221 réponses à ce sujet

[ZipZap2000]

Sidequel. Prequel. New Galaxy. Alternate Universe. Has everyone forgotten that it's not confirmed to be a sequel yet?

[XCopperCrowX]

Sidequel. Prequel. New Galaxy. Alternate Universe. Has everyone forgotten that it's not confirmed to be a sequel yeI

I really am hoping it's not going to be a sidequel.  Truly, I'm ready to move on from the Reaper threat.

Prequel... maybe... But I don't want to hear about the damn Reapers again.

[XCopperCrowX]

Here's a random thought, let's say the next game takes place in the 'not too distant future,'  Who's to say they don't set the direction of the game based off of a questionnaire like they did in the beginning of ME3 when asked 'who died: Kaiden or Ashley?' 

They could ask about what ending did you choose,who did you choose; Geth, Quarians, or both?  Did you get Krogans Genophage or no?

 

Various things to help create the experience in the next game.

[InWeirdPeril]

Here's a random thought, let's say the next game takes place in the 'not too distant future,'  Who's to say they don't set the direction of the game based off of a questionnaire like they did in the beginning of ME3 when asked 'who died: Kaiden or Ashley?' 

They could ask about what ending did you choose,who did you choose; Geth, Quarians, or both?  Did you get Krogans Genophage or no?

 

Various things to help create the experience in the next game.

 

I think that would be a good idea in general, but also problematic because it's a new "hero".

But, something like DA:I Keep could help with that.

[DudeMcPersonMan]

Honestly, I just don't get the hate for Mass Effect 3's storyline. Apart from the ending being bittersweet at best, it's a freaking masterpiece the entire rest of the way through. The Destroy ending is looking like it's being groomed to be the canon ending, and there's only one really big thing I disliked about it (the fate of the Geth) - but that can be retconned or written around, just like when they changed the mass relays from "totally destroyed" to "badly damaged". Think about it, if the mass relays were not destroyed, perhaps the Geth survived as well in some form.

 

Honestly, though, I'm ready to move on from Sheppard and the Reapers. They had a great trilogy - some bumps needed to be ironed out in the end, but it was still a great trilogy. Can't wait for Mass Effect 4.

[InWeirdPeril]

I agree. I loved it too, except for the ending.

And to be honest, I don't get why some people have to get their way and only that.

 

If they can come up with something to give a bit of clarity to the fans who still dislike the endings, by not writing new ones mind you, but by going a bit more into the aftermath of them and showing that things will be alright eventually.

 

Or something for those that want no reference at all

 

Or even for those that only want some vague reference.

 

It is neither impossible nor would it be that time consuming if it is a short sequence at the beginning or genesis style comic. If they make it entirely optional.

 

Hell, TonyMac and I came up with some bittersweet idea yesterday that would work wonders in a scenario that is a bit into the future.

Flashbacks of the aftermath that the LI is having while attending Shepards memorial. And either through the date of the gravestone, defined through the flashbacks or the new Hero attending the Memorial (knowing that XX years have passed) would indicate that Shepard lived to an old age afterwards. With the (maybe now old) LI saying a final goodbye. Now that is bittersweet, would not impact the new game even in the slightest and would put the characters to rest in a proper way.

That is for the Destroy ending.

You can easily twist that by having the old crew go through stories of their adventures.

Afterwards we could have the Boy ask the Stargazer at the memorial again if all that was true. And he now can answer "Yes, but it was a long time ago".

 

And if we can come up with something like that... BW can come up with even better stuff.

 

Like I said, stuff like that would not draw much resources from the new game, it would mend things with fans and people who want a fresh start as well.

Optional... in a game full of choice. To me it makes sense.

[Farangbaa]

I don't get the hate for the ending either.

 

Yep, it's space magic. Just like essence, the Cipher, element zero, the almost complete lack of Asians in the MEU, the Reapers, the ressurrection of Space Jesus by a woman in a frigging catsuit, etc, etc, etc. And how else did you expect to defeat the Reapers? With a warp and your pistol?

 

[KaiserShep]

I don't think it's so much the space magic stuff, but rather the unsatisfying way that the story concludes. It's very much like the Matrix Revolutions in that it's very anticlimactic and ends with some kind of negotiation with an obnoxious character, which can also come off as contradictory if you play the trilogy a certain way. The Catalyst's words are pretty hollow if it's blathering on about this created vs. creator crap and you've resolved a 300 year old conflict peacefully. It seems to me that the story plays out more coherently if you play a non-import game.

[Farangbaa]

We've been over this before. Even if Geth-Guarian peace is eternal, it does not disprove the Catalyst's statement.

 

All organics will create synthetics.

 

Keyword here is all. It doesn't matter if the Geth and Quarians hug each other now. Sometime somewhere someone will create AI again and **** starts again.

All instances of AI in the game, every single one of them, at least kills it's (direct) creators (or 99% of them) up to and including the Catalyst. It's not as if the conflict is pulled out of thin air in the last few minutes of the game. If you think that's so, you haven't been paying attention (an IT favourite, I know ). There's a reason the creation of the Geth by the Quarians was illegal. The galaxy knew of this conflict, just like we in real life are aware of it's dangers. and have been talking about it for a century in academic circles.

[InWeirdPeril]

Not getting something or simple disagreeing is just fine. Everyone has their own opinion. What I meant is, that I dont get that when someone disagrees, that they try to actively to keep others from also getting what they hope for even though it would not impact them in the slightest if it is an entirely Optional thing and not mandatory.

[Iakus]

I don't think it's so much the space magic stuff, but rather the unsatisfying way that the story concludes. It's very much like the Matrix Revolutions in that it's very anticlimactic and ends with some kind of negotiation with an obnoxious character, which can also come off as contradictory if you play the trilogy a certain way. The Catalyst's words are pretty hollow if it's blathering on about this created vs. creator crap and you've resolved a 300 year old conflict peacefully. It seems to me that the story plays out more coherently if you play a non-import game.

All true.  But for me there's more.

 

The endings are, to me, horrific.  Every single one of them.  EC tried to sugar-coat them, but  failed miserably as far as I'm concerned.  I came away from the game thinking that in the end, Shepard became something worse than Saren.  Which leaves me with no interest in pursuing another story in a setting Shepard helped shape.

[Iakus]

Here's a random thought, let's say the next game takes place in the 'not too distant future,'  Who's to say they don't set the direction of the game based off of a questionnaire like they did in the beginning of ME3 when asked 'who died: Kaiden or Ashley?' 

They could ask about what ending did you choose,who did you choose; Geth, Quarians, or both?  Did you get Krogans Genophage or no?

 

Various things to help create the experience in the next game.

 

But we're not talking about just individuals who lived or died, but whole worlds, even whole species.  We're talking about changes to the face of the galaxy, literally.

[InWeirdPeril]

But we're not talking about just individuals who lived or died, but whole worlds, even whole species.  We're talking about changes to the face of the galaxy, literally.

 

If you dont want to play in a galaxy that was shaped by events of the trilogy, you are probably in luck. Since they will set it in a different one, of that I am damn sure.

But, for those of us that want some kind of amends/bridge from the trilogy that only happens when you play/see/import stuff that is optional and you can skip... why not allow it for those that want it? It would have no impact on your experience if they come up with some clever writing. Not saying that would happen, but if it would, would you really be opposed to that?

[Iakus]

If you dont want to play in a galaxy that was shaped by events of the trilogy, you are probably in luck. Since they will set it in a different one, of that I am damn sure.

But, for those of us that want some kind of amends/bridge from the trilogy that only happens when you play/see/import stuff that is optional and you can skip... why not allow it for those that want it? It would have no impact on your experience if they come up with some clever writing. Not saying that would happen, but if it would, would you really be opposed to that?

This isn't about what's wanted, it's about what's practical.  Even if there was an ending I loved, I don' think it would be feasible to continue to import.  ME3 was already cracking under the imported choices.  So many important were ignored or trivialized for the sake of telling a single story.

 

Like I pointed out, it would be impossible to have a krogan a quarian, or a geth as a major character or a companion, because tehy might no longer exist.  So a backup character would be needed.  How expensive would it be to have two different fully voiced characters playing the exact same role in a story?  Look at what happended to Ashley and Kaidan.

 

Similarly, the state of the galaxy as a whole will be very different depending both on ending choice and ending EMS.  Short of canonizing a choice, I don't see how they can address that at all in a way that does the magnitude of the chocie justice. 

 

Dragon Age is keeping importing going mainly by keeping the changes localized, and moving from nation to nation and hero to hero for each game.  Even then I don't know how much longer they can keep doing that.  Mass Effect screwed up by having the ending affecting the entire galaxy.  There's really nowhere left to go, unless they want to admit they frakked up and change galaxies. 

And for that, just look at SWTOR, which canonized the stories of Revan and the Exile.  Not many people were too happy with that.

[dreamgazer]

If everyone is lacking circuits and glowing eyes, then the Synthesis ending is false.

Why? Synthesis apparently unlocks all the secrets of physiology. Surely they can turn the green lights off.

[InWeirdPeril]

This isn't about what's wanted, it's about what's practical.  Even if there was an ending I loved, I don' think it would be feasible to continue to import.  ME3 was already cracking under the imported choices.  So many important were ignored or trivialized for the sake of telling a single story.

 

Like I pointed out, it would be impossible to have a krogan a quarian, or a geth as a major character or a companion, because tehy might no longer exist.  So a backup character would be needed.  How expensive would it be to have two different fully voiced characters playing the exact same role in a story?  Look at what happended to Ashley and Kaidan.

 

Similarly, the state of the galaxy as a whole will be very different depending both on ending choice and ending EMS.  Short of canonizing a choice, I don't see how they can address that at all in a way that does the magnitude of the chocie justice. 

 

Dragon Age is keeping importing going mainly by keeping the changes localized, and moving from nation to nation and hero to hero for each game.  Even then I don't know how much longer they can keep doing that.  Mass Effect screwed up by having the ending affecting the entire galaxy.  There's really nowhere left to go, unless they want to admit they frakked up and change galaxies. 

And for that, just look at SWTOR, which canonized the stories of Revan and the Exile.  Not many people were too happy with that.

 

Allright then, Imma take that as a yes then? You are opposed to it still? I ask because the answer kind of went past the question. Which was not aimed at practical. Well, that's your prerogative I suppose.

[Vazgen]

I believe Bioware had already stated that save import system is a mess, because they have to deal with way too many variables. That was in relation to DA Keep system. I think it will be the closest to the save import we get for new ME.

[InWeirdPeril]

I believe Bioware had already stated that save import system is a mess, because they have to deal with way too many variables. That was in relation to DA Keep system. I think it will be the closest to the save import we get for new ME.

 

'tis better than nothing I suppose. But then again, they also said it might be a good idea to keep those ME3 saves.

Speculation can be fun, but this is getting ridiculous. I really hope they clear things up and soon so this mindless guessing/wishing can stop and the inevitably dissapointed people (which I am guessing to be part off, if they try to sell me a reboot but call it a side-/sequel with no love for the trilogy) can try to move on.

[Iakus]

Allright then, Imma take that as a yes then? You are opposed to it still? I ask because the answer kind of went past the question. Which was not aimed at practical. Well, that's your prerogative I suppose.

I guess that is a yes, then.  Because I don't see how they can do that without opening up a huge can of worms concerning canonicity, personal or otherwise..

[InWeirdPeril]

I guess that is a yes, then.  Because I don't see how they can do that without opening up a huge can of worms concerning canonicity, personal or otherwise..

 

That is why I kept the question hypothetical the way it was and was explicitly saying "It would have no impact on your experience" and "optional".

But if you want to deny people their cake even then...  like I said, your prerogative. I for one, still have, quickly fading mind you, hope that BW will have that one moment, where they see how to make things work for almost everyone Also, why I wrote to probably be one of the dissapointed ones because I think I will give them too much credit in the end.

[Iakus]

That is why I kept the question hypothetical the way it was and was explicitly saying "It would have no impact on your experience" and "optional".

But if you want to deny people their cake even then...  like I said, your prerogative.

 

That's just it, though, I don't think your hypothetical is possible.  It would impact my experience.  I don't see how this can possibly be optional, unless there a "none of the above" option to check as far as imports go.

 

Not a "default" no-import setting, a "None of the Above, Let Me Headcanon My Own" choice.

 

And again, this still doesn't address major hurdles like the races.  How can that be optional and have no impact on the experience without sinking a lot of zots into the game, and perhaps the franchise going forward?

[InWeirdPeril]

That's just it, though, I don't think your hypothetical is possible.  It would impact my experience.  I don't see how this can possibly be optional, unless there a "none of the above" option to check as far as imports go.

 

Not a "default" no-import setting, a "None of the Above, Let Me Headcanon My Own" choice.

 

And again, this still doesn't address major hurdles like the races.  How can that be optional and have no impact on the experience without sinking a lot of zots into the game, and perhaps the franchise going forward?

 

Hm, I should have been more clear maybe. I thought it would imply a "none of the above" option. My bad. It is what I meant by optional.

 

And I agree with you, would the new game play in the same galaxy, it would be be hard to ignore the choices.

But I think it is pretty clear by now it wont. Keeping that in mind, if the game starts off either directly after ME3 ended OR a couple of years in the future, it would be possible that some have survived. I can't remember any choice that would insta-kill any race within a few seconds. Well, except the geth maybe. But even that could be circumvented by having a freak accident occour that gets them out while they flee to the new galaxy. What I am trying to say with that is, that it is possible to have those races in a different galaxy. Just not in that abundance we got in the trilogy. It would not realy impact the new story. If you import the save, they could make references to trilogy. If you dont import, they just dont know and wont react the same way. And if it will be a sequel, having the same races will lead to at least referencing none trilogy specific lore no matter what. This ist just a quick example though. Like I said, the question was for a hypothetical scenario that they actually do find a way to do all the options.

 

Don't get me wrong though, I do get your point. And when I say I wish for some story bit of the aftermath and maybe a bit more. I mean only the characters. What they do afterwards. And that could be entirely optional for those that want it and have no real impact on the "new" galaxy.

 

In the end, I think one of two things will happen.

1.) Either we will sigh and go "I knew they would take the easy way out"

2.) or we will be completly caught of guard and they found a way to make things really work out ok.

 

But I have no hope for anything in the middle.

[Iakus]

 I'm highly skeptical that Mass Effect will take place in a galaxy other than the Milky Way.  Given what a tiny fraction of the galaxy we have seen so far, relocating to Andromada or whatever is tantamount ot admitting they frakked up so bad that the setting isn't salvageable and they have to relocate.  I mean, it could happen.  But the implication will be clear to everyone.  So more than likely they'll try to dig themselves out rather than face that.  So the choices will somehow have to be dealt with.

 

Or, preferably (to me, anyway), ignored.

[GimmeDaGun]

To OP: Why would they do that? ME3 is part of the saga, or the canon. Ignoring it would be totally stupid. 

 

As for the sequel problem. It's not the endings that make the sequel thing difficult, but the other "smaller" scale decisions. There are just too many alternative states. The case of the endings on its own would be pretty simple: make one of them canon (I'm thinking about Destroy). Lets take a look at them one by one:

 

Synthesis: A peaceful utopia. Everyone got what they wanted more or less: the Intelligence, the reapers, organics and synthetics, even Cerberus. It's an ascension for all living and non-living beings. Singularity at its best. If you chose that outcome, the ME-saga stops there for you, since you can't make a "happier" sci-fi ending than that (lets not start the whole free will issue and Shepard dying thing - these are secondary in this case). It would be pretty hard to continue the story from this point. 

 

Control: The rise of a new power which would look out for or eventually destroy the galaxy. Since the reapers and the rebooted/Shepardised intelligence does live you just can't bring the story forward. The reaper's presence takes away the opportunity for a sequel: they would either eliminate all possible threats or start another war with the population of the galaxy and destroy it in a whim. So if you chose this one, the saga would end for you here. 

 

Annihilation ending: Worst case scenario (along with low ems destroy). Impossible to continue the saga, since everything you know of the ME-galaxy is pretty much gone. 

 

Destroy (high ems): Clean slate. The reapers and all the AI are gone. Every species survive except for the Geth and the other AI (lets face it, if it wasn't for the whole Legion thing they would be nothing more than threat, despite the peace option). Shepard being dead or alive would not change a thing (he's story is over). The galaxy is intact (even if scarred by the conflict with the reapers). So it's the most logical option for a sequel. The other three endings could be possibilities too of course, but they would be way too far fetched and a lot less logical. Also you have to canonise one ending in order to make a sequel work. 

[The Twilight God]

Sidequel. Prequel. New Galaxy. Alternate Universe. Has everyone forgotten that it's not confirmed to be a sequel yet?

It is confirmed to be a sequel.