844 réponses à ce sujet

[drechner]

Speaking of scars, could Sarevok's be made a bit more noticeable? They're glowy in his original pic, which would likely look silly, but you have to look closely in order to see them in your model.

I like how he looks in general, and the scars don't look exactly -bad-, but I was wondering about that.

 

Definitely, though the new materials actually helped quite a bit in this regard. Maybe I'll upload a new pic that shows off his scars a bit more.

 

I like to use an olive green for skin specular, myself.

 

Interesting. How did you decide on using that out of curiosity? I really don't know much on the subject other than many people seem to use blue quite a bit (though NWN2 OC doesn't?), so I'm mostly resorting to using trial-and-error.

 

I think they look great but I still think that Nalia and Mazzy seem too dark skinned. Nalia is indoor raised and I imagine her as very fair skinned, almost wan perhaps? Mazzy would have a pale complexion I imagine, but is outdoorsy and thus the more worn skin tone would look fine. The others are great and very fitting to their race/lifestyle.

 

PJ

 

They're both pretty dark-skinned in their portraits though. I think Mazzy could use some more highlights, details, etc. on her diffuse, but I wasn't considering changing their base skin tone very much. Do you think they differ that much from their portraits?

[Tolkien Bard]

Welcome Tolkien Bard, good to see a new face. Here's something to do while you are waiting:

 

http://www.nexusmods...ter2/mods/538/?

 

http://www.nexusmods...ter2/mods/269/?

 

http://www.nexusmods...ter2/mods/938/?

 

PJ

 

 

Thanks for the links. I discovered Crimmor just the other day, but have yet to load it up since I am in the midst of another campaign at the moment. I've added the other two to the list. It looks like I have nice selection of new material waiting for me now. It's an odd feeling watching my campaign list grow so quickly after years of just being the core four plus some BRG and IWDR.

[-Semper-]

Interesting. How did you decide on using that out of curiosity? I really don't know much on the subject other than many people seem to use blue quite a bit (though NWN2 OC doesn't?), so I'm mostly resorting to using trial-and-error.

you both are sure that the electron engine supports colored spec maps? afaik only gray scaled maps work and the colorization was done through the spec color of the lights in-engine.

[drechner]

you both are sure that the electron engine supports colored spec maps? afaik only gray scaled maps work and the colorization was done through the spec color of the lights in-engine.

 

It's used according to the OEI document that Hellfire (thankfully!) uploaded here: http://www.rwscreati....php?f=18&t=725.

I noticed a difference in the engine when I set it to different values in the material itself, though I could have just been imagining it

[PJ156]

 

They're both pretty dark-skinned in their portraits though. I think Mazzy could use some more highlights, details, etc. on her diffuse, but I wasn't considering changing their base skin tone very much. Do you think they differ that much from their portraits?

 

Perhaps you're right ... it's just me it seems.

 

PJ

[Tchos]

Interesting. How did you decide on using that out of curiosity? I really don't know much on the subject other than many people seem to use blue quite a bit (though NWN2 OC doesn't?), so I'm mostly resorting to using trial-and-error.

 

I used to be more of a 3D rendering animator/artist and texturer, not so much a modeler, and olive green specular highlights was recommended in my circles as being good for bringing out natural-looking skin tones.  I expect not much has changed in the intervening time as far as that goes.  Blue light is definitely nice for the backlight or edge light in a 3-point lighting setup, though, and it's certainly not a bad choice for specular highlight colour.

 

Semper: No, I'm not sure at all whether tints on the model work in this engine, and I do use it in the light setup in the toolset, which as you say does work.  My suggestion was more for general 3D work.

 

Perhaps you're right ... it's just me it seems.

 

No, not just you.  I never interpreted either of them to be particularly dark, but I admit that could just be my preconceptions, like the blue and black or gold and white dress.

[Arkalezth]

They're both pretty dark-skinned in their portraits though.

Both Mazzy and Nalia look about average white in their portraits to me.

Spoiler

[kamal_]

imo, Mazzy's "black", she has the cheek and orbital bone structure. (probably ethiopian or somali, like these models).

 

[rjshae]

Mazzy's bio says she's from Amn, which is supposedly comparable to Spain climate-wise. Perhaps a Mediterranean skin tone then? Anyway, she's a halfling so human standards may not apply.

[Arkalezth]

Wait. David Bowie's Somali???

Seriously, though, I'm talking only about skin tone. I don't know about bone structure and the like... which is kind of irrelevant, anyway. I mean, technically black or not, her skin tone is still white.
 

Mazzy's bio says she's from Amn, which is supposedly comparable to Spain climate-wise.

 
Which inhabitants are mostly average white-skinned. I'm speaking as an average white, average skin toned Spaniard.

[kamal_]

Wait. David Bowie's Somali???

Seriously, though, I'm talking only about skin tone. I don't know about bone structure and the like... which is kind of irrelevant, anyway. I mean, technically black or not, her skin tone is still white.
 
 
Which inhabitants are mostly average white-skinned. I'm speaking as an average white, average skin toned Spaniard.

While Amn is "Imperial Spain", the typical Amnian is not "white" in the sourcebooks. Below are pics from the Lands of Intrigue sourcebook of Amnians. You can see the typical "white" adventurer in the second picture, so the skin shading is intentional. Valygar is specifically an Amnian native, it's an inherent part of his storyline, and he's definitely "black". According to sourcebook "Native Amnians are primarily of old Tethyrian and Calishite stock,"  I would suggest they are predominantly "north african" in look/skin tone, like Berbers or Moroccans. Keldorn, Anomen, and Mazzy's skin tone fit that. The only obviously "white" party member from Amn is Nalia.

 

I also tried the Maztica sourcebook, but the only Amnian in that was the guy on the cover, and he probably represents the specific character from the Maztica novels.

 

 

 

 

 

And some Tethyrians for comparison:

 

 

And Anomen (Keldorn's pic is much more battleworn and dirty, so I picked Anomen):

[Tchos]

So they're talking about Spain during the Moorish occupation, then.

[Arkalezth]

While Amn is "Imperial Spain", the typical Amnian is not "white" in the sourcebooks

Well, I was just replying to the comment about real life's "Spanish skin tone". What Tchos said sounds about right when looking at the pictures.
 

I would suggest they are predominantly "north african" in look/skin tone, like Berbers or Moroccans. Keldorn, Anomen, and Mazzy's skin tone fit that. The only obviously "white" party member from Amn is Nalia.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, then. Some are more tanned than others, but they all seem quite "obviously white" to me.

Do all these details really matter, anyway? Just make everyone's skin look as it does in the portraits, and then call it whatever.

[Tchos]

Out of curiosity, I took Ark's provided portraits into Photoshop and sampled the colours from each at what seemed to be the "baseline" unshaded section on each of their right upper cheeks.  (On the left of the portraits.)  The circle to the right of the portraits is the colour that was sampled from each.

 

 

Of course, the shadowed areas, especially under the hair, are darker on Mazzy, and I can't say what that means.

[kamal_]

Well, I was just replying to the comment about real life's "Spanish skin tone". What Tchos said sounds about right when looking at the pictures.
 
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, then. Some are more tanned than others, but they all seem quite "average white" to me, give or take.

Do all these details really matter, anyway? Just make everyone's skin look as they do in the portraits, and then call it whatever.

I want the details to be right because if it's like BGR, SOAR is going to get a ton of downloads and press. I don't want the Docks and Slums to be ultra-clean for instance, because they're not supposed to be, and that's important to the "feel" of the game. I don't want to hear "they messed it up", that would be bad for the rest of us. Of course I'm not on the team making it so I don't have any say in things, just giving my opinion.

 

I personally think one of the great things about BG2 was seeing something that wasn't the generic clean western europe fantasy world. We finally got to see something else, and it gave the game more character and made the player want to know more about the world because it wasn't something they'd seen so many times before that they already knew how everything worked. MotB had the same non-typical setting advantage by drawing on eastern european influences.

[Dann-J]

I would expect that any adventuring type who spends a lot of time outdoors would at the very least have weather-beaten tanned skin, regardless of their racial background. Peaches-and-cream complexions just don't seem realistic. Neither are overly-complex beaded or braided hairstyles (dreadlocks are fairly low-maintenance though).

 

Halflings specifically tend to fall into two camps; the home-bodies who prefer sitting in an armchair by a fire (who would have reasonably pale skin), and the more outdoorsy types like scouts, outriders, and the occasional rare adventurer, who would be appropriately tanned. Not to mention ingrained dirt from prolonged exposure to the elements.

[Arkalezth]

Snip.

Agreed, but I don't think that NPCs keeping their skin tones is bad (more like the contrary), or that trying to determine the exact racial background of each of them is all that relevant. I don't know if Mazzy has "black cheekbones", but her skin has always been, and IMO, should continue to be white.

[Luminus]

Let's not do what many wrongly do: bringing real-life biology to a fantasy setting.

Moon Elves or Avariel, for example, could spend decades under the sun and their skin-tone would still be pale. Such changes might take hundreds or even thousands of years, to make an elf tanned.

As for halflings, they live up to twice human years (up until 150) and have their own subraces. Which means that those subraces could have their own colors that might or might not change.


About Mazzy, she's neither pale nor tanned. She has a light copper tan perhaps. And she seems like a Strongheart Halfling based on her personality and alignment.
"A martially inclined and well-organized people compared in many ways to the industrious dwarves."

Anyway, what's important is making the characters the way they are in their portraits. Arguing what would be more realistic and appropriate is pointless and irrelevant.

[Dann-J]

About Mazzy, she's neither pale nor tanned. She has a light copper tan perhaps. And she seems like a Strongheart Halfling based on her personality and alignment.
 

 

If she's from pre-Spellplague Amn then she's more likely to be a lightfoot. Amnish lightfoots tend to be more militaristic than those from other parts of Faerun, not unlike stronghearts. The halflings of the Citadel of the Banner Raised Anew (near the village of Zinner, in the territory of the ancient fallen halfling empire of Meiritin) make themselves useful by culling the monster populations of the western Tejarn Hills, and aid the Amnish hillfort patrols in the region. They're considered to be quite a respected fighting force.

 

Halflings in general tend to be described as having ruddy complexions. Whether that's due to hard work in the fields or to their level of alcohol consumption is anyone's guess.

[drechner]

Out of curiosity, I took Ark's provided portraits into Photoshop and sampled the colours from each at what seemed to be the "baseline" unshaded section on each of their right upper cheeks.  (On the left of the portraits.)  The circle to the right of the portraits is the colour that was sampled from each.

 

 

Of course, the shadowed areas, especially under the hair, are darker on Mazzy, and I can't say what that means.

 

Mazzy is actually darker complected than Nalia; the lighting of the portraits can be a bit tricky though and make this a bit confusing. Further complicating this is they're both wearing "makeup" in the portraits, so it yields some weird results such as the overly colored cheeks on Nalia.

 

I don't want to hear "they messed it up", that would be bad for the rest of us. 

 

That's... kind of a weird thing to say. At the very least, you'll get an influx of new NWN2 players

[-Semper-]

Semper: No, I'm not sure at all whether tints on the model work in this engine, and I do use it in the light setup in the toolset, which as you say does work.

ah, you talked about the spec color of the 3dsmax material, and not the spec map which is used in-engine. yes, that should work.

[Eguintir Eligard]

I just wanted to post here that I completed my fatty project and it may be relevant here since BG and BG2 invented the fatty model I based it on. While it might not be up to par with your project, if you click the link in my signature you will note that I containted files for the original 3ds max models so they could be modified or improved along with the texture files as one would see fit.

[drechner]

I just wanted to post here that I completed my fatty project and it may be relevant here since BG and BG2 invented the fatty model I based it on. While it might not be up to par with your project, if you click the link in my signature you will note that I containted files for the original 3ds max models so they could be modified or improved along with the texture files as one would see fit.

Nice; thanks!

Rigging scares me a bit because I don't really have any experience doing it. I did a couple test heads and the best I did was getting eye lids to move

 

There are some good tutorials out there for NWN2 though, so hopefully I'll figure it out with the help of those. How did it go for you?

[-Semper-]

if you work with 3dsmax then be sure to read about the skin wrap modifier. it should be relatively easy to base the weighting of your new head on an imported vanilla one.

[Eguintir Eligard]

If you were to come up with a head, anyone of the 3d pros like semper or 4760 could put it on my fatty body easily. The original max files are right there, and the mapping is extremely simple on the 2 or 3 bones in the head of the model I did.