stream with Knight Enchanter, not Rift Mage. It has the heal and 20% dmg returned while you have a barrier active on your self. Actually, that 'might' effect barriers you place on others but I have a feeling it's just the barrier on your self. It's wording seems rather specific to you causing dmg back as long as 'you' have a barrier on you.

 

If you've run into another video though, share it!

[themageguy]

I wonder if Knight Enchanters Spirit Blade would go well with the storm passive Static Charge....

[Adhin]

I would imagine very much so, yeah. Every Spirit Blade swing would count since it's a spell, anyone attacking you during your attacks would get zapped and shocked (but not paralyzed). Though I think Spirit Blade is a detonator? So, it might actually cause the effect if they hit you and get shocked before the spirit blade lands, failing that theres always a follow up hit!

 

I'm personally curious which cold spells will trigger the 50% DR. I know people immediately jump to Blizzard but I highly doubt we can actually keep 'fighting' while casting blizzard. It's spell type seems to be the ones where you have to 'keep doing it' kinda thing. Icewall though maybe? It's persistent - for 20 seconds. Question is does the CD start upon casting or upon it crumbling. I'd imagine on cast as, apparently, it get be torn down early (by large enough stuff, like a dragon). With a little CD reduction you could easily fight around your Icewalls for 50% DR, and have it back up as it falls.

 

Also wonder how close you have to be. It just says 'standing near' in the description, gives no indication of radius in meters. That like, melee distance? 3 meters, 5 meters? Is this one of those '25 meters away is technically close'?

[Biotic Sage]

^ Well Blizzard is actually a toggle spell, so you can toggle it on in the area you want to stand in to gain it's damage mitigation and deal AOE to all enemies around you.  You should still be able to cast all your other spells while it's toggled on.  However, the mana drain is the thing to worry about.  How long would you be able to keep it on?  

 

Personally, with my KE build, I'll be using a combination of Blizzard and Ice Mine to take advantage of Ice Armor.  Any time somebody's frozen next to me with Ice Mine, no need for Blizzard to be on.  Also, I'll take another ranged Mage with me to cast some Winter spells as well.  Double the amount of Ice Mines.

[themageguy]

I would imagine very much so, yeah. Every Spirit Blade swing would count since it's a spell, anyone attacking you during your attacks would get zapped and shocked (but not paralyzed). Though I think Spirit Blade is a detonator? So, it might actually cause the effect if they hit you and get shocked before the spirit blade lands, failing that theres always a follow up hit!

I'm personally curious which cold spells will trigger the 50% DR. I know people immediately jump to Blizzard but I highly doubt we can actually keep 'fighting' while casting blizzard. It's spell type seems to be the ones where you have to 'keep doing it' kinda thing. Icewall though maybe? It's persistent - for 20 seconds. Question is does the CD start upon casting or upon it crumbling. I'd imagine on cast as, apparently, it get be torn down early (by large enough stuff, like a dragon). With a little CD reduction you could easily fight around your Icewalls for 50% DR, and have it back up as it falls.

Also wonder how close you have to be. It just says 'standing near' in the description, gives no indication of radius in meters. That like, melee distance? 3 meters, 5 meters? Is this one of those '25 meters away is technically close'?

Good point regarding Ice armor. I suspect perhaps 8m away from an enemy. I would be surprised it was any more than a 10m radius from a frozen enemy.
I think all cold spells would trigger the effect, as long as they can chill / freeze targets.

I cant wait to see more of the Tempest skills.
I wonder if they can cause 'elemental deaths' like mage spells can.
Im currently debating on whether my tempest should be a DD qunari, a bow human or a dwarf.
I also wonder if they add just elemental dps to basic attacks or all attacks, do they have a chance to burn, freeze, stun, chill etc.
And whether when activated, do abilities have a sort damage returned element to them. (gee sera looked awesome with flask of fire activated).
After seeing the wraith in the latest video and noticing they take on the element of a higher level demon (rage demon gave the wraiths fire bolts, the despair demon gave them ice bolts) and recalling necromancers summoning spirits in the official description, i thought hey, wouldn't it be cool if a necromancer could summon wraiths, and say through an ability upgrade, your staff could influence their bolt attack?
So a necromancer might have a fear spell, walking bomb, an animate dead spell (in you go fade spirit, that smelly corpse is your new home) and summon wraith ability.
Just some food for speculation

I also look forward to seeing the two unknown rift mage spells. I hope that the skill with the ensnare icon is a plant looking spell. It will pretty much mean my first inquisitor will be a dalish rift mage.

[themageguy]

^ Well Blizzard is actually a toggle spell, so you can toggle it on in the area you want to stand in to gain it's damage mitigation and deal AOE to all enemies around you. You should still be able to cast all your other spells while it's toggled on. However, the mana drain is the thing to worry about. How long would you be able to keep it on?

Personally, with my KE build, I'll be using a combination of Blizzard and Ice Mine to take advantage of Ice Armor. Any time somebody's frozen next to me with Ice Mine, no need for Blizzard to be on. Also, I'll take another ranged Mage with me to cast some Winter spells as well. Double the amount of Ice Mines.

Sounds.....COOL

[Adhin]

Yeah looked at the 2nd E3 video again, looks like you could do normal actions once blizzard was cast. That said I wont be using it much and if I do I certainly wont be standing 'inside' the thing. I intend to play this game with FF on, standing inside your own AoE is generally a bad idea. Hopefully, for those wanting FF on 'and' want to use blizzard like that the radius is well past the edge of that spell, or it just doesn't effect friendlies, that would be ideal though really bizar.

 

As far as 'any ice spell' the description states 'frozen' or 'persistent' cold spells. I guess most of the ice spells cause freeze, at least with an upgrade. Though there will be some enemies completely immune to the freezing, and once somethings frozen they're an easier target and have a tendency to explode into being horribly dead you'll have to be careful not to target them... I just don't wanna rely on frozen enemies as my source of 50% DR.

 

Ahh who am I kidding I don't wanna rely on any of it for my 50% DR. I kinda wish it just was on you for 5-10 seconds after casting an Ice Spell or something. Or 10% DR per spell cast up to 50% cap, and the whole stack lasts 5 seconds. The whole 'stay in indeterminate radius around ice stuff' just kinda... is iffy. But it's nice either way, and something I'll use if I ever make a tank-ish mage.

 

-edit-

Oh as an example, Great Bears in Emerald Graves all seem to be immune to being Frozen, and are cold resistant. Granted, you also fighting them 1 on 1 usually too but still. That could of also just been on hard but I coulda sworn it was like that in the recent youtube stuff too on normal. Anyway, that pretty much means just Icewall or Blizzard as your 50% options against giant bear.

[themageguy]

Yeah looked at the 2nd E3 video again, looks like you could do normal actions once blizzard was cast. That said I wont be using it much and if I do I certainly wont be standing 'inside' the thing. I intend to play this game with FF on, standing inside your own AoE is generally a bad idea. Hopefully, for those wanting FF on 'and' want to use blizzard like that the radius is well past the edge of that spell, or it just doesn't effect friendlies, that would be ideal though really bizar.

As far as 'any ice spell' the description states 'frozen' or 'persistent' cold spells. I guess most of the ice spells cause freeze, at least with an upgrade. Though there will be some enemies completely immune to the freezing, and once somethings frozen they're an easier target and have a tendency to explode into being horribly dead you'll have to be careful not to target them... I just don't wanna rely on frozen enemies as my source of 50% DR.

Ahh who am I kidding I don't wanna rely on any of it for my 50% DR. I kinda wish it just was on you for 5-10 seconds after casting an Ice Spell or something. Or 10% DR per spell cast up to 50% cap, and the whole stack lasts 5 seconds. The whole 'stay in indeterminate radius around ice stuff' just kinda... is iffy. But it's nice either way, and something I'll use if I ever make a tank-ish mage.

-edit-
Oh as an example, Great Bears in Emerald Graves all seem to be immune to being Frozen, and are cold resistant. Granted, you also fighting them 1 on 1 usually too but still. That could of also just been on hard but I coulda sworn it was like that in the recent youtube stuff too on normal. Anyway, that pretty much means just Icewall or Blizzard as your 50% options against giant bear.

Hmmm when you put it like that, a sub-zero mage doesn't seem so good

And it makes the storm tree all the more awesome looking.

Im also keen on trying to max barrier strength and picking up chaotic focus. Fire spells get a significant boost, and between two mages in the party with barrier, you should be able to fire off at least two maybe three very powerful inferno spells.

Hmmm if i made a rogue tempest dual daggers....i get sub-zero, scorpion and raiden all in one character hahaha.

[Eudaemonium]

Hmmm if i made a rogue tempest dual daggers....i get sub-zero, scorpion and raiden all in one character hahaha.

 

It's only Warriors that really get a 'Get over here!' though. Rogues have a more 'Go over there!'

[themageguy]

It's only Warriors that really get a 'Get over here!' though. Rogues have a more 'Go over there!'

True......but its similar enough. I mean rather than throwing a fireball, with a flask of fire, my tempest BECOMES a fireball......


with daggers

[Adhin]

LOL dagger wielding fireball, that's pretty snazzy. And I don't mean to try and crap on the ice tree, I just think all this 'stand inside the blizzard' is a bad idea. standing right outside it though? Yeah makes sense. Honestly I feel like a lot of stuff they've done is based off most people playing with FF set to off. Fighting in your blizzard would be pretty damn awesome with the 50% DR, and I'm sure most encounters you could keep 1-2 people frozen (even on harder diffs).

 

Apparently blizzard only costs 5 mana a second too, which is a rather small amount comparitively. I mean, Spirit Sword cost more then that, 10 per cast which is rather considerable. Honestly, I'm hoping there are more ways to get mana back outside of Winter Stillness just cause that works off generation - which means you don't consume stamina for awhile. That is to say, regeneration wont be active while blizzard is going so that skills regeneration is pointless while using blizzard.

 

There's gadda be something though, Rogue and Warrior both have more then 1 method to get stamina back via passives outside the normal 'sit around and wait'. I'm sure Mages have more too, though It's probably in the specializations.

 

-edit-

Prime example of FF not being part of the balancing - Corpse Explosion as a weapon proc. Once you enable FF that property becomes super pointless. I love Corpse Explosion but it also takes A LOT of setup to not blow up your whole party. Having a 10% chance to just proc that crap on a melee weapon? With FF off, great! With it on? Well your just killing your self and everyone else.

[themageguy]

LOL dagger wielding fireball, that's pretty snazzy. And I don't mean to try and crap on the ice tree, I just think all this 'stand inside the blizzard' is a bad idea. standing right outside it though? Yeah makes sense. Honestly I feel like a lot of stuff they've done is based off most people playing with FF set to off. Fighting in your blizzard would be pretty damn awesome with the 50% DR, and I'm sure most encounters you could keep 1-2 people frozen (even on harder diffs).

Apparently blizzard only costs 5 mana a second too, which is a rather small amount comparitively. I mean, Spirit Sword cost more then that, 10 per cast which is rather considerable. Honestly, I'm hoping there are more ways to get mana back outside of Winter Stillness just cause that works off generation - which means you don't consume stamina for awhile. That is to say, regeneration wont be active while blizzard is going so that skills regeneration is pointless while using blizzard.

There's gadda be something though, Rogue and Warrior both have more then 1 method to get stamina back via passives outside the normal 'sit around and wait'. I'm sure Mages have more too, though It's probably in the specializations.

-edit-
Prime example of FF not being part of the balancing - Corpse Explosion as a weapon proc. Once you enable FF that property becomes super pointless. I love Corpse Explosion but it also takes A LOT of setup to not blow up your whole party. Having a 10% chance to just proc that crap on a melee weapon? With FF off, great! With it on? Well your just killing your self and everyone else.

I share you concerns on both blizzard and walking bomb

Thanks for the compliment to my Qunari Tempest

What are your thoughts on the chaotic focus and barrier strength?

[Adhin]

I think Chaotic Focus will be amazing if paired with a 2nd mage, some good timing, and doing the largest spell you can do immediately upon barrier triggering. Reason is once barrier is on, it starts eating its self away. So you wont ever get the full 50% barrier, but you can get a good 46-48% on first spell. At which point your left with say, 46% and by the time you cast again you might be at 40% so your only getting 20% of total barrier as a bonus.

 

Best use I can think of for that would be Fire Mine as the obvious one. Your other mage cast barrier on the party and you immediately cast Fire Mine prior to starting the fight. Mine primes, you trigger the group off, melee's hit it, BOOM. Massive explosion that probably immediately takes a few of them out. Does lead me to wonder how Firewall would be handled. Would the dmg be split up in 8ths doing that per second on burned targets? Would it be done upon the completion of the spell and only people standing at the point of its creation? Not really sure, honestly, would require testing when the games out.

 

I'll tell ya 1 thing that has me interested though for a support mage. Something thats, up till now, slipped my attention. Flashpoint. Flashpoint makes it so whatever spell you cast 'after' getting a critical hit has no CD at all. Unlike Chaotic Focus it doesn't specify it only works with Fire Spells. Think about this for a moment in relation to Barrier. Now, it wont lower the existing CD, but if you have 2 mages, mage one barriers at the start of the fight, your fire mage then handles it from there. Simple auto-attacks will get you your crits, you can focus heavily 'on' crits with barrier as your focus. Also, lets say Firewall and Static Cage or the like for some CC.

 

Single critical hit means your next 'spell', in this case, Barrier, has NO cooldown. None, meaning you could cast it immediately again upon it ending on your main tank. This actually has me thinking you wouldn't actually need the upgrade to barrier it's self. Sure you'd go for the passives and whatnot that result in a stronger barrier, but if a single crit can result in a no CD barrier? Sounds pretty great to me with even a mild crit chance. Oh did I just get a crit? Barrier almost gone? Meh, new barrier!

 

Course if we find out all these passives only function on their respective elements that'll be a huge bummer and kill all of what i just said hahaha..ahh...that would suck.

 

-edit-

Hell I'd go so far as to say with Flashpoint all other CD passives can be considered almost pointless. Almost, anyway, but not entirely. It's also the first passive in the fire tree so a pretty easy one to nab. Just waiting on a crit prior to casting any major spells could result in being able to do them again rather quickly. Not sure how super important that is for most of them though, considering it would be a massive mana drain to do anything to expensive to often.

[PillarBiter]

Yeah, I see a lot of crit passives, meaning, critical chance will be a major stat, with regards to your bonuses from passives kicking in. (not that critical chance wasn't handy in previous games, but even moreso here)

[Adhin]

Yeah, I'm also kinda curious how Fortifying Blast works. Says 10% Barrier per enemy effected by it. It also doesn't say it drops 100% aggro, just says they're less likely to target you again. I have a feeling if your the closest thing to them, and nothing else is really pegging them with a lot of dmg they're gonna still go right for you. Anyway, curious if it'll work even if you have no barrier on? I think so, but it may require you have barrier active already to kinda... heal that barrier. But then barriers upgrade doesn't up its strength, a passive does, so to me that says it's not reliant on barrier being there in the first place and barrier strength is entirely level/passive dependant.

 

Anyway, that seems like a nice little upgrade, even to tanky Knight Enchanters. Barrier's about to drop, mind blast if surrounded to shoot barrier back up with out having to directly re-cast barrier. As an aside to that with KE in mind, I think the Fire 1 sec CD reduction will be a great passive for KE. Spirit Blade all of a sudden reduces CD's for your other spells. Ah well, lotta synergy all over with these mages, gonna be fun to come up with builds.

[Icy Magebane]

You know, after reading this discussion about Blizzard, it doesn't sound nearly as useful as I had imagined.  I thought it was a persistent aura of cold that surrounded the caster, not a ranged AoE like... Immolate, for example.  Hm... if it turns out that I was wrong and that it sucks (or just can't be used in the way that I expected), I'll make an exception to my normal rules and use a respec amulet (technically not an exception since this would count as a misunderstanding of what the spell does).  In that case I'd probably get rid of both Ice Armor and Blizzard, and take Fade Step and the upgrade...  Ice Armor's worth fully depended on the effectiveness of Blizzard, so if that spell is merely an AoE like the DA:O version but with a much, much smaller radius, then the persistent cold effect that it causes it won't be useful to me anyway.  I'm not going to be standing near this thing casting spells as a Knight Enchanter... maybe a ranged mage would get more use out of it.

 

I was looking for a way to add Fade Step to my build, so maybe this isn't such a bad thing after all.

[Adhin]

You can see it being used in the 2nd part of the E3 demo. It's definitely where you target and not centered on you. But it is and on/off toggle with low mana consumption, 5 per second, that's 7 seconds before it consumes the same mana as most other spells (seem to often be 35). We need to know the distance of a persistent spell or a frozen enemy for us to get the Armor to find out how useful it will really be. Like I said, Icewall will be useful and will also trigger it. I mean you use Icewall to block off archers, fight melee near it get your bonus, don't take the ranged dmg... pretty solid.

 

Either way I still think it's to conditional for me to really focus on it but it seems, at least to me, that it was put in as a means to compensate for a lack of armor that warriors get. And I don't think your going to get that 50% DR via any other method, since you can't just throw on Plate Armor. I bet if you craft something to look like plate armor it wont actually have that total armor bonus the warrior ends up having. Could be wrong on that though.

[Icy Magebane]

You can see it being used in the 2nd part of the E3 demo. It's definitely where you target and not centered on you. But it is and on/off toggle with low mana consumption, 5 per second, that's 7 seconds before it consumes the same mana as most other spells (seem to often be 35). We need to know the distance of a persistent spell or a frozen enemy for us to get the Armor to find out how useful it will really be. Like I said, Icewall will be useful and will also trigger it. I mean you use Icewall to block off archers, fight melee near it get your bonus, don't take the ranged dmg... pretty solid.

 

Either way I still think it's to conditional for me to really focus on it but it seems, at least to me, that it was put in as a means to compensate for a lack of armor that warriors get. And I don't think your going to get that 50% DR via any other method, since you can't just throw on Plate Armor. I bet if you craft something to look like plate armor it wont actually have that total armor bonus the warrior ends up having. Could be wrong on that though.

Well, the 50% DR sounded so great that I was willing to sacrifice mobility to be able to access it, but if it doesn't work like that, then Fade Step might be more useful to me... I'm not saying that Blizzard + Ice Armor is crap now, just that I'd prefer to have increased mobility if being a slow moving juggernaut is out of the question.  I'm also not rebuilding everything to incorporate Ice Mine and Ice Wall, and the only other Ice spell I had was Winter's Graps.  Replacing this combo with an upgraded Fade Step seems to be the best choice.

 

Oh, and I missed that part of the demo.... I wasn't really paying close attention, but it seems like I should have!  xD

[Adhin]

Well, to get the 50% DR you needed Icewall 'or' Ice Mine anyway, so you'd technically 'have' one of them just to get it. Grasp would also work on stuff you could freeze but.. yeah. I don't think going tank mage really works that well. But I'm pretty confident, to do a tank mage you'd need that passive. I bet you anything it wont effect Barrier though, but it would effect your base HP and Guard if you can proc it via items. Which I feel like is how you'd have to tank mage. Work around that 50% DR from cold and get a proc for your staff that nets you guard.

 

But then, that's all a guess, I'd just avoid trying to make a 'tank' mage and just make a survival mage. Which isn't really the same, survivals just about not dying all the time. Which is what i'll end up doing, and I don't need 50% DR for that lol.

[Icy Magebane]

Well, to get the 50% DR you needed Icewall 'or' Ice Mine anyway, so you'd technically 'have' one of them just to get it. Grasp would also work on stuff you could freeze but.. yeah. I don't think going tank mage really works that well. But I'm pretty confident, to do a tank mage you'd need that passive. I bet you anything it wont effect Barrier though, but it would effect your base HP and Guard if you can proc it via items. Which I feel like is how you'd have to tank mage. Work around that 50% DR from cold and get a proc for your staff that nets you guard.

 

But then, that's all a guess, I'd just avoid trying to make a 'tank' mage and just make a survival mage. Which isn't really the same, survivals just about not dying all the time. Which is what i'll end up doing, and I don't need 50% DR for that lol.

edit:  WTF... I was looking at the tree incorrectly on top of everything else!  Arg...

 

I guess I should be thanking you for pointing all of this out...