19659 réponses à ce sujet

[rolson00]

to be honest having set preferences appealing too me it gives the characters more depth and makes them more believable . I welcome this in DA:O i played a female elf that went with lelania, but i really wanted to know what morrigans romance was like so i created a male cousland and discovered my favourite back story. creating limitations on characters encourages people to broaden their own horizons.

[AkiKishi]

David Gaider, on 13 Jun 2014 - 02:41 AM, said:

By "particular group" I mean "in real life."

 

Worrying about the distribution between male and female players, and one of them feeling like content geared at them was an afterthought, I am fine with. Worrying about a distribution amongst sexualities, and making it so that gay or bisexual players don't feel they won't have choices, I am also fine with. Worrying about "players who like playing dwarves" or "players who like playing humans" or whatever other races, that I'm not as concerned about. Which is why I'm saying you will have options, but you may not have the same number of options depending on what race you select.

 

It's fine if someone doesn't like that idea. Some folks, we're quite aware, aren't happy that romances are being gated at all and would prefer to have all romances available to all PC's. I would suggest not panicking just yet, as not all romances are even race-gated and the options have not all suddenly dried up as someone might fear, but I suppose until and unless they learn otherwise they can justifiably choose to be pessimistic. Maybe we'll put up the chart (yes, there's actually a chart) at some point, and having said information will make you feel better before you play the game, but that's not really my decision.

 

I'd go with the lore over the player base myself. But those are the reasons given. 

[Vegeta 77]

I'd expect that because dwarves are unpopular. Qunari equally awkward or more so, but also something new. 

Yeah i think this race system is aimed at dwafs and qunari cause of there height. Human and elfs have the same body and height its easy to have that work for a love scene. Plus like you said dwafs are unpopular.

[Dean_the_Young]

It's adeffinately a techincal issue to an extent (maybe budget too). The amount of storage that would be needed for a fully fleshed 4 bi LI's would be crazy (exponential).

 

It's better to get a full fleshed expirience than a linear not engaged LI scenario.

 

Having said that, I hope Viv is a LI ... I have jungle fever.

 

I'm fairly sure it would be logarithmic, not exponential, and I highly doubt memory space is the limiting factor. Bioware romance scenes have tended to be packed with emotion, not data.

[cogsandcurls]

I'd expect that because dwarves are unpopular. Qunari equally awkward or more so, but also something new. 

 

Having race gated romance content that skews against one of the more unpopular races sure seems like a really easy way to dissaude even more people from playing them. I understand why from a technical point of view since dwarves are an awkward size (cue flashbacks to Alistair kissing the air above my dwarf's head), but it seems incredibly counterproductive from a "encouraging more people to actually make use of the race system" perspective.

[Mukora]

I'd expect that because dwarves are unpopular.

[AkiKishi]

Having race gated romance content that skews against one of the more unpopular races sure seems like a really easy way to dissaude even more people from playing them. I understand why from a technical point of view since dwarves are an awkward size (cue flashbacks to Alistair kissing the air above my dwarf's head), but it seems incredibly counterproductive from a "encouraging more people to actually make use of the race system" perspective.

 

Like I said I don't agree with Daves reasons I'd always go with the lore reason over the real world reason and do my level best to keep people from associating my world with the real world. But those are Daves reasons and we have to live with them.

[Dean_the_Young]

Having race gated romance content that skews against one of the more unpopular races sure seems like a really easy way to dissaude even more people from playing them. I understand why from a technical point of view since dwarves are an awkward size (cue flashbacks to Alistair kissing the air above my dwarf's head), but it seems incredibly counterproductive from a "encouraging more people to actually make use of the race system" perspective.

 

Maybe- but then, maybe Bioware doesn't consider 'I want to romance X race' a compelling argument in 'things to encourage more people to actually make use of the race system.'

 

Of course, deliberate use of race gating could be a way to encourage people to make use of the race system by having the gating restrict more common player choices (ie, humans and elves). Since the majority of people play as 'human male' even when given the choice for others, in so much that race gates could be considered an influencer in player's racial choice it would actually be a lack of any gating that would continue the status quo of under-appreciated minority choices.

 

Similarly, replayability is something that is often enhanced by adding differences to the potential content available to a player's choices and route. Replayability is enhanced by distinction: when nothing is forbidden or altered for anyone, when all choices are available regardless of any other choices, then it's very easy to argue that 'choices' lose their meaning. For people who want their chosen race and gender to have an impact, rather than be an illusory difference, things will have to be different. Difference can be good or bad depending on the whims of the player.

[LilyasAvalon]

We're back, *******.

 

On topic.

 

I'm going with the assumptions there ARE racial restrictions in DA:I.

 

Still don't think it's going to be that big of a thing though. Maybe dwarves won't get to romance Iron Bull, maybe qunari won't get to romance Varric.

 

 

Still want to know WHO are even romancable anyway. I would like a confirmation on number of LI's at least though

[cogsandcurls]

 

Of course, deliberate use of race gating could be a way to encourage people to make use of the race system by having the gating restrict more common player choices (ie, humans and elves). Since the majority of people play as 'human male' even when given the choice for others, in so much that race gates could be considered an influencer in player's racial choice it would actually be a lack of any gating that would continue the status quo of under-appreciated minority choices.

 

 

You are completely right about this in theory, I agree. I suppose I'm just being an old cynic and expecting that if anybody ends up with the short stick re: racegating meaning fewer options for one race, it's not going to be humans/elves AKA the most popular races, purely for convenient-character-model-size reasons. It would be a nice suprise to be proven wrong, however

[Ajna]

Yes, I'd like to see The Chart (caps appropriate I feel).

[godModeAlpha]

Indeed

It kinda implies that all straight dudes are jerks and sexists

And that's not true

 

Agree, seems being straight might be granted minority stauts.

 

I hope they dont treat Viv as a minority and leave her out as a non LI candidate.

[Aimi]

Or a female Dwarf who is sick and tired of every surface dwarf hitting on her because, hey, dwarfxdwarf, and so has developed a thing for tall?

 
Yeah, well, nobody ever considers what the tall person thinks about that.

I'm definitely done with anybody shorter than 160 cm or so. It's just not fun.
 

Sure. I'm a professional cynic. It means I prepare for the worst, not that I go out looking to make myself miserable and hopeless when I have no reason to believe the worst is actually likely.

 
Whoa, whoa, whoa. You get paid to be a cynic?

Cause, I mean, I've got a similar duty as a grad student, but I don't really get paid for that.
 

Not to mention that Mass Effect had, what, one bisexual romance the entire series?

 
Two: Liara (ME1, 2, and 3) and Kaidan (ME3).
 

Oh and I very much enjoy the double standards that often get tossed around. Being a poster child for the straight white dude bro in appearance and inclination, that never gets old.

...

this is a very good way to get into another discussion that will lock the thread. And that's all I have to say about that.

[daveliam]

As optional content romances are prime candidates for cutting to meet deadlines. I can't think of any other optional content that has a higher time to cost ratio.

 

I think people just need to take a step back and appreciate when things are cut to get the game out and not because they hate you or anything. Of course when they make a point point of using the "DA:I has more romances" card. People are going to feel they have been mislead and brings up painful memories of ME3's endings the theory vs the reality.

 

I think that this is my issue with it right now.  If they just said nothing about romances, I would be fine.  But instead, they make statements like there will be more romances than any other DA game, getting everyone's hopes up for having multiple romance options.  Then they follow it up with the announcement that there will be race-gating, suggesting that some people will have less options.  It's the half information that they are releasing that's frustrating me.  They have the answers, but are only releasing bits and pieces and it's causing distress for some players.  It would cost them nothing to release the information and would alleviate many players' concerns.  It's leaving a bad taste in my mouth.

 

I had a feeling that something like this (racegating) would happen as soon as it was announced they were bringing race options back.

 

Honestly? If it's a choice between getting to choose my character's race or getting to romance my preferred LI, then i'd happily choose race options every time.

 

These do not have to be mutually exclusive concepts though.  Race-gating is completely arbitrary.  It's also optional.

 

From what DG said sounds like dwaf players are getting the worst of it. Plus him saying not all li are effected by race . So human players like me should be fine if we pick cass or viv. 

 

This is why I'm most upset about this.  Not only do I play as a gay male character (the group that consistently gets the least amount of options), but I also don't like playing as a human or elf.  In BG, dwarves had no romance options.  I'm sure that dwarves will have some options in DA: I, I'm also convinced that dwarves and qunari (the two races that I'm interested in playing) will be the ones with less options because of animation.  I hope I'm wrong, but I'm becoming pessimistic because I can very easily see me having little to no choice in romance options based on my race/gender/sexuality combination.

 

Having race gated romance content that skews against one of the more unpopular races sure seems like a really easy way to dissaude even more people from playing them. I understand why from a technical point of view since dwarves are an awkward size (cue flashbacks to Alistair kissing the air above my dwarf's head), but it seems incredibly counterproductive from a "encouraging more people to actually make use of the race system" perspective.

 

The technical concerns shouldn't be a reason for race-gating though.  If people are arguing that race-gating adds "depth" then it should be because of the character not because of animation concerns.  Those are two different things.  If the "IB will sleep with anyone who he thinks won't break" thing is just their way of justifying race-gating dwarves because of animation concerns, then I call BS on it because dwarves are way sturdier than elves.

 

Yes, I'd like to see The Chart (caps appropriate I feel).

 

Yes.  If there is a chart, it costs them nothing to show it.  No one loses if they post it but many people stand to "win" by being able to figure out who the LI's will be for their particular race/gender combos. 

 

I'm usually pretty damned positive and caution people against getting pessimistic, but I certainly feel disheartened not only by the way that they are handling romance discussion, but also by the tone of some of the devs posts.  I appreciate that Allan is always pretty level headed and rarely short or snippy in his posts. 

[Finnn62]

I'm going to throw it out there that I didn't see too much issue with bisexual non-race-gated Leliana romance in DAO… I enjoyed female dwarf romance with her and didn't seem to have too many animation issues. I guess, though, that there are more romance options so it may be tougher to achieve that, but there's probably a bigger overall budget, too, amiright? I feel more hopeful now that Gaider has said that, at least, "not all romances are even race-gated". I just really want to see The Chart, tbh.

[LilyasAvalon]

The Chart?

 

YES! GIVE US THE CHART!

[wright1978]

Yes, I'd like to see The Chart (caps appropriate I feel).

Definitely, there's no point in me even giving any thought to potential characters to build until I know the extent of horrendous ness of the damage to the options I'd like to use have been arbitrarily gated off in terms of having a rewarding romance experience to complement it.

[carlo angelo]

The Chart?

 

YES! GIVE US THE CHART!

We probably won't see it until months down the track. We don't even know how many LIs there are and who they might be.

 

But I do want that chart.

[Bichaneca]

Is there anyone that lives near BioWare that volunteers to break in and steal THE CHART?

 

Edit: Added emphasis as sugested.

Modifié par Bichaneca, 13 juin 2014 - 01:33 .

[Ajna]

It's Chart, you forgot the caps

[Reznore57]

I'm not sure they can publish any chart because well it's the marketing guys who decide .

We had a lot of information during E3 , they need to keep the hype up and growing until the release date.

[Ajna]

I wonder who's job it is to keep it safe *ponder*

[Phate Phoenix]

I wonder who's job it is to keep it safe *ponder*

 

I like to imagine they have The Chart framed somewhere, roped off with mood-lighting.

[LilyasAvalon]

We probably won't see it until months down the track. We don't even know how many LIs there are and who they might be.

 

But I do want that chart.

 

*makes displeased ferret noises*