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[Xilizhra]

You can still be someone's friend if you don't agree with every life decision they make. xP 

"You cannot be my friend and despise what I stand for."

[Ianamus]

 

It's going along with Marethari's blatantly illegal-by-Dalish-law action, which is quite good enough for me. And you weren't her friend.

 

I can only speak for myself, but I consider my true friends to be the ones who'd to to stop me from doing things that would harm myself. Being a bobblehead that nods to everything a person does isn't being a friend. 

[Xilizhra]

I can only speak for myself, but I consider my true friends to be the ones who'd to to stop me from doing things that would harm myself. Being a mindless bobblehead that nods to everything a person does isn't being a friend. 

Which, conveniently enough, Hawke is not on a friendship path with Merrill. Also conveniently, rival Hawke doesn't stop Merrill from doing a damn thing.

[xAmilli0n]

"You cannot be my friend and despise what I stand for."

 

Well, when you're still there when things go badly, hopefully she can reevaluate that.

[Xilizhra]

Well, when your still there when things go badly, hopefully she can reevaluate that.

If Anders who remains suicidal has anything here in common with Merrill, no.

[xAmilli0n]

If Anders who remains suicidal has anything here in common with Merrill, no.

 

Well, Anders is Anders lol.

[Ianamus]

Which, conveniently enough, Hawke is not on a friendship path with Merrill. Also conveniently, rival Hawke doesn't stop Merrill from doing a damn thing.

 

But had Merrill listened to rivalry Hawke and stopped what she was doing she would never have gone through the loss of Marethari, death threats from her clan or having to kill her entire clan herself. 

 

I'd rather be the one who saw it coming and tried to prevent it than the one who encouraged Merrill along the course that would lead it to happen, regardless of whether or not the outcome is the same. 

[Chernaya]

I didn't despise what she stood for, I just wasn't comfortable with an idea she had. It may have been very important to her, but I don't think it's all she stood for. I maintain healthy friendships through mutual respect for personal disagreement in real life. Some people may not want to have friends who disagree with them on certain things, but it's possible. 

[Reznore57]

"You cannot be my friend and despise what I stand for."

 

I didn't despise what she was trying to do.

I just didn't think losing her was worth it.

There's a difference.

[Xilizhra]

But had Merrill listened to rivalry Hawke and stopped what she was doing she would never have gone through the loss of Marethari, death threats from her clan or had to kill her entire clan herself. 

 

I'd rather be the one who saw it coming and tried to prevent it than the one who encouraged Merrill along the course that would lead it to happen, regardless of whether or not the outcome is the same. 

What does the rivalry path have to do with Merrill's treacherous Keeper or lunatic clan?

 

 

I didn't despise what she stood for, I just wasn't comfortable with an idea she had. It may have been very important to her, but I don't think it's all she stood for. I maintain healthy friendships through mutual respect for personal disagreement in real life. Some people may not want to have friends who disagree with them on certain things, but it's possible. 

It's unlikely any of these would survive an attempt to destroy all of their life's work, in my opinion.

 

 

I didn't despise what she was trying to do.

I just didn't think losing her was worth it.

There's a difference.

Then protect her while not opposing her. It isn't difficult.

[Chernaya]

Ah, well just differing opinion on the matter I suppose. x3 I can see where you're coming from. I didn't expect her to be happy with me, but I guess I'm willing to sacrifice a friendship if I see it as  protecting people I care about, as hard as it can be. Perhaps I wasn't her friend anymore, but I did what I felt was right, personally. 

[HuldraDancer]

About DAI romances anyone think we'll be stuck with a 'it's me or them' type of deal in the game? Kind of like how you could lose Alistair at the end of DAO if you picked Loghain or how you had to pick Anders or Sebastian at the end of DA2 and being in a romance with either of them didn't give you any pull to change their minds?

[LobselVith8]

Yeah, Merrill was just so naive and adorable, I just wanted to be her pal and look out for her, so her hating me always got me in the feels pretty hard. :c Anders is crazy, but I agree with his outlook on demons, they aren't something to play with if they can be avoided. (I hated how he treated her though, he was too harsh...)

 

Merrill deals with culture shock about human society, but she's quite informed about magic. The issue is that Anders has an Andrastian outlook on the denizens of the Fade, seeing them as Spirits and Demons, while Merrill has a Dalish view, and sees them all as dangerous spirits. It's why Merrill chastises Anders about how there's no such thing as a good spirit (assuming she is in Friendship with Hawke).

[Xilizhra]

About DAI romances anyone think we'll be stuck with a 'it's me or them' type of deal in the game? Kind of like how you could lose Alistair at the end of DAO if you picked Loghain or how you had to pick Anders or Sebastian at the end of DA2 and being in a romance with either of them didn't give you any pull to change their minds?

With our current party, I might say it's unlikely, but maybe we'll have choices with Orlais or something that would lead to a confrontation between Vivienne and Sera.

[Chernaya]

About DAI romances anyone think we'll be stuck with a 'it's me or them' type of deal in the game? Kind of like how you could lose Alistair at the end of DAO if you picked Loghain or how you had to pick Anders or Sebastian at the end of DA2 and being in a romance with either of them didn't give you any pull to change their minds?

 

I see it as very likely, it's a common theme that's been included in both games. D: So far I haven't had a problem with the choices, but we'll see what happens this time around. 

[Ianamus]

What does the rivalry path have to do with Merrill's treacherous Keeper or lunatic clan?

 

Trying to show Merrill that her actions will always affect those around her and those who love her, however much she tries to make sure the only one negatively affected is her. That's practically the entire arc of her rivalry path. She may not care if she dies trying to fix her mirror, but those around her do.

 

Also, slightly off topic and more spoilers for The Masked Empire:

 

Spoiler

Considering what happened to the clan who summoned the demon to help them in the Masked empire, Marethari's clans stance on demons and blood magic seems entirely justified.

[LobselVith8]

Rival path wasn't Hawke destroying Merrill's dreams.  It was Hawke convincing her that they were a bad idea.

 

Merrill's dream is to help her people through restoring technology that she has extensively studied, while Hawke opposes it - despite being completely ignorant about it. I'm familiar with the trope - and I intensely dislike it.

[Yinello]

About DAI romances anyone think we'll be stuck with a 'it's me or them' type of deal in the game? Kind of like how you could lose Alistair at the end of DAO if you picked Loghain or how you had to pick Anders or Sebastian at the end of DA2 and being in a romance with either of them didn't give you any pull to change their minds?

 

It's possible. Personally I don't really like them if they don't seem logical - especially in DA:O, Alistair was more than happy to let me make all the very hard decisions while running around and suddenly he throws an all or nothing at me in front of everyone? I found it very inconsiderate, even though I understood his motivations.

 

The one in Awakenings made more sense. Considering what happened to all your companions and how they too had to actively deal with some real difficult moments (Velanna and Sigrun pretty much had everyone they loved die in front of them), it made sense they'd be angry if you did/didn't side with the Architect. 

[HuldraDancer]

With my luck we'll be forced to choose between the characters I really end up liking. It would be an interesting thing to deal with though especially if the dialog changed depending on your relationships with the characters. I personally don't like things like that since I like to keep everyone but I won't be upset if its in the game.

[Xilizhra]

Trying to show Merrill that her actions will always affect those around her and those who love her, however much she tries to make sure the only one negatively affected is her. That's practically the entire arc of her rivalry path. She may not care if she dies trying to fix her mirror, but those around her do.

 

Also, slightly off topic and more spoilers for The Masked Empire:

 

Spoiler

Considering what happened to the clan who summoned the demon to help them in the Masked empire, Marethari's clans stance on demons aand blood magic seems entirely justified.

Attempting to foist the blame for the actions of Marethari and her clan onto Merrill, who did nothing, doesn't seem like maturity to me. Marethari was a treacherous ****** who chose becoming an abomination over losing any power over her clan, or having to admit anything to Merrill, and her clan was a pack of idiots.

[LobselVith8]

Some times I see Merril's plot line as being about addiction.  Which makes me feel pretty skeevy about the friendship path.

 

Though most  times I think that that analogy doesn't really work, and that Hawke doesn't really have a good enough reason to actively stand in Merrill's way.  So I end up in a friendship path, but one with a lot of warnings and "are you sure?" going on.

 

I don't see how wanting to bring an end to the decline of her people is comparable to addiction. I thought it was admirable that she wanted to help the Elvhen, and she did research the subject quite a bit. Merrill studied the lore on the Eluvians and extrapolated information from the shard she took from the Elven Ruins, then worked on the construction of her own Eluvian, incorporating the shard she took into it's construction.

[xAmilli0n]

About DAI romances anyone think we'll be stuck with a 'it's me or them' type of deal in the game? Kind of like how you could lose Alistair at the end of DAO if you picked Loghain or how you had to pick Anders or Sebastian at the end of DA2 and being in a romance with either of them didn't give you any pull to change their minds?

 

I don't know if the story lends itself to that sort things, but if we are purely going off previous games, then I'd say its likely.

[LobselVith8]

Exactly! If an option like that had ever come up, I probably would have taken it. I mean, I'm flexible. But when it was between "SHE'S TALKING TO DEMONS THROUGH HER MIRROR AT NIGHT" and "No stop it, this is a bad idea, hun. I'm not supporting it.", I was more inclined to pick the latter. xD *shrugs*

 

Merrill spoke to Audacity - a spirit who was trapped since the war between Arlathan and Tevinter, and was completely sundered from the Fade - in order to learn blood magic, because the spell she knew to cleanse the shard would have required more lyrium than she had access to. Her construction of the Eluvian was from her own research, and there's no evidence suggesting it lead into the Fade. In fact, "The Masked Empire" would suggest otherwise.

[Chernaya]

Merrill spoke to Audacity - a spirit who was trapped since the war between Arlathan and Tevinter, and was completely sundered from the Fade - in order to learn blood magic, because the spell she knew to cleanse the shard would have required more lyrium than she had access to. Her construction of the Eluvian was from her own research, and there's no evidence suggesting it lead into the Fade. In fact, "The Masked Empire" would suggest otherwise.

 

I appreciate the explanation. I haven't read that, so my outlook on it was different.