674 réponses à ce sujet

[Dovahzeymahlkey]

i get a feeling this version of Wonderwoman will be the Justice league leader. Supes and Bats are too busy kicking each other's ass and she'll be all like "bruhs, stop wrecking this city!" then she ends up kicking both of their asses and getting them to work for her cuz SHES THE GODDAMN GODDESS OF WAR.

[Sully13]

Lovers tiff. they will be too busy making out. 

[Vroom Vroom]

Got to admit WW is the one i'm more interested in this too. if this works out she will be the 1st dc female hero to potentualy pull off a decent solo flick.

I've been dying for a Wonder Woman movie forever, I wouldn't mind power girl either. At least we are finally getting Wonder Woman and Harley on screen.

[Dovahzeymahlkey]

I've been dying for a Wonder Woman movie forever, I wouldn't mind power girl either. At least we are finally getting Wonder Woman and Harley on screen.

id love to see non-caricature new52 Supergirl on the big screen. That would be a fun movie to watch.

[Display Name Owner]

I'm quite looking forward to this now that I've seen the trailer. I'm picking up a lot of apprehension/dislike towards it which I don't quite get. Maybe it's because I really don't care about Superman and his lore, so I've got no problems with Zack Snyder fudging the character about. If that's what he's even doing, I can't say I see it that way. He and Zodd ruined the city in their big fight, I think it's quite a cool idea to have Superman suffering some consequences for the use of his powers rather than just impeccably saving the day right at the start of his career.

[Obadiah]

You caught me. Instead of using my alien superhuman powers to save thousands from an ongoing flood, I'm reading the internet. I've been shamed into going back to my superhero past.

No one on this forum is immune to physical damage, can fly and is faster than a speeding bullet. It's a cost-benefit ratio.

I could go out for twenty minutes and accomplish zero good, despite how hard I tried. Superman could go out for twenty minutes and accomplish World Peace, without even trying hard. With great power comes great...

Since when did helping or saving people require super-powers? Send your money to save those starving kids I keep seeing on television instead of spending it on video games. Or send it to those abused pets that Sarah Mclachlan keeps talking about. And if you're doing that already, *shrug* you can always do more (dedicate life to medical professions, community services, etc...). Don't pretend you can't. We put limits on how much we help others all the time.

[Fast Jimmy]

Since when did helping saving people require super-powers? Send your money to save those starving kids I keep seeing on television instead of spending it on video games. Or send it to those abused pets that Sarah Mclachlan keeps talking about. And if you're doing that already, *shrug* you can always do more (dedicate life to medical professions, community services, etc...). Don't pretend you can't. We put limits on how much we help others all the time.

And we are all FORCED to help the common good with our ability every day. We all pay taxes, which support common good acts, each person's contribution corresponding to how much they earn, the measure of how much power someone has in the majority of cases. When you earn little, you are forced to contribute little, when you earn lots, you are forced to contribute more. On average, 20% of your daily pay goes to the greater good.

Superman has strengths more valuable than money, more influential than armies. Yet there is no tax or forced enlistment of any portion of his power. If Superman were to then give 20% of his day saving people, fighting crime, ensuring world peace... this would be PLENTY. And, honestly with the cover of his alter ego having a "normal" job and then also having friends and family, 20% of his day spent being Superman and doing Superman things doesn't seem a stretch.

It's not forced because no one can force him. But it should be, because it's what we all do every day, proportionate to the ability/power/money we have.

[Obadiah]

And we are all FORCED to help the common good with our ability every day. We all pay taxes, which support common good acts, each person's contribution corresponding to how much they earn, the measure of how much power someone has in the majority of cases. When you earn little, you are forced to contribute little, when you earn lots, you are forced to contribute more. On average, 20% of your daily pay goes to the greater good.

Superman has strengths more valuable than money, more influential than armies.
...

So some contribution that we are forced to give absolves us from the moral obligation to do more? Seems like an arbitrary limit to force the argument that Superman should do more, but we don't have to.

[Medhia_Nox]

Watching people die because you don't want to save them is absolutely horrible. If you think people drowning in floods makes humanity better... well, I can't even begin to understand the logic that gets you there. Let's try it this way: do you think modern medicine makes humans "lazy and craven", because we're not all dying of untreated bacterial infections out of ignorance? We're all throwing ourselves at the mercy of doctors - we don't get medicine, unless we're trained.

 

People have moral obligations. People breach their moral obligations all the time. This isn't an "absolutist" position, anymore than saying that people have legal obligations not to carelessly risk others well-being is absolutist. 

 

And the jerkass god argument works differently: because jerkass god has to create a world where there's suffering first. Even if you could come up with some argument suffering is a virtue - which is stupid, but let's pretend it's not - jerkass god is on the hook for creating a world that has it in the first place. 

@In Exile:  I absolutely believe people worship doctors.  Doctor's don't "save lives" they extend them (a not insignificant good in itself).  What are doctors saving your life from?  Dying.  So - you won't die?  Of course that's false.  You just won't die "right now".  This misconception leads to a general populace incapable of dealing with death on very profound levels.  Yes, people are craven.  From YOLO - to huddling in churches once old age creeps in.

 

As for medicine making the species weaker.  In very cold terms it does.  Nature culls the weak.  The weak survive because of medicine (which, mostly comes from nature to begin with).  This is a good and necessary thing (not because it is writ true in the universe, but out of my belief).  Vaccinations, doctors, meds, etc. etc. all great advances of the human race... often too abused and misused just like everything else we do.  The more medicine you use - the weaker the species becomes - the more medicine you need until you're living entirely by artificial means.

 

Assuming a creator - you work on the assumption that you are the only thing in the universe worth having a life.  The universe doesn't function without entropy.  There is no free will without entropy.  Had the universe popped into existence exactly as it is now - with us here, never dying/aging/changing - are you telling me THAT is the universe you want?  Cause I think that's pretty damn selfish.  

 

You suffer - because things happen in the universe that aren't about you.  Bacteria and viruses are about bacteria and viruses... flood and earthquakes are about world building... dying is about getting out of the way for something new.  None of it is wrong/bad/evil.  As for the things humans do to each other.  That's humanities fault - blaming "God" or "Superman" is - to me - childlike thought.  

 

And it IS absolutist... you can not provide any proof, if required, that any such obligations to moral or legal duties exists outside of human invention.  I - actually happen to agree with you (not about Superman, or this particular instance - but in general) - but I don't try to be moral, or obey the law, because I believe it is required of me, I do it because I believe it is right.  Proving it to others... is not something I concern myself with.

[Paragon Gabriel]

I found the trailer to be all around badass! Ben Affleck has seriously impressed me as Batman. I think he will do a great job as him, possibly better than Christian Bale (who was more a better as Bruce Wayne).

 

Though can anyone explain this scene to me.

 

 

Is this simply a Joker reference? The armor and the lance just makes me wonder what it is about.

[LPPrince]

Is this simply a Joker reference? The armor and the lance just makes me wonder what it is about.

 

Joker killed Robin by this point in time in this universe.

[Fast Jimmy]

So some contribution that we are forced to give absolves us from the moral obligation to do more? Seems like an arbitrary limit to force the argument that Superman should do more, but we don't have to.

He should do SOMETHING. Saying that he doesn't owe the world anything is asinine. He may not owe 24 hours a day, 365 days a year to solving mankind's problems, but he is obligated to show up and save drowning people who no one else could save if it costs him nothing more than 20 minutes of his time.

[Paragon Gabriel]

Joker killed Robin by this point in time in this universe.

 

Aaaah, so that's what it was about.

 

Thanks!

[AresKeith]

Joker killed Robin by this point in time in this universe.

Maybe they're going a certain storyline lol

[Medhia_Nox]

@Fast Jimmy:  Why is it asinine?   I can say that "I" owe the world something - because I can be the arbiter of what I may, or may not, owe the world. 

 

On what authority do you call upon to determine what a person owes to the world? 

[Fast Jimmy]

@In Exile: I absolutely believe people worship doctors. Doctor's don't "save lives" they extend them (a not insignificant good in itself). What are doctors saving your life from? Dying. So - you won't die? Of course that's false. You just won't die "right now". This misconception leads to a general populace incapable of dealing with death on very profound levels. Yes, people are craven. From YOLO - to huddling in churches once old age creeps in.

As for medicine making the species weaker. In very cold terms it does. Nature culls the weak. The weak survive because of medicine (which, mostly comes from nature to begin with). This is a good and necessary thing (not because it is writ true in the universe, but out of my belief). Vaccinations, doctors, meds, etc. etc. all great advances of the human race... often too abused and misused just like everything else we do. The more medicine you use - the weaker the species becomes - the more medicine you need until you're living entirely by artificial means.

Assuming a creator - you work on the assumption that you are the only thing in the universe worth having a life. The universe doesn't function without entropy. There is no free will without entropy. Had the universe popped into existence exactly as it is now - with us here, never dying/aging/changing - are you telling me THAT is the universe you want? Cause I think that's pretty damn selfish.

You suffer - because things happen in the universe that aren't about you. Bacteria and viruses are about bacteria and viruses... flood and earthquakes are about world building... dying is about getting out of the way for something new. None of it is wrong/bad/evil. As for the things humans do to each other. That's humanities fault - blaming "God" or "Superman" is - to me - childlike thought.

And it IS absolutist... you can not provide any proof, if required, that any such obligations to moral or legal duties exists outside of human invention. I - actually happen to agree with you (not about Superman, or this particular instance - but in general) - but I don't try to be moral, or obey the law, because I believe it is required of me, I do it because I believe it is right. Proving it to others... is not something I concern myself with.

This entire argument is nonsense.

Medicine saves people who would die earlier than they would have otherwise. If a storms hits and impales a village's best warrior/hunter with a branch, this is not "culling the weak." If a wise leader catches a common cold, it is not making the tribe stronger if he is killed.

If medicine makes us weak, than so does food. Civilization could not sustain itself if not for modern agrarian technology and food preservation techniques. In fact, farmers are unnatural becausw hey grow food, which allows weak humans and strong alike to eat off the fruit of the land equally.

Only people who can hunt down a wooly mammoth to feed and clothe themselves are "worthy." But then... hunting for a tribe enables weakness, as it implies there are others at home who are not being "tested" by nature. Everyone should hunt and if they are too weak/young/old to keep up, then they should starve.

But wait... working together enables weakness. One strong hunter could compensate for the weaker ones. So only hynters who are able to take down their prey, fight off any competing predators and also meet all of their own water, clothing and shelter needs is fit to survive.

In fact, needing clothing, shelter, tools and weapons makes someone weak... nature should only allow those who are able to take care of all their needs without intelligence or technology. Then they will be deemed by nature to survive... and the human race would be extinct.



You logic is so flawed it is a joke. By allowing "weak" elements of our society, we have accomplished space flight, split the atom and have made the world small enough that people on opposite sides of the planet can talk as easily as next door neighbors. A person's value to society is exponentially more worthwhile than if they are completely immune to disease. Intelligence, creativity, drive, passion, resourcefulness, leadership... these qualities are infinitely more important to a society who has evolved beyond cavemen. Overcoming "nature" is not the highest test of humanity, it was simply the price of admission to a much larger calling in the universe.

So back to the point - Superman is not doing humanity a favor by not saving innocent people from death.

[Jaison1986]

Ok, here is my take on this trailer.

 

- I still don't buy this batman. Ben is just way too stoic. Half of the scenes, he looks like he is constipated. And seriously, another origin flashback? That does nothing but steal screentime.

 

- My god, this Luthor is even worse then I thought. Not only Jesse looks nothing like the character he is supposed to portray, he acts like an whiny insecure brat in all the scenes that show him. Those idiots should have brought Bryan Craston. Damn good actor and would make an much more mature Luthor.

 

- Gadot still looks like an skinny supermodel rather then an bombing amazon warrior godess. Other then that, there is nothing I can say about her since her screentime in the trailer is of less then 5 seconds.

 

- The plot seems to be too dramatic for it's own good. Unlike avengers, this has no build up and the events are happening all too quickly. Man of steel had the virtue of the movie giving us enough time to become confortable with Henry portrail of superman. This one seems to just toss the characters at our face and hope we just like them out of the blue. Same happened with Vision in age of Ultron.

 

- Wait, did superman just used heat vision at batman? He does know this will kill his squishy human body, right? Or the no killing policy has been tossed out of the window entirely? I can understand Zod since he gave superman no choice, but here it's just out of nowhere.

[Fast Jimmy]

@Fast Jimmy: Why is it asinine? I can say that "I" owe the world something - because I can be the arbiter of what I may, or may not, owe the world.

On what authority do you call upon to determine what a person owes to the world?

Because everyone is part of the world. Someone who says they owe the world nothing doesn't deserve a place in it.

[Medhia_Nox]

@Fast Jimmy:  Fascinating - you still didn't answer my question however.  By what authority do you make all these claims?  You certainly can't prove anything you're claiming scientifically - so, you cannot appeal to science.  

 

Morality is an invention - and is great for governing ones self.  By what measure do you feel the right to govern someone else - and why should they feel compelled to listen?

[Sully13]

I found the trailer to be all around badass! Ben Affleck has seriously impressed me as Batman. I think he will do a great job as him, possibly better than Christian Bale (who was more a better as Bruce Wayne).

 

Though can anyone explain this scene to me.

 

 

Is this simply a Joker reference? The armor and the lance just makes me wonder what it is about.

JASON TODD. read a book...  

[DarthSliver]

Since when did helping or saving people require super-powers? Send your money to save those starving kids I keep seeing on television instead of spending it on video games. Or send it to those abused pets that Sarah Mclachlan keeps talking about. And if you're doing that already, *shrug* you can always do more (dedicate life to medical professions, community services, etc...). Don't pretend you can't. We put limits on how much we help others all the time.

Not all charities are legit, some if not most are a scam. 

[Paragon Gabriel]

JASON TODD. read a book...  

 

Haha, it was a bit of a "derp" moment for me, since I didn't see the "R" symbol before Prince said Robin is dead.

 

I just thought it was some random armor at first.

[Sully13]

Haha, it was a bit of a "derp" moment for me, since I didn't see the "R" symbol before Prince said Robin is dead.

 

I just thought it was some random armor at first.

 

 

 

And you call your self a Basment dwelling Virgin. for shame.

[Paragon Gabriel]

 

And you call your self a Basment dwelling Virgin. for shame.

 

 

Waah!? Since when have I said such?

[DarthSliver]

Maybe they're going a certain storyline lol

 

Arkham Knight, next villian for the Standalone Batman movie

 

Anyone who played the game or seen the story knows what I refer to.