19658 réponses à ce sujet

[Andraste_Reborn]

That's why I hope, they'll make the remaining romanceable characters bisexual. We'll never get more options than straight people, We don't even dream about it. But it'd be nice, if we'll get at least the same amount of options.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed - I think it's far better if both straight and gay PCs get three options. (Especially since the existence of race-gating probably means that some of them will only get two anyway.)

 

I'm confused as to why people keep saying "What reason did they have to not make them bi?" about the straight characters. It's happened with the gay characters too but to a far lesser degree, it's almost like people have a problem with characters being straight.

 

I saw at least as much complaining about Sera being as lesbian as about Cullen and Cassandra being straight. (Less about Dorian, but that may be because a lot of fangirls shrugged and started planning the male character they're going to romance him with. I know I did.)

 

Also, keep in mind that Cullen and Cassandra have appeared in previous games and have been popular for years. Some people have been hoping to romance them for a long time, and that includes gay and lesbian players.

[Fialka]

no, I didn't see something like this. On the ontrary. I found far more people complaining about the gay and lesbian characters...

The 'why are they straight' things doesn't come up as often - as far as I've seen, anyway.  And I've been hesitant to comment on it - being the privileged majority in real life, I didn't want to come across as waving the 'disadvantaged' flag, because that'd be gross.  Just pointing out, that, trying to find reasons for a character to be straight is just as problematic as finding reasons for a bisexual/gay person to be that way.

[Fialka]

Anyone said there shoudln't be straigth options? I referred to words that there would be nothing wrong if there were more straight romances, because apparently the characters just "didn't fit" as bisexuals. So I'm curious what personality trait could make them only fit as straight.

I'm not saying you said there shouldn't be straight options.  It's the idea that there must be some correlation between personality traits and sexual orientation that I find problematic.

[Sporothrix]

Probably for the same reasons that the world is not exclusive made of bisexual people.

You claimed one thing, and now avoid answering my question. Bisexual people are bisexual simply because they're attracted to both genders. But that's not what's the fuss about. To defend the idea of unfair distribution of romances in favor of straight people, you claimed that there's something that could make those certain characters not fit as bisexual, not fit as having feelings for both genders. So what is it?

[Xilizhra]

The 'why are they straight' things doesn't come up as often - as far as I've seen, anyway.  And I've been hesitant to comment on it - being the privileged majority in real life, I didn't want to come across as waving the 'disadvantaged' flag, because that'd be gross.  Just pointing out, that, trying to find reasons for a character to be straight is just as problematic as finding reasons for a bisexual/gay person to be that way.

If I ask "why are they straight," it's got nothing to do with personality, but with decisions made by the writers and why they thought it was a good idea to make their most plot-centric romances straight.

[Fialka]

I've seen this said mostly about Cassandra, then Sera, hardly anything about Dorian or Cullen.

This is actually true, now that you mention it... so maybe this is a more gender issue?  Now, I do love debating those, but this is the romance thread so... best not to get me started 

[azarhal]

You claimed one thing, and now avoid answering my question. Bisexual people are bisexual simply because they're attracted to both genders. But that's not what's the fuss about. To defend the idea of unfair distribution of romances in favor of straight people, you claimed that there's something that could make those certain characters not fit as bisexual, not fit as having feelings for both genders. So what is it?

 

here

[Deviija]

 

I'm confused as to why people keep saying "What reason did they have to not make them bi?" about the straight characters. It's happened with the gay characters too but to a far lesser degree, it's almost like people have a problem with characters being straight.

 

You realize no one said this in this current exchange, though, correct?   If the exchange between Azarhal and Misoretu9 is what prompted this.  

 

I've seen this happen far more about Sera than anyone.  It's also the intensity and venom in which it happens as well, which I haven't seen aimed at Dorian or Cass or Cullen.  People expressing disappointment is one thing, but Sera's outcry got really disturbing for a while.  

[SnakeCode]

I saw this mostly about Dorian. But I believe it's all the same. people get furious, because they don't get the character who they wanted.

 

no matter if straight or gay.

This is true, there's been an equal amount of complaining about every character from disappointed fans (not seen too many from Cullen fans though, they seem to have kept everything extremely respectful too.)

 

The need to have a reason why the character's orientation is what it is, seems to be primarily aimed at the straight characters though, from what i've read.

[SnakeCode]

 

 

 

You realize no one said this in this current exchange, though, correct?   If the exchange between Azarhal and Misoretu9 is what prompted this.  

 

I've seen this happen far more about Sera than anyone.  It's also the intensity and venom in which it happens as well, which I haven't seen aimed at Dorian or Cass or Cullen.  People expressing disappointment is one thing, but Sera's outcry got really disturbing for a while.  

 

It didn't, It's something that's been bugging me for a couple of days. It's come up many times in the Cassandra thread.

[Xilizhra]

It didn't, It's something that's been bugging me for a couple of days. It's come up many times in the Cassandra thread.

Again, that had a lot to do with Cassandra's greater plot importance; the rest had largely to do with her preestablished fanbase.

[jtav]

It's worth noting that there are slightly more queer characters than straight characters in DAI at the moment. If 2/4/2 holds, 75% of LIs will be something other than straight. Cole is asexual. DAI is probably the most diverse game I've seen.

[Sporothrix]

here

 

That didn't answer my question at all - first of all, they wouldn't be all bisexual anyway. It started with you defending the idea of preferential treatment of straight people, so I guess that you're saying there would be nothing wrong if sexual minority groups members would have it worse simply because devs chose so. And I'm still waiting to hear what could make any of those characters not fit as having feelings for both genders.

[LiaraShepard]

It's worth noting that there are slightly more queer characters than straight characters in DAI at the moment. If 2/4/2 holds, 75% of LIs will be something other than straight. Cole is asexual. DAI is probably the most diverse game I've seen.

 

yes, but queer means everything: gay, bi, lesbian, asexual...there will never be more gay OR more lesbian OR more asexual characters than straight ones. So, I don't see the problem with it.

 

It's as if you count the number of green cars and compare them with the sum of cars with blue, yellow, black, red, brown and white colors.

[SnakeCode]

Again, that had a lot to do with Cassandra's greater plot importance; the rest had largely to do with her preestablished fanbase.

I'm not talking about fan disappointment though. I'm talking about the notion that Bioware seemingly have to justify why they made certain characters straight, when there is so little demand for them to justify making other characters bi or gay.

[Fialka]

If I ask "why are they straight," it's got nothing to do with personality, but with decisions made by the writers and why they thought it was a good idea to make their most plot-centric romances straight.

We don't really know that yet... I would argue that Cullen is not plot-centric at all.  Actually Solas could be the plot-centric male LI - what with him being the Fade expert and seeking you out, and I'm speculating he'll be bi.  But, a lot of people don't think that's the case or should be, for the totally shallow reason of him not being hot enough (a fact I disagree with - I'm totally rooting for him, myself), so... yeah.

 

But you're right... Why not make Cass bi?  Hell, I'm straight in real life, but like her character enough to have wanted to romance her at some point (but have little interest in playing a man, so, if she's straight it won't happen).  Is it because they wanted to make her the archetypal 'strong woman' whose heart is softened by love?  In that case, why did they feel it made sense if a man played that role, but not a woman?

 

Just saying, I don't totally disagree with you, at least in regards to Cass, but the way some posters word things gives me 'what makes you straight?' vibes, which I find just as annoying as the 'what makes you gay' argument, since I firmly believe the answer is to both is, you, know, birth 

[Xilizhra]

I'm not talking about fan disappointment though. I'm talking about the notion that Bioware seemingly have to justify why they made certain characters straight, when there is so little demand for them to justify making other characters bi or gay.

Largely because the crowd demanding the latter doesn't care about rationale, they just don't want any gays.

[Gwydden]

But you're right... Why not make Cass bi?  Hell, I'm straight in real life, but like her character enough to have wanted to romance her at some point (but have little interest in playing a man, so, if she's straight it won't happen).  Is it because they wanted to make her the archetypal 'strong woman' whose heart is softened by love?  In that case, why did they feel it made sense if a man played that role, but not a woman?

I don't think writers need a reason to justify their characters' orientation.

[Sporothrix]

I'm not talking about fan disappointment though. I'm talking about the notion that Bioware seemingly have to justify why they made certain characters straight, when there is so little demand for them to justify making other characters bi or gay.

 

Sorry, but that's not true. No one ever had a problem with the fact there will be straight LIs (maybe except for those who wanted "player-sexual" approach), as long as the treatment is equal. The problem with Cassandra is that it doesn't really look that equal - she's far more "big" and important character than Sera, at least as it looks like for now, and the same is true for Cullen. So it looks like "celebrities" are for straight people, sidekicks for gay people.

[SnakeCode]

I don't think writers need a reason to justify their characters' orientation.

This is exactly what i'm talking about, Bioware seemingly have to justify making characters straight, when nobody is asking for them to justify making gay and bisexual characters. It just feels like "because they were born that way" isn't good enough.

[LiaraShepard]

Sorry, but that's not true. No one ever had a problem with the fact there will be straight LIs (maybe except for those who wanted "player-sexual" approach), as long as the treatment was equal. The problem with Cassandra is that it doesn't really look that equal - she's far more "big" and important character than Sera, at least as it looks like for now, and the same is true for Cullen. So it looks like "celebrities" are for straight people, sidekicks for gay people.

 

I hope you're wrong, but I'm afraid you'll be right. I just hope, Sera and Dorian are story important as well. : (

[Gwydden]

Sorry, but that's not true. No one ever had a problem with the fact there will be straight LIs (maybe except for those who wanted "player-sexual" approach), as long as the treatment was equal. The problem with Cassandra is that it doesn't really look that equal - she's far more "big" and important character than Sera, at least as it looks like for now, and the same is true for Cullen. So it looks like "celebrities" are for straight people, sidekicks for gay people.

You're making a lot of assumptions there. I could assume that since they have been shown a lot more in demos, Dorian, Sera, and Iron Bull are much more relevant to the plot. As a matter of fact, I have every reason to assume Dorian is based on the last one... but I prefer to go by the devs comment that all characters will be important in certain situations.

[LiaraShepard]

This is exactly what i'm talking about, Bioware seemingly have to justify making characters straight, when nobody is asking for them to justify making gay and bisexual characters. It just feels like "because they were born that way" isn't good enough.

 

I don't agree. I always see comments of people who are complaining about the gay character because there's no reason to make him gay, when he could also be bisexual. Again: I think, it has nothing to do with the sexual orientation. You see this as often with gay and lesbian characters as with straight ones.

 

I'd even claim you see this a bit more often with gay and lesbian characters.

[Fialka]

I don't think writers need a reason to justify their characters' orientation.

I agree, the writers don't need justification for how they write their characters.  Doesn't mean these types of questions shouldn't be asked though.  

[SnakeCode]

Sorry, but that's not true. No one ever had a problem with the fact there will be straight LIs (maybe except for those who wanted "player-sexual" approach), as long as the treatment was equal. The problem with Cassandra is that it doesn't really look that equal - she's far more "big" and important character than Sera, at least as it looks like for now, and the same is true for Cullen. So it looks like "celebrities" are for straight people, sidekicks for gay people.

Not to be rude, but how on earth did you get this from the post you quoted? I never said anything of the sort.