Aller au contenu

Photo

The Joining

Débuté par UNCinPA , juil. 14 2014 11:33

  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
12 réponses à ce sujet

#1
UNCinPA
Posté 14 juillet 2014 - 11:33

UNCinPA
  • Members
  • 19 messages

I have had a question now for a very long time,

 

"If the Joining involves 'a mixture of darkspawn blood, lyrium, and a drop of blood from an archdemon,' then during The First Blight - - what?"

 

The first wardens could not have needed the drop from an archdemon. That aspect of the chalice must have been added later? No?

 

And, if the first wardens were successful without it, the archdemon blood, then why add it? Taste? Color? Drama? What?

 

So, the location of this codex, please, that explains this. Also, there must have been a past thread on this. Would someone have the location of that thread?

 

Thx

 


#2
DeathScepter
Posté 14 juillet 2014 - 11:52

DeathScepter
  • Members
  • 5 527 messages

i don't know but I do suspect that it is similar to the Reaver joining. OF course Reaver joining involves Dragon blood. SO maybe that the Grey Wardens might be Reavers and over time developed their own joining.


#3
sylvanaerie
Posté 15 juillet 2014 - 02:46

sylvanaerie
  • Members
  • 9 436 messages

The first blight went on for something like (90?) years because they didn't know about a Warden being needed to slay the Archdemon.  It kept rising up again and again once killed.  So, they would have had plenty of archdemon blood on hand to perform the ritual.  What bothers me is, blood coagulates and doesn't keep fresh.  Seems to me Thedas doesn't have much in the way of scientific means to preserve it (though I suppose it is done in magical containers).  

 

Anyway, they would have had plenty of archdemon blood on hand after killing it two, three, four (or however many) times.


  • DeathScepter aime ceci

#4
Guest_Faerunner_*
Posté 15 juillet 2014 - 03:12

Guest_Faerunner_*
  • Guests

The first blight went on for something like (90?) years because they didn't know about a Warden being needed to slay the Archdemon.  It kept rising up again and again once killed.  So, they would have had plenty of archdemon blood on hand to perform the ritual.  What bothers me is, blood coagulates and doesn't keep fresh.  Seems to me Thedas doesn't have much in the way of scientific means to preserve it (though I suppose it is done in magical containers). 

 

It might be different with tainted blood. The darkspawn taint kills everything, including microbes. In the Return to Ostagar DLC, Cailan's body is almost perfectly preserved despite being dead for likely months at least, because the excessive taint in the area killed all the bacteria, insects, etc that would have decomposed his body. Normal bodies decompose after death, but the taint prevents that. The devs have also said the darkspawn don't need to eat because "the taint sustains them" - whatever that means. They devour the dead in battle for... other reasons. (I don't know, I guess intimidation.) Living beings need to eat and hydrate to replenish themselves, but the taint sustains the darkspawn.

 

It might be something similar with blood coagulation, though I must admit I was always terrible with science and am not sure how the process works.


#5
Sawtooth357
Posté 15 juillet 2014 - 03:58

Sawtooth357
  • Members
  • 435 messages

I assume the blood longevity is some kind of enchantment. They do something to phylacteries to keep the blood usable for tracking, it's not a stretch to think the Wardens have something similar. Or maybe archdemon blood is just so freaky and wrong that natural laws don't apply to it.

I don't remember the exact section but somewhere in the codex it mentions that during the first blight the archdemon was definitely taken down at least one time, which is how they discovered its power to resurrect itself. I assume the original corpse provided a good deal of blood.


#6
Guest_Faerunner_*
Posté 15 juillet 2014 - 04:26

Guest_Faerunner_*
  • Guests

I don't remember the exact section but somewhere in the codex it mentions that during the first blight the archdemon was definitely taken down at least one time, which is how they discovered its power to resurrect itself. I assume the original corpse provided a good deal of blood.

 

I do not envy whatever poor saps had to go through that nightmarish trial-and-error of fighting hordes upon hordes of darkspawn, only to finally get to the archdemon, only to spend forever fighting the hideously powerful dragon, only to find that it resurrected itself by transferring its soul into the nearest darkspawn, for God only knows how many times before finally figuring out how to kill it for good.

 

I don't know how correlated the two are, I also can't imagine how much trial-and-error they had to go through to discover how to develop an immunity to the taint in order not to waste away or become ghouls while fighting the darkspawn, and how much trial-and-error experimentation with taint-absorbing (and probably Archdemon-slaying) methods before finally discovering the magic concoction of the Joining ritual; and realizing they needed Archdemon blood to make it work.

 

"JUST STAY DEAD ALREADY!! Maker in the Black City, we've killed you like a dozen times, and sacrificed several hundred of our men to get Bob here close enough to you to see if your soul would transfer into him and not that darkspawn mook several paces behind you, and to see if it would actually kill you since he has a soul while your mooks don't. It's been nearly a century of fighting you Blighted f*ckers! We are tired, we are fed up. Just stay down this time!"

 

That would be my reaction by the end.  :whistle:


  • Jeffonl1, Vexed Forest et Lady Luminous aiment ceci

#7
Blazomancer
Posté 15 juillet 2014 - 05:04

Blazomancer
  • Members
  • 1 307 messages
Archdemon blood is not necessary for the joining, although it is preferable to have it as a component because of the potency of the corruption in it.

#8
UNCinPA
Posté 17 juillet 2014 - 11:50

UNCinPA
  • Members
  • 19 messages

"Well, that was a bit of news, and no mistake." [Barliman Butterbur, Prancing Pony]

 

Thanks, guys! Interesting, very, very interesting!


#9
X Equestris
Posté 18 juillet 2014 - 12:47

X Equestris
  • Members
  • 2 521 messages

Archdemon blood is not necessary for the joining, although it is preferable to have it as a component because of the potency of the corruption in it.


I'm pretty sure Riordan states that it is necessary for the Joining.

#10
LeeAmnesia
Posté 21 juillet 2014 - 10:31

LeeAmnesia
  • Members
  • 18 messages

The first blight went on for something like (90?) years because they didn't know about a Warden being needed to slay the Archdemon. It kept rising up again and again once killed. So, they would have had plenty of archdemon blood on hand to perform the ritual. What bothers me is, blood coagulates and doesn't keep fresh. Seems to me Thedas doesn't have much in the way of scientific means to preserve it (though I suppose it is done in magical containers).

Anyway, they would have had plenty of archdemon blood on hand after killing it two, three, four (or however many) times.


The length of the first blight is actually 192 years. The second was 90.

As for the question, it's not impossible to kill an archdemon without the taint, just impossible to prevent its old god soul from taking over another host. The taint absorbs the soul into the soul of the warden, and the two eradicate each other.

#11
dragonflight288
Posté 21 juillet 2014 - 02:50

dragonflight288
  • Members
  • 8 852 messages

I'm pretty sure Riordan states that it is necessary for the Joining.

 

He does. Wardens need a drop of archdemon blood in the joining ritual, Alistair mentions he knows it requires lyrium, and Duncan has us get darkspawn blood. 

 

You'd probably need an Avernus-like-person to figure it all out and create it from scratch. 


#12
Merle McClure II
Posté 26 novembre 2014 - 09:36

Merle McClure II
  • Members
  • 315 messages

Although I really like the idea of a half crazed mage researching Blood Magic to figure out the Joining and Archdemon Slaying from scratch, I have a sinking feeling that if we ever discover the truth it will be that the Wardens were given the Joining Ritual.


#13
Apo
Posté 27 novembre 2014 - 09:34

Apo
  • Members
  • 290 messages

This part of the joining remains a shadowy area, if I remember we knew about the archdemon blood when speaking with Riordan and not early in the game.

 

And if I'm not mistaken, Dumat was killed during a battle before the people of that time realized that his soul has transfered into another darkspawn body.


Retourner dans Story, Campaign & Characters


  1. The BioWare Forum
  2. → Dragon Age
  3. → Dragon Age: Origins
  4. → Story, Campaign & Characters