6397 réponses à ce sujet

[RustyW]

We should just ask quite a few times on twitter (but not spam) to Cameron, Mark & Mike on Twitter and ask them to show the rest. I am sure they could whack outa video or show in a twitch stream or just post them.

[Adhin]

@Andy: Yeah I know, I said 'fervor' didn't increase attack speed anymore. I didn't say they don't have an attack speed anymore. I very much am looking forward to that Rampage skill, though it's a focus, so you know... few and far between use vs almost constant attack speed boost. But like I said, I'd rather have the 30% dmg boost all the time over attack speed.

 

Attack speed kinda 'feels' better, but actual damage output 30% dmg boost is far more universally useful.

 

-edit-

You'd probably have better luck asking some reviewer of a more RPG info oriented site then the dev's directly. Don't think they're gonna do a stream just to show the trees, as much as I wish they would.

[andy6915]

@Andy: Yeah I know, I said 'fervor' didn't increase attack speed anymore. I didn't say they don't have an attack speed anymore. I very much am looking forward to that Rampage skill, though it's a focus, so you know... few and far between use vs almost constant attack speed boost. But like I said, I'd rather have the 30% dmg boost all the time over attack speed.

 

Attack speed kinda 'feels' better, but actual damage output 30% dmg boost is far more universally useful.

 

I'm going to miss 2-handed warriors in DA2 slashing faster than rogues can attack with dual wielding in DA2. That wasn't with just reaver mind you, pulling that off required berserk too.

[Kage]

wow the info!!

 

After reading all, I think I got my 2 first runs.

 

Female Elf Necromancer: Inferno, Spirit, some random spells

Cole

Cassandra

Solas

Varric

 

Male Human Templar: 2H

Vivienne

Dorian

Sera

Iron Bull

 

I think that is how I would maximize the personalities and banters I want to hear (Cassandra+Varric, Vivienne+Dorian, Solas+Cole, Sera+Iron Bull), and they make up for some really nicely balanced parties.

There are some pretty sick combos, like:

- a Cassandra super tank aggro management, while I use the glass cannon fire mage (yes, I will embrace chaotic focus)

- a haste with multiple AA companions

- etc

 

And also, they would be 2 very different combat approaches, gameplay and mechanics. For the first, it will be a classic main tank (Cass), keep all mobs under control, lots of CC, and a nuker Inquisitor. For the second, it will be a just offtank, dps race, with resourgence for bosses, aggro more distributed (Viv can take damage from minor mobs, Dorian combats while dead, Iron bull gains health...).

 

CANT WAIT!!!

 

(My third playthrough, just after my divorce due to not having a life outside the PS4, will be an Evilquisitor!)

[PillarBiter]

I'm going to miss 2-handed warriors in DA2 slashing faster than rogues can attack with dual wielding in DA2. That wasn't with just reaver mind you, pulling that off required berserk too.

 

yeah, I really hope the last passive is an attack boost passive, but we'll see. 

 

Also, that rampage at tier 3 is madness! 30% attack speed AND 30% damage? If you couple that with haste tier 3... Doom for one and all, and all and one!

 

Also, can someone twitter the question: for gore and trample, does that apply to sustaineds or toggles as well? I doubt they'll answer something so specific, but still... I'd like to know :/

[themageguy]

Is there any screen shots of dragon rage/?

[Kage]

Oh, I just realized necro + inferno does not combo at all, since panic is not the same as fear.

Fear is a CC effect that does breaks with damage, while panic does not break.

 

The inferno passive "pyromancer" gives you a +25% fear duration, and wall of fire and flashfire both cause fear. There is no panic in the inferno tree.

 

However, necromancer's Horror causes "panic". And blinding terror only gives a damage bonus against panicked enemies, not feared. There is no fear in the necromancer tree.

 

So yeah, they are completely different... Unless there is some combo sinergy, they have none.

 

I AM STILL DOING THOUGH. The lore sinergy is enough for me. Beware of the FEARQUISITOR

 

EDIT: And also, the enemies immune to fear/panic (undead), are vulnerable to fire. The enemies resistant to fire (venatori), are vulnerable to fear/panic. So yeah...

[Jurus]

Oh, I just realized necro + inferno does not combo at all, since panic is not the same as fear.

Fear is a CC effect that does breaks with damage, while panic does not break.

 

Where did you get this info?

 

I assumed they were the same, since Flashfire's description says it sends it's enemies fleeing in panic and it's upgrade saying that it intesifies panic, while the spells themselves list fear.

[Biotic Sage]

Oh, I just realized necro + inferno does not combo at all, since panic is not the same as fear.

Fear is a CC effect that does breaks with damage, while panic does not break.

 

The inferno passive "pyromancer" gives you a +25% fear duration, and wall of fire and flashfire both cause fear. There is no panic in the inferno tree.

 

However, necromancer's Horror causes "panic". And blinding terror only gives a damage bonus against panicked enemies, not feared. There is no fear in the necromancer tree.

 

So yeah, they are completely different... Unless there is some combo sinergy, they have none.

 

 

What do you mean by "Fear does breaks with damage, while panic does not break?"

 

And if this is true, then they have some very poorly worded skill descriptions.  They literally use the word "panic" in the descriptions for Flashfire and Wall of Fire.  If "panic" is a distinct cc effect, then they should absolutely refrain from using that word when describing a completely different cc effect, "fear;" they should use a word like "frighten" in the Inferno tree descriptions if this is the case.

 

Are you sure about this?  Panic and fear seem to be the exact same thing.  And what does this mean for the Rogue passive, Mercy Killing?  Or the Necromancer passive Blinding Terror (if what you're saying is true, then that passive only benefits from one active ability: Horror, which would be a pretty big waste).  Do you have any confirmation on "fear" and "panic" being distinct effects other than interpretation?  You could very well be right, but I'll need to see some hard evidence before I panic. (hue hue hue)

[Dunbartacus]

Horror says Panic duration while flashfire says fear duration which probably means different status effects.

[Jurus]

Horror says Panic duration while flashfire says fear duration which probably means different status effects.

 

LOL Just rechecked the spells and while Flashifire says it sends enemies fleeing in panic a lists fear, Horror says you unleash spirits of fear and lists panic. GG

[Biotic Sage]

LOL Just rechecked the spells and while Flashifire says it sends enemies fleeing in panic a lists fear, Horror says you unleash spirits of fear and lists panic. GG

 

Which leads me to believe that Bioware devs themselves mix up the two because they are the exact same thing.  They probably originally named the CC effect one of those and then later decided to change it to the other.  Just like how they always misspeak and say "Blink" when referring to "Fade Step" in the streaming videos.

 

If we happen to see an official effects list for DA:I or get dev confirmation that they are in fact different, then that is GG. / discussion

[Murloc Knight]

Hi guys. I'm feeling kinda lazy to read this long thread. Mind giving me any feedback on knight enchanter? how awesome are they?

[Jurus]

Which leads me to believe that Bioware devs themselves mix up the two because they are the exact same thing.  They probably originally named the CC effect one of those and then later decided to change it to the other.  Just like how they always misspeak and say "Blink" when referring to "Fade Step" in the streaming videos.

 

I think so too, since there are at least 4 talents in Inferno that have panic/ing in their description and fear as their effect.

[PillarBiter]

I think so too, since there are at least 4 talents in Inferno that have panic/ing in their description and fear as their effect.

 

yeah, they use that alternatingly, so I think it's the same effect. 

 

Either way, Dorian is going to become the most feared Tevinter mage ever

[Adhin]

@themageguy: Nah, no screen shots of how much dmg it does or exactly how it works. We have footage (quite a bit) of Iron Bull using the skill though. What we know is basically 3 bits. 1 it's the last skill in the Reaver tree, requiring you have devour ahead of it. It consumes Health instead of stamina, and it's a 3 hit chain combo thing. That is you use it, and it hits 3 times... well I guess it could count as 4 hits as the one visually is 2 ghost dragon arm claws instead of 1 but ... whatever, visuals.

 

That's about it though, if you've seen any footage of Iron Bull doing something with red claw graphics where its like a left to right swipe, then right to left, then 2 large claws upper cutting - that's the move. Considering theres a passive based off having lower health, and devour gets 20% bonus dmg per 1% missing life, this is the skill that ensures your HP drops quick even if your not being hit, or if your heavy with guard/barriers.

 

@PillarBiter: I honestly hope it doesn't. If it does it'll probably only effect the initial cost. I mean making Block and Slash not cost it's 10 stamina but then keep costing 5 after would be a colossal waste. Ring of Pain initial free 10 then costing 10... now if it made the whole sustained cost free indefinitely? That's something else, if it worked like that I'd charge into a group and immediately throw down a perm-free ring of pain and fight in that the whole time with out worrying about my stamina drain. Which... I doubt is the case LOL.

[Kage]

Oh sorry guys, I thought you already knew about the difference between them.

They talked about fear and sleep in one of the twitch sessions, with Mike and Cameron. Mike explained what it is fear and sleep, and he used Flashfire as an example. They are CC abilities that break when you deal damage to the target. He also said that flashfire can cause a fear of up to 20 seconds, so it is better used to take out of the fight a mob you are not attacking soon. The spell says 8, the upgrade says 8 more, and pyromancer adds 25%, so (8+8) x 1.25= exactly 20 seconds. He knows his stuff.

 

You also have an upgrade to Sleep Powder so the target keeps sleeping for 3 seconds more after taking damage, called "Deep sleep", so it's pretty much confirmed that way too.

 

And then we have "panic", which is a different CC effect. I totally assumed that it does not break upon damage, because:

1) Horror causes just 6 seconds of panic, and that is all. Wall of fire causes fear AND massive dot damage

2) Necromancer has a passive to incentive the burst down of enemies panicked, so it makes sense to actually attack them while in panic

 

Edit: And yeah, the description of the spell really confuses... I guess they tried not to repeat themselves too much by using synonims, and that's all

 

Edit 2: So yeah, my flamequisitress will be so fun. Panic for the enemies you are killing, fear for the enemies that will be next, but every single one of them is sh**ing their pants.

[themageguy]

Thanks Adhin.

Well I've decided on my three inquisitors.

#1. Dwarven tempest. Closest a dwarf may get to casting spells also that magic resistance is great.

#2. Qunari Knight Enchanter. Melee defence bonus, and should look badass wielding spirit blade !

#3. Human necromancer. Extra skill point will help me gain mastery over the spirits of death

there's is a slight possibility the qunari knight enchanter may be dalish instead....

[mikeymoonshine]

Hi guys. I'm feeling kinda lazy to read this long thread. Mind giving me any feedback on knight enchanter? how awesome are they?

 

There are images (or links to where you can find images) for KE in the OP. Anything else you want to know you just ask and we will tell you if we know ourselves, but you will have to be more specific. 

[Bronson]

Oh sorry guys, I thought you already knew about the difference between them.

They talked about fear and sleep in one of the twitch sessions, with Mike and Cameron. Mike explained what it is fear and sleep, and he used Flashfire as an example. They are CC abilities that break when you deal damage to the target. He also said that flashfire can cause a fear of up to 20 seconds, so it is better used to take out of the fight a mob you are not attacking soon. The spell says 8, the upgrade says 8 more, and pyromancer adds 25%, so (8+8) x 1.25= exactly 20 seconds. He knows his stuff.

 

Flashfire does 300% Weapon damage so if Fear is broken on DMG taken we can assume DMG is applied before Fear.

 

The bolded is what i was talking about earlier. You could use it on a dangerous enemy at the beginning of the battle, virtually keep them perma feared, then when the rest of the enemies are dead, "allow' them to charge back in, only to be nuked by the party.

[mikeymoonshine]

So do you guys think KE/Fire Mage would work for a sort of tank(ish) build? 

 

Thanks Adhin.

Well I've decided on my three inquisitors.

#1. Dwarven tempest. Closest a dwarf may get to casting spells also that magic resistance is great.

#2. Qunari Knight Enchanter. Melee defence bonus, and should look badass wielding spirit blade !

#3. Human necromancer. Extra skill point will help me gain mastery over the spirits of death

there's is a slight possibility the qunari knight enchanter may be dalish instead....

 

Awesome! My 3rd playthrough will be a qunari KE/Fire Mage. I might also play a dwarven Tempest. I don't usually do dwarven rogues and prefer to roleplay them as warriors but what with the Artificer and Tempest specs I feel like rogue suits dwarves better in this game lore wise. I can't decide between those two though I might actually roll one of each both as dwarves tbh. 

[themageguy]

So do you guys think KE/Fire Mage would work for a sort of tank(ish) build?


Awesome! My 3rd playthrough will be a qunari KE/Fire Mage. I might also play a dwarven Tempest. I don't usually do dwarven rogues and prefer to roleplay them as warriors but what with the Artificer and Tempest specs I feel like rogue suits dwarves better in this game lore wise. I can't decide between those two though I might actually roll one of each both as dwarves tbh.

Im not sure what order i will play my planned inquisitors in. Maybe mage, rogue then mage. If i don't enjoy tempest with sera i may not even start the dwarven inquisitor.

I think knight enchanter with skill in inferno magic would be quite fearsome. Indeed mike Laidlaw's KE had immolate as his only elemental spell after his respec.

There also seem to be a fair few enemies weak to fire, and any that resist you have your spirit blade

Also, are you having horns with your qunari? There are horns that remind me of the fire breather type dragons.

My qunari will be specialising in storm magic to compliment KE (i hope it does ...it seems to in my head hahaha) and will have horns similar to the other dragons seen in footage.
Just a little aesthetic quirk to my character.

[Kage]

The tankish Knight Enchanter is still in the air, we need more maths regarding it.

Does Barrier allow mitigation? Does 50% damage reduction apply to barrier?

 

Right now, we know KE will generate barriers depending on the damage they do. So more damage = more barrier.

We also know you do not need barrier to be cast on you to benefit from this.

 

So to cast a barrier to protect yourself, and then attack in melée, seems stupid. It is better to just attack directly, and generate barrier with those attacks. At least from an offtank perspective.

 

To be main tank, I think KE will have a hard time, since barrier will disappear fast, you dont have guard, and you dont have any aggro management abilities.

 

I still think KEs are rogues, and their protections are more like the evasion of a rogue. Something to mitigate some attacks, but not a constant flow of attacks.

 

Right now I think all 4 trees give something useful to the KE. With inferno, you reduce CD on spell casts, so using spirit blade would be awesome. With frost, you can easily create your own combo, have more durability, and maintain blizzard while you melée. With storm, you can set up rings of dead and battle mages/archers, you can hit with a passive nearby enemies. With spirit, you can really benefit from the evasion of mind blast since you will be at melée, and the barriers will also hit yourself besides the main tank.

 

Right know I think I would go fire or lightning...

 

 

Edit: To make Inferno KE tank work, I think you would need to spec heavily in spirit to have huge barriers. With spell CD reduction, and your damage, you should be able to generate a lot of barriers on yourself all the time. However, I think it would be a little boring... It would be much fun to cast Wall of Fire many times from having low CDs!

(And spec critical!)

[Adhin]

100% Yes Mikey. The whole Barrier Leech with spirit blade makes any kind of KE tankable. You'll get far more effect out of it via making sure you get the Spirit passive for bolstering Barrier but other then that, KE has a lot of good Barrier buffs. As far as Fire mage... yeah. The only thing in the Pyro tree that has much effect on the tanking would be Chaotic Focus.

 

Now, I'd say while that seems like a big hit (50% of current barrier) Spirit Blade leeching Barriers can compensate that rather quickly. It's ultimately a matter of keeping mana up (which doesn't seem to hard). I also believe Mike said Spirit Blade hits in a wide arc and, as such, can hit multiple enemies. So, since it's 30% leech - more enemies you hit, more barriers your getting back. And since Chaotic Focus 'only' effects fire spells, you'll only have to be careful when you do that portion of things.

 

Or you know, focus entirely on 'tanking' and just don't take Chaotic Focus. Personally I like the idea of being able to keep your barriers topped off so you get the most out of Chaotic Focus and quickly pulse them back up with a few Spirit Blade attacks.

 

-edit-

@Kage: We already know the mitigation thing - no, no it doesn't. But Barrier has massive health totals to compensate for that. and KE has some passives to get Barrier back, do dmg to attackers while barriers up and slow the decay of barrier (by 35%!). Ultimately that means the per-second drain of Barrier with just idling is less severe, ultimately resulting in more barrier more often.

 

Again with one KE passive you leech 30% of your damage as Barrier and you can easily do 800-2k dmg with Spirit Blade. We've seen over 5k to Guard (it has huge bonus to guard). As long as you have mana, you can kinda perpetually keep your barrier going.

 

-more edit-

Oh also keep in mind procs. 10% to cast barrier or there might also be barrier on hit like there is guard. Speaking of that, theres guard per hit on weapons... though that maybe warrior weapons only. Either case all this is ultimately ignoring what items can do since we don't know exactly how that all works and if theres any limitations on it.

 

I'm confident you could make a hell of a off-tank if nothing else with a KE. Not sure if your gonna be taking on 5 all at once, or a few super heavy hitters. But then since Spirit Blade hit's more enemies, leech becomes more effective in a group making your barriers that more effective. So who knows, but from footage we've seen im relatively confident it wont be horribly impossible.

 

Sure wont be a high con Shield Wall warrior though, they'll be able to do waaay better then a KE, as they should.

[Biotic Sage]

Oh sorry guys, I thought you already knew about the difference between them.

They talked about fear and sleep in one of the twitch sessions, with Mike and Cameron. Mike explained what it is fear and sleep, and he used Flashfire as an example. They are CC abilities that break when you deal damage to the target. He also said that flashfire can cause a fear of up to 20 seconds, so it is better used to take out of the fight a mob you are not attacking soon. The spell says 8, the upgrade says 8 more, and pyromancer adds 25%, so (8+8) x 1.25= exactly 20 seconds. He knows his stuff.

 

You also have an upgrade to Sleep Powder so the target keeps sleeping for 3 seconds more after taking damage, called "Deep sleep", so it's pretty much confirmed that way too.

 

And then we have "panic", which is a different CC effect. I totally assumed that it does not break upon damage, because:

1) Horror causes just 6 seconds of panic, and that is all. Wall of fire causes fear AND massive dot damage

2) Necromancer has a passive to incentive the burst down of enemies panicked, so it makes sense to actually attack them while in panic

 

Edit: And yeah, the description of the spell really confuses... I guess they tried not to repeat themselves too much by using synonims, and that's all

 

Edit 2: So yeah, my flamequisitress will be so fun. Panic for the enemies you are killing, fear for the enemies that will be next, but every single one of them is sh**ing their pants.

 

That still doesn't really confirm that "Fear" and "Panic" are different though.  I know the stream you're referring to; watched it myself.  Like you said, they explained the difference between "Fear" and "Sleep."  You think they'd really have "Fear," "Sleep, " and "Panic?"  I highly doubt they'd make a whole different status effect just for the Necromancer tree.  "Weakened" is a status effect shared by Rift Mage, Templar, and who knows what else.

 

So I see what you mean by panicked enemies losing the panic effect when they take damage.  I think this will be the exact same for Horror.  Horror does give just 6 seconds of panic/fear, but it has a cooldown time of 24 seconds compared to Wall of Fire's 32 seconds, it's AOE unlike Flashfire, and more significantly it is accessible right off the bat without investing in any other abilities on the tree, so it's not a top tier ability.  Wall of Fire you need to invest in at least 3 skills in Inferno before you get to it.  As for the Necro passive, it's a little less powerful considering that damaging the enemy breaks the panic effect, but it's still really good to use a high powered single target DPS spell on enemies who are panicked.  Just like the Rogues who auto-crit with Mercy Killing on panicked/sleeping enemies.