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Saving the Chantry


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#26
Mistic

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I don't think we'll get a choice.

If BioWare wants it saved, we'll have to save it. If BioWare wants it removed, we won't be able to save it.

 

I agree. Saving or destroying the Chantry is too big of a change to leave it just in the PC's hands.

 

I can see other things happening. For example, a king-maker scenario with two Divine candidates. That I could see happening, especially if the rumours about Justinia dying at the beginning of DA:I are true. Or a change in the way the Circle-Templar system is managed, depending on who the PC supports in the end (and nothing major; like having the same Circles again but different lines of dialogue suggesting that the Templars are more vigilant than ever or that First Enchanters now have the last word in Circle affairs), but nothing more.



#27
Roamingmachine

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This is actually a tough question. On one hand, there is my personal beef with all organized religions that is strong enough to be reflected in every character in every rpg I have played that has had that theme. On the other hand, the Qun is pure concentrated evil and removing a unifying force like the chantry could critically damage the ability of Thedas to defend itself against it. Case of evil vs. worse evil.

#28
TheKomandorShepard

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This is actually a tough question. On one hand, there is my personal beef with all organized religions that is strong enough to be reflected in every character in every rpg I have played that has had that theme. On the other hand, the Qun is pure concentrated evil and removing a unifying force like the chantry could critically damage the ability of Thedas to defend itself against it. Case of evil vs. worse evil.

How qunari are pure evil?

They care about their peoples , they have and promote racial equality (only society in setting that does that) , very low corruption , highly prosperous society.Looks much better than chantry that is highly corrupted and ineffective.



#29
Spaghetti_Ninja

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I agree. Saving or destroying the Chantry is too big of a change to leave it just in the PC's hands.

 

Considering they already have plans for two more games, yeah. They simply can't change the universe too much. I bet it's sticking around in some form.



#30
Roamingmachine

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How qunari are pure evil?
They care about their peoples , they have and promote racial equality (only society in setting that does that) , very low corruption , highly prosperous society.Looks much better than chantry that is highly corrupted and ineffective.


The full answer would go pretty far in to personal philosophy and values territory which isn't the point of this thread so I will just say that the Qun is what every organized religion wants to be and everything I stand against. I'll leave it at that.

Oh, and I don't think we will be given such a big choice either. Chantry is too big of a plot tool for any writer to give up.
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#31
Pierce Miller

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The full answer would go pretty far in to personal philosophy and values territory which isn't the point of this thread so I will just say that the Qun is what every organized religion wants to be and everything I stand against. I'll leave it at that.

Oh, and I don't think we will be given such a big choice either. Chantry is too big of a plot tool for any writer to give up.

It'll probably lose or regain power depending on player choice though, at least that's the way I see it.


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#32
TheKomandorShepard

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The full answer would go pretty far in to personal philosophy and values territory which isn't the point of this thread so I will just say that the Qun is what every organized religion wants to be and everything I stand against. I'll leave it at that.

Oh, and I don't think we will be given such a big choice either. Chantry is too big of a plot tool for any writer to give up.

Still doesn't make it pure evil if it has so many good qualities especially when compared to orlais or tevinter that pretty much lack any redeeming qualities.

 

About choice i rly hope that we will able bring chantry down but it was already crushed by DG who said that we won't be able lead crusade against the chantry in dai still i hope for that or at least extremely weaken chantry.



#33
LobselVith8

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Funny that BW name the hero inquisitor. In real life inquisitors were the church's secret police killing any who question the church. they cause massacres. i sincerely hope thaat we dont hav to do that.


Considering the elven option is to be Dalish, I sincerely doubt that would be the case. As an elf, the player is a member of a society who blame the Chantry for invading their homeland for refusing to convert, and have dealt with hostile Andrastians threatening the clans to convert or templars hunting their mages. If the player was restricted to helping the Chantry (which multiple developers explicitly said wouldn't be the case), it would've made more sense to play as an Andrastian elf.

#34
Hanako Ikezawa

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Considering the elven option is to be Dalish, I sincerely doubt that would be the case. As an elf, the player is a member of a society who blame the Chantry for invading their homeland for refusing to convert, and have dealt with hostile Andrastians threatening the clans to convert or templars hunting their mages. If the player was restricted to helping the Chantry (which multiple developers explicitly said wouldn't be the case), it would've made more sense to play as an Andrastian elf.

Still worst news of Inquisition.  :crying:



#35
Gervaise

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Leaving aside any real world analogies, historically in Thedas there was an Inquisition.   It pre-dated the Chantry and comprised a bunch of Andrastrian hardliners who tried to bring order from the chaos that existed in the period after her death.   At that time there were numerous cults, some devoted to Andraste, some to something else.  They were also concerned to ensure that the mages didn't establish a powerbase for themselves.  This was the case, even in Tevinter, where for a time they maintained a front of non-mages in power, while the mages themselves actually pulled the strings behind the scenes.  

 

Then along came the Chantry.   They unified the various cults into one accepted version.   They seem to have offered some degree of protection to mages provided they didn't use their power in any significant way.   The mages objected to this and so a compromise was agreed whereby the mages would live outside the community but be able to practice and develop their magic.   The Chantry then brought in the Inquisition and presumably suggested they police the mages to ensure things never got out of hand.   So the Inquisition became the Templar order and the Circles were started.   

 

Subsequently the Chantry split, so the Tevinter Chantry allowed mages back into government and actually had a mage as the Black Divine, whereas the Orlesian Chantry retained its stance on mages in positions of power.    The Templars continued to operate in both places but have rather less power in Tevinter.

 

So the Templars have always been semi-autonomous but answer to the Chantry when it comes to major decisions, like calling an Annulment of a Circle.   The White Chantry no longer have a military force to enforce their decisions but that makes no difference to the ordinary people of Thedas who continue to worship as they have done for the last 900 odd years.    All the latest events mean is that they Chantry no longer controls the activities of mages or Templars.   Whether having Templars come in a kill peasants they mistakenly think are mages will impact on the Chantry will, I suppose, depend on how aware they are of the current situation.   I would imagine that the local Chantries will opt for damage limitation and would have already informed their flock of the Templars defection shortly after it happened.   Cullen hinted that ordinary folk were already regarding Templars in a less favourable light than they once had, so most people will just see them as rebelling against their religious leaders  and withdraw their support.    Apparently the latest Inquisition was the idea of the Divine to deal with the situation, thus restoring a measure of military and political power to the Chantry but owing to her death it has become something of an independent organisation.

 

So from what we have been told,  if you wish to play up the religious aspects of the Inquisition and your own place in it, you are free to do so.   You can even have Chantry buildings in your keeps.     However, if you don't wish to do so, that is also an option.      Neither is likely to impact on the Chantry religion as a whole unless you choose to let the world be torn apart, in which case it won't really matter what people believe.


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#36
Eveangaline

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Eh. I'm only willing to save it if it's willing to demilitarize and step out of state matters. If it wants to do exalted marches or tell countries what to do with their mage citizens or make it illegal for dalish religions to exist they will get no assistance from my inquisition.

 

Unless I'm doing a playthrough as a devout "All will kneel before my whims and my religion" type human.



#37
Mistic

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So from what we have been told,  if you wish to play up the religious aspects of the Inquisition and your own place in it, you are free to do so.   You can even have Chantry buildings in your keeps.     However, if you don't wish to do so, that is also an option.      Neither is likely to impact on the Chantry religion as a whole unless you choose to let the world be torn apart, in which case it won't really matter what people believe.

 

Is this true? I've been waiting to hear more of keep customization, actually.



#38
Xilizhra

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Is this true? I've been waiting to hear more of keep customization, actually.

If we have that, I'd like to add Dalish shrines...


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#39
BlueMagitek

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Do Dalish even have shrines?  I remember they had broken statues in DA:O.



#40
Xilizhra

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Do Dalish even have shrines?  I remember they had broken statues in DA:O.

It'd have to be a newish addition, but they do adorn aravels with symbols of the Creators.



#41
Senya

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Well, I certainly want to play a devout Andrastian at least once or twice. I'd love to be able to support/reform the Chantry.

 

It's a little late to add a change if it hasn't already been put in, though. If I remember correctly, the game's story is pretty much finished and they can already play through the whole game, though I can be mistaken about that.



#42
KC_Prototype

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I will for sure save the chantry and reform it a little. 



#43
Xilizhra

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If I play a devout Andrastian, I will play one like this:

 



#44
Eveangaline

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Wait we can have chantry buildings in our keep? Is it like a quest you do for a brother berkel type where they ask and you let them set up or do you have to pay to build it? Also can we keep the tithe money?



#45
ISpeakTheTruth

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I hope we can purge the world of the Chantry. The "White Divine" had its chance with the world now its time for the 'Black Divine" to take over as the new faith of the world. Where mages are seen as the protectors of the world and no a curse to be hidden.


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#46
Hanako Ikezawa

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I hope we can purge the world of the Chantry. The "White Divine" had its chance with the world now its time for the 'Black Divine" to take over as the new faith of the world. Where mages are seen as the protectors of the world and no a curse to be hidden.

Then Tevinter and the Black Divine are the absolute last people I want in charge. 


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#47
Jedi Master of Orion

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I don't know why people seem to think the Black Divine is some sort of legitimate alternative to the White Divine. The Black Chantry is a direct arm of the Tevinter government. The Black Chantry is inextricably and exclusively associated with Tevinter rule. You can't have one without the other and the Imerpium is not going to rule the rest of Thedas again.

 

The one and only possible exception is in Qunari controlled Seheron. The recently reconquered Seheron still has Imperial Chantry Andrastians that have come to resent the Imperium.


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#48
ISpeakTheTruth

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Then Tevinter and the Black Divine are the absolute last people I want in charge. 

 

The view of the Black Divine is the correct social view for mages. Magic is a gift that should be encouraged not hidden away out of fear. Obviously the Tevinter's slave policy and absolute mage supremacy is wrong but that doesn't mean that their faith is immoral.

 

We know that the White Divine enjoys actively destroying other cultures, pushing drugs on Templars, and forcing every country to do exactly what they want or they'll declare war on them. The White Divine had its chance and it didn't really work. Let the Black Divine have a chance now... if nothing else it would be a refreshing change from the constant White Divine setting that we've had in the last two games.


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#49
Jedi Master of Orion

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The Black Chantry is a reflection of the Tevinter Imperium and Tevinter culture. You can't separate the two. The Black Chantry is a mage supremacist Chantry. And the Tevinter Imperium has destroyed more cultures than the Chantry did.



#50
ISpeakTheTruth

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The Black Chantry is a reflection of the Tevinter Imperium and Tevinter culture. You can't separate the two. The Black Chantry is a mage supremacist Chantry. And the Tevinter Imperium has destroyed more cultures than the Chantry did.

 

I believe characters like Dorian are being introduced into the story to show what the future of Tevinter society is going to end up going. A far more moral society that will have more limits on what is acceptable and unacceptable magic. People like Dorian are the future of not only the Tevinter but of all mages. Once that happens allowing the Black Divine to replace the White will be something completely welcome in the new age of magical acceptance.


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