19658 réponses à ce sujet

[SurelyForth]

Hopefully they just don't know his backstory? :/ I mean, if I was just going by looks and didn't know anything about him, I would probably wonder if he was a romance. Yeah, he's a little sick-looking, but he doesn't look like a Kristoff-esque corpse. 

 

Edit: I've got pretty hard-core dark circles under my eyes, so I don't mind the sick look. I relate to it, haha.

 

A lot of people are pretty much ignoring everything that has been said about Cole by the devs...sort of a "I reject your reality and substitute my own" thing. While I think it's ableist to pull the "mind of a child" card, because it comes with some unpleasant RL implications, the fact remains that the spirit that animates Cole remained emphatically disinterested in sex or nudity. I feel like attempts to romance him, if allowed, would be very coercive in nature, because he seems like he could be led into certain situations without fully understanding what is actually happening and therefore unable to give informed consent. 

 

Plus, his character model is more than a little sickly- he's got visible veins on his neck and face and the slightly sunken appearance of someone who died from neglect. Died recently, maybe, but definitely died.

[Ispan]

Hopefully they just don't know his backstory? :/ I mean, if I was just going by looks and didn't know anything about him, I would probably wonder if he was a romance. Yeah, he's a little sick-looking, but he doesn't look like a Kristoff-esque corpse. 

 

Edit: I've got pretty hard-core dark circles under my eyes, so I don't mind the sick look. I relate to it, haha.

 

Haha, I think that's actually part of the reason I love Solas so much: I feel for him with that cleft chin, sleepy eyes, and that look of complete and utter exhaustion.  Not sure how a romance would work out though, maybe it'd culminate in a nice nap

[Maria Caliban]

I maintain that if sexual interaction with him is wrong because he wouldn't understand what's happening and can't give informed consent, then having him as a soldier for the Inquisition is also wrong.

[Former_Fiend]

I maintain that if sexual interaction with him is wrong because he wouldn't understand what's happening and can't give informed consent, then having him as a soldier for the Inquisition is also wrong.

 

I don't entirely disagree, which is one of the reasons I'm not recruiting him.

[HuldraDancer]

I maintain that if sexual interaction with him is wrong because he wouldn't understand what's happening and can't give informed consent, then having him as a soldier for the Inquisition is also wrong.

 

Agreed on both parts though they both should really be a given, sad that they are not. I have a feeling I'll be putting Cole on the side lines a lot because using someone who has the mind of a child to go fight and kill feels wrong to me and I already felt bad enough having to do something like that in FO:NV would rather not go through that again. So unless he no longer has that mindset I'll be keeping him out of the fights I don't care how useful he is won't feel right like I'm taking advantage of him.

[BabyFratelli]

I maintain that if sexual interaction with him is wrong because he wouldn't understand what's happening and can't give informed consent, then having him as a soldier for the Inquisition is also wrong.

 

I had the same thought. I guess we'll have to wait and see how he is in-game. It could be more complicated than we know. Perhaps recruiting him but not actually letting him fight anyone will be a happy middle ground.

[Ailith Tycane]

I maintain that if sexual interaction with him is wrong because he wouldn't understand what's happening and can't give informed consent, then having him as a soldier for the Inquisition is also wrong.

 

Yeah, I'm still torn. I'd like to have him in my party just for the sake of experiencing a cool character, but as far as RP goes I dunno if my Inquisitor would be down for it. 

[Maria Caliban]

Cole is a hard fit.

He's a demon/spirit/unknown thing, which means many PCs will be wary and uncomfortable with him. If you do get to know him, you probably grasp quickly that he's not mentally mature, which means taking him into battle after battle could be seen as using him.

I'm betting he's a good character, but I don't know what sort of PC I'd make who would use him all the time.

[Former_Fiend]

Ironically enough, I think the PC type that would be the most comfortable with using him in battle would be exactly the type he wouldn't want to work for.

[Eveangaline]

Cole is a hard fit.

He's a demon/spirit/unknown thing, which means many PCs will be wary and uncomfortable with him. If you do get to know him, you probably grasp quickly that he's not mentally mature, which means taking him into battle after battle could be seen as using him.

I'm betting he's a good character, but I don't know what sort of PC I'd make who would use him all the time.

 

Perhaps an inquisitor that is not quite mature themselves? You are just a random fade survivor. Maybe you don't have enough real world experience to realize what kind of judgement calls you're making with Cole.

[JadePrince]

Haha, I think that's actually part of the reason I love Solas so much: I feel for him with that cleft chin, sleepy eyes, and that look of complete and utter exhaustion.  Not sure how a romance would work out though, maybe it'd culminate in a nice nap

 

I like everything about this comment, haha. Now I hope I can make an Inquisitor who looks just as tired as me. 

[SurelyForth]

I maintain that if sexual interaction with him is wrong because he wouldn't understand what's happening and can't give informed consent, then having him as a soldier for the Inquisition is also wrong.

 

Were he human, sure. But fighting seems to be part of his natural drive as a spirit. Justice was already a warrior when the Warden encounters him in the Fade, but he clearly struggles to understand human relationships, even with Kristoff's memories available to him. I would say that a romance with Justice would be coercive to a point, but him fighting isn't because that's something he chose to do entirely on his own. 

 

Whatever spirit took over Cole instinctively chose bringing death to those he felt wanted it. After the events of Asunder, he has a better understanding of what he was doing and why it was wrong. So his decision to become a soldier is informed by experience and feedback from others, and strengthened by his desire to protect. Like Justice, he sees combat as a way to fulfill his new found purpose.

 

However, he does not seem to be similarly moved to romantic or sexual expressions of self the way he was moved to kill and fight. Any attempt by someone to romance him or engage him sexually would be foisting their own desires onto him, and he's not yet demonstrated any sort of faculties for the sort of understanding of sex or relationships that would be necessary for him to give informed consent to such things.  

[Magister Caedus]

Were he human, sure. But fighting seems to be part of his natural drive as a spirit. Justice was already a warrior when the Warden encounters him in the Fade, but he clearly struggles to understand human relationships, even with Kristoff's memories available to him. I would say that a romance with Justice would be coercive to a point, but him fighting isn't because that's something he chose to do entirely on his own. 

 

Whatever spirit took over Cole instinctively chose bringing death to those he felt wanted it. After the events of Asunder, he has a better understanding of what he was doing and why it was wrong. So his decision to become a soldier is informed by experience and feedback from others, and strengthened by his desire to protect. Like Justice, he sees combat as a way to fulfill his new found purpose.

 

However, he does not seem to be similarly moved to romantic or sexual expressions of self the way he was moved to kill and fight. Any attempt by someone to romance him or engage him sexually would be foisting their own desires onto him, and he's not yet demonstrated any sort of faculties for the sort of understanding of sex or relationships that would be necessary for him to give informed consent to such things.  

Wanted to de-lurk and say something to this effect, but this pretty much mirrors my thoughts on the matter. 

[Brian ofthe Dialogue Wheel]

Perhaps an inquisitor that is not quite mature themselves? You are just a random fade survivor. Maybe you don't have enough real world experience to realize what kind of judgement calls you're making with Cole.

Well, someone who thinks of him as, at the very most, a spirit lacking true autonomy and life might use him MORE, because he's a means to an end. If he dies, it's not like an actual PERSON died, just the demon posing as a kid I saw in Hot Topic that one time.

(Cole, more than likely. will be in my first anti-Templar play through, along with either Solas/Mustached Wonder and Iron Bull, because I think they'd all understand a mage's position on that.)

[In Exile]

Being less picky sucks more. Don't apologize for having standards, but also don't complain about being single for long periods of time because people will just hate you and tell you to not be picky. 

 

I don't mind being single; I just mean that the prize for being picky isn't a prize. 

[KC_Prototype]

What Inquisitor would want to sleep with Cole? Look at him...*shudders*. Not to mention he has a child's mind.

[pallascedar]

I maintain that if sexual interaction with him is wrong because he wouldn't understand what's happening and can't give informed consent, then having him as a soldier for the Inquisition is also wrong.

 

Eh, keep in mind that he's a spirit that once thought he was a small child. He isn't a small child. Cole in Asunder had the mind of a scared small child, and I think part of David's point is that it's kinda weird for someone to read Asunder and think "I wanna romance that character."

 

Cole in DA: I is different, I wouldn't be surprised if he still maintains some naivete, but he knows what he is, and he's not a stranger to killing. He's a spirit, not a human. He can understand some aspects of humanity (violence, mercy, kindness) without understanding others (sex or romance.)

[Brian ofthe Dialogue Wheel]

Eh, keep in mind that he's a spirit that once thought he was a small child. He isn't a small child. Cole in Asunder had the mind of a scared small child, and I think part of David's point is that it's kinda weird for someone to read Asunder and think "I wanna romance that character."

 

Cole in DA: I is different, I wouldn't be surprised if he still maintains some naivete, but he knows what he is, and he's not a stranger to killing. He's a spirit, not a human. He can understand some aspects of humanity (violence, mercy, kindness) without understanding others (sex or romance.)

The biggest thing for me was the huge tease about the Tranquil- that was really nice.

[KC_Prototype]

Being picky sucks. I'm pretty picky IRL, although I kind of really wish I wasn't. It just leads to being single for really long periods of time. 

Bruh, story of my life. I am picky and also overshoot my standards. 

[Nocte ad Mortem]

I think there's a big difference between Cole's ability to consent to sex and his ability to fight in battle. The difference is that his entire arc in Asunder revolved in his learning to stand up for himself and his friends. All the character development he's had went into this particular issue. He started out terrified of the idea and, over the course of the book, he came to be very brave, focused and protective over those he considered friends. 

 

On the other hand, he still has no concept of sex or romantic love and there's not even any indication that he would ever want those things. Unless that changed substantially, he would basically be being lead into something he didn't understand. In both cases, he started out as a sort of blank slate. Spirits don't come into the world understanding reality at all, but I think his capacity was always higher than a child. He just hadn't gotten the input yet. In Asunder, he got the input on "when is it right to kill" and "do I want to live in isolation, or do I want to be a part of the world, even if that's not always comfortable". He's still a blank slate when it comes to sexuality, so it's impossible for him to know if it's something he'd want to pursue.     

[Gwydden]

I maintain that if sexual interaction with him is wrong because he wouldn't understand what's happening and can't give informed consent, then having him as a soldier for the Inquisition is also wrong.

I just see him as asexual. Can't see how that impairs him from participating in combat if that's what he wants :shrug:

[AkiKishi]

He's not human. Just because he looks like one does not change that.

[Ajna]

I want to recruit Cole just for the turnips in the fireplace thing...

[Incantrix]

Oh brother, cole is a natural killer from we've heard. Taking him into battle wouldn't be morally wrong. 

[Vapaa]

Oh brother, cole is a natural killer from we've heard. Taking him into battle wouldn't be morally wrong. 

 

Read the book.