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I allways felt the dalish made up the story of there great homeland how the were immortal i think the were more savage and used blood magic to increse there life spains
Felassan comments on the immortality of the Arlathan elves, so there might be some truth to the elven lore.
Felassan comments on the immortality of the Arlathan elves, so there might be some truth to the elven lore.
And everything that elf says should be taken with a grain of salt, or a pound or a metric ton.
Considering the ancient elves practiced slavery, had a rigid caste system, and kept the lower castes in conditions that were similar to those of the city elves today, I have to wonder if the Chantry version of that story is the correct one after all.
Felassan compared Arlathan to Orlais. Are you saying you believe Orlais practices slavery?
Wow...I'm still catching up from page 39.
Felassan compared Arlathan to Orlais. Are you saying you believe Orlais practices slavery?
Serfdom has been compared to slavery by modern contemporaries of civil rights, incorrectly mind you but it has been compared to that.
So no, Orlais practices Feudalistic Serfdom; Elves are treated worse then human serfs but that really isn't unique to Orlais.
Serfdom has been compared to slavery by modern contemporaries of civil rights, incorrectly mind you but it has been compared to that.
So no, Orlais practices Feudalistic Serfdom; Elves are treated worse then human serfs but that really isn't unique to Orlais.
I think that serfdom can legitimately be compared to slavery. It only becomes incorrect if conflate the two.
Felassan compared Arlathan to Orlais. Are you saying you believe Orlais practices slavery?
We know they do. Just in secret. Look at Fiona.
Felassan comments on the immortality of the Arlathan elves, so there might be some truth to the elven lore.
Am sorry i think its lie the Dalish use to increse there numbers am sure city elf that has been brutalized by humans would fall for it hook line and sinker come join us we can reduscover out lost immortality together kinda like the lie Darth Sidious told Anakin skywaler only through me can you achieve the power to stop others form dying
I think that serfdom can legitimately be compared to slavery. It only becomes incorrect if conflate the two.
Well, Admittedly the objective is near the same, except in the case of Serf's their income (that's major difference number one) is directly drawn from their work on their Lord's Estate, And after a set agreed upon period, the Lord would actually be indebted to the Serf to a period of agreed upon income, So to me, Serfdom is different Slavery, in the very real sense, that they were paid for their service upon the end, and occasionally even given properties of their own manage and own.
Slaves? Even during the era we are speaking of, we were to work until death or until their debt was repaid in whatever task the Lord found suitable, Serfs usually had more strings attached, such as they were designated for a specific type of labor usually upon the agreement with the Lord, but most of all, you usually have to agree to be a serf, it isn't hereditary or involuntary usually such as being a slave.
Both are brutal, exhausting ways to live life, but they are unique enough for me to see them clearly as two things.
Felassan comments on the immortality of the Arlathan elves, so there might be some truth to the elven lore.
I still don't think the elves were immortal , it seems only nobles had those pretty tombs.
My big theory is Tevinter culture is closer to ancient elves than the Dalish.
I think Dreamers were rulers , and only dreamers could be immortal ...same way Tevinter higher class is the Altus nowadays,the descendant of dreamers.
In the book some elven dreamers were killed by their servants, it may hint at slavery or some abuse.
Felassan said the ancient elves weren't so different from Orlais nobility ...Orlais + magic = Tevinter.
And It seems ancient Tevinter and the ancient elves were at one point close.They probably influenced each others.
It's just theories of course ,but I seriously doubt the ancient elves were all very nice people ...and the humans were terrible and bloodthirsty .And that's why the war happened.
We know they do. Just in secret. Look at Fiona.
honestly i don't care what happened to mary sue elf savior jr.
We know they do. Just in secret. Look at Fiona.
Yes. "Slavery is illegal in the Empire, but it still goes on. Nobody pays attention if an elf disappears here or there. Wealthy, powerful men like the Count get to do whatever they like, to whomever they like, so long as nobody cares."
And the Divine has authority over wealthy, powerful men like the Count.
That alone is something you should not ignore - especially considering the Chantry's dogma is directly tied to total conversion of "heretical" peoples and facilitates expansionist attitudes.
It facilitates expansionist attitudes about as much as the Dalish culture facilitates genocide. Possible in theory, advocated by some extremists, absent in practiced policy. It's about as inherent as, oh, the American political motif of spreading freedom and democracy across the world equating world conquest.
Even the point about the total conversion of 'heretical' peoples is overstating it. The Chantry doesn't maintain a policy of mandating conversion and expanding the Chant by conquest of nonbelievers for the purpose of conversion itself- as the Dev's have mentioned before, they've broadly taken the stance that the True Religion will ultimately come on top on its own, without needing to be forced at sword point. The only mass forced-conversion in the history of the setting directed by the Chantry itself was in the creation of the Alienages, and even that comes with the caveat of it being uncleare if the elves were allowed to refuse and join the Dalish exodus. One could argue that the Exalted Marches against Tevinter were an attempt, but it would be ignoring that the religious schism corresponded with the return of the Tevinter mageocracy and its abuses of magic and slavery- as much a political struggle as a religious one.
As it is, there's precious little to support the idea that the Chantry has, say, sent its Templars and might to crush and convert nonbelievers in any systemic or organized fashion. It hasn't happened with the Dwarves, who are already dependent on the surface for trade and losing a war with the Darkspawn, it hasn't happened with the Dalish (who seem to be targeted more because of their mages than religion, and even then only when they remain near settlemetns for long periods), it wasn't happening with the Ferelden Barbarians in the South, it wasn't happening in Rivain, and it wasn't even being discussed towards the Qunari and their sympathizers/converts in Kirkwall. Heck the Andrastian powers outright let their city elves leave the city and join the Dalish, despite the expected conversion to heathen ways.
The Chantry's dogma is interested in the total conversion of the 'heathens', but it isn't and hasn't been cast in terms of urgency and haste justifying and necessitating conversion by the sword. The few who have believed in the urgency of eternity are... pretty much Petrice, who the game pretty much beat you over the head with the fact that hers was a marginalized and deviant viewpoint.
None of which is to say that religious intolerance doesn't occur- it's just not directed or encouraged by the Chantry dogma. It happens at the national or even local level. It doesn't need direction and sanction from the Chantry to happen. The Chantry's stance on heretics in the Dragon Age has been to send missionaries if possible, allow refusal by individuals who don't wish to be part of the faith, and defend the faithful from attack.
Yes. "Slavery is illegal in the Empire, but it still goes on. Nobody pays attention if an elf disappears here or there. Wealthy, powerful men like the Count get to do whatever they like, to whomever they like, so long as nobody cares."
And the Divine has authority over wealthy, powerful men like the Count.
Moral authority, and only in context. The Divine has about as much authority over the national nobility as the Pope does the Mafia.
We know they do. Just in secret. Look at Fiona.
I ask because certain people immediately accept Felassan's comparison of Arlathan to Orlais, to the point of saying that the ancient elven kingdom practiced slavery, but many of the same people who take Felassan at his word about Arlathan don't accept Felassan's comments about how the ancient elves were immortal. It seems that we're only supposed to take Felassan at his word when he says something bad about the ancient elves, but take his words with a grain of salt when he says something that may indicate that elven lore could be right.
I ask because certain people immediately accept Felassan's comparison of Arlathan to Orlais, to the point of saying that the ancient elven kingdom practiced slavery, but many of the same people who take Felassan at his word about Arlathan don't accept Felassan's comments about how the ancient elves were immortal. It seems that we're only supposed to take Felassan at his word when he says something bad about the ancient elves, but take his words with a grain of salt when he says something that may indicate that elven lore could be right.
I just find it more likely to them keeping slaves, to them living forever.
Seems more feasible and likely, for some odd reason.
I just find it more likely to them keeping slaves, to them living forever.
Seems more feasible and likely, for some odd reason.
So Felassan should only be believed when he condemns Arlathan (in this case, comparing Arlathan to modern Orlais), not when he says anything that might prove that the Dalish could be right?
So Felassan should only be believed when he condemns Arlathan (in this case, comparing Arlathan to modern Orlais), not when he says anything that might prove that the Dalish could be right?
._. Don't recall saying that (I don't believe most of what he said)
I just cite him as a source for the ancient elves using a believable practice.
Seriously, stop projecting your opinion on what i say and just read it, it works easier that way.
I ask because certain people immediately accept Felassan's comparison of Arlathan to Orlais, to the point of saying that the ancient elven kingdom practiced slavery, but many of the same people who take Felassan at his word about Arlathan don't accept Felassan's comments about how the ancient elves were immortal. It seems that we're only supposed to take Felassan at his word when he says something bad about the ancient elves, but take his words with a grain of salt when he says something that may indicate that elven lore could be right.
Well, can't speak for others but I think the elves could have been immortal. Now whether the humans are the source of them not having it anymore I may question because that doesn't make sense to me.
I'm thinking the ancient elves learned how to make Eluvians with the help of demons, and somehow brought humans through them to slave around. And if humans are good at one thing, that's adapting. Spreading around...and making babies...That's more than one thing but it's basically what they do best. And causing trouble...
I ask because certain people immediately accept Felassan's comparison of Arlathan to Orlais, to the point of saying that the ancient elven kingdom practiced slavery, but many of the same people who take Felassan at his word about Arlathan don't accept Felassan's comments about how the ancient elves were immortal. It seems that we're only supposed to take Felassan at his word when he says something bad about the ancient elves, but take his words with a grain of salt when he says something that may indicate that elven lore could be right.
Since none of the ancient elves are alive today, I'd be hard pressed to believe any claim as to their immortality... especially when we have evidence they were able to die even before the Humans overthrew them. (Unless the throat-slitting and all that only happened to the mortal sort.)
As it is, Felassan's remarks are far more compatible with his general point that the elves over-romanticized and embellished their tales of the past. There was plenty of magic... but there was also a magical elite, and not necessarily universal magic. There could be immortality of a sorts... but unlikely to be shared or wasted on the floor scrubbers.
Since none of the ancient elves are alive today, I'd be hard pressed to believe any claim as to their immortality... especially when we have evidence they were able to die even before the Humans overthrew them. (Unless the throat-slitting and all that only happened to the mortal sort.)
As it is, Felassan's remarks are far more compatible with his general point that the elves over-romanticized and embellished their tales of the past. There was plenty of magic... but there was also a magical elite, and not necessarily universal magic. There could be immortality of a sorts... but unlikely to be shared or wasted on the floor scrubbers.
You mean like how the Baroness sacrificed children to retain her youth?
I ask because certain people immediately accept Felassan's comparison of Arlathan to Orlais, to the point of saying that the ancient elven kingdom practiced slavery, but many of the same people who take Felassan at his word about Arlathan don't accept Felassan's comments about how the ancient elves were immortal. It seems that we're only supposed to take Felassan at his word when he says something bad about the ancient elves, but take his words with a grain of salt when he says something that may indicate that elven lore could be right.
Yeah but something fishy about elven immortality.
The word Immortal in Elven language is Uthenera.Everything about Uthenera or In Uthenera seems related to dreamers and the fade.
Yeah but something fishy about elven immortality.
The word Immortal in Elven language is Uthenera.Everything about Uthenera or In Uthenera seems related to dreamers and the fade.
Uthenera is the endless dream, the state that those elves who were tired of living entered into instead of death.
Since none of the ancient elves are alive today, I'd be hard pressed to believe any claim as to their immortality... especially when we have evidence they were able to die even before the Humans overthrew them. (Unless the throat-slitting and all that only happened to the mortal sort.)
It's not really an issue as to whether it's true or not, it's an observation on how some people take Felassan at his word when he said something bad about Arlathan, but not when he said something that could address that the Dalish are right. It seems like a double standard to immediately accept his word as fact when it vilifies the elves, but not when it might prove the Dalish right.
As it is, Felassan's remarks are far more compatible with his general point that the elves over-romanticized and embellished their tales of the past. There was plenty of magic... but there was also a magical elite, and not necessarily universal magic. There could be immortality of a sorts... but unlikely to be shared or wasted on the floor scrubbers.
There's not really that much written about their past, aside from the immortality of the Arlathan elves, the use of magic, and how alien the ancient elves were in comparison to modern elves. I'm not so sure it's romanticized, as even the Dalish considered the possibility that Audacity could have been summoned by their ancestors, despite their negative view on using magic that involves spirits; that would indicate that the Dalish believe their ancestors could be just as bad as some of their wayward brethren.
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