19658 réponses à ce sujet

[Herr Uhl]

I think people are working under the assumption that they won't double gate (race AND gender) a romance because it would limit the amount of players who would access it.

Although I guess a romance exclusive for straight male humans might still hit a large percentage of players.

 

If they just remove one race that isn't human it would hit the vast majority of players while still being technically race gated. If they were to go with Varric for dwarves only (seeing as that has been thrown around here), that would be a tiny minority, even if it was bisexual.

[Reznore57]

I think people are working under the assumption that they won't double gate (race AND gender) a romance because it would limit the amount of players who would access it.

Although I guess a romance exclusive for straight male humans might still hit a large percentage of players.

 

From the post Gaider made a couple of weeks ago , I understood the romances would be fair for gay/straight (role) players .

Just depending on the race you choose , you may have less options.

[daveliam]

Also thanks for the responses to my question. It's helpful for me to see how people are thinking about it. I tend to also think that a 5/3 (male/female) skew seems a bit off, but I was playing devil's advocate since I recently got into a debate with someone who swore that Garrus didn't count as a female romance option for ME3 because you had to import him.

I have to say that it's odd to be in my place right now. For the first time ever, I'm good with whatever happens from this point on. I've already gotten my first choice. It's looking very likely that I'll get my second choice (if I make an unbreakable PC). And of the four remaining options, if it's Vivienne, then I get my preferred female romance (provided she's not o/s only), if it's Blackwall or Varric, I'm happy (provided they are not o/s only), and if it's Solas, well, he's growing on me.

I will continue to hope for equal options for everyone, but it feels good to have the selfish concerns about my own options off my shoulders. Of course, I'm making a few assumptions here. Watch, it will be Solas as bi and Varric and Vivienne as straight.......

[pallascedar]

If the split is 5/3 I think it'd be likely that they'd add another straight/gay character. Gay men and straight women would still have more options than gay women and straight men, but it wouldn't be double.

[Maria Caliban]

If it's 5m/3f, they can't add another woman. They could add another straight or gay man, but that wouldn't increase the number of LIs for people who romance women.

[Herr Uhl]

If it's 5m/3f, they can't add another woman. They could add another straight or gay man, but that wouldn't increase the number of LIs for people who romance women.

 

But it would be 3 for gay men and 3 for straight women if they were exclusive. Thus it wouldn't be double, which I think was the point.

[SurelyForth]

If the split is 5/3 I think it'd be likely that they'd add another straight/gay character. Gay men and straight women would still have more options than gay women and straight men, but it wouldn't be double.

 

What would the breakdown on that be? Because if, say, Varric and Iron Bull were both bi and one was dwarves only and the other was qunari/human/elves, then that means that in any given playthrough, straight women and gay men would still only have two choices. Only if the third option was another gay or straight man would they have more. 

 

I guess that would work for David, though. Theoretically. It just feels like the best way to approach it would be to have the unrestricted 2/2/2 and then have one bi race restricted male and one female. That would give everyone two solid options, regardless of race or gender.

[pallascedar]

But it would be 3 for gay men and 3 for straight women if they were exclusive. Thus it wouldn't be double, which I think was the point.

Pretty much. More fair than 4 options for people interested in men.

[Sylvianus]

I have to say that it's odd to be in my place right now. For the first time ever, I'm good with whatever happens from this point on. I've already gotten my first choice. It's looking very likely that I'll get my second choice (if I make an unbreakable PC). And of the four remaining options, if it's Vivienne, then I get my preferred female romance (provided she's not o/s only), if it's Blackwall or Varric, I'm happy (provided they are not o/s only), and if it's Solas, well, he's growing on me.

I will continue to hope for equal options for everyone, but it feels good to have the selfish concerns about my own options off my shoulders. Of course, I'm making a few assumptions here. Watch, it will be Solas as bi and Varric and Vivienne as straight.......

 

Mhh, today, I'm fine with whatever is the outcome. the day before yesterday, I was in a bad mood, but it took me one night to get over my disappointment, accepting my options with Cassandra and the Npc Josephine. ( Though I was really annoyed because for my ambitious and sassy noble inquisitor, I realized that Vivienne was just perfect. Josephine seems a bit too normal for him, and I could see Cassandra thinking black and white with her chevalry ideas, which is the opposite of what he thinks. Vivienne was just the ideal LI for what I tend to play. )

 

 And this morning I come on this forum, and I discover that finally Vivienne could be an LI. So I don't even know what to think anymore, I'm just telling to myself, ' nope,stay away from all of this until confirmation. '

 

So if we end up with 5/ 3, I'll be fine. I just want everything to be announced.  I'm sick of this ridiculous marketting around the romances. 

[daveliam]

What would the breakdown on that be? Because if, say, Varric and Iron Bull were both bi and one was dwarves only and the other was qunari/human/elves, then that means that in any given playthrough, straight women and gay men would still only have two choices. Only if the third option was another gay or straight man would they have more.

I guess that would work for David, though. Theoretically. It just feels like the best way to approach it would be to have the unrestricted 2/2/2 and then have one bi race restricted male and one female. That would give everyone two solid options, regardless of race or gender.

I think it's safe to say that everyone is going to get two options, regardless of how this shakes out. The question is how are the last two race-gated companions going to fall.

[Maria Caliban]

But it would be 3 for gay men and 3 for straight women if they were exclusive. Thus it wouldn't be double, which I think was the point.

My thanks.

And no, I wasn't being sarcastic earlier.

[jtav]

My predictions, just for the heck of it:

 

Straight

 

Cassandra

Cullen

 

Gay

 

Sera

Dorian

 

Bisexual

 

Josephine

Iron Bull (gated: qunari and human)

Vivienne

Varric (gated: elves and dwarves)

[Sylvianus]

I don't think all the female lis would be ungated. And I don't believe Varric will be bisexual, which makes me think he's less likely to be an option than Solas or Blackwall. 

[Char]

I think if Varric is an option he will only be gated against Qunari, because of what happened in Kirkwall, and how it was mentioned in his interview- that would be the 'story reasons' to go with animation reasons.

[jtav]

I think if Varric is an option he will only be gated against Qunari, because of what happened in Kirkwall, and how it was mentioned in his interview- that would be the 'story reasons' to go with animation reasons.

You have a point, but they may want to honor his statement in DA2 that he's not into humans.

 

I think Vivienne is ungated because she's no more a challenge to animate than Josephine, and I think that was the first concern.

[Grieving Natashina]

I always felt if they really wanted to drive home the idea that Varric wasn't into humans, they would have put it in a conversation that you didn't have to romance Merrill to get.   That bit of dialogue is pretty buried in the game.  Hell, I didn't even know about that conversation at all until I hit the forums, because I didn't do a Merrill romance until about three months ago.  As a maleHawke romancing Merrill (the only time I've romanced her,) Varric never said that to me.  

 

I think he just said that to Hawke since Merrill was standing right there and Varric isn't the kind of guy to hit on someone's lover when the other person is in the same room.

[javeart]

I think if Varric is an option he will only be gated against Qunari, because of what happened in Kirkwall, and how it was mentioned in his interview- that would be the 'story reasons' to go with animation reasons.

 

What I don't like about this kind of reasons for a character not to romance us, it's that it doesn't sound fair to our tal vasoth to be judged because of what qunaris did, especially because I imagine we will have the chance to show that we're very oppossed to them... Especially because I don't think Varric experience of the qunari rebellion was particularly traumatizing... though who am I to judge if he was traumatized or not, that's true   and there's also the stuff of the comics...

 

But even so, how would that go? He starts almost hatings us if we're qunaries and progressively he starts liking us, but only by the end, so too late for romance, sorry? I don't know, I don't really see it. 

 

I feel really bad too about IB telling us "I might break you", tbh. If I knew nothing and heard about it from the first time inn the game I'd very like "what?"    

 

At least Vivienne telling us that he's not risking her position for a few weeks (or months) of passion with an elf (or a dwarve or qunari or whatever), seems quite in character for all we know about her so far...

 

In any case, if there's not going to be a good reason for the race-gating, I'd rather have no reason at all: you flirt with them, they say "sorry, you're very sweet, but I'm not interested" and that's it. 

[Clockwork_Wings]

I always felt if they really wanted to drive home the idea that Varric wasn't into humans, they would have put it in a conversation that you didn't have to romance Merrill to get.   That bit of dialogue is pretty buried in the game.  Hell, I didn't even know about that conversation at all until I hit the forums, because I didn't do a Merrill romance until about three months ago.  As a maleHawke, Varric never said that to me.  

 

I think he just said that to Hawke since Merrill was standing right there and Varric isn't the kind of guy to hit on someone's lover when the other person is in the same room.

Varric lies a lot.  Remember on the Varric thread I was speculating just how much of what he told Cass was true?

[Maria Caliban]

I always felt if they really wanted to drive home the idea that Varric wasn't into humans, they would have put it in a conversation that you didn't have to romance Merrill to get.

If they really wanted to drive home that Cassandra liked men, they would have changed her dialogue when she talks about the duel against the Arishok.

I don't think conversations are built around making absolutely sure people know the sexual preferences of the speaker.

[Grieving Natashina]

Varric lies a lot.  Remember on the Varric thread I was speculating just how much of what he told Cass was true?

I remember.  I think it was Cher that said that 90% of what Varric says is just bullsh*t.

 

 

If they really wanted to drive home that Cassandra liked men, they would have changed her dialogue when she talks about the duel against the Arishok.

I don't think conversations are built around making absolutely sure people know the sexual preferences of the speaker.

That's why assuming that Varric isn't attracted to humans based on a tiny bit of very deeply buried dialogue is just silly imho.  That's why I was getting at.  We shouldn't assume either way.

[daveliam]

So these seem to be the most popular theories:

 

1.)  Vivienne (ungated, bisexual), Varric (gated - dwarf [and elf?], straight?), Iron Bull (gated - human and qunari [and elf?], bisexual)

  

* I think this one is unlikely unless Varric is actually bisexual because in this scenario gay dwarves only have one option and I think that it's safe to say that everyone will get at least two options regardless of race/gender/sexuality

 

2.)  Blackwall/Solas (ungated, bisexual), Vivienne (gated - human only?, bisexual), Iron Bull (gated - human and qunari [and elf?], bisexual)

 

* This one is feasible.  It would mean that straight guys get two options (+1 for humans), straight gals get two options (+1 for humans and qunari), gay guys get two options (+1 for humans and qunari) and lesbians get two options (+1 for humans)

 

3.)  Blackwall/Solas (ungated, bisexual), Varric (gated - dwarf and elf, bisexual), Iron Bull (gated - human and qunari, bisexual)

 

* This is possible, but most people think unlikely because it would be a 5/3 gender breakdown and technically 4 romance options for straight gals and gay guys (with each gender/race/combination getting three choices

 

Are there any other strong suggestions?  I would say that number 2 looks the most equitable and realistic at this point.

[Kallimachus]

Why do people think Varric is an LI at all? I don't get it...

I think at most Varric would be Aveline round 2 (or Oghren round 2), when we get to reunite him with his lover from the comics.

[Grieving Natashina]

Why do people think Varric is an LI at all? I don't get it...

 

Fellow Varricmancers, care to answer this?  I'm about to go to bed.

[Former_Fiend]

From what I've seen, there are essentially two arguments in favor of race gating from a "story" perspective; 

 

1: Racism. "Cullen's kind of a jerk when it comes to other religions and cultures" and "Varric won't romance qunari because of what happened in Kirkwall." Well, our qunari isn't part of the qun and didn't take part in the battle of Kirkwall, so them lumping us together with that is racist. Also opens up some rather nasty implications; they're willing to take orders from us, follow us into battle, put their lives and the fate of Thedas in our hands, but the idea of romance is out of the question?

 

2: Random preference. I've mentioned several times that I'm friends with a woman who vastly prefers black men to white men. Just finds them way more attractive. Also have a best friend who only likes short, petite women(preferably hispanic), and a friend who only likes heavyset women, and a friend who vastly prefers natural redheads. Are these really the type of preferences that are worthy of representation in the game? Even as a cheap excuse for covering up animation costs? Do petty, arbitrary quirks really count as "story reasons" when all they do is make the character have to explain, "Oh, no, I'm not racist, I just don't find [racial feature X] to be attractive!"

[Maria Caliban]

That's why assuming that Varric isn't attracted to humans based on a tiny bit of very deeply buried dialogue is just silly imho.  That's why I was getting at.  We shouldn't assume either way.

Right. That would be like assuming Cassandra is straight because Varric said she had a crush on...

Oh wait.