There is actually lyrium magic, its what templars use. Except that mages can't use it, or at least there hasn't been any example of templar like magic being used by a mage, could be lack on knowledge or it could be harmful for a mage to use it themselves, we don't know. You could consider it an "anti-magic" as it mostly is used as a way to disrupt other magic.
Templar spells are basically a copy of the DA:O mage spirit school. They use exactly the same spells mages do.
Blood Magic is a TYPE of magic, and a SOURCE of magic. You can increase the power of your magic by using blood, but there are also some spells that can only be used using Blood Magic.
And this would be fine and dandy if Gaider didn't say that you can power blood magic with lyrium..
But how can blood magic be anything besides a power source just like lyrium IF lyrium can power up ''blood magic'' spells? You can use spell heal through use of blood.
I think Blood Magic as a skill set refers to the "sacrifice". You make a blood sacrifice and this calls to a demon. This demon teaches you different spells that you can only do because of the contract with the demon. Blood has a power to it because it is a life force making is like Mana or Lyrium, but more powerful because it is "alive". That's why he said the phylacteries and joining are a type of blood magic because they are using blood as a power source for a spell. The Blood Magic skill set has more to do with the mage having learned forbidden spells with the help of a demon. Idunna says she used equal parts blood and desire magic, so her demon "teacher" must have been a desire demon. The mage can use blood (their own or someone else) to power the spells or they can use lyrium, but the spell won't be as strong. If the spell requires the entire life force blood of someone, you couldn't very well use your own so you would have to supplement lyrium or you would die. I think an appropriate metaphor would be magic as fire. Use logs (lyrium) and it burns just fine, but throw gas on it (blood) and the fire rages.
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Read my post on the last page, kain. Do you get it?
I'm not sure if this is still the DA team consensus, but it's worth mentioning that, at least in the past, there were two different types of blood magic--one involving blood as the POWER
For the second one, it's talking about specific types of magic that can ONLY be done in the blood--like mind control for example. However, they're blood magic in the sense that they work THROUGH the blood--they don't necessarily have to be POWERED by blood. As a result your "blood magic," or a magical effect IN the blood, can be powered by something OTHER THAN blood, such as lyrium.
YES. And they mashed both into a single skilltree in both games, and made it so that you can't use mind control unless you cast it through blood, which is incorrect.
Nah, Kain's not a troll. This is just one of his favorite aspects of Thedas and now he's understandably confused.
There are certain spells that can ONLY be cast with Blood Magic.
Read my above comment.
Read my above comment.
Ok, thats great.
But you are letting gameplay mechanics get in the way of the actual lore of the series.
The limitations of game design mean that sometimes wired **** happens because its "fun".
What on earth is making you think that you dont need blood magic to cast mind control spells?
What on earth is making you think that you dont need blood magic to cast mind control spells?
Because David just said that you can use lyrium instead to power up this ''blood magic'' ( quotes there for a reason ) mind control spell.
Also your question is incorrect.
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
YES. And they mashed both into a single skilltree in both games, and made it so that you can't use mind control unless you cast it through blood, which is incorrect.
Exactly. That was kind of a problem. Blood magic as power is, theoretically anyway, not morally wrong.
Blood magic as its own school, as in manipulating another's blood, might be thought of as morally wrong.
I realize you don't care about that, I'm just trying to make a distinction.
Nah, Kain's not a troll. This is just one of his favorite aspects of Thedas and now he's understandably confused.
I love your sig, namely the quote by Maria.
Exactly. That was kind of a problem. Blood magic as power is, theoretically anyway, not morally wrong.
I could argue with this ( not from my personal perspective, rather the traditional one 
), because the source of power is purely based on S&M.
Because David just said that you can use lyrium instead to power up this ''blood magic'' ( quotes there for a reason ) mind control spell.
Also your question is incorrect.
No. He didn't. Listen to the interview again. Carefully this time.
He said that you can use lyrium (with blood) to enhance the power of blood magic spells.
He also said that there are some spells that can only be cast using blood magic. Such as magics that dominate minds.
He said that you can use lyrium (with blood) to enhance the power of blood magic spells.
Yes, you can use lyrium and blood to enhance any spells.
He also said that there are some spells that can only be cast using blood magic. Such as magics that dominate minds.
What you just said is along the lines of:
There are some spells that can only be cast using entropy magic. Such as magics that Drain life.
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
I could argue with this ( not from my personal perspective, rather the traditional one
By S&M do you mean sadism and masochism? One might counter-argue that ALL power is based purely on that--on putting your body through pain to make it stronger. Now taking blood from another person (Tevinter slaves), I think your traditional argument would be justified if it was involuntary.
Because David just said that you can use lyrium instead to power up this ''blood magic'' ( quotes there for a reason ) mind control spell.
I missed that part. I know he said you could use lyrium to supplement Blood Magic and that Blood Magic is the only ones who can do mind control spells, but I didn't catch the part where it was lyrium for mind control spells. Can you give me the link again and the approximate time please?
I never played as a Blood Mage, but I always thought the difference was that Circle Mages learn less powerful spells through other mage teachers and Blood Mages learn from a demon. This demon teaches them how to use their life force to manipulate another's life force resulting in mind control. That's why I never played as a Blood Mage because I always believed that I made a deal with a demon by using my blood to power a spell and I don't make deals with demons.
Can you give me the link again and the approximate time please?
It's in the direct quote, last part:
''...so you could use lyrium to power blood magic as well.''
No but what he basically said was that you can use lyrium to power blood magic.. Which means you can use lyrium to mind control people.. through blood.. without blood.. or.. without using blood to power your blood magic, cuz you power your blood magic with lyrium instead of blood.
I never played as a Blood Mage, but I always thought the difference was that Circle Mages learn less powerful spells through other mage teachers and Blood Mages learn from a demon. This demon teaches them how to use their life force to manipulate another's life force resulting in mind control. That's why I never played as a Blood Mage because I always believed that I made a deal with a demon by using my blood to power a spell and I don't make deals with demons.
Blood magic has nothing to do with demons per-se. It CAN but it doesn't have to.
That's what he said.
How are you confused?
I'm actually a lot less confused now, we almost got to the bottom of this. See the gameplay design thew me off a bit.
It's in the direct quote, last part:
''...so you could use lyrium to power blood magic as well.''
You can use it to AID blood magic.
You can use it to AID blood magic.
You can use it to aid Entropy, Spirit, Elemental or Blood magic. Yes. Any magic.
I kinda think that this topic outlived it's usefulness now. I think I got it. But we can still argue a bit with people that didn't, or think that they did. xD
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
That's what he said.
How are you confused? This is also something we've known since DA:O.
He didn't completely understand the two-fold nature of blood magic, that's all. Looks like a couple others here still don't.
Yes, you can use lyrium to power some blood magic (school) spells, but not all of them. Some blood magic (school) can only use blood as a source.
Can I have examples for both and the reason why?
He didn't completely understand the two-fold nature of blood magic, that's all. Looks like a couple others here still don't.
It's not even two-fold, it seems. There is only one blood magic, the other is just blood.
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