851 réponses à ce sujet

[Tchos]

SpeedTree is a third party proprietary system licensed by Obsidian to use in this game that purports to perform culling of meshes out of the visible area and LOD reduction of ones that are.

[drechner]

True - but they're called 'speedtrees' for a reason. The format has been designed to be as low on resources to render as possible. They don't have actual model meshes of their own, but rather are generated on-the-fly by algorithms.

 

The algorithms create the mesh, which needs to be rendered (hence a draw call). SpeedTrees don't just magically show up on your screen (though that would be some amazing stuff!)

Also, the reason SpeedTree is used so frequently in the industry is not because of their performance necessarily, but because of the speed at which artists can create realistic, nice-looking trees with all sorts of built-in support for tweaking various aspects to fit the game/game engine.

[Dann-J]

The algorithms create the mesh, which needs to be rendered (hence a draw call). SpeedTrees don't just magically show up on your screen (though that would be some amazing stuff!)

Also, the reason SpeedTree is used so frequently in the industry is not because of their performance necessarily, but because of the speed at which artists can create realistic, nice-looking trees with all sorts of built-in support for tweaking various aspects to fit the game/game engine.

 

Speedtrees are read into RAM and then transferred directly to the GPU using DMA calls while being rendered, bypassing the CPU. That takes a substantial load off the system. Plus, beyond a certain distance they're displayed as flat 2D planes. An area full of speedtrees renders with far better framerates than the same area full of solid tree models of similar detail would.

 

You could nuts with the tree seeds in that area if you wanted to. Compared to what all those static placeables are doing to performance, a few more tree seeds aren't going to make things much worse.

 

Now if only they looked this good in NWN2...

[rjshae]

Seems like this speedtree performance issue is really just a matter of degree, and it depends on whether SOAR is being designed with archaic PCs in mind. But if this campaign is going to take at least five years to put together, by then the current state of the art system is going to be de rigueur minimum. So my suggestion would be to see this game push the current GPU envelope a bit, then list a recommend system requirement once it comes out.

[Arkalezth]

I haven't played much NWN2 lately and I haven't toyed much with the graphic options and such, but I've recently got myself a new computer to replace my six-years old, SSD-less one, and honestly, I haven't noticed a huge difference when it comes to this game. Most things would run decently enough on the old one anyway, load screens are still slow (less so, but slow)...

The game is just badly optimised, regardless of your PC. And I'm aware that this is old news, but a reminder doesn't hurt.

[Eguintir Eligard]

You don't need to list system requirements for a campaign.
At the end of the day, people get the same performance.

Here's an example from myself:
When I played it on a laptop with barely enough power in a Nvidia 7600 (Laptop version, so lets say 7500)
I played in the laptop 1024x768 mode, reflections were on but no anti alias, and shadows.

With a GTX 295 I play 1920x1080, max everything although still set one of shadow types not completely maxed (thanks to said innefficient nwn2 engine).

On both setups it basically results in an acceptable frame rate.Both might give the odd chug in a heavy city area.

Many people always make some false assumption that if the user has a stronger computer they are immune to frame rate drops or max it out to an pointless frame rate that exceeds what the human eye can even see. By the same token, they assume someone with a weaker computer can't handle what the stronger computer user can.

That's not the case. People set their graphic quality levels to the best they can get while still maintaining an acceptable frame rate. So a performance hit is a performance hit is a performance hit. And we should not assume the mid powered PC user has suffered a devastating lag issue just because the high end PC shows a mild to moderate lag in an area. For all you know, both users are experiencing equal jolts, just with different levels of anti aliasing to enjoy.

The only exception are those who can't even reach an acceptable rate of performance even on min settings, and I don't think anyone needs to lose sleep about those who haven't updated a pc since 1985. They failed to read the NWN2 requirements or heed them as it is.

So lets credit people with a little common sense... game players know how to set their graphics settings. They aren't idiots.

[rjshae]

So lets credit people with a little common sense... game players know how to set their graphics settings. They aren't idiots.

 

No, you're the only one bringing up the notion that game players may be thought of idiots. But that's your typical approach. Before spending a couple of hours downloading a massive game file, I always check for the graphic requirements; it makes sense to tell people when a campaign may make heavy demands on their system.

[-Semper-]

NWN2's biggest issue with GPU-related perf is the culling (or lack thereof) of static meshes.

 

a simple form of culling is implemented through farclip.

[PJ156]

Can you tell what it is yet?

 

 

I've started to get a grip on what I can and can't do with this area and what it will look like in the end. It wont be a copy of the original but it will be recognizable.

 

This is the walkable area.

 

I've had a lot of help to get this far from Tchos and RJShae. None of the content they helped with is on the screen yet but it soon will be

 

PJ

[Eguintir Eligard]

I thought you said you were doing the Saughahin area so thats my guess.

[kamal_]

Yes, that's Sahaugin city.

[Tchos]

The link doesn't work for me.  Says "Sorry, an unexpected error occurred."  Might be a temporary thing.

[Arkalezth]

Same, but I can see the pic in the post. Weird.

[rjshae]

PhotoBucket seems to be having problems today.

[Tchos]

Now it shows up in the thread for me.

[Eguintir Eligard]

I got two words for you: postimg    org

 

no sign up, instant pic upload and linkage.

[Shallina]

it 's an impressive start I am also super happy to see NWN2 modders with knowledge doing a lot of work for SOAR. Tonight i' ll see if i can upload screens of an area I made which isn 't in TOB

[Shallina]

here i think it was the first area made which will be kept for SOAR.  It is around one year old and it is not scripted, but the walkmesh is fully functional. It's one of my favorite area from BG2.

 

[rjshae]

That must be Brynnlaw. It looks nice, although it could perhaps use a few domes. I think I recognize Baron's Adobe set in there.

[Eguintir Eligard]

I also like it. But shouldnt the top right of the area be growing up and out of sight to the huge mountain that looms over the town and holds the asylum atop? Thats where the north east exit leads you in BG2, in this shot you would walk off a cliff i nto the water

[PJ156]

Awww, I'm jealous now. I wanted Brynnlaw 

 

Can't have all the fun stuff I suppose.

 

PJ

[PJ156]

There's a long way to go but I am staring to get a grip on how I want this area now and how I will "sanitize" it in terms of being able to believe it.

 

Tchos mentioned in a PM that Sahuagin cannot be more than an hour out of water so that got me thinking. The city is below the water but there is water within it. I see it as being in a dome but I cannot do a dome. I will have it within a curtain of water with water overhead. The player will be under the water but in a fish tank of sorts. The houses of the city will be submerged as they are in the original. Again, as in the original, the walk way will be at the very top of the city and pretty much the only dry place the Sahuagin hang out.

 

This is an exciting area to build. There's a huge risk that it will turn into a BCK box but we shall see. I have some more organic forms to break up the squareness.

 

 

PJ

[Arkalezth]

I will have it within a curtain of water with water overhead.

That sounds cool as a concept, but I wonder if it'll turn out as a graphical annoyance in the actual game.

[PJ156]

You make a good point Ark, you might well be right.  Therefore, when I have the draft down, will you try it out for me please?

 

I could have put too much movement in the background?

 

PJ

[Arkalezth]

Sure, I can check it if you want me to. Maybe it'll work fine, it's just a thought.