6397 réponses à ce sujet

[Hellion Rex]

Did anyone snap a picture of the Inferno and Winter trees?

[Gamemako]

And they've changed again in the most recent video!

...Or have they? This time, it's Dorian's trees. Remember how Bianca had its own name in DA2? Could each mage have their own trees?

//EDIT: Totally ninja'd by amggrunt. Need to hit refresh button before posting.

[Adhin]

They might 'rename' the skill trees per characters but for the 4 general tabs ALL CLASSES get... that seems pretty damn pointless. The specialization i can see being unique (or semi-unique) but they're not going to make all the skill trees changed up for everyone. I mean what are they going to cal Two-Handed for the warriors? The Long Horn for 2H on Iron Bull? C'mon guys... c'mon now...

 

-edit-

And before anyone says it - they already said everyone gets access to all the base stuff. IB has SnB, 2H, Vanguard and battlemaster or whatever it is. Just the same as the player and the other 2 warrior companions.

[themageguy]

Now I'm really wondering if earth spells have been thrown in with creation spells.

[Thibax]

I will cry forever without nature spells. Bioware, why? 

 

Nature is important for everyone.

[The Night Haunter]

We've almost never had nature spells. In DAO we had 2 spells that did nature damage, and in DA2 we had 0. Merrill was the sole source of Nature damage. Made me sad

[Borosini]

I will cry forever without nature spells. Bioware, why? 

 

Nature is important for everyone.

 

I really think there will be a tree for every element. I could be wrong, but why were they showing off lightning spells and stonefist in the demo just as much as fire and ice spells?

 

No guarantee earth = nature damage though...

[Adhin]

They've said there are 4 tabs. The other 2 tabs could easily have the lightning and the earth spells in them, I mean we know stone fists is in and we've seen lightning spells. So we 'know' they exist at least. But I don't think there going to devote the entire 4 tabs to just be the 4 elements. We know theres healing, haste, we've seen Spirit stuff and there was an obvious Entropy oriented thing in the E3 showing.

 

But then I've said this much before. I think there will be a spirity/creation-ish tree with some earth, and a spirity/entropy with lightning in it along side the heavily focused Fire and Cold. I'm 99% sure that Fire and Cold is the mages version of Sword n Board and 2H, or Daggers and Bow. Only difference is the Mage can mix and match it since it all works with staffs.

[Magdalena11]

I will cry forever without nature spells. Bioware, why? 

 

Nature is important for everyone.

I can't remember the timestamp but there's a time when Vivienne is casting chain lightning and a symbol that looks a lot like Merrill's stone's throw ability is beneath it, in purple as well.  

[Adhin]

Think that's stone fist (normal mages had access to it in DA2 as well). They showed it in E3, mage used it to shatter there own frozen enemies which is a nice change of pace from DA2 only cross-class combos. Little more DAO brought back for that.

 

One side thing I forgot to say in the last post, I kind of like the spell restructuring. As has been said before the 'categories' isn't some universal held thing or truth to the world. It's just how the circle classified stuff. With the circle being dismantled for a year-ish amongst other crazy events it kinda makes sense they're all over the place. Kinda represents how the world currently is you know?

 

Side's how is making a wall of ice not a creation thing? I mean, in DnD the 'schools' are a fundamental extension of literally how the spell works. Evocation is literally creation from nothing. Conjuration is taking something that exist elsewhere and bringing to a location. DA just hasn't really had that, outside of spirit manipulation or blood magic they 'all' create something from nothing.

 

-edit-

Lol wall of nice, oops.

[Gamemako]

I'm not sure what to make of the trees. The four trees we see on Dorian are Primal (fire), Primal (ice), Spirit (butprobablyalsoprimal), and Primal (lightning in Vivienne's tree, and where is earth?). We never see Dorian use lightning, but we definitely see Vivienne use those 3 primal elements and have them in her trees. I'm not sure where Stonefist is hiding. If everything is the same -- 4 trees and a spec, no difference between trees except the name -- then we basically have Fire, Ice, Thunder, and ****-it-shove-everything-else-here-and-call-it-Spirit. Definitely not the most interesting possibility for how they could have done things, but... I still have my reservations.

//EDIT:
 

Think that's stone fist (normal mages had access to it in DA2 as well).

Er, do you see that icon anywhere in these?
 

Thought I'd put this here, since I find this fascinating. Source: dragonaging.tumblr.com

//EDIT 2: I just checked again, and the icon isn't in the spirit tree in the E3 demo. Also, Stonefist's icon is yellow rather than purple in that demo.

[The Night Haunter]

You know what would be really cool? 

If which tree we had the most invested in determined what elemental attacks our staff has (or if there were a toggle for each element). Instead of picking up an awesome Ice Staff that is +2 better than your old Fire Staff and still throwing around fireballs, we just pick up a staff that is better, and it gets fire basic attacks.

[Adhin]

@Gamemako: Yeah don't see it there or in the spirit tree in the E3 demo but the E3 demo also had an Entropy tree. That was, as of this time a good 5 month old build. Lotta crap changes as you'd expect and I doubt the way that was layed out is how it is currently, not by a long shot. Case in point the current video which I'm assuming is the latest information available has a different Fire tree then the image you linked too.

 

Untill they show up each tree, and give us a general idea of whats in there (I don't expect full details from them), we just wont have a damn idea whats in what. Other then Fire and Ice are definitely 2 main focuses. But I can't see Earth and Lightning being focuses as well as that would really kill the concept they had going. for themes with the tabs beyond 4 flavors of killing stuff.

 

That said I had forgotten Green Happy icon was named Spirit in the E3 one. Makes me wonder if its still called that, It probably still has the heal and buff oriented stuff though. But then makes me wonder what the other tab is called. I guess that could just be a mix of lightning and earth stuff which kinda makes 3 full tabs devoted to murdering **** and 1 tab for support? Seems odd to me, but we'll find out sooner or later.

[Kage]

I'm not sure what to make of the trees. The four trees we see on Dorian are Primal (fire), Primal (ice), Spirit (butprobablyalsoprimal), and Primal (lightning in Vivienne's tree, and where is earth?). We never see Dorian use lightning, but we definitely see Vivienne use those 3 primal elements and have them in her trees. I'm not sure where Stonefist is hiding. If everything is the same -- 4 trees and a spec, no difference between trees except the name -- then we basically have Fire, Ice, Thunder, and ****-it-shove-everything-else-here-and-call-it-Spirit. Definitely not the most interesting possibility for how they could have done things, but... I still have my reservations.

//EDIT:
 

Er, do you see that icon anywhere in these?
 

//EDIT 2: I just checked again, and the icon isn't in the spirit tree in the E3 demo. Also, Stonefist's icon is yellow rather than purple in that demo.

 

 

Dorian has chain lightning in 1.30 in this video, you can see it when he is about to resurrect Blackwall.

 

I think Bioware knew the spells they wanted their game to have, and now they are playing around to see how they can fit them in 4 skill trees, how to call them, balance them, etc.

They ended with so many fire and cold spells, they could create 2 skill trees only with those, and I guess they are struggling to find the perfect approach to the other 2, in order to keep them elegant, consistent, balanced, and with no tree feeling like its the "put everything that doesnt belong anywhere" tree.

 

Just give them time!

[Icy Magebane]

I'm not sure what to make of the trees. The four trees we see on Dorian are Primal (fire), Primal (ice), Spirit (butprobablyalsoprimal), and Primal (lightning in Vivienne's tree, and where is earth?). We never see Dorian use lightning, but we definitely see Vivienne use those 3 primal elements and have them in her trees. I'm not sure where Stonefist is hiding. If everything is the same -- 4 trees and a spec, no difference between trees except the name -- then we basically have Fire, Ice, Thunder, and ****-it-shove-everything-else-here-and-call-it-Spirit. Definitely not the most interesting possibility for how they could have done things, but... I still have my reservations.

I don't like how much emphasis they've placed on primal/elemental spells...  way too simplistic IMO.  Unless there are a couple more spell trees, they might have put all non-elemental magic in the specializations...

[Gamemako]

@Gamemako: Yeah don't see it there or in the spirit tree in the E3 demo but the E3 demo also had an Entropy tree. That was, as of this time a good 5 month old build. Lotta crap changes as you'd expect and I doubt the way that was layed out is how it is currently, not by a long shot. Case in point the current video which I'm assuming is the latest information available has a different Fire tree then the image you linked too.

I don't see any good reason to have Stonefist in the spirit tree, though. That would be pretty absurd, and removing the abilities in that tree from the E3 demo just doesn't make any sense -- they have to go somewhere. Honestly, I don't see any evidence that Vivienne even has the Stonefist ability at all. It is not on her bar at any point in the gameplay demo, it's not on any of the 3 trees from SDCC, and it's not on the fourth tree from E3. For now, we either have incomplete setup from which limited conclusions about the final product can be drawn, or that companions have not only unique names for their abilities but also unique trees. I'd like it to be the latter, not because I like that but because of what you just said: 3 single-element killing trees and one support tree would be pretty strange.

//EDIT:
 

Dorian has chain lightning in 1.30 in this video, you can see it when he is about to resurrect Blackwall.

Good catch. I know they're not keen on throwing out spell effects, and since we haven't seen anything that could be in these other trees... well, it sure does look like primal-primal-primal-catchall at this point...

[themageguy]

Primal magic has always been a common form of offensive magic in Dragon Age.
One can see this just by reading the novels.

I actually like this new style of options for spells.

For those of you who have seen the combat video, is it just me and my wishful imagination or at 2.23 is that a new stone spell or is it just some ability from the enemy?

[Hellion Rex]

I don't see any good reason to have Stonefist in the spirit tree, though. That would be pretty absurd, and removing the abilities in that tree from the E3 demo just doesn't make any sense -- they have to go somewhere. Honestly, I don't see any evidence that Vivienne even has the Stonefist ability at all. It is not on her bar at any point in the gameplay demo, it's not on any of the 3 trees from SDCC, and it's not on the fourth tree from E3.

funny, cause I have seen Viv have Stonefist both on her bottom right interface as well as utilizing the ability several times, so I don't know what you're talking about.

[Adhin]

@Gamemako : I think you need to drop the idea of a 'Spirit tree' as a thing. Also why do you think everyone has stone fist but Viviene doesn't? We know, we have confirmation and have for awhile (pretty sure it was also in the QnA) that everyone gets the SAME SKILL TREES. So, if Viviene 'doesnt' have the stone fist we've seen used multiple times which specialization do you think its in? Necromancy or Rift Mage? Like I said I can see a more creation oriented tab being mixed with earth and other natury like things. And Entropy/Lightning like stuff in another. Spirit would fit into both but maaaybe they do have a tab named Spirit. Though with tabs like 'Winter' I... don't think they're using the same naming as past games for that. Who knows though, could still be.

[Morroian]

I will cry forever without nature spells. Bioware, why? 

 

Nature is important for everyone.

 

Just generally if fire and ice are completely separate trees I would be disappointed because prima facie it leaves less room for the more esoteric and interesting magic abilities given that they want mages to have the same no. of abilities as rogues and warriors. I guess we'll have to wait and see though. 

 

 

I don't like how much emphasis they've placed on primal/elemental spells...  way too simplistic IMO.  Unless there are a couple more spell trees, they might have put all non-elemental magic in the specializations...

 

Spot on.

[The Night Haunter]

They've already confirmed that they won't be removing trees from companions. All warriors have access to Sword and Board and Two-Handed trees, all Rogues have both Daggers and Bows. It wasn't explicitly stated, but it is pretty obvious that extends to all mages having access to all spell trees. The only thing each character has unique access to is Specializations, which may or may not be the same specializations as the Inquisitor gets. Stonefist is almost certainly not in a specialization tree, so it is a good bet that all 3 mages will be able to cast it, should you devote the necessary points to the tree (whichever it ends up in).

[Gamemako]

funny, cause I have seen Viv have Stonefist both on her bottom right interface as well as utilizing the ability several times, so I don't know what you're talking about.

Gonna have to say when, because I don't see it used a single time in the new gameplay trailer.

@Gamemako : I think you need to drop the idea of a 'Spirit tree' as a thing. Also why do you think everyone has stone fist but Viviene doesn't? We know, we have confirmation and have for awhile (pretty sure it was also in the QnA) that everyone gets the SAME SKILL TREES. So, if Viviene 'doesnt' have the stone fist we've seen used multiple times which specialization do you think its in? Necromancy or Rift Mage? Like I said I can see a more creation oriented tab being mixed with earth and other natury like things. And Entropy/Lightning like stuff in another. Spirit would fit into both but maaaybe they do have a tab named Spirit. Though with tabs like 'Winter' I... don't think they're using the same naming as past games for that. Who knows though, could still be.

We can see the trees and spells which have been used. We see a ton of these fire, ice, and lightning spells, and we've seen some really key spells in the Spirit tree from the E3 demo (the one explicitly called Spirit with a description to match), like barrier, dispel magic, and healing. Those aren't likely going anywhere. Maybe they dug up Stonefist (ha-ha) and threw it into the catchall tree, but it's not in any of Vivienne's trees in the previous demo, and she doesn't have the spell at any point in the more recent demo. But that's really just looking for some way to reconcile this current setup they're showing off. Really, unless they condense fire and ice into one tree and a new wave of spells parachute out of the sky, then it's a setup that makes little sense. It's basically boils down to flavor text for an ability set, with three skill trees as a choose-your-theme-color setup. At least DA2 gave you some variety in your spell selection, where DA3 here is essentially Blue Damage Spell, Red Damage Spell, and Yellow Damage Spell. You'll have to excuse my utter lack of enthusiasm for the absence of any interesting choice choice there.

*sigh* I guess I can still hope maybe it's keyed to staff element... or any other number of equally-unlikely possibilities.

[Hellion Rex]

Gonna have to say when, because I don't see it used a single time in the new gameplay trailer.

I wasn't saying she used Stonefist in the trailer that came out today, I was saying she used Stonefist within the SDCC and the E3 trailers:

 

At 18:38

 

[spacediscosaurus]

Maybe they dug up Stonefist (ha-ha) and threw it into the catchall tree, but it's not in any of Vivienne's trees in the previous demo, and she doesn't have the spell at any point in the more recent demo.

 

In the same demo that showed her trees, I'm fairly certain the spell was used to shatter the bear again. I think it was the Inquisitor who used it, not Vivienne, but I doubt Stonefist is limited to a specialization tree.

 

Anyway, the point is, the spell still existed in the build where Vivienne's trees were shown.

 

I wish I could fact-check this though; I'm currently at work and don't want to go traipsing through Youtube to find this video.

[Hellion Rex]

In the same demo that showed her trees, I'm fairly certain the spell was used to shatter the bear again. I think it was the Inquisitor who used it, not Vivienne, but I doubt Stonefist is limited to a specialization tree.

 

Anyway, the point is, the spell still existed in the build where Vivienne's trees were shown.

 

I wish I could fact-check this though; I'm currently at work and don't want to go traipsing through Youtube to find this video.

In the video posted above, she uses it at 18:38