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Mass Effect combat-What should change about it?


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#1
Karlone123

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Some people might disagree with my idea but I would like to see a more tactical form of combat appear in ME4, just as an example, say we are playing as Turian C-SEC swat commander about to breach a terrorist hideout to kill ot apprehend a bad guy in the lower wards, you can scope out the area, finding enemy positions and possible infiltration routes. you can use drones to go through the ventilations to provide surveillance inside the base. Options should include breaching the door or silently unlocking doors to get in.

 

Squad commands needs to expand more on providing covering fire as you make your way through to slowly approaching an emeny for a surprise attack.

 

I've been playing a lot of Rainbow Six New Vegas and would like to see that type of game format reach into Mass Effect.


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#2
Excella Gionne

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Some people might disagree with my idea but I would like to see a more tactical form of combat appear in ME4, just as an example, say we are playing as Turian C-SEC swat commander about to breach a terrorist hideout to kill ot apprehend a bad guy in the lower wards, you can scope out the area, finding enemy positions and possible infiltration routes. you can use drones to go through the ventilations to provide surveillance inside the base. Options should include breaching the door or silently unlocking doors to get in.

 

Squad commands needs to expand more on providing covering fire as you make your way through to slowly approaching an emeny for a surprise attack.

 

I've been playing a lot of Rainbow Six New Vegas and would like to see that type of game format reach into Mass Effect.

I don't think stealth would really be that popular for the Mass Effect series. We're all about big booms and explosions like Michael Bay movies, but 10x more badass. This kind of feels too... boring for a Mass Effect combat style and it wouldn't apply to certain classes. It needs to be something universal where all classes can benefit without the other feeling extremely under-powered compared to the other classes. Infiltration would match like an Infiltrator or an Engineer, but as a biotic, it's pure thirst for Chaos.


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#3
Elhanan

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If they would get rid of the need to scour the area for thermal clips, it would improve the games so much for me. This was not as problematic in ME3 as it was in ME2, but still removes me from character when I have to police the battlefield instead of moving forward the mission.

#4
Karlone123

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I don't think stealth would really be that popular for the Mass Effect series. We're all about big booms and explosions like Michael Bay movies, but 10x more badass. This kind of feels too... boring for a Mass Effect combat style and it wouldn't apply to certain classes. It needs to be something universal where all classes can benefit without the other feeling extremely under-powered compared to the other classes. Infiltration would match like an Infiltrator or an Engineer, but as a biotic, it's pure thirst for Chaos.

Makes sense, I wish they could incoperate different game modes that could fit the tactical and universal format.



#5
Farangbaa

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Nothing should change about the combat mechanics, or nothing drastic at least. What should change, in my opinion, is the following:

The enemies themselves and the layout of the location you fight them on.

They need to be waaaay less retarded. They need to come from all directions, not just straight in front of you, where, conveniantly, cover is placed at shoulder height. Since ME2, combat doesn't just happen. No, you suddenly see cover and realize there's a battle coming up. (the same might be true for ME1, but I rarely use cover there, so I'm not sure)
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#6
SporkFu

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shep: GARRRRUSSSS!!!

Garrus: I'm alright.

shep: you sure?

Garrus: I think so, yeah... yeah, matching mandible scars is all. 

shep: Is your translator broken, maybe? 

Garrus: Uhhh, no... that's an odd question, commander.

shep: Well maybe you misunderstood me. I told you to stay in cover.

Garrus: I know, I know.

shep: What the hell were you thinking?

Garrus: It's Vega and his boasting about getting right into the thick of battle. He's all Tali talks about anymore. 

shep: I see. So you thought you'd charge right into it?

Garrus: Yeah.

shep: To impress your girlfriend?

Garrus: It sounds less like a good idea when you say it out loud. 

shep: With a sniper rifle? 

Garrus: I know, I know. 


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#7
TheOneTrueBioticGod

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Get rid of most of the waist-high cover that seems to spring up everywhere. 

It'd be great if the PC could manipulate the environment to set up some cover, 



#8
AlanC9

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They need to come from all directions, not just straight in front of you, where, conveniantly, cover is placed at shoulder height. Since ME2, combat doesn't just happen. No, you suddenly see cover and realize there's a battle coming up. (the same might be true for ME1, but I rarely use cover there, so I'm not sure)


It's often true, but ME1 covers it a bit better by putting stuff that could be cover in non-combat areas.

#9
ImaginaryMatter

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I don't think stealth mechanics should be a large part of combat, but I am down for hackable doors that allow the group to skip some engagements or other hacking that causes false alarms to distract enemies -- give the tech classes something to do other than shoot fireballs at people.

 

The biggest thing I think they should go far is creating much more of a distinction between the classes besides just having one or two unique class abilities. One way could be to make the combat/tech/biotic abilities fundamentally different from each other, like by having them have different cooldown mechanics.

 

I feel like biotics should return closer to the strength they had in ME1. Biotics lore wise are suppose to be these very wonderful things but in the games they just feel like differently colored energy attacks. Perhaps, to balance this they would have a longer, universal cooldown. Maybe, the Adept would have a much shorter cooldown than the Vanguard and Sentinel, but those classes can use combat and tech abilities to counter their lesser biotic skills.

 

Destructible and interactive environments. Like the crates characters stand behind eventually break and maybe there could be tables that people can flip over for cover.

 

Make the set pieces larger and less corridor like. Maybe, an engagement with a group of enemies would have multiple spawn points, platforms, levels, balconies, etc. I think something like the Atrium at the Grissom Academy level in ME3, for example, should be closer to the norm.

 

Blend in the combat areas a little bit better, no odd chest high walls. Make the cover look a little more natural.


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#10
DeinonSlayer

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Maybe biotics could have a more extensive cooldown, while tech attacks require "energy packs" or omnigel to form tech grenades which need to be reloaded when depleted. Go back to guns with unlimited ammunition and make powers require it.
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#11
Inprea

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I'd prefer if the combat stayed as is. I have a lot of fun playing my sentinel and even picked the class so that I wouldn't have to spend so much time in cover. Well plus I like that sentinel allows me to give my squad a shield and health boost. I tend to be a fan of defensive, support and passive abilities.


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#12
KaiserShep

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I'd like to see weapon cool down come back, honestly. Conrad Verner was right. They suck.
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#13
themikefest

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I like to be able to use a shield. I wanted so much to use one every time I pulled one from a Cerberus Guardian. And when playing as an engineer, have the ability to setup a mini gun turret like the Cerberus engineers were able to do.

 

 

I'd like to see weapon cool down come back, honestly. Conrad Verner was right. They suck.


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#14
KaiserShep

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Conrad was a real hero.
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#15
SporkFu

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And when playing as an engineer, have the ability to setup a mini gun turret like the Cerberus engineers were able to do.

This right here. 

 

And to really make it interesting, give enemy engineers the ability to sabotage it as well. To quote Garrus, "Oh crap." 


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#16
TheOneTrueBioticGod

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Conrad is right. 

Thermal clips are a bad idea. 

He should be the next mandatory PC.



#17
CptFalconPunch

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Vehicle combat:ss_e75ddcdbb2fda56b5f05dff3a16f6ef3fa649

 

MAKO revengeance :

 

 

SPACE COMBAT PLEASE. THERE IS NO REASON NOT TO HAVE SPACE COMBAT


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#18
RedCaesar97

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Go back to the ME2 mechanics:

 - all weapons have different defense modifiers

 - remove tech combos

 - bring back biotic physics combos; only let Warp bring the boom

 

As for thermal clips versus weapon overheat: I am a huge proponent of thermal clips, if only for the simple fact that is one way (among many) to increase the variety of weapons, and the only real way to make all weapons balanced and viable.

 

Allow me to explain by using shotguns as an example by comparing the Claymore and Scimitar.

 1) The Claymore works as a weapon since it has only one shot per clip, generally enough to kill one enemy before you have to reload. Now compare that to the Scimitar where it will take a few shots to kill one enemy, but then you can go kill another enemy without needing to reload.

 

 2) Now how would the Claymore and Scimitar work with an overheating mechanic instead of thermal clips? You fire one shot with the Claymore and it overheats? Since all overheating has the same duration, the Scimitar is now the only viable shotgun since you can kill more enemies faster with it, whereas with the Claymore you can at most one enemy (assuming you hit) and then have to wait.

 

The overheating mechanic essentially turns all weapons into a DPS (damage per second) race, and we are back to ME1 where you only have one weapon per category. 

 

Now some people liked the fact that you could fire a gun "forever" in ME1; and I will admit that I was one of those people. But thermal clips are the much better game mechanic. 



#19
KrrKs

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Combat in ME3 was actually quite good, imo.

I like Tech and biotic combos, but there are really to many detonator powers. Maybe only warp should be per default able to detonate warp combos, while other powers could get an evo that also allows that.

 

For tech explosions, maybe not let them work directly on (all) enemies, but on specific objects (with a bigger radius then). AKA (ME2 similar) A flammer trooper hit incinerate->FE, Cerberus shield-pylon hit with overload-> TB or similar.

 

Personally I like Overheating weapons better than Thermal clips. This was something that set ME apart from the other shooter hybrids out there.

 

As for thermal clips versus weapon overheat: I am a huge proponent of thermal clips, if only for the simple fact that is one way (among many) to increase the variety of weapons, and the only real way to make all weapons balanced and viable.

 

Allow me to explain by using shotguns as an example by comparing the Claymore and Scimitar.

 1) The Claymore works as a weapon since it has only one shot per clip, generally enough to kill one enemy before you have to reload. Now compare that to the Scimitar where it will take a few shots to kill one enemy, but then you can go kill another enemy without needing to reload.

 

 2) Now how would the Claymore and Scimitar work with an overheating mechanic instead of thermal clips? You fire one shot with the Claymore and it overheats? Since all overheating has the same duration, the Scimitar is now the only viable shotgun since you can kill more enemies faster with it, whereas with the Claymore you can at most one enemy (assuming you hit) and then have to wait.

 

The overheating mechanic essentially turns all weapons into a DPS (damage per second) race, and we are back to ME1 where you only have one weapon per category.

Not necessarily. It could also turn more into a sort of Battletech/Mechwarrior style weapon builds. (If they keep per weapon max. RoF)

 

Say, The Claymore and Scimitar both vent of a similar amount of Heat per second.

-The Claymore does more damage and generates more heat, nearly overheating when shot. Cooling takes X seconds, similar to reloading.

 You can also fire 2 shots and have to wait 2X seconds until it is cool again.

 

-Scimitar does way less damage, but also generates less heat. You can fire 5 shots one after another and it nearly overheats, then also wait X seconds.

 You can also a 6th shot immediatly, also having to wait 2X seconds until it is cooled down again

 Or you can Fire a single shot and wait X/5 long until it is completely cool.

 

What you got is a different Damage, Rof and Rof+'reload'/cooldown behaviour per weapon, similar to what we have now, minus reloading.

Add some weapon mods to that, so the shotguns can be more damaging, or cool faster, or have a bigger heat-capacity.

Then you have your never ending fire Scimitar, or a OHK-everithing Claymore that overheads after every shot. OR something inbetween, e.g., a 2 shot, lower damage, claymore with faster Rof than the wraith.

 

The maximum Rate of fire achievable for each gun would be the minimum of (heat_capacity + cooldown per second)/generated heat and the specific weapons hardcoded RoF.

 

Bring back the defence modifiers, and your 2 shot Claymore is good against lone, shielded or organic enemies, the scimitar against multiple organic or low shielded enemies, and the 1shot uberClaymore and the slow high damage wraith are not bad against armour, too.

 

Of course, certain mods would better fit to certain weapons, like fast fire weapons and cooling mods, or slower weapons and damage mods.

Certain configurations will end in weapons behaving similar, but this is already now so. And stuff like Widow/Black Widow wouldn't need an extra entry somewhere.

Also Bakaras 2-Shot Claymore would be possible.

 

Edit: About some people turning this into a DPS race, that has not changed with the introduction of Thermal clips.

Who really plays MP with the Katana or Phalanx anymore?

Heat management would actually broaden the use cases for these guns, if done right (might be a balance nightmare though).


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#20
Farangbaa

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I don't think the problem lies in the detonations being too strong, or that there are too many ways to do them.

 

The problem is that the enemies have a negative IQ:

 

"Oh look at this big ass glowing blue bubble of energy... 't'is this?

Oh crap, now I'm stuck in the bubble... I should've known this, the 2 guys in front of me already got trapped in it"

 

And that there's way too much unprotected enemies, and if they do have protection, it's kinda weak. (overload + throw --> entire room loses shields) 



#21
Excella Gionne

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I got stuck in the air once with the Mako. My mass was reduced to zero. Stupid mass effect fields.


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#22
Farangbaa

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I got stuck in the air once with the Mako. My mass was reduced to zero. Stupid mass effect fields.

 

Have you bumped all over the planet?

 

This tends to happen when you enter the Mako from foot and try to jump with it too quickly... I think. It's a really weird bug.



#23
Excella Gionne

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Have you bumped all over the planet?

 

This tends to happen when you enter the Mako from foot and try to jump with it too quickly... I think. It's a really weird bug.

I don't think I've experienced that. Being on the Mako is the last thing I would want to do. I like the planet scenery, but it' very time consuming when you're just trying to get to your destinations and then a Thresher Maw spawns under you and kills you. :crying:



#24
sharkboy421

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Go back to the ME2 mechanics:

 - all weapons have different defense modifiers

 - remove tech combos

 - bring back biotic physics combos; only let Warp bring the boom

 

As for thermal clips versus weapon overheat: I am a huge proponent of thermal clips, if only for the simple fact that is one way (among many) to increase the variety of weapons, and the only real way to make all weapons balanced and viable.

 

*snip for space*

 

I agree about the ME2 mechanics.  I was really sad to see the defense modifiers removed.  I'm not too sure about removing tech combos, I liked their addition but I agree there were far too many detonaters and being able to detonate a tech combo with a biotic power was odd.  I would be ok with Warp being the only biotic detonater and and bringing back physics combos.

 

For gameplay mechanics I've thought about the idea of borrowing from The Bureau: XCOM Declassified.  They seemingly borrowed a ton from Mass Effect and then refined the squad commands and gave you a lot more individual control.  The enemies were also tougher and required a lot more tactics and coordination among your team.

 

I think it would be quite awesome for the next ME to include that level of control over your squad mates in combat while adding those mechanics from ME2 that were discussed above.



#25
KaiserShep

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I got stuck in the air once with the Mako. My mass was reduced to zero. Stupid mass effect fields.

 

Goddess of oceans, Cortez was right!