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[dreamgazer]

List of ME2 Bugs

[ImaginaryMatter]

ME3 will always be one of my all-time favorite games alongside the Dragon Age series, and it's certainly flawed, but I found it to be a pretty great experience. I loved the Tuchanka and Rannoch arcs, I loved the farewells and I'm rather satisfied overall with the Destroy epilogue, despite having some obvious flaws in the logic and lore. It's the only one of the three that I can continually replay and the only one that I can really indulge myself in with its combat as well as its story. Heck now that I have the Citadel DLC, I can gleefully fight all of the multiplayer enemies for fun with whatever I want and no concern for those weird MP tasks. Also, I feel that I have the greatest connection to the ME3 crew. James, Steve and even EDI were massive pluses to me.

I do understand why people don't like the game though. It has lots of problems, and that's fine. But then, I'm one of those freakwads that loves Dragon Age 2.

 

I like DA:2 too, overall; while I find ME3... underwhelming. I do like the fan-service-y moments and the DLC but getting to those moments is the hard part. The overabundance of the overly uninteresting and silly Cerberus (if these jokers weren't present I would probably enjoy this game magnitudes more), the complexities behind the Genophage and Geth/Quarian conflict being reduced to black/white conflicts was disappointing, and to top it off the anthropocentrism and final evolution of Shepard and attempt to give him forced character development really took me out of the story.

 

A lot of these things aren't the fault of the ME3 team. It did have to make up for the shortcomings of ME2 and the failure to plan things out in advance; although I think this only extends so far... looking at you TIM. Additionally, the development of TOR taking place at the same time did not help things.

 

I guess the thing I really hate is the ever expanding Cerberus, and ME3 has the unfortunate distinction of carrying those guys in their biggest role yet.

[KaiserShep]

I'm not sure how ME3 is buggier than either of the other games. To this day, I still get freezing issues with ME1, though not with game-breaking frequency, and in ME2, I get this horrendous audio bug where the last syllable of dialogue is cut off for some reason. There seems to be no way around it, and it often takes me out of the experience because it happens in almost every line of dialogue in the game. I've yet to come across any bugs that are nearly as obnoxious in ME3. I can't even remember any of note off the top of my head. Maybe there's some in multiplayer, but I don't give one volus cloaca about that.

[dreamgazer]

I don't think either the genophage cure or the geth/quarian conflict were made into "black and white" conflicts.  Both are still complex, if a bit truncated to arrive at their resolutions. And I don't dislike the idea that Cerberus became the puppets of the Reapers after they retrieved tech from the Collector base and went overboard with research ... yet again.  

[CosmicGnosis]

... the complexities behind the Genophage and Geth/Quarian conflict being reduced to black/white conflicts was disappointing...

I don't these conflicts are as black-and-white as some people believe. If Wreav stands alone, I'm probably going to sabotage the cure. If Bakara survives, it's a very difficult question. If Wrex is alive, I'm going to cure it. However, I've read compelling arguments for curing the genophage even when Wreav stands alone, and for sabotaging the cure when Wrex is alive. It's actually very ambiguous, but I guess it doesn't help that the EC didn't show enough positives when Wreav is alive or enough negatives when Wrex is alive.

 

As for Rannoch, the game definitely makes the geth sympathetic, even up to the moment when you make the big decision. HOWEVER... if you choose to actually side with the geth, the game makes the quarian annihilation far more depressing than the geth annihilation. If you destroy the geth, there is a sense of "good riddance" and "oh well" from the crew. If you destroy the quarians, the crew regrets that the conflict had to end like this. Siding with the geth almost feels like the wrong decision.

[KaiserShep]

Maybe it varies in each platform. On PS3, I've yet to come across any troublesome issues., but the other two are full of annoying little things.

[themikefest]

On my ps3, I don't recall seeing any bugs/glitches for ME1/ME2. But with ME3, at times the game freezes and I have to shutdown the console and restart. At times a character will speak and you won't hear the voice. You know this if you have the subtitles on. This is very noticeable on the Normandy.

[KaiserShep]

On PS3, I occasionally experience the audio bug, freezing when using biotic charge, enemies freeze in midair when using shockwave, which sometimes made Arrival impossible to complete without reloading in ME2, and on ME1, I experience freezing, especially during autosave sections, the Mako loves to sink into the ground, requiring returning to the Normandy, freezing in the Normandy's elevator, uncooperative squad AI (on Feros, the team will get stuck in the tunnels and won't move even when I try to direct them) , lines of dialogue in cutscenes sometimes play twice, and the squad will sometimes fire nonstop, stuck in combat mode even when the battlefield is clear.

[dreamgazer]

There are camera tracking issues all over the place in ME2, as well as its share of other glitches, as reported in the link I included above.

I really wish I had been able to record the time a salarian was essentially riding a Segway through the markets in ME1. He was moving forward, but his walking animation didn't trigger. It was kind of hilarious.

[KaiserShep]

Something like that happens in ME3 also. There's one salarian in the presidium commons, though this doesn't happen to me often, and there's one that frequently does this in the Omega DLC during the sequence when you pass the mad prophet, but Omega DLC and bugs go together like Kai Leng and cereal.

[ImaginaryMatter]

I don't these conflicts are as black-and-white as some people believe. If Wreav stands alone, I'm probably going to sabotage the cure. If Bakara survives, it's a very difficult question. If Wrex is alive, I'm going to cure it. However, I've read compelling arguments for curing the genophage even when Wreav stands alone, and for sabotaging the cure when Wrex is alive. It's actually very ambiguous, but I guess it doesn't help that the EC didn't show enough positives when Wreav is alive or enough negatives when Wrex is alive.

 

As for Rannoch, the game definitely makes the geth sympathetic, even up to the moment when you make the big decision. HOWEVER... if you choose to actually side with the geth, the game makes the quarian annihilation far more depressing than the geth annihilation. If you destroy the geth, there is a sense of "good riddance" and "oh well" from the crew. If you destroy the quarians, the crew regrets that the conflict had to end like this. Siding with the geth almost feels like the wrong decision.

 

By black and white I mean the game is definitely supporting one side over an other.

 

I do agree there are compelling reasons for curing/not curing the genophage for whatever Krogan/Salarian match-up is alive, my problem though is how well those arguments are apparent in the game. For example, if Wrex is dead the only argument you get from a character for not curing the genophage is from the all-so-likable Salarian Dalatrass, and no where in the game do we get a Mordin-esque defense for the genophage (even Mordin changes his mind regardless of what went down in ME2). Furthermore the most likable characters are supportive of the genophage cure. And while Wreav is a pretty strong reason for not curing the genophage (especially without a woman to hold him in line) I don't think that argument should be dependent on who or who isn't alive in a given scenario.

 

The Rannoch arc is even worse. The mention of that nasty business with the genocide and enforced isolation gets minimalized and even then it's usually up to Shepard to speak up for the Quarians (which sometimes takes a bit of dialogue acrobatics). The admiralty board does some flip-flopping as well. Korris is now no longer a blow hard but a noble saint and often the sole voice of reason among the Quarian leadership. Han'Gerrel is now a reckless, warmonger who is even questioned by his own piers. Then there's the Geth consciousness mission. Once again while the blows are softer with the Geth VI, there is still that feeling that the writer is trying to hammer in a side.

 

I think as far as the ultimate choice on Rannoch the emotional impact has the same magnitude. In choosing the Quarians you have to actually kill Legion and the Geth are then left completely helpless as the Quarians destroy them. In choosing the Geth the death of the Quarians is somewhat mitigated because once again Han'Gerrel is reckless and charges in. As for the aftermath, I think EDI's lament is just as powerful as the loss the ME1 crew feels from Tali's death (without Tali, they are more neutral about the whole thing).

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

To add on, if you side with Tali and don't allow the upload of Reaper code, it's impossible to make peace. 

[Hello!I'mTheDoctor]

I don't think either the genophage cure or the geth/quarian conflict were made into "black and white" conflicts.  Both are still complex, if a bit truncated to arrive at their resolutions. And I don't dislike the idea that Cerberus became the puppets of the Reapers after they retrieved tech from the Collector base and went overboard with research ... yet again.  

 

I can attest to that. I think the morally repugnant option is to cure the Genophage, discarding that morality for the sole benefits needed to secure Krogan support (which I always wondered why they were needed to fight big ass ships.) I'd argue that the Geth/Quarian perspective really is a black and white scenario. Going by moral compass, people would be surprised to learn that I did come to a black and white moral conclusion to that: Not supporting the Geth is the immoral thing to do, and everything that's ever led up to it has had its fault originate with Quarians or organics.

 

As for TIM, I still would say it was alright research. Hell, I have a theory about TIM where absolutely everything that happens to Cerberus and with Cerberus in ME3 is by his planning. Everything up until the very end was calculated perfectly by TIM. His whole plan for Cerberus was fulfilled at Earth. The one spanner in the motor was that he himself never accounted for his own indoctrination at the very end, which prevented him from taking control of the Reapers. However, a renegade Shepard can essentially pull off what TIM wanted all along with Renegade Control.

[JasonShepard]

On X360 - ME3 hardly ever crashes for me. The only thing I have to remember is to hit quicksave before I enter the cockpit, just in case I get my foot stuck in the floor (even if I do, a save and reload usually frees me). The import bug was a pain, but they fixed that pretty quick (still amazed that they didn't catch that before launch though). And there were numerous fan work-arounds, one of which I used successfully.

 

There was that one time I managed to glitch outside of Javik's room and discovered that the entire Normandy is interconnected even without the loading screens. I was walking underneath the Cargo Bay, and could also see all the way up to Thane's old room and the CIC in the distance. That was fun.

 

But yeah, I find ME3 pretty reliable. ME1 was far worse.

[CronoDragoon]

I lost 30 hours - my entire save - to the save corruption that existed before BioWare patched it in ME2.

 

Nothing in ME3 can ever approach that type of damage to a playthrough.

[wolfhowwl]

I do agree there are compelling reasons for curing/not curing the genophage for whatever Krogan/Salarian match-up is alive, my problem though is how well those arguments are apparent in the game. For example, if Wrex is dead the only argument you get from a character for not curing the genophage is from the all-so-likable Salarian Dalatrass, and no where in the game do we get a Mordin-esque defense for the genophage (even Mordin changes his mind regardless of what went down in ME2). Furthermore the most likable characters are supportive of the genophage cure. And while Wreav is a pretty strong reason for not curing the genophage (especially without a woman to hold him in line) I don't think that argument should be dependent on who or who isn't alive in a given scenario.

 

Even if they did add some Mordin-esque arguments, it would still be weak because they don't mean much in the face of events happening in the game and how the scenario is structured.

 

The game tells you that curing the genophage is the requirement for the Krogan boots on Palaven which in turn is the requirement for the Turians helping YOU.

 

Love or hate the Krogan, you have a reason to cure it to help you deal with the immediate threat of the Reapers. Oh sure a resurgent Krogan could be a future problem but you have every reason to believe that you're going to lose anyways... This is an act of desperation in the face of almost certain defeat.

 

It would be trying to get you to buy into this future threat as being dangerous enough to be worth risking catastrophically screwing up your deal with Victus and the war effort in the middle of the apocalypse. The Turians, a race that unlike humanity fought and won the Krogan Rebellions, clearly thinks that this Krogan "threat" isn't worth caring about with the Reapers rampaging.

 

Maybe the game would toss out some references to the Krogan Rebellions. Except then the Krogans had a massive fleet with dreadnoughts, experienced personnel, and the infrastructure to support their war machine. They don't have jack **** now. They're being transported by other races to die like maggots under a blowtorch to hold back the Reaper ground forces. If the Krogan are going to be starting nonsense after the war they will be doing so without warships, the knowledge to run them, or the support for it.

 

 

 

[Etocis]

I liked ME3 but for reasons that are not in the game itself. I know a lot of us remember when the first news articles came around that tore ME3 up because of its ending and the initial fan outcry of that. Then came both the PR speech and the gaming media ready to shoot down fan complaints, whether they were trollish or actually genuine, with the buzz word of "Entitled". Next came the announcement of the extended cut and the gaming media's rhetoric of how making the DLC was destroying "Artistic Integrity" and the co-founders of the company leaving. Finally we have several other DLC's trying to fill in the gaps that the ending left behind, whether it actually fixed ME3 or made it a Frankenstein monster we may never come to an agreement on, and culminating into the deconstruction and reconstruction of fan to developer interactions. To me ME3 is an example of a wake-up call to everyone invested in it to see where they stand and what they may or may not put up with. It is the spotlight on how fragile trust can be and how hard it is to repair it. What I hope that the new dev team does is work towards rebuilding that trust with their fanbase and help to repair their IP's image so that maybe long time fans don't feel that whatever magic was there is gone forever.

[CronoDragoon]

To me ME3 is an example of a wake-up call to everyone invested in it to see where they stand and what they may or may not put up with. It is the spotlight on how fragile trust can be and how hard it is to repair it. What I hope that the new dev team does is work towards rebuilding that trust with their fanbase and help to repair their IP's image so that maybe long time fans don't feel that whatever magic was there is gone forever.

 

This long-time fan will order another helping of ME3, thanks.

 

(Just maybe hold the anchovies this time).

[Etocis]

I can't tell if that's sarcasm or not...

[Etocis]

In either case ME3 had a few good moments for me so at least it wasn't a complete waste.

[ImaginaryMatter]

Even if they did add some Mordin-esque arguments, it would still be weak because they don't mean much in the face of events happening in the game and how the scenario is structured.

 

The game tells you that curing the genophage is the requirement for the Krogan boots on Palaven which in turn is the requirement for the Turians helping YOU.

 

Love or hate the Krogan, you have a reason to cure it to help you deal with the immediate threat of the Reapers. Oh sure a resurgent Krogan could be a future problem but you have every reason to believe that you're going to lose anyways... This is an act of desperation in the face of almost certain defeat.

 

It would be trying to get you to buy into this future threat as being dangerous enough to be worth risking catastrophically screwing up your deal with Victus and the war effort in the middle of the apocalypse. The Turians, a race that unlike humanity fought and won the Krogan Rebellions, clearly thinks that this Krogan "threat" isn't worth caring about with the Reapers rampaging.

 

Maybe the game would toss out some references to the Krogan Rebellions. Except then the Krogans had a massive fleet with dreadnoughts, experienced personnel, and the infrastructure to support their war machine. They don't have jack **** now. They're being transported by other races to die like maggots under a blowtorch to hold back the Reaper ground forces. If the Krogan are going to be starting nonsense after the war they will be doing so without warships, the knowledge to run them, or the support for it.

 

Perhaps. But as we find out the Krogan can't really feel whether they were cured or not (and why would they?). And with the war going on they probably don't have too much time to start reproducing before realizing something is up. So, why wasn't they option to deceive them available at the onset? Did nobody think about even suggesting it? A compromise cure? Anything else? At the very least there was reason to talk about it so the Dalatrass's option had something more going for it than spaceships vs groundtroops (which I guess is sort of the case, except I think in the Wrex case they strongly hint enough that he will find out).

 

This is personal and part of a larger thematic issue for me but as Wrex said back in ME1, it wasn't the Genophage that was killing the Krogan is was themselves. And it was disappointing that there wasn't the option of Krogan overcoming the genophage vs having it simply cured for them.

 

I also think the Krogan pose a threat beyond the immediate aftermath of the war. They could again go Krogan on the galaxy (or themselves) after advancing their personal tech.

[KaiserShep]

So, why wasn't they option to deceive them available at the onset?

 

The only character with the incentive to make this proposal would be the Dalatrass, and in her position, I wouldn't make this proposal in-person aboard a ship that happens to have a krogan aboard. I doubt Wrex or Wreav would care much for the ramifications of murdering the Dalatrass if he got wind that she was trying to screw him over.

 

As for the krogan post-cure, I think it's more likely that they'd start fighting each other again before they even bother trying to take the galaxy by storm. A group like the krogan would no doubt already be flagged as a potential risk, and any rights they may pursue to colonize other worlds would be in jeopardy if anyone even got the slightest hint that they'd be a problem. They have no warships of their own, and trying to buy or build any en masse would probably lead to a quick response from the Council races. The salarians could just as easily create a more potent bioweapon that simply obliterates them once and for all. They oversaw the near eradication of the rachni; there's no reason to believe they wouldn't do the same to the krogan if they felt it was necessary.

[ImaginaryMatter]

The only character with the incentive to make this proposal would be the Dalatrass, and in her position, I wouldn't make this proposal in-person aboard a ship that happens to have a krogan aboard. I doubt Wrex or Wreav would care much for the ramifications of murdering the Dalatrass if he got wind that she was trying to screw him over.

 

As for the krogan post-cure, I think it's more likely that they'd start fighting each other again before they even bother trying to take the galaxy by storm. A group like the krogan would no doubt already be flagged as a potential risk, and any rights they may pursue to colonize other worlds would be in jeopardy if anyone even got the slightest hint that they'd be a problem. They have no warships of their own, and trying to buy or build any en masse would probably lead to a quick response from the Council races. The salarians could just as easily create a more potent bioweapon that simply obliterates them once and for all. They oversaw the near eradication of the rachni; there's no reason to believe they wouldn't do the same to the krogan if they felt it was necessary.

 

I think any one who saw the Krogan as a threat would have incentive, also I'm sure they could talk about it in secret. Don't the Krogans only find out about the bomb once they read Shepard's mission report? I'm sure they could also privately email each other or something (I know this isn't saying much because I guess Wrex -- somehow -- gets a copy of the Dalatrass conversation, but I'm sure there's some secure channel they at least think is safe).

 

As for the second point perhaps. But the first time they did manage to get from primitive culture to the nuclear age before they started nuking each other. Who's to say that they definitely won't do the same again. As for a future biological attack I think the Krogan will be much more wary, the initial cure was originally distributed at least partly through Salarian infrastructure so at least that means would probably be immediately suspect.