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[ElementalFury106]

Are you sure ring of pain is self damaging? There isn't anything in the description that states it.

 

https://33.media.tum...sbdwo2_1280.jpg

 

I had not seen that!!

 

Apparently it doesn't hurt you like past games, that's a bit odd. If your building a bunch of guard that makes it a little less... useful. Also looks like while Aura of Pain is advice Devour will heal you to FULL upon use, lowering the damage bonus you would of gained after that. That's absurd though, imagine having low health and keeping guard up, and when guard is about to get broken, hitting devour to insta-full heal.

 

wonder what the third ability is then, and if there is anyway to lose health outside of 'not building guard' for a bit.

 

 

It's shown at 11:51-11:53

[BubbleDncr]

I am extremely excited by the Primal/Storm magic tree. The stormcaller passive looks amazing.

 

I just wish we could get a peek at the Rift Mage abilities I want to know what that's all about *flails*

 

My thoughts exactly.

[Adhin]

Kinda weird it doesn't 'say' what skill Iron Bull is using when he does that, or at least i'm not seeing it pop up next to his name. Thought it was one of the horn skills in battlemaster honestly.

[Dragkonias]

Aura of Pain looks awesome.

 

But that means I'd probably have to go for War Horn instead of Horn of Valor because that Stamina Regen bonus from Deep Reserves would be a great help in keeping it going.

[WillieStyle]

I had not seen that!!

 

Apparently it doesn't hurt you like past games, that's a bit odd. If your building a bunch of guard that makes it a little less... useful. Also looks like while Aura of Pain is advice Devour will heal you to FULL upon use, lowering the damage bonus you would of gained after that. That's absurd though, imagine having low health and keeping guard up, and when guard is about to get broken, hitting devour to insta-full heal.

 

wonder what the third ability is then, and if there is anyway to lose health outside of 'not building guard' for a bit.

 

The mechanic for Devour jives with what someone in the DAMP forums said: That health-steal is supposed to be the Reaver's alternative to guard while tanking.  Might mean that the Reaver is more effective when not generating guard at all.  Just time Devour to maximize your damage bonus uptime while healing yourself back to full right before you die.  Talk about high-risk / high-reward.

[WillieStyle]

Also, since 2H abilities have such long cooldowns (double S&S) the 2H Reaver might not be stamina limited.  Coupled with the skill that returns stamina the more targets you hit, and the skill that increases stamina regen when at low stamina, it might be possible to keep circle of pain up indefinitely (at least when tanking multiple enemies).  The Reaver tank might generate so much AoE dps that she wouldn't need taunts at all.  Put all ability points into Damage dealing and Utility (combat roll, the chain thingie, War Cry etc.) and be a daredevil whirlwind of destruction that tanks via lifesteal.  You might just need a few Barriers and Slows from party members to increase your margin of error.

 

P.S.

My sense is that as a tank, you're going to want to take combat roll.  Note the upgrade that says you can use it to recover from most debilitating conditions.  No faster way to get dead as a tank (especially a lifesteal tank) than to get stunned or knocked down.

[Adhin]

Yeah I'll end up using Aura of Pain for dmg, and keep devour for emergencies when the HP is getting low and CD's are funky and can't quickly build guard back up. Not sure I'd want to rely 'entirely' on the health loss and all that. Then again, it may work out relatively well with little guard gained via Block and Attack. Ahh whatever, more survival options are whats important. Don't need to maximize damage on my tank reaver. But having that devuor + pain combos pretty awesome... though devour consumes a TON of stamina.

 

-edit-

@WillieStyle : Not sure there will be to many stuns like that. Been mentioned they're trying to get away from heavy incapacitation effects on players end. Knock down so far has been mostly a thrown and get back up, don't think roll will fix that unless you can use it mid-flying through the air. That said I think it'll help you get rid of debuffs. Like being slowed or something.

[Biotic Sage]

So we're nearing the final stretch.  We now know most everything about abilities; just a few details elude us still.

 

In my opinion the skill trees look great.  My only criticism is that the spell choices (especially the active spells) are too limited.  You're going to have 8/21 available spells on your hotbar.  I think it should be more like 8/25.  Then you have more significant choices and opportunity cost to consider when building your character.  Each class should have one more base skill tree added.  Here is my "perfect world" scenario, my suggestions for the added skill trees:

 

Mage - Earth

Stinging Swarm (not the bees!!!; it can transfer to nearby enemies from the primary target, can be contagious up to 5 times; nature damage over time)

Heroic Aura (use like Barrier so that it affects party members in a targeted area; a combination of all the Enhancement spells from DA:O)

Stone Fist (move this spell from Rift Mage and instead put Crushing Prison in Rift Mage)

Ensnare (move this spell from Rift Mage, if it's actually there, and instead put an Entropic spell like Drain Life or Miasma in Rift Mage)

 

Warrior - Utility

Throwing Axe (throw a hard-hitting axe at a single target that also stuns for a few seconds)

Flail (basically go berserk with a flail on all enemies within close range; sunders their armor and does massive damage)

Frenzy (activate this and it lasts for 10 seconds; attack 8% faster with each basic attack, stacking)

Cleave (activate this and it lasts for 10 seconds; each basic attack does bonus damage and generates some guard)

 

Rogue - Bard

Song of Courage (activate this and it lasts for 15 seconds; basically a general party buff; slight increase to damage, crit chance, and stamina/mana regen; 45 second cooldown)

Captivating Song (activate this and it stuns anyone in a 10m range for 3 seconds; when they regain consciousness their threat amounts are reset to 0, which means they'll go to the highest inherent threat, probably the warrior, unless more threat is generated by other characters from this point forward)

Decoy (just like DA2)

Back to Back (just like DA2, except you appear next to the party member closest to you)

[Adhin]

So... Reavers. We know 2 of the skills now, we know devour has it's own, special icon. I was pretty sure Dragon Rage or whatever it is was the third skill was that 3 hit combo aaand someone recently posted a video in some VO thread. Gonna post it here: http://youtu.be/FfGTtyYeO8E?t=1m58s

 

Now the reason I'm bringing this up is, and tell me if im crazy here but the eyeballs light up with circles each time you attack. Which is super weird. I'm pretty sure the skill 'always' does the 3-hit combo, and that eye-ring thing might just be some old E3 build thing with the icon counting each attack for testing purposes. Either way I'm confident that's the third Reaver skill, and that it's a 3 hit combo for dmg output.

 

Not really sure why I wanted to post this but there ya go.
 

-edit-

OMG... Omg... guys, GUYS... if you watch the clip it doesn't consume stamina! This is how we lose hp with out taking damage! Ignore all that bullpoop I said earlier. Maybe you use it like Spirit Blade or something, tap to use, hold to chain blah blah I dunno, maybe it has a combo system blah blah. But check out his stamina when he uses it, then check out his health. Ok, Screw that, just check out his health cause I'm tellin' ya it doesn't consume stamina at all.

 

No idea how I missed that up to this point. Dragon Rage or whatever that attack skill is called totally consumes your own life for damage. Ring of Pain boosts your damage for stamina drain, Devour does dmg based off how low your life is + can heal you IF Ring of Pain is on. So... think about this. Ring of Pain, bust out some rage attack to lower your own health which strengthens pain. If health is real low, hit em with a devour for massive 1 shot that full heals.

 

-insert mind blown meme-

 

-second-edit-

Oh and further indication it is indeed the skill harming his health? Bull has like 80-90% barrier through out the attack chain and isn't being directly attacked. Evidence yall!

[Fashion Mage]

I wonder if Spirit Blade works with Clean Burn.

[azarhal]

I wonder if Spirit Blade works with Clean Burn.

 

I'm personally wondering if Clean Burn is really cumulative. O_O

[Thibax]

Abraham_uk and Roninbarista, thank you very much.

Great opinions!

 

I'll try others options when I can see all spells/talents available.

[Borosini]

So... Reavers. <snip>

 

What you're saying is—Reavers are the Blood Mages of DAI?

[Adhin]

Hahah, well Reavers are the Reavers of DAI 'technically' since they've always harmed them selves to dish out more damage. But in the absence of Blood Mages... yes, yes they are.

[hypr]

Nicely spotted Adhin. Reaver looks like it'll be a lot of fun.

 

Also it seems the sword-and-shield passive warriors resolve would be extremly usefull even for a 2handed warrior (assuming it works). So if your stamina runs low because of ring of pain you can just use dragon rage (or whatever the abillity is called) and basicly trade your hp in for stamina (you get 10% stamina back for 10% hp).

[hypr]

Oh and then you use devour to heal yourself and it all starts over again.

[Adhin]

Heh yeah, and failing that you could still play a reaver as a SnB guy. That would actually be kinda funny, using the self-harm rage attack skill to burst stamina back so you can use devour that consumes all that stamina for a full heal lol. Reaver has that kinda awkward synergy I like so much, it's gonna be fun. There is also a passive in Battlemaster that ups your stamina regeneration rate by 50% as long as it's below 50% which could be useful depending on how much stamina we 'actually' have.

 

One I am definitely getting though is gonna be in the 2H tree. Every additional enemy hit nets 10% max stamina per hit. Fighting 3 enemies? 20% per auto-attack. Hell probably works on normal attacks too. I bet with that passive you could refund the full cost of Whirlwind and turn it into a stamina funnel. Might even work on Charging Bull as long as a singular 'charge' counted as one attack.

 

Oh hell... Charging Bull! It's upgraded nullifies stamina cost COMPLETELY. Hah... oh man. Getting low on health? Bull Charge, turn around and devour for a FREE devour! Ohmergerd yalls.

 

-edit-

LOL omg, so quick look over Charging Bull again. It only costs 5 stamina 'per second'. So a single tap of that's just 5 stamina, has the same 8 sec CD of devour. So like.. I mean, you know, that's gonna be my combo. Bull + Devour each time. You even have 6 seconds of a window to use devour after your charge lol.

 

The skills, they are delicious.

[WillieStyle]

Great catch Adhin! I'm starting to see why we're limited to 8 active abilities. Otherwise, some of these combos would be ridiculously broken.
P.S.
It's a shame DA:I combat doesn't have "depth" like Origins.

[WillieStyle]

Ugh! Now I have to take awesome guard generating abilities to go along with my Reaver, 2H and Battlemaster/Vanguard abilities. But at least I won't need to take taunts. [/first world problems]

[Adhin]

Hahaha yeah totally DAI has no depth like DAO...

 

In relation to guard, if your not building your Reaver as a pure tank I think you could get by with Devour almost exclusively. I mean it's on a 8 second base CD. We've seen plenty of skills that can reduce CD"s beyond that as well. For example in 2H tree, left side, every crit reduces CD by 1 second. add groups into the mix you could be Devouring pretty often as long as you had the stamina for it. Add charge into the mix and yeah, could do that combo every 4 seconds.... or however long it takes your HP to drop enough to make Devour worth the dmg.

[Dragkonias]

Hmm...I'm thinking depending on how the rest of the Reaver tree looks I might forego Vanguard completely and just use Block & Slash and Combat Roll as my defensive abilities.

 

On second thought, I forgot Charging Bull's upgrade makes your next skill cost no stamina. So yeah...think I will stick to my original bulid.

[Kage]

I dont know, maybe I understand something different for "depth", but I would say DAO had very little, and DAI has tons.

In DAO there were tons of spells sure, but since 70% were useless, and you had a mana limitation, you would not even cast them. The combat in DAI has more combos, the rogues and warriors seem better, we have the mitigation gameplay, we have focus.... I dont kow, I would say that even if we have many less abilities, they are more interesting, deep and offer more gameplay features.

[WillieStyle]

My plan is to take the bare minimum number of tank skills to be viable. But since I won't be rolling with another tank (likely two mages and a rogue) I'll have to be the "main tank". The reason I think I might have to take guard is because of the banes of every "active mitigation" tank in any RPG I've ever played: unlucky enemy crit streaks, and stuns.

Now, maybe enemies on Nightmare will never be able to burst you from half health to zero in under four seconds or stun you right before you hit Devour. But until I'm sure that's the case, I'm going to plan some guard building abilities into my build.

[Adhin]

@Kage : Re-read all that with sarcasm man... cause it was sarcasm. DAI has far more tactical oriented skills then either of the past games. And a lot more thought put into synergy between all the skills.

 

-edit-

@Willie: Yeah I'll be working on building guard effectively with in my build. There's a lot of good tank passives around having guard. You can build guard via items too (thought not in % values). I'm pretty much only using War Cry and Charging Bull from Vanguard for skills, getting all 4 passives though. War Cry is great AoE taunt and upgrade will build 20% guard per enemy.  Has a 24 sec CD though, but it's upgrade also will come with 200% armor bonus for 10 seconds. So it'll heavily impact how much dmg you in take before even think about that bonus temp HP from guard.

 

Either way everything in Vanguard except 1 of the skills builds guards anyway. Charge does, taunts do.. Unbowed does too. If you wanted just 2 abilities to build as much guard as possible, War Cry and Unbowed would do it. 20% per enemy from War Cry, and Unbowed is another 20% (fully upgraded) per enemy... that's a quick path to 100%. I wont be using unbowed though, I figure taunt + 2H counter will be enough. Add to that Charge doing 10% per enemy you hit... I figure it adda be enough but we'll see. Oh yeah, one passive is also another 20% armor bonus just for having Guard. So that's 220% armor bonus with War Cry going.

[azarhal]

@Kage : Re-read all that with sarcasm man... cause it was sarcasm. DAI has far more tactical oriented skills then either of the past games. And a lot more thought put into synergy between all the skills.

 

To his credit, I didn't read that as sarcasm the first time either. It just made me wonder what the hell I missed in DAO.