978 réponses à ce sujet

[JeffZero]

<snip for post brevity's sake>

 

It's true, there are some dire holes in it all, yeah. I think the thing with the husks is the only aspect of Synthesis, per my chosen interpretation of it, that gets me. That's less getting-to-me than any other ending, I think, mainly because Destroy is so contrived and I feel like skipping on any visual representation of EDI (my favorite squadmate, go figure based on my ending choice, right?) and the geth kicking the bucket is awful, even though I'll admit the husk thing is... pretty damn weird, just the same. But I mean, when Extended Cut released, and I decided I could be content, even satisfied, with some of the endings if I went ahead and filled in the big blanks myself, well, it keeps me OK going forward. I can zero in on the aspects I genuinely like -- and the emotional resonance of my favorite squadmate breaking down a little bit during the last lines of her monologue is a top moment in the series for me, so it works.

 

I really have gotten the impression it's more likely the Reapers were removed of their former (probable...?) sentience in Control and Synthesis, though. It seems to me that Shepard usurping their will, their drive, and replacing it outright, is the equivalent to CTRL+ALT+DEL on their system software. And Synthesis has, similarly, always given me the vibe that the various races of the galaxy are granted access to the knowledge of all those stored-up previous races whilst also gaining some mystical, impossible-to-explain understanding from the base synthetic element therein. But I realize now, as I type this, that you're right, that there is a lot of grey in there. My interpretations and someone else's can be vehemently opposing in this matter. It's not like saying, "Garrus is Archangel." 

[Mordokai]

All I know for sure is I don't want to have a cybertronic conversation with my toaster every time I want breakfast. Or... to have circuitry in my bread, for that matter.

 

This seems like good as any time to post this:

 

From the Journal of Javik, Last of the Protheans in a Synthesized world

 

Day 1

Today, a shambling mutated insectoid mockery of my race shambled up to me and asked me in a distorted voice to explain how to have sex with another of its kind. This morning when I attempted to take a ****, I found myself unable to remove my pants, as they have fused to my ass. Attempts to remove them were more painful than you can imagine, and I am force to let the turds force their way down my pants legs. Also the turds have circuits.

I cannot stop screaming.

Day 36

The Geth will not stop asking me such inane philisophical questions as "What if when I power down for repairs, when I return from stasis, I am no longer myself?" and "What if the spectrum of electromagnetic radiation my optics processes produces a different output for me than it does for you? What appears to be magenta to me may appear to be green to you."

I have noticed that Joker has been spending more time with them, and his eyes are often bloodshot. I am concerned that our pilot may not be meeting his sleep requirements.

Also, someone keeps stealing the supply of Prothe-os I kept in my stasis pod. When I found out who is responsible I will murder them.

Day 47

This morning, I awoke to discover that I can hear all of Joker's thoughts. All of them, including the ones he has while rutting with his synthetic toy.

All of my attempts to kill myself have been unsuccessful. Last night I attempted to electrocute myself with a hair dryer in my bath, but the hair dryer turned itself off in self defense. The day before I attempted to strap high explosives to myself and hurl my body into the void, but the bombs began arguing existentialist philosophy with the airlock mechanism. Also, I can now apparently breathe in space.

Shepard. I hate you, Shepard.

Day 53

Today, I met a husk with a piece of paper with the number "27" scrawled on it, taped to its head. Even though our beers screamed and begged not to be consumed, we drank for several hours at the bar, trying to ignore the bar itself yelling at the beer to shut the **** up and the glasses from which we drank the beer complaining that my lips are too slimy.

The husk told me a tale of woe, how it spends every day remembering what it was to be human and how it can no longer feel or love, but is doomed to suffer eternal remembrance of what it was once, its sorrows spiced by the joy it feels from everyone else through the hive mind. Apparently, I can have sex with husks.

My latest suicide attempt has ended in failure. I convinced the Normandy's waste processing systems to crush my skull, only to wake up a few hours later with a splitting headache. According to the door to the women's lavatory, I "reverted to my last save point".

I do not remember entering the women's lavatory. I had previously assumed the doors cannot actually open.

Day 71

Today, a Geth Prime approached me and asked for instruction on the use of the confused, mangled mass of psuedo-genitalia and wires grafted to its crotch. As this is the ninth time this has happened, I am beginning to suspect that this is some sort of a joke among the Consensus.

I am not amused.

Day 234

The plague known as "synthesis" teaches us new horrors each day. Every time we think the peak of our suffering has been reached, we find that new and more terrifying fates await us. I woke up this morning and my left foot is now a blender. The human woman Williams gouged her eyes out this morning, but would not stop screaming that she can still see. We have chained her to the bulkhead for her own safety. If I had a shred of my honor left, I would hijack the ship and crash it into a moon, but I no longer believe that death is any release.

Last night, a coffee maker in the galley attempted to mate with me.

 

Day 312

Today I have been informed that I am a "racist" because I dared to observe that all Reapers look the same.

They do all look the same.

[JeffZero]

Blegh. The worst part is that that's genuinely funny. I need to start writing geth-stare-woefully-from-hell fan fiction.

[RiptideX1090]

It's true, there are some dire holes in it all, yeah. I think the thing with the husks is the only aspect of Synthesis, per my chosen interpretation of it, that gets me. That's less getting-to-me than any other ending, I think, mainly because Destroy is so contrived and I feel like skipping on any visual representation of EDI (my favorite squadmate, go figure based on my ending choice, right?) and the geth kicking the bucket is awful, even though I'll admit the husk thing is... pretty damn weird, just the same. But I mean, when Extended Cut released, and I decided I could be content, even satisfied, with some of the endings if I went ahead and filled in the big blanks myself, well, it keeps me OK going forward. I can zero in on the aspects I genuinely like -- and the emotional resonance of my favorite squadmate breaking down a little bit during the last lines of her monologue is a top moment in the series for me, so it works.

 

I really have gotten the impression it's more likely the Reapers were removed of their former (probable...?) sentience in Control and Synthesis, though. It seems to me that Shepard usurping their will, their drive, and replacing it outright, is the equivalent to CTRL+ALT+DEL on their system software. And Synthesis has, similarly, always given me the vibe that the various races of the galaxy are granted access to the knowledge of all those stored-up previous races whilst also gaining some mystical, impossible-to-explain understanding from the base synthetic element therein. But I realize now, as I type this, that you're right, that there is a lot of grey in there. My interpretations and someone else's can be vehemently opposing in this matter. It's not like saying, "Garrus is Archangel." 

 

Exactly. I got into an argument with someone who was a Synthesis supporter a while back, I forget his name... but I explained I didn't like Synthesis, and his rebuttal was that I simply didn't read enough Asimov and that I was a Luddite.

 

Except... both of those aren't true. The problem with all of the endings, and not just Synthesis is they are all open to interpretation. They all have these huge leaps of logic and you have to take a LOT on faith. Unfortunately this is taken to the point where the audience loses their suspension of disbelief, not just breaking it but outright obliterating it with one big thematically, technically and narratively incompressible mess. You can say we rebuild the geth in Destroy and it all works out... but that's just one interpretation. You can just as easily say killing all synthetic life and keeping them from returning is the right call and that's what happens. You can say Shepard will be a benevolent God Emperor that won't abuse his or her power, but we're never shown that for certain. You can say everyone in Synthesis is free and happy, but you can also say they're all indoctrinated because they're hooked up to the Reapers.

 

It's all open to interpretation. You say one thing, someone else says another, and neither is right and neither is wrong because neither side can really prove anything. It's just... a mess. A big, speculative mess.

[JeffZero]

Exactly. I got into an argument with someone who was a Synthesis supporter a while back, I forget his name... but I explained I didn't like Synthesis, and his rebuttal was that I simply didn't read enough Asimov and that I was a Luddite.

 

Except... both of those aren't true. The problem with all of the endings, and not just Synthesis is they are all open to interpretation. They all have these huge leaps of logic and you have to take a LOT on faith. Unfortunately this is taken to the point where the audience loses their suspension of disbelief, not just breaking it but outright obliterating it with one big thematically, technically and narratively incompressible mess. You can say we rebuild the geth in Destroy and it all works out... but that's just one interpretation. You can just as easily say killing all synthetic life and keeping them from returning is the right call and that's what happens. You can say Shepard will be a benevolent God Emperor that won't abuse his or her power, but we're never shown that for certain. You can say everyone in Synthesis is free and happy, but you can also say they're all indoctrinated because they're hooked up to the Reapers.

 

It's all open to interpretation. You say one thing, someone else says another, and neither is right and neither is wrong because neither side can really prove anything. It's just... a mess. A big, speculative mess.

 

Yep.

 

I even really like various sections of Extended Cut and I still completely agree with you. Speaks volumes.

[RiptideX1090]

Blegh. The worst part is that that's genuinely funny. I need to start writing geth-stare-woefully-from-hell fan fiction.

 

I lost it at "Prothe-os."

[N7Dom]

Synthesis=Kumbaya

[dreamgazer]

Exactly. I got into an argument with someone who was a Synthesis supporter a while back, I forget his name... but I explained I didn't like Synthesis, and his rebuttal was that I simply didn't read enough Asimov and that I was a Luddite.

 

Wulfie strikes again.  Needn't worry about that one.

 

Mass Effect 3 does borrow from Asimov's Foundation's Edge in the ending, though, thrown together with Contact. 

[ImaginaryMatter]

What's scarier than the simple husks gaining self awareness is the fused Reaper constructs regaining their sentience.

 

What happens when Tom the human arm cannon realizes he's grafted to Surly the Batarian? Talk about awkward.

 

What about all those heads in the mouth of the Praetorian?

[Mordokai]

What about all those heads in the mouth of the Praetorian?

Gangbang?

[RiptideX1090]

Wulfie strikes again.  Needn't worry about that one.

 

Mass Effect 3 does borrow from Asimov's Foundation's Edge in the ending, though, thrown together with Contact. 

 

I would truly be astounded if anyone on the ME team actually read Asimov. Personally, I don't think they did.

[dreamgazer]

I would truly be astounded if anyone on the ME team actually read Asimov. Personally, I don't think they did.

 

Why would you be astounded?

[RiptideX1090]

Why would you be astounded?

 

Because of how poorly written the Reaper's motives are. Because of how illogical or horrifying Synthesis could potentially be.

 

Actually, no, I redact my assertion. It's completely feasible they did read Asimov.

 

And somehow completely failed to take anything away from it other than "robots & cyborgs r awsume every1 shud want to b 1!"

 

Sorry, that's probably a bit unkind, but the whole thing just annoys me. God I wish we had something else to talk about other than these same old topics. I can't wait to start seeing new stuff about the next game if only to have something new to discuss.

[JeffZero]

Foundation and Contact are fantastic. Gosh, I love them.

 

Being able to talk about something new in the Mass Effect franchise sounds fantastic. Gosh, I love that concept.

[von uber]

Comparing leng to vasir is laughable. She would have made a much better antagonist in me3.

[the_last_krogan]

destroy

[themikefest]

Comparing leng to vasir is laughable. She would have made a much better antagonist in me3.

I agree. I like Vasir. Its unfortunate she couldn't had more of a role than what she had

[JeffZero]

I may be the single person in this entire fandom OK with Kai Leng.

 

...

 

No, wait. I know of a few people I introduced the game to who are cool with him.

 

As far as "posts actively on the BSN" levels of fandom, though... I am truly starting to suspect it's the case.

 

Edit: Nevermind. I google searched. There is an amazingly talented artist on dA with a much greater degree of Kai Leng enjoyment than I would ever claim to possess.

[RiptideX1090]

I may be the single person in this entire fandom OK with Kai Leng.

 

...

 

No, wait. I know of a few people I introduced the game to who are cool with him.

 

As far as "posts actively on the BSN" levels of fandom, though... I am truly starting to suspect it's the case.

 

Edit: Nevermind. I google searched. There is an amazingly talented artist on dA with a much greater degree of Kai Leng enjoyment than I would ever claim to possess.

 

Found that thing written by my friend on Kai Leng. He really illustrates why Leng was SUCH A missed opportunity. I was REALLY looking forward to him before ME3 came out because I was expecting something along these lines. What we got was... much less. Check it out if you like.

 

http://social.biowar...17/blog/212391/

[OPM_Lunacy]

Comparing leng to vasir is laughable. She would have made a much better antagonist in me3.

 

Can't argue with that, Leng is sometimes sooo derp: he kills Thane (trained assassin with amazing reflex) with a sword, and in the end game you can just slap him down, that's the easiest way to kill him. I sense a contradiction here...
At least Vasir is smart, her quotes are amazing, she looks far more dangerous than Kai Leng (He has a pony tail??) AND she is hard to kill 

 

Don't you dare judge me for saying all this

[lordbyro]

Red ending. Don't like to think I'll be half synthetic. I also don't like the idea only one man having all that control/ power.

Note: Sad to see Shepard is gone. I loved him. I'll always love male sommander Shepard. In the end, he breathed and then he still living on me ;-).
It will be difficult play Mass Effect "4" without Shepard. I don't know if I will buy the new game.

[lordbyro]

destroy

 

Me too!

In time: nice boty yours! ^^

[RiouHotaru]

Because of how poorly written the Reaper's motives are. Because of how illogical or horrifying Synthesis could potentially be.

 

Actually, no, I redact my assertion. It's completely feasible they did read Asimov.

 

And somehow completely failed to take anything away from it other than "robots & cyborgs r awsume every1 shud want to b 1!"

 

Sorry, that's probably a bit unkind, but the whole thing just annoys me. God I wish we had something else to talk about other than these same old topics. I can't wait to start seeing new stuff about the next game if only to have something new to discuss.

How poorly written the Reaper's motives are?  I dunno, it made perfect sense to me.  I realize that before Leviathan and the Extended Cut there were plenty of question-mark filled gaps, but that was the point of Leviathan.  It filled in the gaps.  Also, the Catalyst's logic is easy to understand if you remember that it's not operating on a system or morality as we understand it.  Very, very Blue And Orange.

 

As for Synthesis, I dunno, like any of the esoteric "transcendence"-style endings (Deus Ex and Invisible War come to mind, as does Alpha's Centauri Ascent to Transcendence Victory epilogue), there's always going to be that uncertain, uncomfortable element to it because of the idea of everyone being connected like that.  We can't reasonably fathom what such a unity is like.  Or how people would take to it.  But then, I prefered the original endings being completely open-ended because it left us and Bioware with more wiggle-room, but that's just me.

 

I wish there was more info as well.  At this point I think everything been's discussed to death, and the same old arguments are just looping around in circles.

[RiouHotaru]

On topic, originally I was a die-hard Destroyer.  I felt that the Reapers being permanently removed from the galactic equation was the best solution, and even though it would cost us the Geth and EDI, we could start over and begin anew without making the mistakes the people of the past did.  After all, the Catalyst said it himself.  Synthesis is inevitable, it's just a matter of crossing that gap of conflict between the beginning and the end.

 

But Synthesis as a whole still appeals because of the fact it is by all accounts a "best" ending.  A minimum of people die, the Reapers are forever free of the Catalyst, and peace galaxy-wide is finally achieved.  But it requires Shepard to sacrifice themselves, and simply hope things turn out alright.  Even as a player that's a bit of a leap of faith that's a bit much for me to take.  In-character it's even worse.

[Iakus]

 

But Synthesis as a whole still appeals because of the fact it is by all accounts a "best" ending.  A minimum of people die, the Reapers are forever free of the Catalyst, and peace galaxy-wide is finally achieved.  But it requires Shepard to sacrifice themselves, and simply hope things turn out alright.  Even as a player that's a bit of a leap of faith that's a bit much for me to take.  In-character it's even worse.

 

I find Synthesis is a "best ending" only because Bioware all but tells us "This is the best ending!  Take it!"  It has horrible implications for me:  That organics and synthetics are not worthy of existence, that they cannot be trusted to work out their differences on their own.  They must submit to the Qun be forcibly changed from what they are to meet the Catalyst's idea of "perfection".

 

To me, the Reapers backing off would be a "leap of faith"  That the galaxy has grown enough to find their own answers.  Synthesis to me is a lack of faith.