76 réponses à ce sujet

[Eveangaline]

The OGB is the result of the biggest decision we've had to make thus far in our Dragon Age journey and he should be treated with the respect he deserves, small cameo quests from past companions are all well and good as fan service, but the OGB is beyond that,

 

eeeeh, I think that's a bit of a matter of opinion. Honestly to me, the OGB choice never screamed "important decision" or even "real in game decision" it was just a button to let your character live if you didn't want to make the real important decision of who dies and how this effects the monarchy of ferelden. When we got told one of us would have to die against the archdemon no matter what I got hyped because the game was making you do a permanent death for you or a character you liked no matter what (and since alistair was my romance that time and he was the only other option, I really liked that I'd have to choose between us). I thought it was pretty cool Bioware was making us do this choice and I wondered how they would survive the fans complaining endlessly about it.

 

Then Morrigan comes in and I thought "Oh, they put in a 'let me live button' if you don't want to make the real decision" as she screamed "OBVIOUS GAME MECHANIC" in my face with the whole ritual

 

Honestly the reason I don't want the OGB to be too big a deal is because I don't want time and resources spent to awkwardly shove what seemed like an obvious "ok fans if you don't want to have to make a decision here's an out button" into the story, because I honestly think doing so might detract from it.

 

Obviously though there are people that thought it was a major decision and I hope something happens that can appease them and the people who saw it as just a "push this to not die" button.

[Vroom Vroom]

I imagine at the most the OGB would be an optional companion you can have in DA4 if you did the Dark Ritual in DA:O.

 

At the very least I'm thinking the OGB will serve as just an NPC that has insights and knowledge of the Old Gods and could provide us with some surprising information about them.

I share Urazz's line of thought on the matter. Another thing I have been thinking of is that maybe the OGB could end up being the boss in an optional quest in DA4 or beyond, how I see that working is that the quest is available for all players, but the boss changes based upon whether players did the Dark Ritual or not.

Bioware could also have DA4 or a later game cover the Sixth Blight and have Morrigan do the Dark Ritual with another Warden and have it to where the Dark Ritual always happens (Another Warden character agrees to it if you don't), they could even have the Sixth Blight be a subplot and not the main plot of the game to keep it from being too familiar to Origins. If Bioware did this then the following Dragon Age game would likely take place decades later so that the age of the OGB couldn't be discerned, a simple solution. 

[Elite Midget]

In the end it depends if Bioware wants to canonize the God Child like they canonized King Alistair and Leliana going off to serve as Sister Nightingale. Both seem to be Hardened versions as well due to the Novels and how Alistair seems very responsible as a King when you meet him in DA2 and how Leliana seems Hardened in what we've seen with DA:I so far.

[Shark17676]

I honestly think the devs kinda wrote themselves into a corner with that one...him possibly being half-elf or half-dwarf, him possibly having a father other than the male Warden (if the Warden was female, the father would have to be one of Alistair or Loghain), the fact that Morrigan can instead have a "regular" baby with the male Warden later...plus his creation being entirely optional to begin with.  It just seems like there's too many complications to write a major story arc around him.

[Elite Midget]

I honestly think the devs kinda wrote themselves into a corner with that one...him possibly being half-elf or half-dwarf, him possibly having a father other than the male Warden (if the Warden was female, the father would have to be one of Alistair or Loghain), the fact that Morrigan can instead have a "regular" baby with the male Warden later...plus his creation being entirely optional to begin with.  It just seems like there's too many complications to write a major story arc around him.

Unless, of course, they make a canonized version of events like how Alistair, no matter what, is canonically King as far as Bioware is concerned. If you have a file that says differently than you miss quite a bit of little extra stuff with nothing in return to make up for it.

 

While if you killed Leliana? Ignored outright in Novels and later Games. 

[dutch_gamer]

Unless, of course, they make a canonized version of events like how Alistair, no matter what, is canonically King as far as Bioware is concerned. If you have a file that says differently than you miss quite a bit of little extra stuff with nothing in return to make up for it.

 

While if you killed Leliana? Ignored outright in Novels and later Games. 

There already is a canonized version of events concerning the OGB. The OGB doesn't exist in Bioware's canon which is about having as little loose ends as possible between games. In Bioware's own canon the warden did the ultimate sacrifice.

 

And it doesn't even matter if Alistair is king as far as Bioware is concerned because Alistair wasn't king in DA2 if you failed to keep Alistair around at the end of DAO. That alone goes to show Bioware is not only sticking to one particular canon. And yes, Leliana is different but that may be because the developers simply had a change of heart later on regarding Leliana's full story. I can't see them having the change of heart with the OGB considering they have been pretty adamant about the OGB simply not happening if the player never did the dark ritual. And since it is likely the OGB will be addressed in DAI for the ones who did do the dark ritual, it is unlikely they somehow between now and release will make OGB canon for everyone. It just makes little to no sense for them to go back on their word this close to release and I really doubt they will.

[Eveangaline]

Unless, of course, they make a canonized version of events like how Alistair, no matter what, is canonically King as far as Bioware is concerned. If you have a file that says differently than you miss quite a bit of little extra stuff with nothing in return to make up for it.

 

While if you killed Leliana? Ignored outright in Novels and later Games. 

 

The "bioware cannon" is a female dalish elf warden who did the ultimate sacrifice rather than make an OGB.

[daveliam]

BioWare didn't canonize ANYTHING. They created a streamlined default with as little loose ends as possible for the convenience of people who are new to the series. Stop forcing your world-states on to other people please. Thank you.

 

They "canonized" a world state for the books and comics.  However, this state does not affect the state of the world for players who import games.

[Eveangaline]

BioWare didn't canonize ANYTHING. They created a streamlined default with as little loose ends as possible for the convenience of people who are new to the series. Stop forcing your world-states on to other people please. Thank you.

 

No one is forcing their world states on other people by aknowledging the staff has said there's certain decisions they see as canon https://twitter.com/...864515717873665

 

And that other states are more of a 'what if' https://twitter.com/...409998804221953

 

Honestly though I consider each run canon to itself and only itself, and obviously whatever worldstate you import will be canon for whatever run you are doing.

[CapivaRasgor]

But... The ritual was required to both keep the Warden alive and get the soul. He'd still be dead if she left.

 

Err.. yeah, that's pretty much what I meant. How the fact that if she didn't leave the Warden out of spite because he refused her the ritual could cause her to feel regret if he died, since she was already pregnant and could have performed the magical part of the ritual had she remained by his side.

[Elite Midget]

There already is a canonized version of events concerning the OGB. The OGB doesn't exist in Bioware's canon which is about having as little loose ends as possible between games. In Bioware's own canon the warden did the ultimate sacrifice.

 

And it doesn't even matter if Alistair is king as far as Bioware is concerned because Alistair wasn't king in DA2 if you failed to keep Alistair around at the end of DAO. That alone goes to show Bioware is not only sticking to one particular canon. And yes, Leliana is different but that may be because the developers simply had a change of heart later on regarding Leliana's full story. I can't see them having the change of heart with the OGB considering they have been pretty adamant about the OGB simply not happening if the player never did the dark ritual. And since it is likely the OGB will be addressed in DAI for the ones who did do the dark ritual, it is unlikely they somehow between now and release will make OGB canon for everyone. It just makes little to no sense for them to go back on their word this close to release and I really doubt they will.

Bioware hasn't outright denied  the OGB and there are 3 Default versions so you really cannot say 1 way or another.

 

And what do you get if you didn't make Alistair King or killed him off? Less content.

 

There's also the Leliana factor where her death is outright ignored and not even mentioned in the Novels or Later game(s). Ohgren also avoids death as well if you killed him in Origin and he still gets with his old flame to make a kid even if you don't do his Quest.

 

So Bioware has a history of ignoring certain choices in favor of plot and story progression.

[Eveangaline]

Bioware hasn't outright denied  the OGB and there are 3 Default versions so you really cannot say 1 way or another.

 

And what do you get if you didn't make Alistair King or killed him off? Less content.

 

There's also the Leliana factor where her death is outright ignored and not even mentioned in the Novels or Later game(s). Ohgren also avoids death as well if you killed him in Origin and he still gets with his old flame to make a kid even if you don't do his Quest.

 

So Bioware has a history of ignoring certain choices in favor of plot and story progression.

 

They have said that in 'their canon' the warden died. So no Dark Ritual. https://twitter.com/...864515717873665

And that playthroughs that differ from their canon is more of a 'what if' https://twitter.com/...409998804221953

 

So if they are going to force a canon on the players for plot and story progression, odds are it's that there is no OGB.

 

I hope they just make some different content for each choice so no one gets forced to have one or the other in their playthoughs if they don't want to.

[powerXmad]

I'm confused my warden romanced morrigan and she never got pregnant. The only way i know of for her to get pregnant is through the dark ritual

[Eveangaline]

I think you are overestimating the importance of "canon" to Bioware.

 

 

I'm not saying that they intend to force their canon on anyone or that they don't prioritize character agency, I'm just saying it's probably a pipe dream to imagine they'll canonize something that's the opposite of what they consider their canon.

[Elite Midget]

They have said that in 'their canon' the warden died. So no Dark Ritual. https://twitter.com/...864515717873665

And that playthroughs that differ from their canon is more of a 'what if' https://twitter.com/...409998804221953

 

So if they are going to force a canon on the players for plot and story progression, odds are it's that there is no OGB.

 

I hope they just make some different content for each choice so no one gets forced to have one or the other in their playthoughs if they don't want to.

Yet they have 3 Default files and 2 out of 3 of them don't have a Warden that died.

 

They didn't make it equal with Alistair or Leliana. Alistair being dead = Less Content and the such. Leliana always lives no matter what, so does Oghren. So not all choices are respected as Bioware tends to go for the more popular/most picked choice or ignoring choice if the plot and story they want to tell demands it.

[Eveangaline]

Yet they have 3 Default files and 2 out of 3 of them don't have a Warden that died.

 

They didn't make it equal with Alistair or Leliana. Alistair being dead = Less Content and the such. Leliana always lives no matter what, so does Oghren. So not all choices are respected as Bioware tends to go for the more popular/most picked choice or ignoring choice if the plot and story they want to tell demands it.

That first link isn't just talking about default files, it's asking them what they consider canon. I am aware not all choices are respected, I'm just saying that they overrode most choices to fit with their canon, whereas overriding to make the god baby canon would be overriding to make something be in contradiction to their canon.

 

I'm against forcing it one way or the other, and honestly I'm not worried they will. There's no indication they would or want to at all.

[Elite Midget]

And we all know that canon is quite flexible if Bioware wants it to be as they have contradicted and changed canon more than once to suit the story/plot as needed. 

[Eveangaline]

And we all know that canon is quite flexible if Bioware wants it to be as they have contradicted and changed canon more than once to suit the story/plot as needed. 

 

In theory but there's absolutely no indication they want to make the OGB canon or think it would better suit the story or plot. You said above their canon is that Alistair is king, if we're going into hypotheticals, they might change it so that Anora is the canon ruler.

[Elite Midget]

No indication that we know of and things do change. If they see merit in the ODB being an important character in later games than they will do that and make up an excuse for files that didn't do the DR. Maybe even having the Archdemon somehow ending up lost in the Fade and Morrigan finding its spirit there and forcing it into a child of hers.

 

That in turn could lead to those files, that didn't do the DR, to have a OGB that's more insane and the such due to the method being post-mortem, for the Archdemon, and forced and not a proper ritual or out of love.

[Eveangaline]

No indication that we know of and things do change. If they see merit in the ODB being an important character in later games than they will do that and make up an excuse for files that didn't do the DR. Maybe even having the Archdemon somehow ending up lost in the Fade and Morrigan finding its spirit there and forcing it into a child of hers.

 

I'm somewhat doubtful, as hasn't David Gaider said that the more games go on, the less they want the OGB to come up, since it will be more and more people each game who never played DAO and therefor don't care at all what the warden did? So throwing that in would just confuse them whereas the dead warden leaves no loose ends.

 

And they have repeatedly said over and over and over that they aren't going to force the OGB to be canon. We have literally no reason to think they would want it to be canon at all.

[Elite Midget]

I'm somewhat doubtful, as hasn't David Gaider said that the more games go on, the less they want the OGB to come up, since it will be more and more people each game who never played DAO and therefor don't care at all what the warden did? So throwing that in would just confuse them whereas the dead warden leaves no loose ends.

 

And they have repeatedly said over and over and over that they aren't going to force the OGB to be canon. We have literally no reason to think they would want it to be canon at all.

 

My edited part - That in turn could lead to those files, that didn't do the DR, to have a OGB that's more insane and the such due to the method being post-mortem, for the Archdemon, and forced and not a proper ritual or out of love.

 

Thus choice is still retained as you doing the DR or not would affect how the OGB turns out and what type of person they would be.