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Why do the Reapers avoid the Citadel?


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#226
Iakus

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See this is ultimately where we are disagreeing, the size of the reaper fleet. You go of the theoretical maximum numbers altered for some casualties and I'm estimating their size based on what they are able to do in the game.  If 15,000 reapers attacked Earth, no ships would have been able to escape, but they did.  If 15,000 reapers attacked Palaven they never would have been able to hold them, but they did.  The reapers in ME 3, the source of cannon we have and not the mythos that was built up in other works, reveals that the reapers are only capable of 2 major offensive action at one time while still having a significant force left to attack smaller colonies and disrupt their enemies movement.  Honestly, I put the combined size of their fleet at around 5,000 ships total based on it's ability to operate in the field.  If there are 50,000+ reapers then they can do whatever they want because they will have the ability to fire 1,000 dreadnaught killing shots every second of a battle.  But I don't see any evidence for that many ships in cannon, I know they have a mythos that built them up to be massive swarms, but that could just be the entire fleet moving from system to system which may be why it took hundreds of years to defeat the protheans.  If I remember right Javick was born long after the citadel fell but the protheans were still fighting back and still had interstellar travel, if they had 100,000 ships why didn't they just roll into every system and destroy their defense and leave a dozen ships behind to indoctrinate everyone on the planet?  They could have had the entire empire in 30 years, but they don't because they don't have the ability to be everywhere all the time. 5,000 ships is still a lot compared to 100 or 200 ships in a large fleet and enough to darken the skies of major population center. 

 

At this point were at a lock because if you honestly believe that they have 30,000, 50,000, or 100,000 ships sitting around doing nothing while ships are getting blown up in orbit of Palaven then their is nothing I can do to convince you.  Though I would question the intelligence of those reapers because that is a massive waste of resources and I wouldn't be surprised it they made many strategic and tactical errors, like leaving the citadel alone given how stupid one would have to be to have all those ships and not use them. 

And going by ME1 and ME2, a few hundred Reapers would be a reasonable assumption.  But then they made the stupid mistake of making the Leviathan of Dis a Reaper, rather than keeping it as a Farscape joke.  And further confirmed it in the Leviathan dlc.

 

That makes the Reapers in excess of a billion years old.  Which means, yeah, they could send a couple thousand Reapers to every homeworld and still have more than enough to take the Citadel with overwhelming force.  This makes their strategy throughout ME3 look like sheer incompetence on their part.  Massed organics are no longer a threat.  They're no longer even a paper cut.  Shepard wins because plot.

 

The problem is, you are looking for a rational answer behind what is happening in the game, when the in-game lore throws rationality right out the window.  There is no reason for it to be happening.  The Reapers shouldn't have to limit themselves to Earth and Palaven, they should be everywhere right off the bat.



#227
von uber

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Assume 20,000 sovereign class reapers; assume 100 significant planets - 200 reapers per planet plus destroyers.
Therefore each planet has a fleet greater than the entire galaxies at it.
Me3 should not have got past the rather good leaving earth cutscene.

#228
ImaginaryMatter

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You want to know my point?  I'll say it again, massed organics pose a threat.  That is it.  And where are you likely to find the most organic ships in one spot at the start of the war?  The citadel.  If all there computing power tells them that they run a .000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% chance of losing 1 more ship by attacking the citadel at the start of the war rather then by waiting then they aren't going to rush the issue.  Fleet shows up, organics all target 1 ship and blow it up, reapers level 25% or organics, organics blow another ship and lose half their remaining ships, battle over, if those 2 ships could be saved by avoiding that battle why would they engage if they don't have to to win the war.   We know organics can harm or destroy reapers, the reapers likely know that to so why would they put themselves into harms way if they don't have to.  To rush the harvest, they got time.  If this harvest takes 500 years they don't care, as long as they compute they are taking the safest option because as much as they maybe sentient, they are still computers and don't have that creativity or risk taking mentality, that is why the catalyst want's syntheses.

 

If the Reapers are really so concerned about preserving the slushy mix why are they installing it on board every single armed ship? Common sense would dictate that you not do that and just keep it somewhere safe. The Reapers had support ships without the slushy mix so it's not like this would be some radical idea and the Catalyst used this method in the early days.



#229
themikefest

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They can't find the Citadel

 

Harbinger: Report

reaper #73: Sir. Mr. Harbinger. The Citadel is not in its usual location like in past cycles, sir

Harbinger: What do you mean? Did look throughout the system?

reaper #73: Mr. Harbinger. Sir. Yes. Me and the reapers found no trace of the Citadel , sir.

Harbinger: Hmm. I guess the organics found how to move the Citadel. This is unexpected. Alright. Capital ship #32. Take your battalion and head to Palaven and start the harvest.

Capital ship #32: Moving out sir. We won't let you down Mr Harbinger.

Harbinger: Capital ship # 209. Take your battalion to Thessia. Do not. I repeat do not attack Thessia until I give the word. Only attack the sorrounding planets and colonies.

Capital ship #209: Yes sir. You can trust me and my fellow reapers to do the job.

 

Harbinger: destroyer #783 Front and center. I have a special mission for you and only you. Go to Rannoch and make an offer to the Geth. They could prove useful in this cycle.

Destroyer #783: I'm honored to be given this task Mr Harbinger. I won't let you down sir.

Harbinger: Destroyer #1987. Front and center. Your job is to go to Tuchanka to contaminate the atmosphere. Can you do that?

Destroyer #1987: Sir. Yes sir. It will be a pleasure to do this. Thank you for giving this opportunity to prove myself, Mr. Harbinger.

Harbinger: Capital ships #3 through #25. Each of you will take a platoon to each of the other systems and start the harvest in those systems. If for some reason you need more support, let me know. You have your orders.

Harbinger: Capital ship #1 and #2. You two will lead the rest of the reaper forces to Earth. Humanity will be our new reaper.

Capital ship #1 and #2: Yes sir.

Harbinger:  One last thing. I will remain in this area to keep an eye on our progress.